Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-

[Armada]

One question is there anything new that I should know about since I have been away for a while

Don't remember exactly how Fox was played around the time you started to play less but some things you should do (unless you already do it).

-Shine OOS into waveland. I basically have only seen 2 Fox mains use this kinda often and it is very good (especilly vs Falco). Might be a bit tricky timeing but learn how to do it consistently and you will have a much easier time.

- u-tilts: Most underrated move Fox has. After a long Nair combo across the stage it can be very good to mix in with a u-tilt instead of uppsmash. Cause the correct DI for u-tilt is the bad DI for uppsmash (on killing % at least). One pretty funny thing i have noticied with this move (mostly vs Sheik) is that if you are about to edgeguard someone (Sheik) and they land with their upp-b on the stage and you go up to punish them u-tilt is pretty good.

The player will in basically all cases as long as they are not experienced against it at least, DI super bad. Cause if they have survival DI they go RIGHT upp from the u-tilt and that gives you a free uair and it works until higher damage with a plattform of course. Also can be good on medium % to kick in with a bair or two after the u-tilt. If they DI the other direction they fly VERY far off stage giving you a free edgeguard. But yeah when you use this you should be the one closest to the ledge and the Sheik (or another char) should be close to the center of the stage then you.

-Second hit only with uair: This is kinda old but also something only 2-3 Foxes use consistently

- Shield drops improve your movement from beging deffensive to offensive super fast. And from the days when I played you I remember you could stay a bit more deffensive and then go in when you knew you would benefit from it. I do think you are one of the Foxes that can benefit most from this technique.


That's some stuff on top of my head. Good luck at EVO man =)

EDIT: Yeah run up with shield is very underrated and something I also used while I played this game. I do think overall people has been overrating some aspects of the game and staying in shield is not that bad. From shield you also have the chance to change your movement and grab is the only thing that truley counter it

 

[Redd]

Thanks, Adam! Good stuff.

I've been trying to learn the waveshine OOS but that's some tricky stuff. I've only seen a few, like you said, be able to do it, the best being Eggm and Sypher (lesser known but he's REALLY good at it)

Going all Fox and dropping secondaries has been AWESOME, really confidant for the two tournies I have coming up and then EVO. <3

 

[Jesus aka jman]

Don't remember exactly how Fox was played around the time you started to play less but some things you should do (unless you already do it).

-Shine OOS into waveland. I basically have only seen 2 Fox mains use this kinda often and it is very good (especilly vs Falco). Might be a bit tricky timeing but learn how to do it consistently and you will have a much easier time.

- u-tilts: Most underrated move Fox has. After a long Nair combo across the stage it can be very good to mix in with a u-tilt instead of uppsmash. Cause the correct DI for u-tilt is the bad DI for uppsmash (on killing % at least). One pretty funny thing i have noticied with this move (mostly vs Sheik) is that if you are about to edgeguard someone (Sheik) and they land with their upp-b on the stage and you go up to punish them u-tilt is pretty good.

The player will in basically all cases as long as they are not experienced against it at least, DI super bad. Cause if they have survival DI they go RIGHT upp from the u-tilt and that gives you a free uair and it works until higher damage with a plattform of course. Also can be good on medium % to kick in with a bair or two after the u-tilt. If they DI the other direction they fly VERY far off stage giving you a free edgeguard. But yeah when you use this you should be the one closest to the ledge and the Sheik (or another char) should be close to the center of the stage then you.

-Second hit only with uair: This is kinda old but also something only 2-3 Foxes use consistently

- Shield drops improve your movement from beging deffensive to offensive super fast. And from the days when I played you I remember you could stay a bit more deffensive and then go in when you knew you would benefit from it. I do think you are one of the Foxes that can benefit most from this technique.


That's some stuff on top of my head. Good luck at EVO man =)

EDIT: Yeah run up with shield is very underrated and something I also used while I played this game. I do think overall people has been overrating some aspects of the game and staying in shield is not that bad. From shield you also have the chance to change your movement and grab is the only thing that truley counter it

Yea every thing u said I pretty much already Do and no beside the shine oos wave land that's to Technical for some1 like me lol ill keep it simple and just shine OOS lol

Thanks tho

 

[Armada]

Great!
Looking forward to see you play again. And those shield drops is something I really think you will benefit a lot from so if you handle those good that would be fun to see =)

 

[Jesus aka jman]

Great!
Looking forward to see you play again. And those shield drops is something I really think you will benefit a lot from so if you handle those good that would be fun to see =)

That's one more thing that I liked which is that I can benefit from that I didn't do in the past that I will like to start doing thank you so much for the info

 

[Bones0]

Oh great, let's all give Jman tips vs. Falco!

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

all excess money from the wizzzrobe/shiz/jman funds need to be given to m2k and taken to a 711 for lottery tickets

mans technical

 

[S l o X]

When does u-throw > u-air stop working on Peach and Marth?

 

[Xyzz]

When they get good at SDI.

scnr

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

so shud i smash both sticks one way when the first hit of the uair connects?

 

[Xyzz]

so shud i smash both sticks one way when the first hit of the uair connects?

http://www.smashboards.com/threads/how-to-sdi-foxs-u-throw-u-air-and-not-die.217426/ Part of my top10 favorite posts on smashboards for sure :D

 

[Эикельманн [РУС]]

I have a serious problem. Over the past 12 months, I've been sweating more and more when I play Melee and have really serious/intense matches. I'm going to assume that some of you more technical Fox mains have had this problem. It's getting to the point where my hands are becoming so sweaty that it's a serious detriment to my gameplay for some of my more technically inclined characters, and I'm getting really tired of cleaning my controller out thoroughly every few hours.

I would be greatly appreciative of an informative response about this.

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

http://www.smashboards.com/threads/how-to-sdi-foxs-u-throw-u-air-and-not-die.217426/ Part of my top10 favorite posts on smashboards for sure :D

aww hell yea that kirby drawing i remember viewing that thread
good stuff by kirbykaze for sure

can you smash di it at any percent? or is it a guaranteed combo on most characters to a %
y does sdi inside of fox how you do it, like kk said " fox dashes left, di right?

 

[BTmoney]

I have a serious problem. Over the past 12 months, I've been sweating more and more when I play Melee and have really serious/intense matches. I'm going to assume that some of you more technical Fox mains have had this problem. It's getting to the point where my hands are becoming so sweaty that it's a serious detriment to my gameplay for some of my more technically inclined characters, and I'm getting really tired of cleaning my controller out thoroughly every few hours.

I would be greatly appreciative of an informative response about this.

Because store bought deodorants are profit-orientated garbage. Their active ingredients are usually alcohol (anti-bacterial, but only until it’s evaporated which takes like 2 minutes), aluminum chlorohydrate (decreases perspiration, but not completely and might be toxic) and perfume (overshadows the sweaty stench).
The best solution are chemicals that kill the bacteria, for example sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) and zinc oxide. I stir them in liquified shea butter. After cooling down, you get a thick cream that stops odor for at least 24 hours.

Concerning the sweaty hands problem, I always carry a towel with me as well as diluted sodium bicarbonate. I pour some of it on one end of the towel and rub it against my hands and my controller, then I use the other end to rub them dry. Removes both grease and sweat very effectively.

10help 10sweat

aww hell yea that kirby drawing i remember viewing that thread
good stuff by kirbykaze for sure

can you smash di it at any percent? or is it a guaranteed combo on most characters to a %
y does sdi inside of fox how you do it, like kk said " fox dashes left, di right?

It's never a true combo, you can always SDI it unless they space it and time it so only the 2nd hit connects

 

[Xyzz]

The amount of SDI is not related to how much percent you have or how much damage a move does. So yes, you can SDI it at any percent. Keep in mind that some foxes will try to move in a way that will accommodate to the SDI to keep you in range for the 2nd hit. You'll usually want to SDI against the moving direction of the fox, because that way it's rather hard for him to do that. (If his momentum carries him left, and you move right, it's really hard to keep you in range because he can't change directions in the air too well.)

 

[Silent Wolf]

10help 10sweat


It's never a true combo, you can always SDI it unless they space it and time it so only the 2nd hit connects

Uair is a true combo, unless you smash DI it or the 2nd hit just misses.. the hits still connected before anything could be done in between the hits, aka the hits still combod. Nair nair can be a true combo, and saying that it isn't just because sometimes it isn't is dumb.

 

[omgwtfToph]

Dam SW just swagged all over everyone this weekend and he still has fox energy left over to lay it down for you plebians.... You can **** my ***** Silent Weezy

 

[BTmoney]

I only talk like a pseudo-intellectual stiff on the boards but I actually have no idea what the **** that post means lmao

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

rofl
ggs sw and thanks guys
im a ****ing scrub
also @eikkelmann if your concerned with your sweat problem i suggest playing b r a w l
you know your not intense if your not sweating post match/set
noobs will learn this later, your not working hard enough if your not sweating
real talk
or just use your bowser

damn silentwolf all of your **** is just improvised right? you dont understand how many times i have to rewind during your vids.
your one of those guys who brings life to the game dont stop

 

[stabbedbyanipple]

Yeah Otto, your fox was NASTYYYY at NWM, damnnnn

 

[Bones0]

so shud i smash both sticks one way when the first hit of the uair connects?

That's called "Redundant DI".

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

^ y wud i be mashing both sticks
boards are hella wierd im done
legit going to xanadu, confirmed, for real,

with my limited experience it will be wierd adapting to how other people like to do their **** rather than knowing what the few people i play with and their habits

 

[unknown522]

wait, didn't you ask the question?

 

[KirbyKaze]

Fox vs Peach tips? Not sure whether to be on the ground or not mostly

 

[Diakonos]

Guys, should I switch to Sheik/Fox to beat a great Peach? I felt terrible for playing my mediocre Sheik vs. Teddy but I feel like I don't know the matchup well enough with Marth.

In all likelihood I should just go Fox and watch SW matches.

edit:// LOL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bxQadaTeYXE

I mean, if you're going to make a video, at least pronounce it right. Better: http://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/nas/diakonos.html

 

[Xyzz]

Marth is perfectly fine (and it's not really worth it to try to counterpick her), but you need to know what you're doing. That would still hold true for Fox / Sheik (I don't really know how easy NTSC Sheik is, but it feels you still need to somehow get those grabs, which can be kinda hard) as well, so...

And well... PP vs Armada is such a great example of how the match up should look like and well worth watching a couple of times, imho (:

 

[Oskurito]

Lol I can't believe people still talk about SSBM nowadays. Do people in the U.S still play as much as four years ago?

 

[Silent Wolf]

Fox vs Peach tips? Not sure whether to be on the ground or not mostly

Yeah armada, give us some tips.

 

[Oskurito]

Don't get grabbed, don't hold down on the stick all the time trying to shine and **** cause you'll get D smashed, learn to grab turnips, play safe.

 

[Diakonos]

Yeah armada, give us some tips.

And with Marth against Peach, too, pls

 

[Divinokage]

Patience, discipline. Just bait that *****, combo when you can.. that's the matchup. =D I don't think anyone needs to tell you what kind of setups you can do. You can catch her on her startup frames of like Fair too.. if she doesn't have a turnip, I'd always be in a range where I can hit her but you have to wait it out or take angles where Nair doesn't hit.

Why are you worrying about Peach though? Without Vwins/Armada, pretty sure you can own the rest for free.

 

[omgwtfToph]

I think catching Peach's fair startup is one of the most unexplored things about the matchup. A lot of players give Peach's float way too much respect.

Your mileage may vary, but I started running under Peach's float land and usmashing (depending on my, and Peach's %). So far I like it.

 

[Pengie]

Agreed, being able to stuff mid to high float fairs with things like FJ nair is something I don't think I see very often that is super useful because it can lead into some pretty solid punishes.

Something else that's pretty useful is shield DIing her down smash away and then getting a free punish with wavedash OoS shine. The shield DI isn't always necessary, but it does make the punish more consistent because you avoid getting shield stabbed when you shields been worn a bit.

 

[Divinokage]

I think catching Peach's fair startup is one of the most unexplored things about the matchup. A lot of players give Peach's float way too much respect.

Your mileage may vary, but I started running under Peach's float land and usmashing (depending on my, and Peach's %). So far I like it.

Ya definitely you can outright beat falling fair with Usmash or trade I think. To say that it's possible to react to all Peach's attacks without that much trouble. Her setups on spacies mainly rely on grab and juggles so playing on the ground is pretty good, you can also laser to force her to move towards you. Fox's combos are actually grounded indeed but you cant follow up that well I guess that's a bit of a weakness but you have much better movement. I'd capitalize on her approachs after lasers rather than just lasering and running because if you do only that.. you give Peach A LOT more opportunities to punish the hell out of you.

 

[L__]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMc_hJqcfOs

can someone teach me how to not get murdered?

 

[omgwtfToph]

Ya definitely you can outright beat falling fair with Usmash or trade I think. To say that it's possible to react to all Peach's attacks without that much trouble. Her setups on spacies mainly rely on grab and juggles so playing on the ground is pretty good, you can also laser to force her to move towards you. Fox's combos are actually grounded indeed but you cant follow up that well I guess that's a bit of a weakness but you have much better movement. I'd capitalize on her approachs after lasers rather than just lasering and running because if you do only that.. you give Peach A LOT more opportunities to punish the hell out of you.

Yeah I pretty much agree with this post. The only thing that I want to point out is that "reacting to all of Peach's attacks" can prove difficult because most of the time you can't punish AC fair directly since it has no landing lag (so if you know it's going to come out, and you can't outright beat it, you have to respect it and punish what comes after it, if anything).

I like staying on the ground in the matchup while making sure not to get boxed into a corner. I'll go to the platforms if I need to maneuver around Peach to reclaim stage control; other times I'll run under her or look for an opportunity to go through her with an aerial or something. Getting aerial'd out of being in the air is really really dangerous (especially Armada-style uairs).

I also find that, more and more, just FJ aerial-ing into Peach's float is really not that bad if you're cognizant about overshooting so that she can't nair you after you hit her with the aerial. I played a bunch of matches vs. M2K's Peach this past weekend and it seemed good even when Peach is at low %. I think Foxes are overall more scared to attack Peach's float than they should be. More testing required maybe though. I miss getting to smash with Bladewise.

 

[Rocketpowerchill]

probably best species mu of 2013
holy **** your waveland game is stupid sexy
GGs
most of the kills in that set were off of stuff ive never seen before like your utilt combo at 5:30 and last game westballz falling dair combo
that was amazing

 

[Divinokage]

Yeah I pretty much agree with this post. The only thing that I want to point out is that "reacting to all of Peach's attacks" can prove difficult because most of the time you can't punish AC fair directly since it has no landing lag (so if you know it's going to come out, and you can't outright beat it, you have to respect it and punish what comes after it, if anything).

I like staying on the ground in the matchup while making sure not to get boxed into a corner. I'll go to the platforms if I need to maneuver around Peach to reclaim stage control; other times I'll run under her or look for an opportunity to go through her with an aerial or something. Getting aerial'd out of being in the air is really really dangerous (especially Armada-style uairs).

I also find that, more and more, just FJ aerial-ing into Peach's float is really not that bad if you're cognizant about overshooting so that she can't nair you after you hit her with the aerial. I played a bunch of matches vs. M2K's Peach this past weekend and it seemed good even when Peach is at low %. I think Foxes are overall more scared to attack Peach's float than they should be. More testing required maybe though. I miss getting to smash with Bladewise.

Then you can also hit her after the move, whiff punish. =D

 

[Silent Wolf]

probably best species mu of 2013
holy **** your waveland game is stupid sexy
GGs
most of the kills in that set were off of stuff ive never seen before like your utilt combo at 5:30 and last game westballz falling dair combo
that was amazing

LOL species. thats filthy tho

 

[stabbedbyanipple]

Anyone know when or if Leffen is gonna come back to the boards?