Q&A Doc General Discussion: Ask and ye shall receive ft. otg and Shroomed!

[eighteenspikes]

yup like dogy said, I hate FD in general. I think it's a terrible doc stage overall. But Marth is one of doc's best matchups so it evens out. imo DL64 is doc's best stage, the only character I would think twice about taking there is cfal. FoD is actually pretty good, honestly I think everyone is just conditioned into avoiding it because it's off for teams. observe: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XziLdVgxrmo

 

[St. Viers]

^^marth is one of doc's best matchups? Elaborate please XD Also, I agree with the FoD observation--I personally love that stage

 

[boss8]

playing mango's falco made me realize jus how bad i am

and how bad doc is vs falco

everytime i wavedash outta shield cuz im being pressured, laser -> sumthin

can i cape b4 that laser gets to me?

P.S. I dair too much LOL

EDIT:

BOSS:

Elaborate on wut i shulda capitalized on plz....n i can only go to pound 4 if i can find someone to buy my plane ticket n let me pay them bak in mid january....cuz that's wen ima get plenty of cash

i'll probably find someone, so are we still teamin?

if your still down to team then i will team with you ofcourse.....

some things i saw.....was....

you tried to punish him OOS when it was clear that after one move....another move was coming out....

i also seen some wave landing oppurtunitys......

see vs mango when u have the lead....just chill out and play defense and let the damage come to you....you have no reason to attack...just to get trick damage is all.....

mango fears doc......so think of that through the match.....dnt be so aggro....lol


or just read my sig

 

[VGmasta]

But Marth is one of doc's best matchups so it evens out. imo DL64 is doc's best stage, the only character I would think twice about taking there is cfal. [/url]

I agree with the Dreamland 64 counterpicking. But what kind of Marth players are you up against?! They couldn't possibly be any good for them to be Doc's "easiest" matchup.

 

[j3ly]

im fairle confident in that matchup, but im talking mario here. If marth takes a bair on his 2nd jump off the edge at ANY percent, its over. But the smart marths will DJ and upB str8 away to avoid this in some situations

dont know about doc, but mario combos marth to the dog house!

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Doc doesn't.

And Mario+Doc can have invincible dsmashes by wavelanding from the edge and dsmashing while the invul is still there. They seem pretty **** invincible with it, but a shieldgrab ~might~ do something? I dunno, I played like balls vs DJ N. But yeah, invincible dsmashes are tight. So is using pills to punish CCers by bonking them on top o' the head. Usmash is still better, but pills are purdy kewl.

Umm... I can't really remember what else he did. He did a pretty good job of shutting off my options, and I did a pretty good job with running into every ******** set-up ever. =(

 

[eighteenspikes]

out of the top tiers, marth is the only one who can't really lock down doc during approach... laser/dair/needle on your shield pretty much force you to roll, marth isn't quick enough to do that -- he has to space you out instead, and doc has some pretty good spacing (compared to his speed, at least). I find marth to also be the easiest to combo (utilt is SICK) and edgeguard (uair->nair/sledgefoot). And as long as you don't get tipped or flub DI, you can live pretty long since he has trouble killing off the sides (compare to slap/dsmash/shine from the other 3).

 

[Niko45]

Interesting. As a Marth I'd 100% ban FD against Doc. I think Doc's platform game is wack, and he's generally more vulnerable and less tricky when he's above marth.

 

[VGmasta]

im fairle confident in that matchup, but im talking mario here. If marth takes a bair on his 2nd jump off the edge at ANY percent, its over. But the smart marths will DJ and upB str8 away to avoid this in some situations

dont know about doc, but mario combos marth to the dog house!

Maybe I should call up my plumber since the doctor ain't taking care of business then, lol.

J/K, I'm inspired to become the best Doc player vs. Marths (That is if eighteenspikes hasn't beaten me to that feat yet).

 

[P.C. Jona]

on yoshis story you can up b onto the top platform

it *****

if someone is on right under it

dair>up b

****

 

[Shroomed]

Marth eats doc alive

if he wanted, he could get the lead stand in one spot and jab for the rest of the match

Assuming he's not a complete ****** and has some decent timing, WTF r u gonna do? I had that happen to me. It was pretty gay, I still won though =)

 

[otg]

yup like dogy said, I hate FD in general. I think it's a terrible doc stage overall. But Marth is one of doc's best matchups so it evens out. imo DL64 is doc's best stage, the only character I would think twice about taking there is cfal. FoD is actually pretty good, honestly I think everyone is just conditioned into avoiding it because it's off for teams. observe: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XziLdVgxrmo

Dreamland is def one of Doc's best stages, and I'm iffy on FD in general but if you can land the grabs and make em count then I don't think it's fair to say that it's terrible. I can see why you think Marth is one of Doc's better high tier matchups. It's pretty stage dependant imo, like I have a hard time on smaller stages as opposed to larger ones where you have more manuverability.

FoD is nasty too vs. certain characters, and since a lot of people don't like it, I tend to CP it against people who I know hate it. Most people tend to ban FD on me for fear of the CG, so FoD is a nice substitute.

Also, Niko I wouldn't say Doc's platform game is crap. It's not broken or anything, but it gets the job done.

if he wanted, he could get the lead stand in one spot and jab for the rest of the match

Assuming he's not a complete ****** and has some decent timing, WTF r u gonna do? I had that happen to me. It was pretty gay, I still won though =)

****.

 

[boss8]

marth doesnt own doc GTFO......

the only one that really owns doc is a gay shiek.....

 

[Shroomed]

get outta here
sheik is def easier than marth
the edgeguarding is ridiculous (then again marth is kinda easy to edgeguard, but a good spacing marth is such a pain)

the only marths i like to fight are the ones that love their fsmashes
mmmm free hits/grabs

although if sheik decides to turn her bak to you and bair, gg pick a different char or go mario and fsmash that ho

 

[VGmasta]

FoD is a terrible substitute vs. Marth though. I mean, what's the way around that ***g's fsmash on that small stage. The platform are terrible there and screw up all my ways of trying to space myself in and out of Marth. It's tough (maybe even impossible) to sweetspot your recovery against a Marth who just spams fsmash. Wall-teching is a complete fail because the fsmash seems to go through the stage and hits you out of your up-B everytime. The only benefit I see in picking FoD against Marth is easier caping. I'd rather play on Yoshi's Story before I ever couterpick FoD.

 

[Dogysamich]

Man, on a normal day, I'd hit you guys with a quote-combo, but **** it, I dun feel like hitting the back button.

@Boss: Ya know, I always think the same thing myself when I watch shroomed play, but then again whenever people ask me about Doc playstyles today, I always tell them Shroomed is the "ridiculously aggressive doc". I'll have to go back and watch those vids again to see what you mean about these infamous WAVELAND OPPS OF JUSTICE. Maybe I just don't look for those like I should.

@Shroomed: -Related to the previous post- With that being said, don't take what boss says as translating to "Don't be aggressive", what I think he's really saying is try to have more patience.

Now, I know that SOUNDS like an oxymoron, but I actually got hit with this idea at the halloween tourney when lambchops was making me play his "aggressively campy" fox. It's kinda hilarious, because it's a concept I've seen in like, millions of times in all sorts of characters (and games), but it's kinda hard to pick up on the idea. Come to think of it, I know m2k and boss were doing it in some of those vids of their doc dittos.

@Zeal: Um, alot of characters can do that. What I'm talking about is literal invincibility frames. Falco actually has 6 frames of inv on his d.smash (on his legs only). Any where, any day. Even on sundays.

@Doc vs Marth: I mean, you guys say that out of the elite 4 marth is the only one that cant lock doc down on approach. Do you guys keep forgetting that, of the elite 4 marth is the only one that NEVER EVER HAS ABSOLUTELY ANY REASON WHATSOEVER TO GO INTO DOC'S RANGE, AND CAN POKE THROUGH IT.

I understand that's easy to overlook because people don't play the matchup properly, but that doesn't change stuff that exists. Not to mention marth is the only character that doesn't take hard guarenteed damage from a grab (read: doesn't get chaingrabbed).

@Dreamland: I mean, I honestly don't think it's that great of a stage, but that's me. It's good in comparison to the other stages, but it's not great. It's just... I hate anything with platforms. Ignore me.

@FoD vs Marth: It's actually not bad because of how the stages works (in that it's random). The problem is it's a complete dice roll, and if you're a person who hates having NO platforms (read: 18s), you're going to hate the stage the entire time anyway. If you want a stage that's flat sometimes and lets you actually do platform stuff for others, then FoD is ok.. I guess. I personally pray that Marths choose to ban FoD for me so I can get rid of this and YS and be done with them.

 

[Shroomed]

yea i should learn to be a little bit more patient

i cant even count the times i jump at a fox with a nair and he stands there, and upsmashes my **** and i rage

iono how to play all patient and all that jazz, im like the joker

i jus do things lol

 

[unknown522]

waffles, we gotta play at ROM2.

Also if OTG is going.

 

[otg]

waffles, we gotta play at ROM2.

Also if OTG is going.

Are you crashing at Milos'? I'm going to try and go out there tomorrow night so we can play then . Then you can **** me and post all about it on smashboards and ****.

OOOH **** I totally forgot to mention this, but the last hit of Doc's tornado trades with Falco's dair. Hilarious.

 

[unknown522]

lol, wow I didn't know that.

We're crashing at Alex Strife's. Milos' is full, so we can't crash there. Quebec will be there though you should try to play them.

 

[otg]

lol, wow I didn't know that.

We're crashing at Alex Strife's. Milos' is full, so we can't crash there. Quebec will be there though you should try to play them.

Yeah I heard that Quebec was there, Mogwai mentioned that you guys might be too, but I guess I heard wrong though. Alex Strife is actually closer to me though... maybe if its cool I'll go out there? I dunno, I wanna play with you guys (it's Ontario right?) and who knows if we'll end up playing at ROM.

 

[unknown522]

Milos wanted to host us, but we asked too late.

It's even better that alex's house is close to yours. You definitely should come.

 

[Dogysamich]

So, this is what happens when you randomly send pics to Dogysamich.

 

[eighteenspikes]

lol sheik is my *****

hey dogy there's more pix waiting for you in pm

 

[elvenarrow3000]

Consorting with the enemy!

 

[boss8]

im probly the biggest doc player out and i still get feamales.......

 

[Niko45]

Marth eats doc alive

if he wanted, he could get the lead stand in one spot and jab for the rest of the match

Assuming he's not a complete ****** and has some decent timing, WTF r u gonna do? I had that happen to me. It was pretty gay, I still won though =)

lol vids or it doesn't happen.

Seriously tho, if ur going to ROM, I need to play ur doc.

 

[boss8]

i dont think shroom is going.....

im not going either...

*FML*

 

[Dogysamich]

im probly the biggest doc player out and i still get feamales.......

Yeah, I'd imagine you're the biggest doc. Not like, fattest, but literally the BIGGEST.

But the problem is, you havent been sending me random pics at like, 2:30 in the morning.

ESPECIALLY PICS OF YOU CHAINGRABBING A SHEIK IRL.

 

[boss8]

WOW ummmmmmmmm

WOW no comment...

 

[unknown522]

****it, I hate having to settle being the 2nd biggest doc player...

 

[otg]

Yeah, I'd imagine you're the biggest doc. Not like, fattest, but literally the BIGGEST.

I'm like 6'5" and weigh almost 250. Aka I'm a big mofo. I think I got you on this one Boss. And PS, you're mad gay for not going. In fact, everyone here is mad gay for not going. Shroomed and Waffles are on the VIP list, so hopefully they pull through. I just had this idea in my head that a major Doc Conference was gonna go down and y'all nuckas are leaving me high and dry. Oh well, we got me unknown and DJN at least, I guess Yedi can be our 4th..... *shot not!*

 

[unknown522]

holy **** 6'5"....I weigh more but I'm much shorter.

6' and 265lbs.

Also, never mario dittoing boss again. **** took forever at the first ROM.

 

[P.C. Jona]

yea max is the biggest smasher, probably ever

 

[boss8]

gayyyy im only 6'2 but im like 340 pounds xD

 

[Angrylobster]

On the other hand, I'm probably one of the smallest doc players. I'm 5'8 and only weigh like 115. Yeah, i'm a shrimp haha

 

[boss8]

dude i went up to a newcomer it was his first turney.......

i grabbed him by the shirt and said..

PAY FOR MY VENUE FEE >=O!!!

and he said....hey man hey man be cool be cool i gotchu...

i patted him on the back and said...im kidding bro....im boss wassup???

ROFLMAO!!!! his parents where like ur never going out again xD

 

[anthony000]

Thanks for the info about cp'ing. I think I just gotta play better.

 

[Dogysamich]

WOW ummmmmmmmm

WOW no comment...

WELL YOU SAID IT NEGRO. SORRY I AGREED LOLOL. ^_^

****it, I hate having to settle being the 2nd biggest doc player...

2nd biggest, 2nd loudest, probably have the 2nd blacke~~, actually no, 2nd blackest has to go to HMW.

MAN IT JUST AINT GOIN YO WAY NOW IS IT?

I'm like 6'5" and weigh almost 250. Aka I'm a big mofo. I think I got you on this one Boss. And PS, you're mad gay for not going. In fact, everyone here is mad gay for not going. Shroomed and Waffles are on the VIP list, so hopefully they pull through. I just had this idea in my head that a major Doc Conference was gonna go down and y'all nuckas are leaving me high and dry. Oh well, we got me unknown and DJN at least, I guess Yedi can be our 4th..... *shot not!*

lol. Poor... not south region. If I ever want a Doc conference all I have to do is go to FL now. There's like, 5 of them down there not including $mac. It's pretty funny.

gayyyy im only 6'2 but im like 340 pounds xD

BIG!<<<<<<<<<<<< click

On the other hand, I'm probably one of the smallest doc players. I'm 5'8 and only weigh like 115. Yeah, i'm a shrimp haha

You're a ness player at heart and you know it AL. JK MANG!!

Thanks for the info about cp'ing. I think I just gotta play better.

I mean we all gotta get better, but you just gotta actually think about your CPs and whatnot. Some people try to make it out like you have to have one or 2 specific stages for every character, but dont actually think about what's happening.

It's like, by default you would think YS is great place to take peach to (which, no matter how you add it up, it's still good), but you dont want to take her there if you lost because you couldnt get her away from you. You're just making the problem worse at that point.

Stuff like that/

 

[VGmasta]

On the other hand, I'm probably one of the smallest doc players. I'm 5'8 and only weigh like 115. Yeah, i'm a shrimp haha

Well, i win for being the shortest Doc main: 5'6" at 145 lbs.