COMPETITIVE Brawl+: Code Agenda

[plasmatorture]

Who has access to this backroom? Almas, The Cape, and Mookie, obviously, but who else? Who gives out access? Who runs it? Who decided Brawl+ should be run by a backroom?

I don't neccesarily distrust y'all or have a problem with it, I'm just curious.

 

[zxeon]

Who has access to this backroom? Almas, The Cape, and Mookie, obviously, but who else? Who gives out access? Who runs it? Who decided Brawl+ should be run by a backroom?

I don't neccesarily distrust y'all or have a problem with it, I'm just curious.

I've asked myself those same questions.

 

[SketchHurricane]

Who has access to this backroom? Almas, The Cape, and Mookie, obviously, but who else? Who gives out access? Who runs it? Who decided Brawl+ should be run by a backroom?

I don't neccesarily distrust y'all or have a problem with it, I'm just curious.

Well, we've been talking of forming one for a while now, but it looks like someone just took initiative and formed one (without any notice lol). Not that I mind, because back room or not, it's still largely the community input that will shape things. And honestly, it's a lot of hard work that's being taken care of in terms of finding a starting point for us to test. I don't know if there are any SBR dudes involved, or if it's just Almas and his crew though (since it's his code).

 

[MuBa]

kupo's/Mookie's.
They're really alike.

Which they will eventually become similar to mine once all of the codes come out.

 

[shanus]

Who has access to this backroom? Almas, The Cape, and Mookie, obviously, but who else? Who gives out access? Who runs it? Who decided Brawl+ should be run by a backroom?

I don't neccesarily distrust y'all or have a problem with it, I'm just curious.

We will be making a public announcement regarding the details behind it + a first codeset pretty soon. Recruiting for it isn't done yet either, we have just kept it very limited while we got the ball rolling.

Feedback for this first codeset is CRITICAL. We will prefer if people play with the values we have presented without modifying dash speed, etcetc so that we can get an accurate representation of what the public feels is a needed change. This will be critical to proper balance. It feels great right now, and I look forward to hearing your inputs!

 

[GPDP]

Man, I can't freaking wait. I'm gonna have an aneurysm out of sheer anticipation!

Ok, it's not THAT bad, but yeah. I'm excited.

 

[cAm8ooo]

Which they will eventually become similar to mine once all of the codes come out.

I hope so. I have about 5 or 6 vids of my kirby vs my friends metaknight using your codeset. Ill be getting them up tonight. SOOO much fun

 

[Revven]

IMO, adding the gravity differences adds depth on its own! It'll make characters so diverse from one another unlike in vBrawl and just be uber sexy. I'm excited, I'd be willing to test it out without playing humans first actually lol.

The question would be how it would affect online with its constant desyncs. (Well, not as much as before).

 

[Alopex]

I've been gone for a while, so I'm kind of wondering if any progress has been made on these previous issues:

Current Code Issues That Still Need to be Fixed

(The list is in no particular order.)

1) Lagless Ledges needing more invincibility frames.

• This was being thrown around before and kupo has stated that a separate code is needed to adjust for this.

2) No Auto-Sweetspot not properly affecting all characters.

• a) Diddy's recovery needs to get fixed. Its current state like this is tolerable, but
  hardly appropriate.

• b) The code has been shown to affect write-protected Ness and Lucas. It's inconsistent
  and seems to affect them differently, though. Meanwhile it does not affect write-
  protected Lucario.
  Given enough research into the matter, the code could maybe be perfected to work
  consistently on all characters pending the consensus on how every character should be affected.
  In the case of Ness and Lucas, for example, if the consensus is that they should always ASL, then the code
  needs to be perfected in order to make sure that is what always happens.

3) YES! lag.

• It still exists despite the TJG Fix.

4) Near Perfect Shielding.

• Spunit's previous shieldstun code got rid of it, but the current one still has it. Spunit is looking into the matter and hopefully it'll be fixed soon.

5) Buffer glitches.

• Instant aerials still can't be performed on 0 buffer. Many Brawl+ players feel that 0 buffer is the way to go, so this needs to be rectified in order for it to be viable.

• Any buffer setting above 1 is glitched to a near unplayable degree. This needs to be fixed in order for values of 2 and above to be properly tested and discussed.

There might be some glitches I have missed. If so, mention them and I'll add them here.


Some mechanics-related codes that are still need to be created:
1) Air momentum.
2) Grab release fix.
3) Bounce lock fix.
4) Damage-only decay.

The OP hasn't changed much in the month I've been gone, really, so it would make me assume that all of those issues still remain.

 

[GPDP]

The YES! lag is gone entirely now, so you can safely add that code.

Also, the No ASL code works a little better now (you can't AS with, say, Toon Link by doing your Up-B at a certain time anymore). AFAIK, though, the problems with Lucario, Ness, and Lucas remain.

I THINK buffer is fixed now, but I can't be sure.

 

[Revven]

Lucario has to remain the same with NASL (as in, he should autosweetpot) because his recovery would be utter crap without it (he could easily get punished and KOed). Unless somehow he slides onto the stage after doing Up B OR we make it faster (and make it TRULY ExtremeSpeed) then it should autosweetspot.

 

[The Cape]

Lucario, Lucas, and Ness have always had recovery trouble. Is the auto snap really all that bad for them? Lucario definetly needs it, I agree with that.

As for lagless ledge, I thought that we decided on them having less invulnerability as a trade off for having so much less lag.

 

[MookieRah]

Lucario, Ness, and Lucas need the autosnap. That said, we can't fix that even if we wanted to cause they are write-protected.

 

[Witchking_of_Angmar]

Lucario, Ness, and Lucas need the autosnap. That said, we can't fix that even if we wanted to cause they are write-protected.

What does that mean, exactly? Does that mean you can't modify any of their properties using codes?

 

[leafgreen386]

No. Only their upBs are write-protected, so those are the only things we can't change about them.

 

[izzy24]

wat about diddy?

 

[The Cape]

wat about diddy?

His up and B is very hard to sweetspot. You know how when someone is on the ledge he can hit it and his barrels explode and he goes flying?

Happens all the time now. You have to have GREAT aim.

I never did try teching that explosion though....

 

[izzy24]

right, so wat about the sliding fix instead of exploding?

 

[The Cape]

right, so wat about the sliding fix instead of exploding?

What do you mean by the sliding fix?

Also most of the side Bs still snap sweetspot:
Diddy, Ganon, Falcon, etc

 

[izzy24]

replace the exploding with a sliding animation?

 

[Deleted member]

but you're in the air.
??

 

[leafgreen386]

He means sliding up the stage. Like fox's upB in melee.

 

[The Cape]

How would I go about taking the Wifi room waiting music and putting it on my WarioWare stage?

 

[kupo15]

Which they will eventually become similar to mine once all of the codes come out.

I can almost guarantee our numbers won't be close to yours. Our current numbers will stay around where they are but feel as fast as yours so if people practice on yours thinking thats how things will be, adjusting back to our numbers will still be very weird. This is my prediction.

 

[Eaode]

but with the char specific grav + SH's you will undoubtedly start including upwards gravity yes?

That's the most important thing to me now. My other values are very similar to yours, I just love upwards gravity :3

 

[Shadic]

Lucario, Ness, and Lucas need the autosnap. That said, we can't fix that even if we wanted to cause they are write-protected.

Wasn't there a YouTube video of somebody playing around with the code when it applied to Lucas and Ness?

That said, I LIKE autosnap for those two. And think that Diddy needs it as well. His Up-B is already easy to gimp.

 

[kupo15]

but with the char specific grav + SH's you will undoubtedly start including upwards gravity yes?

That's the most important thing to me now. My other values are very similar to yours, I just love upwards gravity :3

Well apparently I hear that the gravity codes will go out the window with almas' next code since the SBR+ already made a code and individualized the gravity and short hops on all the characters. The FF and DD and jump speeds and ALR speeds will still remain and probably won't ever go up to MuBa's speed. We also won't be reducing the ALR lower that 1/2 like MuBa wants to do

 

[Stratocaster]

We should consider a code to make the transform time for zelda, samus, and pokemon quicker. As most people know, its faster when the character you are transforming into is on screen, or if you pause during the transformation, because it has to load the character. Couldn't a code be made to say "load data for these characters when someone is using this character" Especially for 1v1 matches, where loading 2 extra characters at the start shouldn't be a big deal, since the game is used to having 4 loaded. In theory, if you could make a character come up, but he was invisible and invincible, it would still load the character so they would still have increased transform time...

 

[kupo15]

We should consider a code to make the transform time for zelda, samus, and pokemon quicker. As most people know, its faster when the character you are transforming into is on screen, or if you pause during the transformation, because it has to load the character. Couldn't a code be made to say "load data for these characters when someone is using this character" Especially for 1v1 matches, where loading 2 extra characters at the start shouldn't be a big deal, since the game is used to having 4 loaded. In theory, if you could make a character come up, but he was invisible and invincible, it would still load the character so they would still have increased transform time...

here is a question, if you have a sheik vs a zelda vs a w.e and the sheik/zelda changes, will that be faster since the zelda model is already loaded in the other player?

 

[Almas]

It's more about moving it to the correct location in memory.

 

[kupo15]

It's more about moving it to the correct location in memory.

So is it possible because a while ago we all thought it was not

 

[Almas]

No... Because before you transform, the correct location in memory is occupied. With, like, the details of the character you're playing as.

You could speed up the transformation by overclocking your Wii. I can see it now...

 

[peachfvl]

i have a question with this code:

Short Hop Height/Dash Speed/Fastfall Speed Multiplier [Almas, spunit262] (8 lines)
C285765C 00000007
2C002F20 4082000C
C002FFE0 EC200072
2C002F00 4082000C
C002FFE4 EC200072
2C002F5C 4082000C
C002FFE8 EC200072
4E800020 00000000

Hack constant (5 lines)

065A9300 0000001C
SHORTHOP DASHDASH
FASTFALL ARIALLAG
LEDGELAG JUMPSTAR
THROWSPD 00000000

if i just want to changethe shorthop,dash speed and fastfall what should i do?

 

[storm92]

i have a question with this code:

Short Hop Height/Dash Speed/Fastfall Speed Multiplier [Almas, spunit262] (8 lines)
C285765C 00000007
2C002F20 4082000C
C002FFE0 EC200072
2C002F00 4082000C
C002FFE4 EC200072
2C002F5C 4082000C
C002FFE8 EC200072
4E800020 00000000

Hack constant (5 lines)

065A9300 0000001C
SHORTHOP DASHDASH
FASTFALL ARIALLAG
LEDGELAG JUMPSTAR
THROWSPD 00000000

if i just want to changethe shorthop,dash speed and fastfall what should i do?

For the ones you want to leave the same, use the hex converter (link in the OP) and use 1 as the constant, and use the values there. For SH, Dash, and FF, enter the values you want into the converter and put them in the code where they should be placed respectively. The standard 1 value is 3F800000.
ALR is different though, I forget quite how to do that one. Just use 4F000000.

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Says the guy from colorado, LOL. I don't recall any major players coming from Colorado.

Ask the people that went to Event 52 about LoVo's Link. Ask Germ about 'em. Ferdi drew first blood on m2k there, too, though m2k still won. Ask Forward, Taj, Wobbles, or South Paw about CO smash. Just because we don't travel often doesn't mean we don't know what we're doing.

You know our scene about as well as I know yours.

The Netherlands have the best Melee scene in Europe. Of course Amsah is well known even in the US, but you also have other excellent players like Adam, Faab, choco, zgetto, Marc, the list goes on.

And you all lose to Nihonjin. lolololol.

Nah, I'm messin', he's just a really good player. It's not like Europe is garbage at Melee or anything.

Secondly, you are clearly unaware of how CC works. Read this. You keep repeating how CC would help against Fox' dair, when that's one of the moves people use to COUNTER crouch canceling!

I'd suggest you actually read the posts you link to next time. I think you're a little confused on something:

You can Crouch needles/Fox's shines/Falco's lasers/spikes/meteors to get reduced launch speed and stun time, but they can't send you upwards until they knock you down and go into a tumble, so you can't Cancel them by instantly going into a regular landing by ASDIing down.

Because of the reduced stun-time, you are able to do things like get Peach's dsmash out before he completely lands and does a shine (at low percents), effectively nailing him with a CC dsmash because he's still going for the shine. At higher percents it doesn't work because you're stunned for longer. I've been playing Melee for a long time, it's not like I haven't done this before.

Though really, if you predict a dair, it's better to just WD back into dtilt.

Still, thanks for the link. It didn't occur to me that me CCing dair was the reason why I couldn't SDI outta drillshines. Hopefully now, I can.

Like paprika killer said, we are NOT remaking Melee. If I want Melee, I go to a smashfest and play Melee, LOL. Crouch canceling was a VERY powerful technique in Melee, so much that entire matchups revolve around it.

I'm not asking for l-canceling, wavedashing, jc grabs, and for battlefield to kill you if you try to recover too far in. I just wondered whether anyone had thought to try out CCing. CCing doesn't make the game Melee instantly. I don't know why paprika and you feel like it's some grave sin to simply inquire about a technique being added.

Also, CC pretty much ruins low tiers because they have less safe moves. If you're sheik, you can pretty much approach every low tier matchup like this:

He does some weird low tier bull****, I CC it/use my broken ftilt hitbox to hit him out of it->grab.

/stock

Now this I can agree with and see as a viable argument against CC. Granted, Sheik could **** most low-tiers without even CCing, but as someone who mained Roy for a very good deal of time, CCing was my enemy, and Samus made me D:

Granted, some characters like Link have workarounds (lol upb, it sounds scrubby, but ask m2k how his Sheik felt against LoVo's Link), but in general, low tier can kinda get ***** by it. Only character that comes to mind that doesn't mind it too much is Ness, since it=free dair mix-up which can equal a decent combo. Doesn't matter though, he still gets ***** by Sheik and Peach for free. D:

CC is very very powerful and there's enough reasons not to include it in Brawl+ other than "we don't want Melee 2.0".

I would much prefer to discuss thse reasons rather than "we dun want melee, lololololol". Intelligent discussion is much preferred over flame-baiting each other.

Btw, while we're on the subject of Melee, why is Peach where she is in the PAL tier list? She seems to be the same in a game where everyone else in the top tier got nerfed. Does Europe just lack Peach players to show how good she is, or is there something about the PAL metagame that I don't know about? Pretty sure she can **** Falco soundly, and if Sheik has more stun on dthrow, can she still dthrow to fair at kill percents? Marth still seems bad, but dair is a meteor, so Ken combo isn't that big of a deal, is it?

 

[kupo15]

put a "1" (3F800000) into the spots you don't want to change

 

[peachfvl]

so i shouldn´t use the other code that has aerial lag, ledge lag and the others since i have them but in separate codes ?

 

[InterimOfZeal]

Hey, Almas, any chance the BR could be made viewable to non-BR people without allowing them to post in it? Just be interesting to have people see what the BR talks about.

Also, I can get like... 10-20 people testing any given codeset in person. If you guys want feedback, give me a codeset and I'll get CO working on it.

 

[storm92]

so i shouldn´t use the other code that has aerial lag, ledge lag and the others since i have them but in separate codes ?

You don't need the other codes, those are pretty much obsolete now.
You just need that code you posted and the Dash Speed/FF/Throw Speed/ALR modifier code.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey, Almas, any chance the BR could be made viewable to non-BR people without allowing them to post in it? Just be interesting to have people see what the BR talks about.

Also, I can get like... 10-20 people testing any given codeset in person. If you guys want feedback, give me a codeset and I'll get CO working on it.

the first is a no for now, and there is already a codeset up in the brawlplusery thread