Brawl- 2.1.1 Legacy thread

[Grim Tuesday]

Okay, so:

1. Is it possible at all to stop DDD's Swallow from sucking in Waddles? It's really hurting the move's effectiveness when I play and I feel like I could do so much more spacing-wise if it was changed.

2. Removed platforms on Mario Bros. is unnecessary imo. Making the middle platform non-hard (so you can jump and drop through it) is a much cleaner solution (not that a solution is entirely necessary, seeing as the stage is already legit, but whatever).

3. Love the new 75m, Spear Pillar, WarioWare, New Pork City (this one made me lol), Skyworld, etc...

4. Speeding up Mushroomy Kingdom was a stroke of genius. Same with the wall thing for Shadow Moses.

5. Universal wall-jump is great.

6. Is it possible to get a more... fitting... texture for Norfairville? Same layout but with vanilla Norfair-themed textures/models?

7. Any reason for not fixing Pictochat, Luigi's Mansion, Rumble Falls, etc...?

Overall, very good. I've had a lot of fun with it =D

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Lol, I just realized why I'm not seeing the new New Pork. I don't have a line to tell it to load it as its disc file name.

 

[Yikarur]

lol DKs healing goes beyond 0%, you can side taunt hundred of times and then being at 0% forever loool
the knockback gets affected by minus percent too because DK has something like super armor beyond 0% xD (like getting hit while metal) haha too good lol

 

[standardtoaster]

Yeah, but when are you actually going to get a chance to be significantly below 0%?

 

[Flutter NiTE]

Sonic's dtaunt is the new TL downtaunt. Sickness.

btw, I discovered a 0-51 combo with Pikachu, works on most heavys, idk about meds or lights. gonna upload eventually

 

[Slaps]

does the text.gct thing need to be in my codes folder as RSBE01? just curious I haven't changed any of my sd card hacks/textures in a while so am kinda behind... This still works with gecko too correct? I don't know what stack smash is...

 

[Linkshot]

Lucario Changelist

I'll dig up the Lucario stuff I have

LUCARIO (Credit to TSON and Rkey)

Spoiler

Date: Sep 23 2010

Spoiler

FAIR:
- Hitbox termination frame 23->18

UPB (Extremespeed):
- Allow interrupt into aerial attacks naturally at frame 16
- Allow interrupt into aerial attacks at frame 9 if hit with

SIDEB (Force Palm):
- Aerial throw works (finally >_>)
- Catch Collisions terminate frame 20 (when graphics go away)
- Angle 3A->1A
- KBG 53->5F

DOWNB (Double Team):
- Autolink angle

PUMMEL:
- Loop timer 0.1->0.05

UP SMASH:
- BKB +20 on ID 0, 2
- BKB -> 3B on ID 1
---BUTTON NOT HELD:--
- Sizes = 7
- Y offset...corrected lol
- Added another hitbox to the top

SIDE SMASH:
- ID 2 Size +1
- ID 0, 1, BKB +10

(Im not even going to try to break this up.

*This is to give Lucario a low percent combo starter that is not u-tilt (u-tilt has been given cons), and giving the third jab a use*
Third jab: speed is x1.5 from frame 14, IASA is now frame 28 instead of 32, which means IASA is now onframe 29.

*This is to make f-tilt useful.*
F-tilt: x1.5 speed from frame 18. This basically means 4 frames less lag only it looks better.

*This is to give each tilt a specific use.*
F-tilt - tilted up: Direction is now 41, 41, 43 and 51, used to be 4A, 4A, 4C and 5A
F-tilt - no tilt: Direction is now 33, 33, 36 and 43, used to 169 on all hitboxes.
F-tilt - tilted down: Direction is now 25, 25, 28 and 35, used to be 169 on all hitboxes.

*This is because it was ********.*
U-tilt: hitboxes terminate on frame 14 instead of frame 25, IASA frame 37 instead of frame 32.

*This is to improve Lucario's spacing game, seeing as his approaches are slightly nerfed.*
D-tilt: Lucario recives slight horizontal momentum backwards on use. Combine with crawldash for good spacing and tech-chasing.

*Since it was too spammable.*
Fsmash: IASA is now on frame 40 instead of 35

*Multihit is for shieldbreak, not for finishing. It had more KBG than normal f-smash.*
Fsmash multihit: kbg lowered to 50, 4D and 4D.

*Usmash in it's previous form would allways be out-trumphed bu u-tilt, all categories, no matter the buff.*
Usmash: Redesigned. Very slow startup, IASA frame 47 instead of 41. Only one small hitbox where Lucario's aura thing is (bone ID=0, y-offset = 32, size=3), 1F damage (31 as a decimal), bkb 57 and kbg 40. Hitbox is out for 6 frames. Hitlag multiplier x3, SDImultiplier 0, -shring- on hit. On FD, Lucario kills another Lucario at 79% with 0% aura (attack deals 22% damage), at 43% with 70 % aura (attack deals 30% damage), at 24% with 120% aura (attack deals 36% damage) and 11% with capped aura (attack deals 43% damage).Added nice GFX and SFX.

*Lucario was killing to early with up-b -> dsmash*
Dsmash: Front and back doesn't matter for kbg anymore. Kbg lowered, inner hitboxes went from 67 and 64 kbg to 5D, inner hitboxes kbg went from 66 and 6C to 61

*You know why, Fair was ridiculous.*
Fair: IASA is now 26 instead of 23. Hitboxes terminate on frame 10 instead of frame 18.

*Hitboxes too long, a tad too spammable.*
Bair: IASA is now frame 36 instead of 33, hitboxes terminate on frame 23 instead of frame 28

*Melee-link style sex-kick, no thanks.*
Uair: IASA is now frame 32 instead of frame 30, hitboxes terminate on frame 11 instead of frame 28 (2 frames of no hitboxes, lol...). Note that move has a x1.35 speed multiplier.)

Date: Jan 11 2011

Spoiler

Up smash:
reverted to vbrawl hitboxes
top hitbox size 8->10,7->8
FSM x1.5 after hitboxes
initial KBG 5F -> 6E

Fair:
FSM x1 10 frames after the hitboxes

Uair:
strong hit KBG 6E -> 79

Bair:
KBG 6E -> 80
strong hit BKB 7 -> 14

======

Sonic's dtaunt is the new TL downtaunt. Sickness.

btw, I discovered a 0-51 combo with Pikachu, works on most heavys, idk about meds or lights. gonna upload eventually

Good ****. Keep trying to break the characters, guys. It's the only way we know if we need more tweaks.
P.S. Our current focus is Zelda/Sheik. Feedback on them yet?

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Yes, Zelda/Sheik feedback would be good. I (and some others) are concerned that one, both, or a combination of the two is really the best character in the game.

 

[DtJ Composer]

Pictochat doesn't need to be fixed people, what is wrong with you.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Pictochat does have some considerable issues for competitive play in vBrawl, and although some (the picasso line above all) are weaker in Brawl- due to buffed recoveries, others (spikes, spike fence, rockets, etc.) are even more of an issue! I will not run it in my tournaments or MMs and would not recommend it to anyone. If the randomness is good enough for you, that's fine... but I do not recommend it at all.

 

[Flutter NiTE]

The only thing I would change about this, if anything, would be not having Yoshi's, Ness's, and Lucas's jumps cancelled when doing an attack.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Okay, so:

1. Is it possible at all to stop DDD's Swallow from sucking in Waddles? It's really hurting the move's effectiveness when I play and I feel like I could do so much more spacing-wise if it was changed.

Probably not... It's not a great move and DDD is a really good character anyways.

6. Is it possible to get a more... fitting... texture for Norfairville? Same layout but with vanilla Norfair-themed textures/models?

I think that honestly, part of the charm of the stage is realizing, "Holy **** they just transplanted Smashville onto Norfair!"

7. Any reason for not fixing Pictochat

Not able to effectively

Luigi's Mansion

Too lazy/the stage is probably actually decent

Rumble Falls

Use RF+

 

[Mr.Kart]

So I put in PW's Stage Expansion code, and for some reason, the game decides to randomly freeze at the end of certain matches on these custom stages. If it froze after all of them that would be one thing, because then I'd know it was certainly something in the code, but any ideas as to why it would freeze just randomly after certain matches? I've even tried doing different variables, like seeing if it's because of certain characters or certain character textures, but alas, there is NO pattern to it. One match could be Mario and Luigi and end fine, the next on the same stage will freeze at the results screen.

 

[Flutter NiTE]

By the way, on Norfairville, I took a look around the stage with the camera hack, if you look up, you can see the original Norfair

 

[MonkUnit]

Yes, because at the time I thought scaling something to 0,0,0 would cause a crash. Turns out it doesn't. It's fine as is. LOL

 

[Slashy]

You can always use Pictochat+, which makes it a Starter/Counter

 

[Yikarur]

Yeah Yoshis DJC Mechaniques are annoying ._. even though DJC is good, not in the way you do it in Brawl- D:
If I got that correctly you DJC if you press the Attack button for only one frame. It should be 2 frames so that you can't use the c-stick for it. (and it's easier to do nair this way)

 

[Linkshot]

For the "see original parts of the stage", it's because hexing them out can cause collision problems, plus it's time-consuming, so it's easier to just toss them somewhere beyond the blastzones.

Also

HERE ARE ALL THE CHANGELIST DOCUMENTS FROM AUG 31ST 2010 TO JAN 20TH 2011

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Probably not... It's not a great move and DDD is a really good character anyways.

Fair enough, thanks.

I think that honestly, part of the charm of the stage is realizing, "Holy **** they just transplanted Smashville onto Norfair!"

Yeah, I thought as much. I assume the same holds true for NPC and the giant iceberg?

Not able to effectively

Project M did it >_>

Too lazy/the stage is probably actually decent

K.

Use RF+

I am. I was just wondering why it wasn't packaged with the mod.

 

[PurDi]

Sooo... testing zelda a bit, can't find out what seems to be a true combo from her bair disjoint... Seems like if they di really bad you can either bair or fair, if theyre on top of you nair > jab > ftilt, and if they're below or on top of you, MOVE AWAY! Zelda's really hard to play against until you get right on her, then she has next to nothing to get you out bar neutral b and dsmash (if she can hit before you...)

All that being said, idk if you guys use green greens as a counterpick for tourneys (I do) but that is her stage... Its soooooo broken for her. The ability to safely blow up the bombs always is ridiculous coupled with the four ledges to mess with the opponent... It's just hilarious.

So basically, if your opponent bans green greens, go warioware with bowser and if they ban warioware, go green greens with zelda.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I like GG as a King Dedede stage, personally

 

[Supreme Dirt]

I just discovered the change you guys made to Pirate Ship.

<3.

That is all.

 

[MK26]

@BPC: Mansion+?

 

[Shiroyu]

I just discovered the change you guys made to Pirate Ship.

<3.

That is all.

Agreed.

Also, Lucario is a beast. :O

Really guys, thank you so much for this. This whole project has been just nothing short of amazing the whole way though, and I'm glad to be able to play it. :D

 

[NO@H]

I just discovered the change you guys made to Pirate Ship.

<3.

That is all.

there's actually quite a few changes, such as no catapult, shorter crash time on rock, greater chance of tornadoes and crash, King of Red Lions shows up 75% more, and the bombs. I'm guessing you noticed the bombs xD

 

[JOE!]

Ugh...

why does Yoshi have DJC... D:

he's so clunky to me now

 

[Supreme Dirt]

Oh, I noticed the lack of catapult, and how it feels like half the match is spent on either the rock or the air. The bombs make me chuckle, especially since they happened a whopping 3 times in a row the other day.

And the bombs. <3

Also, JOE, just hold jump. Yoshi getting DJC is a BUFF, regardless of what you seem to thing. Seriously, he has some of the best aerials in the game.

 

[Linkshot]

Dat SH DJC nAir.

 

[Zef]

wow its done

 

[DSP]

Could someone post a quick list with all the changes to the stages please?

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Sooo... testing zelda a bit, can't find out what seems to be a true combo from her bair disjoint... Seems like if they di really bad you can either bair or fair, if theyre on top of you nair > jab > ftilt, and if they're below or on top of you, MOVE AWAY! Zelda's really hard to play against until you get right on her, then she has next to nothing to get you out bar neutral b and dsmash (if she can hit before you...)

All that being said, idk if you guys use green greens as a counterpick for tourneys (I do) but that is her stage... Its soooooo broken for her. The ability to safely blow up the bombs always is ridiculous coupled with the four ledges to mess with the opponent... It's just hilarious.

So basically, if your opponent bans green greens, go warioware with bowser and if they ban warioware, go green greens with zelda.

We're working on a B-BR Recommended ruleset, and rest assured-it will not have 1 stage ban. I was pushing for 3, we compromised to 2... As far as "GTFO" with zelda, have you forgotten that her Dtilt is really ****ing good?

Also zelda on GG is good... but not like, really good. Not like ROB on RC/Brinstar/Pirate Ship or Bowser on Warioware level stuff.

@BPC: Mansion+?

Kinda lame, doesn't add much to the stagelist IMO. I prefer mansion, but if you're dubious about the stage (like many people are) feel free to replace it with Mansion+.

 

[Supreme Dirt]

If the B-BR Ruleset doesn't have Mushroomy Kingdom legal, I will be annoy.

 

[Hunch]

I (may) have found a slight bug on the new Shadow Moses. The left column instantly regenerated once but then stopped regenerating altogether. The right column quickly regenerated every time normally. I was in training mode with Toon Link and Ness if for whatever reason that makes a difference. Is this a glitch or intentional?

 

[MonkUnit]

It's a glitch that I can't fix.

 

[Hunch]

It's a glitch that I can't fix.

Gotcha. Well regardless I think it's a great change. Definitely adds playability to the stage.

I'm really enjoying this release. The level of polish really shows the work put into this.

 

[Muhznit]

Bit of nitpicking here, BPC, but wouldn't be an overall better idea to say what's changed from VBrawl rather than whatever the previous version might've been. You know, just in case people have never actually played minus before.

 

[Linkshot]

The problem with that, Muhznit, is that most of us don't even remember all the precise changes. The people that made the first alphas didn't keep changelists...

 

[Muhznit]

You don't NEED to remember the precise changes. Let alone list off every single one. Just look through the PSAs and make note of what's different from the vBrawl version. Floating points may be an issue, but you can generalize those by saying "Samus's super missles have massive acceleration now" or something. No one except devellopers need the precise numbers, just an idea of what to expect.

 

[Linkshot]

I did that for Mario back in 1.6. Even just doing Mario took a full hour and mentally wiped me out because there are over 300 SubActions to compare.

 

[DVDV28]

So how long should I expect to wait before the PAL port?