3DS Community Patch Notes v1.0.4 -- Engine Changes to DI

[Thinkaman]

How noticeable is this? I messed around with it in 1.0.4 and it doesn't seem appreciably better from what I can tell.

It's not huge, but it's not a tiny difference either.




Palutena utilt and dtilt lower cooldown confirmed!

Palutena also comfirmed to have ftilt and usmash and fsmash and dsmash unchanged timing-wise.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

For Ike, the Ike boards have noticed overall that his Jab combo flows better. Greninja no longer pops out like a slippery eel. Yoshi and a few others still can block the last hit, but its an improvement.

Dsmash also has a more horizontal angle in knockback angle.

Nair combos better. (Not 100% of all of the aspects of this, almost for sure a lowering of knockback so it combos longer, may or may not be a tad faster in some way, not the easiest move in the world to test)

 

[Thinkaman]

Pit down b is the same timing-wise.

 

[M@v]

Specifically who since Falco's DACUS works fine.

It does? I just heard it was gone in general. If falco has it though, that means everyone has it. DACUS is a mechanic that affects everyone.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

lel i am stepping on panda's toes again

imo @ SamuraiPanda to avoid clutter you should just add the stuff that's been changed, although that list of kirby data was fascinating, it's just a lot of text when it essentially says "untouched"

Also I'll fix the shulk stuff you wrote up

 

[Thinkaman]

It does? I just heard it was gone in general. If falco has it though, that means everyone has it. DACUS is a mechanic that affects everyone.

I just tried Falco's DACUS. I got the input perfect, and it didn't come out.

 

[Ray_Kalm]

Came here to say this.

As for Ganondorf, he no longer has landing lag after a full hop Air Dodge. I believe that previously Ganondorf would have landing lag even if he air dodged from the peak of his double jump. A welcome change.

Airdodge landing lag only occurs if you airdodge near to the ground now.

 

[M@v]

It didn't work for you, but ffamram said it worked for him. X_x ughhhhhhhh lol. ^Is that the character you are best at it with?

 

[-RedX-]

Not too sure about Dsmash since I tested that 20 minutes after the patch was out, which was around 3 AM for me. Seems same-y. Nobody can shield Ike's jab3 if the 1st 2 hits, its just Yoshi can do silly things like double jump armor vs jab3. It doesn't combo properly on him and a few others probably but Greninja problem is gone so I'm content.

 

[LancerStaff]

Then you haven't been paying attention.
Seriously, there were times where 100% Charge Shot at FD's halfway point would hit Pit if he engaged the move at the same time as Samus' firing.
Now, it's at least twice as fast.

I really can't say for sure. I messed around with it earlier and didn't notice a thing, but now that you mention it I'm starting to doubt myself. Placebo effect hng.

@ Thinkaman Can you test Pit's Dspecial?

 

[Thinkaman]

Airdodge landing lag only occurs if you airdodge near to the ground now.

I can confirm this. Air dodges AC window has been moved up to the air dodge IASA window. (Like it always should have been.)

 

[Hartenberg]

Posted this in the wrong thread at first. My b.
Been messing around with and everything seems almost identical. The only difference I've seen is that side b doesn't ko as easily. And that just might be my imagination.

 

[Kofu]

I just spent a lot of time very exhaustively going through Villager and comparing him to the (awesome) Villager data thread on damage/knockback that can be found at http://smashboards.com/threads/comprehensive-villager-data-edge-and-floor-attacks.368614/ . I observed the following:


-Fair far hitbox now does 4% (from 3%). Bair far hitbox now does 5% (from 3%). The near hitboxes on both are unchanged, but this does mean the far versions do more knockback (since damage affects knockback).
-Riding Lloid Rocket's high damage hitbox now does 16% (from 17%). Knockback seems unaffected. Neither custom version of side special is affected nor is the unridden rocket damage. I couldn't confirme the damage of rocket under odd circumstances (self-destruct/hitting wall) because it's really hard to test and niche.

I'm pretty sure Villager has no other damage/knockback changes. Anyone with 1.0.3 who can confirm that the Villager thread was accurate in the first place and thus that these are real changes would be appreciated.

I could be wrong but I did a bit of testing before I downloaded the patch and his FAir and BAir actually have three damage variables. Up close, they did 7/9%, just beyond that, 4/5%, and at max distance 2/3% (first is FAir, second is BAir). And IIRC riding Lloid did 16%. These were done in Training Mode.

 

[Meloetta Star]

Once we have the previous patch kill %s then we can add to OP

Getting these exact same kill %'s for Rosalina and Luma in 1.0.3.

 

[BlueBirdE]

I'm about to have 1.0.3 and 1.0.4 side by side. I'll be able to test stuff super fast, including verify timing changes. I don't even know where to start. What needs doing?

Can you see if luigis up b hitbox is a little bigger? whether the hitbox has increased horizontally or vertically.
Also if luigi has less traction and trajectory of his throws.

 

[Ffamran]

It does? I just heard it was gone in general. If falco has it though, that means everyone has it. DACUS is a mechanic that affects everyone.

Just checked more characters: Luci can do it, Ganondorf can do it, and Doc can do it. So, it's safe to say that DACUS is here to stay.

 

[Protom]

Didn't see it on the list on OP, (though I guess someone pointed it out) but mega mans up air tornado is now larger.

 

[Conda]

Question for those who can test:

Is Samus's roll longer? I can roll 1/4 the length of FD now. I'm not sure if that was the case before. Her roll is still slowasforks

Both of these come in contradiction to initial observations where TripleD apparently lost his spike on a canceled UAir.

The loss of spike properties is likely the thing that's making the vacuum slightly weaker now - less stringent control of your target when hitting them with these multihits. Now the force isn't as strong, so you don't get the spike any more.

That's my guess, seems to make sense.

 

[Thinkaman]

Just checked more characters: Luci can do it, Ganondorf can do it, and Doc can do it. So, it's safe to say that DACUS is here to stay.

What input are you doing?


Edit:
Also, confirming just in case that Lucario's (very significant) increase in special landing lag is real.

 

[LordFluffy]

I really can't say for sure. I messed around with it earlier and didn't notice a thing, but now that you mention it I'm starting to doubt myself. Placebo effect hng.

@ Thinkaman Can you test Pit's Dspecial?

Already been tested by me and him, its the same.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

For Ike, the Ike boards have noticed overall that his Jab combo flows better. Greninja no longer pops out like a slippery eel. Yoshi and a few others still can block the last hit, but its an improvement.

Dsmash also has a more horizontal angle in knockback angle.

Nair combos better. (Not 100% of all of the aspects of this, almost for sure a lowering of knockback so it combos longer, may or may not be a tad faster in some way, not the easiest move in the world to test)

Give me specifics pl0x (i.e. confirm something like "2nd hit of jab combo doesn't have as much knockback making it more consistent)

I'll wait on Thinkaconfirmingman for the Dsmash.

 

[M@v]

I just tried Falco's DACUS. I got the input perfect, and it didn't come out.

Just checked more characters: Luci can do it, Ganondorf can do it, and Doc can do it. So, it's safe to say that DACUS is here to stay.

Vids if possible?

 

[Yikarur]

The Rosalina changes I posted should cover all her changes.

 

[Thinkaman]

Question for those who can test:
Is Samus's roll longer? I can roll 1/4 the length of FD now. I'm not sure if that was the case before. Her roll is still slowasforks

Samus roll is the same distance.

 

[NairWizard]

I can confirm this. Air dodges AC window has been moved up to the air dodge IASA window. (Like it always should have been.)

This is the most serious change for competitive play imo. Being able to airdodge consistently again is great.

 

[DaisukeReds]

I think the Greninja Up Smash nerf was uncalled for.. Well, at least I hope they fixed DeDeDe's bug if not solved already.. haven't seen it in a while.

 

[Amazing Ampharos]

I could be wrong but I did a bit of testing before I downloaded the patch and his FAir and BAir actually have three damage variables. Up close, they did 7/9%, just beyond that, 4/5%, and at max distance 2/3% (first is FAir, second is BAir). And IIRC riding Lloid did 16%. These were done in Training Mode.

You have to be at absolute tip range but that does still seem to be the case which means no fair/bair changes on Villager. It's strange that such a detailed topic would so drastically miss the hitbox behavior of such core Villager moves. They could have just misrecorded that random side-B damage value too; I'd believe that.

Either way, everything else in 1.0.4 matches their observations at least in terms of damage/knockback. This patch is likely not significant to Villager.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

lel i am stepping on panda's toes again

imo @ SamuraiPanda to avoid clutter you should just add the stuff that's been changed, although that list of kirby data was fascinating, it's just a lot of text when it essentially says "untouched"

Also I'll fix the shulk stuff you wrote up

Yeah no I just saw that most of it was normal. I was gonna go through it later to touch it up to only include changes... which seems to be none?

I am compiling lists to do a burst of an update at once. I'll PM you when I want to edit and you tell me if I'm good or not. I got Villager and more shulk queued up atm. I want @ Thinkaman to confirm shulk 2 hit consistency (i.e. 1st hit reduced KB) before I include him tho

 

[Ffamran]

I just tried Falco's DACUS. I got the input perfect, and it didn't come out.

Buddy, I'm gonna prove you wrong, that I will.

More tests: Fox, Ike, and Shulk can as well.

I think the timing's changed a bit. As in either it changed or it's much tighter.

 

[Thinkaman]

What input are you doing?/quote]





Confirmed all 3 DDD changes.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Yeah no I just saw that most of it was normal. I was gonna go through it later to touch it up to only include changes... which seems to be none?

I am compiling lists to do a burst of an update at once. I'll PM you when I want to edit and you tell me if I'm good or not. I got Villager and more shulk queued up atm. I want @ Thinkaman to confirm shulk 2 hit consistency (i.e. 1st hit reduced KB) before I include him tho

yeah that list was normal, you can check it through the history button next to the edit button, as long as the data gets saved, you literally cannot lose it

if something does get saved over I can recover it easy for you

Gonna do some work now, so I'll be gone for liek 30 mins but the PM thing sounds good <3

 

[WT!]

This isn't fair (no pun intended) sheik is getting so much hate!

 

[Aunt Jemima]

lel i am stepping on panda's toes again

imo @ SamuraiPanda to avoid clutter you should just add the stuff that's been changed, although that list of kirby data was fascinating, it's just a lot of text when it essentially says "untouched"

Also I'll fix the shulk stuff you wrote up

My beautiful Kirby data that has no significance regarding the character... removed!

CRI CRI

But seriously, it basically is "untouched", haha. Under Kirby's section, you can add that some information regarding Kirby's Copy Abilities...


Buffs:
Falco's Copy Ability shoots lasers faster and has shorter ending lag.

Nerfs:
Rosalina's Copy Ability has Luma cover less distance.
Jigglypuff's Copy Ability can no longer be used for Hyper Rollout.
Robin's Copy Ability can no longer be used for Thoron Jump Refresh.

 

[Sproll]

K well I'm messing around with Luigi and I noticed this so far:
Tornado- Damage increased from 8% to 9% when all hits land.
Everything else (beside F Smash already mentioned) seems to be the same

 

[thrillagorilla]

This may seem to come out of nowhere, but if people are wanting to test horizontal distance changes might I suggest using the FD version of Mushroomy Kingdom? There are 20 blocks to make up the entirety, each one is split into three parts on top.

 

[Yikarur]

Shulks Jab1 is unchanged (on Mario)

 

[Captain Norris]

so nothing at all on Falcon?
I guess that's a good thing, but it is unexciting.

 

[Delzethin]

@ Thinkaman , if you get the chance can you check Robin's short hop height? I'm talking to a guy who's getting SH Levin fair->double jump off easier, and he thinks it might be because Robin's short hop goes higher now.

Or maybe Levin fair has less cooldown now.

Or maybe it's a placebo. Hell if I know. >_>

 

[M@v]

Buddy, I'm gonna prove you wrong, that I will.

More tests: Fox, Ike, and Shulk can as well.

I think the timing's changed a bit. As in either it changed or it's much tighter.

Let us know; including if its a tighter timing now or different timing.

 

[WT!]

Also it's only a matter of time before pivot cancelling is removed. WHY! WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!