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Wreck-It Bowser
- Thread starter Liquid Gen
- Start date
B!squick
Smash Master
Though much simpler by comparison, they made DeDeDe look epic as well as Shiek. It's clear they put a LOT of thought into the costumes. I'm sure we will not be disappointed when Bowser finally takes the stage.
According to a thread in tactical the best move Bowser can use against vertical knockback is DAir. Both FAir and DAir cancel the same momentum (provided you're pressing downward as you FAir) but DAir reduces Bowser's hurtbox, which can prevent him from touching the blast zone.
I remember reading a dispute about that a while back so here it is.
I remember reading a dispute about that a while back so here it is.
Riddle
Smash Lord
That's actually really cool. Makes sense when you think about it though.
Jupz
Smash Master
Someone should dress up as a boozer at Genesis.
I'm moving in as the nineteenth century newspaper boy.
Overclassed
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- May 4, 2009
- Messages
- 246
Riddle
Smash Lord
And Klaw Hop around alot. Then they need to grab someone with their Koopa Klaw and do a flying slam thingy.
-Kagato-
The Final Boss
I Flying Slam on a daily basis already. Sadly I have no Bowser costume....
B!squick
Smash Master
I Flying Slam the LADIES! Yeeeaaahhh, you fellas know what I'm talkin' about, am I right? 
Riddle
Smash Lord
Wrong, nobody flying slams anybody. The move is now known as the Murder Hug.
Riddle
Smash Lord
How is murder hug unmanly?
Who here plays Bowser in every single tournament match? I do, but that doesn't really count, because DDD's infinite is banned where I am.
JOE!
Smash Hero
Hmn, can we infinate grab-release DDD?
i know its unlikley we get the grab on him 1st, but it would create much lulz
i know its unlikley we get the grab on him 1st, but it would create much lulz
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
Irony! That would be the lutziest non-ditto match-up ever.
Please tell me you guys can do this.
B!squick
Smash Master
Probably. Vex Kasrani would know fo' sure.
JOE!
Smash Hero
I think there is like 1 frame where he can escape...but there is nothing he can really do during it
(from testing done in slow-mo Training mode...)
Anywho, anyone done Boozer testing in BBrawl yet?
(from testing done in slow-mo Training mode...)
Anywho, anyone done Boozer testing in BBrawl yet?
Hobobloke
Atemon Game
I'm going to start posting more here again and actually update my Q&A thread now.
B!squick
Smash Master
I haven't gotten around to BBrawl yet, though I probably will shortly since GH: Smash Hits or whatever is an even bigger let down than I'd first imagined. **** you Activison and the cancer you have become to the Guitar Hero franchise.
**** you Activison and the cancer you have become to the Guitar Hero franchise.
Riddle
Smash Lord
Lol at the people doing BBrawl thinking we need MORE killing options. We can kill well enough without the Dair Spike. Make our jump faster!!!
B!squick
Smash Master
Well, since they took out grab release combos, yes, Bowser would actually need another option to deal damage as well as to kill. I asked one of the creators and he assured me DAir was even a good approach option. I haven't gotten around to trying it out though. I want to, since it seems better than B+.
B!squick
Smash Master
I thought so, too. And I told him about as much. Here is my message and his reply:
Me:
I'm really intrigued by your version of a better Brawl. One reason why I didn't like Brawl+ was because the added hit and shield stun only highlighted a fundamental flaw that Bowser has and that is the relationship of his hurtbox, hitboxes, and overall lag. That and they seem to update the code list on a daily basis and I honestly can't be bothered.
Now you and Amazing Am "claim", and I'm just gonna paraphase this, that you made BBrawl in attempt to balance the game by removing infinites, tweaking various characters and stages, yadda yadda yadda, without really changing how the game was played unless you really <3 D3's chain grabs. It was mentioned that you wouldn't have to relearn a character.
... You don't know how vital Bowser's grab release game is, do you? His chain regrabs and other options from a release is what really gives Bowser a chance to win against some characters. DeDeDe doesn't need his infinites and chains to be good, it's just a bonus against several characters, namely Bowser, so no complaints there. Bowser's grab release game in essential at racking up damage and even killing.
That said, I'll now go into a bit depth with his buffs.
... And this does not sit well with me. While it's been awhile since I've really viewed Yoshi vids, but I'm pretty sure they neglect DAir with good reason.
And to answer your question, it stops Bowser alot. Defensive Bowser > Offensive Bowser
Overall, on the surface, the additions don't seem worth the subtraction of Bowser's grab release, though hot having to worry about that **** penguin brings me some solace at least.
Also, a while back I got the Homebrew Channel for B+ back when it was in 3.0. How do I go about getting BBrawl exactly? I'm a noob at hacking, lol.
Thinkaman:
I'm glad you are interested!
Bowser is actually one of my secondaries, and I learned firsthand from Sliq how important and fundamental the grab releases are to Bowser! Make no mistake there, we are fully aware of this.
Because of this we have had to go the extra mile with Bowser to make sure he is competitive. He received more attention and iterations than most characters during development.
Bowser's dair is actually a very useful and important change, that is worth shaking up Bowser's game a little for. Normally, Bowser jumping at an enemy with a fair forces them to block it, and effortlessly punish Bowser; all Bowser players know how bad the landing lag on fair is. Sometimes Bowser can get side-Bs when the opponent shields, but that too is highly punishable in it's own way. As a Bowser player, you know all of this too well.
Dair can be used instead of fair and side-B to punish a defensive, stationary opponent that is forcing Bowser to approach. It eats through shields, and lasts long enough for the final hit to knock enemies away after their spot dodge. This forces opponents to stay mobile, where bowser's moveset (especially fair and bair) are more effective.
On top of this, the move does incredible damage when you use it to punish an enemy.
Follow the instructions at the end of the thread's first post, and you can find links to the file you need to test Bowser out and tell us what you think!
Me:
I'm really intrigued by your version of a better Brawl. One reason why I didn't like Brawl+ was because the added hit and shield stun only highlighted a fundamental flaw that Bowser has and that is the relationship of his hurtbox, hitboxes, and overall lag. That and they seem to update the code list on a daily basis and I honestly can't be bothered.
Now you and Amazing Am "claim", and I'm just gonna paraphase this, that you made BBrawl in attempt to balance the game by removing infinites, tweaking various characters and stages, yadda yadda yadda, without really changing how the game was played unless you really <3 D3's chain grabs. It was mentioned that you wouldn't have to relearn a character.
... You don't know how vital Bowser's grab release game is, do you? His chain regrabs and other options from a release is what really gives Bowser a chance to win against some characters. DeDeDe doesn't need his infinites and chains to be good, it's just a bonus against several characters, namely Bowser, so no complaints there. Bowser's grab release game in essential at racking up damage and even killing.
That said, I'll now go into a bit depth with his buffs.
I don't understand the jargon. Mind giving me more a visual comparison to something I already know?
Okay, that works. I can't see how you compare it to Rock Smash and Yoshi's DAir as they both seem like very different things, so for now I'll just think of it as similare to Yoshi's DAir.
... And this does not sit well with me. While it's been awhile since I've really viewed Yoshi vids, but I'm pretty sure they neglect DAir with good reason.
Still punishable? See, going back to Bowser's fundamental flaws, what it translates to is Bowser being quite limited in his approach options. When I first looked at this new DAir I had hoped Bowser had a new approach option, but that doesn't seem to be the case.
And to answer your question, it stops Bowser alot. Defensive Bowser > Offensive Bowser
Such as...?
So it's a more reliable way to Bowsercide? Is that really what everyone thinks Bowser is good at? Waiting for that opportunity to SideB offstage when you're down to your last stock?
Eh. UTilt is better for the most part. Remember what I said about hitboxes?
Kill moves killing sooner seems good. Though not being able to grab release to FTilt...
Okay. I guess this good since Jab cancelling into a grab isn't as good as it use to be. But overal this seems quite pointless, lol.
Dash attack is too laggy to be used outside of a grab release but OH, darn, can't do that now, can we? This is REALLY pointless.
His best aerial, why not, right?
Neat.
Overall, on the surface, the additions don't seem worth the subtraction of Bowser's grab release, though hot having to worry about that **** penguin brings me some solace at least.
Also, a while back I got the Homebrew Channel for B+ back when it was in 3.0. How do I go about getting BBrawl exactly? I'm a noob at hacking, lol.
Thinkaman:
I'm glad you are interested!
Bowser is actually one of my secondaries, and I learned firsthand from Sliq how important and fundamental the grab releases are to Bowser! Make no mistake there, we are fully aware of this.
Because of this we have had to go the extra mile with Bowser to make sure he is competitive. He received more attention and iterations than most characters during development.
Bowser's dair is actually a very useful and important change, that is worth shaking up Bowser's game a little for. Normally, Bowser jumping at an enemy with a fair forces them to block it, and effortlessly punish Bowser; all Bowser players know how bad the landing lag on fair is. Sometimes Bowser can get side-Bs when the opponent shields, but that too is highly punishable in it's own way. As a Bowser player, you know all of this too well.
Dair can be used instead of fair and side-B to punish a defensive, stationary opponent that is forcing Bowser to approach. It eats through shields, and lasts long enough for the final hit to knock enemies away after their spot dodge. This forces opponents to stay mobile, where bowser's moveset (especially fair and bair) are more effective.
On top of this, the move does incredible damage when you use it to punish an enemy.
Follow the instructions at the end of the thread's first post, and you can find links to the file you need to test Bowser out and tell us what you think!
Thunderbolt333
Smash Apprentice
I tryed B+ with bowser I compleatly hate it.I hope people don't start useing B+ for tournies tbh.Off topic it blows that there isn't more bowser players so I'm gona start recruiting people to 2ndary/main bowser where ever I go so theres more of us.
B!squick
Smash Master
Woo! And yeah, I didn't like B+ either. I hoping to have more fun with BBrawl if I ever get around to getting it.
B!squick
Smash Master
And yet he still doesn't use Bowser in tournies.
Vex... I am disappoint.
Vex... I am disappoint.
Thunderbolt333
Smash Apprentice
No one eles is going to herb2 are they?I hate to be the only bowser reping there out of 80+ people
B!squick
Smash Master
I only just now heard of it, no. Where's it at?
Thunderbolt333
Smash Apprentice
greensboro NC M2K and mango are going there I asked the NC social group if there was any more bowsers cept me that are from NC they said there was one but he quit lol.If you could come that would be great tho but idk its kinda a far drive from where your at.heres the link http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=230210.
JOE!
Smash Hero
Oh snap:
*BOWSER*
+2% on up-b (opening grounded hit)
Fortress is an important move for Bowser, as it is his fast OoS option -OR- a viable "backup" KO move if fresh. I suggest buffing it to further compensate for the removal of his other reliable KOs from grab release. Playtesting showed this move surprisingly effective against ranged characters due to their frequently slower grabs. (Or lack of armor in Olimar's case.)
they BUFFED fortress....
*BOWSER*+2% on up-b (opening grounded hit)
Fortress is an important move for Bowser, as it is his fast OoS option -OR- a viable "backup" KO move if fresh. I suggest buffing it to further compensate for the removal of his other reliable KOs from grab release. Playtesting showed this move surprisingly effective against ranged characters due to their frequently slower grabs. (Or lack of armor in Olimar's case.)
they BUFFED fortress....
SuSa
Banned via Administration
If you have anyone able to do frame data - or if you have frame data for your pummel please let SuSa know in his thread as it will benefit your character:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=240662
SuSa is using a formula to find each % that you can safely add a pummel before throwing. This can allow you to guarentee extra damage without losing your throw. So help him help you.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=240662
SuSa is using a formula to find each % that you can safely add a pummel before throwing. This can allow you to guarentee extra damage without losing your throw. So help him help you.
Hobobloke
Atemon Game
Lord Bowser also refers to himself in third person because Lord Bowser is "teh awesome"
Aside from that fact Lord Bowser thinks it wouldn't be useful for Bowser because we rarely ever throw, we want them to break out.
Aside from that fact Lord Bowser thinks it wouldn't be useful for Bowser because we rarely ever throw, we want them to break out.
B!squick
Smash Master
Right, but knowing when they break could be vital. Having an idea before hand could be helpful for buffering what you want to do after the release.
megajosh2
Smash Cadet
I forget too often to abuse those grab releases...
B!squick
Smash Master
So, Vex, you have to tell us about Genesis. How was it? Did you go all Bowser and make my fantasies a reality? XD Also, I recently found Chibo's YouTube channel a recently posted crew battle. Good matches. I had no idea Chibo's ROB was so sick. O.o
Thunderbolt333
Smash Apprentice
ever had a itch that you couldn't scratch?
B!squick
Smash Master
Not really. My hair is long enough so that I can reach back and touch it without reaching and I haven't had to scratch the part of my back it covers... ever.
Thunderbolt333
Smash Apprentice
LMAO beasty