VaNz Stuff.. about Peach (Tactical Discussion)

[JamesBJames]

Juushichi, there's no reason you should be up at 6:00 AM on Thanksgiving. You need sleep.

Personally I think any DJC aerial with peach is really situational -- although to be fair, I probably haven't given it that much thought.

 

[.Ðempt]

@MacD: You're fine, relax lol. I had a feeling as such that would be the case. It's just when I DJC them super low and hit the L Cancel, it just felt like it was faster. But I'm well aware of the Peach NAir video that was put out ages ago and they used FC NAirs, as that was the faster of the two.

@Jaiye: Same to you. I ask more in confidence, not because I didn't know. Even that being said, this is still a whole new ground for me.

@Wake: I'm picking her up, lol. Recently have been having fun with her.

Overall, I'll probably start paying closer attention in here, just to see what's being discussed. I gotta say, for some reason or another, I really like the technical aspect of her game. Playing against Jaden when he's on my shield is like trying to pass through a wall, and I'm actually interested in learning more. Definitely not "noob" status, but I'm new to the character.

 

[Wake]

Yeah Vanz is technical.

You play a few characters now don't you? lol

 

[.Ðempt]

Oh I know he is lol Very used to playing Jaden since he's about 30 mins away

Yeah, I kinda have a few, lol. Main Marth, secondary Fox/Falco, other characters are probably Sheik, Falcon, Ganon, Samus (only going to C Tier lol).

I'm in the process of learning a couple other new ones, but right now I'm mainly learning Peach and IC's. But they're nothing special lol.

 

[Jethrotex]

Are you saying your Peach isn't anything special? Because if not, that means you came into the Peach boards and said Peach isn't something special.

O^O

 

[.Ðempt]

No damnit lol just mine

 

[MacD]

i wasn't directing that hate at you, but i was genuinely curious how there are so many people who seem to not know that answer

it's just soooo confusing

 

[crush]

sup mccain

Wat if instead of the cain stain u were just ronald donald

Ronald mcdonald lavelle hahahahaaaha

 

[.Ðempt]

i wasn't directing that hate at you, but i was genuinely curious how there are so many people who seem to not know that answer

it's just soooo confusing

Probably cause a lot of people don't care to know lol but I have no idea how many people are asking either.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Everyone who's tried to learn this character asks about DJC nairs.

We give them all the same answer.

I maintain we should have started mixing it up to cause a stir but *shrug*

 

[MacD]

sup mccain

Wat if instead of the cain stain u were just ronald donald

Ronald mcdonald lavelle hahahahaaaha

LOOOOOL cain stain

you are too good little dude

Everyone who's tried to learn this character asks about DJC nairs.

We give them all the same answer.

I maintain we should have started mixing it up to cause a stir but *shrug*

why have we not done this before now

 

[Jethrotex]

You should just develop a bot to automatically answer the question by sensing the key components of each post.

 

[Xyzz]

Breaking news: Major advances in Artificial Intelligence brought forward by bored Peach players

It's rather hard to get the meaning of a text in natural language. Google are pretty amazing at that thing, but they have an incredible amount of data to analyze and the CPU power to do it... so it's pretty unfair

 

[Rosedemon]

We're gay, we have unicorns.

Google cant compete with unicorns.

 

[Xyzz]

Unicorns are related to magic. Everything is possible if you work THE MAGIX :D

 

[ShroudedOne]

Unicorns are related to magic. Everything is possible if you work THE MAGIX :D

I only just now caught this. Season 3 has started, and I haven't watched a single one yet. I need to get on that.

Vidjo dropping being useful?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=qLNWY3scJ-M#t=115s

 

[Xyzz]

Ponies are mean, they don't show up in my anime rss feed and make me put in the extra 20 seconds to look for them on youtube lol :D
But they are super cute, so it's all right.


That shield pressure is funny... although I don't really go for dair stuff anyways. I feel Fc Nair/fair into grab / dsmash / jab / dash away covers everything pretty nicely already.

 

[Xyzz]

Ahahah, sorry for the double post, but while we were at the topic of ponies... I just got linked to this:
http://www.sporcle.com/games/sproutcm/my-little-pony-or-porn-star and I think it's pretty hilarious.

 

[john!]

Ahahah, sorry for the double post, but while we were at the topic of ponies... I just got linked to this:
http://www.sporcle.com/games/sproutcm/my-little-pony-or-porn-star and I think it's pretty hilarious.

i missed 7 of them and i consider myself an expert on both subjects...

 

[ShroudedOne]

33/45

I'm so bad...

 

[Xyzz]

Well, I'm pretty content with my result, and I only got one more than you did, Shrouded. Then again, I was mostly guessing "Does that name sound lewd to me?" :D

 

[Cia]

Ahahah, sorry for the double post, but while we were at the topic of ponies... I just got linked to this:
http://www.sporcle.com/games/sproutcm/my-little-pony-or-porn-star and I think it's pretty hilarious.

wow.. i got 28/45

wth..

floored @ "lickety-split"

 

[Xyzz]

Waveshine oos > upsmash is super annoying :x :D
Well, kinda happy to have a Fox player this technical nearby now... but goddammit, being forced to be super precise on aerials > stuff is annoying.

 

[baka4moé]

31/45, though i dont watch mlp. that was fun lol

 

[The Irish Mafia]

I only just now caught this. Season 3 has started, and I haven't watched a single one yet. I need to get on that.

Vidjo dropping being useful?: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=qLNWY3scJ-M#t=115s

jesus christ mikael was godlike

 

[Ryobeat]

Does anyone want to help me understand what I need to do vs ICS? I understand its a good matchup, but down smashes get predictable and leads to grabs that I dont understand the DI too. Help?

 

[Xyzz]

Armada once said something which we were able to sum up nicely: Threaten to hit them with fair, so you can hit them with fair, which leads to you being able to hit them with more fairs.

 

[ShroudedOne]

For DI'ing out of the dthrow > dairs, I'm fairly certain that you need to SDI up + away on the dairs...

 

[silentSWAG]

down and away

 

[ShroudedOne]

For people who fall faster, yes, but I think characters like Peach and Marth need to do Up + away. At least, that is what I've been doing, and read. I'll look into it, though.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Peach is up

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

jesus christ mikael was godlike

When I first found out about competitive smash he was my fav peach and I use to argue with a friend b/c I said he was the best in the world

 

[The Irish Mafia]

**** nana really hard. groundfloat bair is good for walling her out and baiting popo into your bair dsmash. jump around and throw turnips and remember that you kinda need to be on the ground and probably shielding to get grabbed, so don't do that.

 

[silentSWAG]

ok that makes sense

 

[silentSWAG]

hey whats the best way to di marths f-throw
i keep geting dash attacked and faired
:'(

 

[ShroudedOne]

down + away

 

[Ryobeat]

down + away

What is the worst your gonna eat?

 

[KirbyKaze]

What is the worst your gonna eat?

Literally? Tipper f-smash that's DIed badly because you tech rolled to the edge and held the direction (and subsequently died at like 30%). But that's also a huge gamble on his part since it's hard to do and if you do anything else his positioning isn't very good for it.

Small note: On YS at low percents if he's tossing me off I sometimes DI into him so he has to combo rather than chancing slope BS. When spike goes online and kills this obviously doesn't work but I hate chancing random tippers at stupid low percents on that level. It's not worth it IMO unless you're super confident you'll get it. 20% throw combo is manageable - dying at 20% is not.

That said, that's a situational exception to the rule. In general force him to tech chase you. Doiwn and away from either directional throw.

Marth's tech chases are very manageable because it builds damage slowly (regrabs work in segments of 4-7%?) and Peach has an awesome reversal if he's even slightly off. He lacks a good ground normal that he can launch with like Sheik f-tilt or Peach dash attack, so his conversions are limited. He often tries to jump and aerial to transition but this obviously gives you a clue as to how to tech to escape (if he dairs forward, rolling through him is great and so forth - he can obviously use this as a bait but most will want to try to start the combo and commit to an option or try to fade to cover 2 or 3).

If you DI in, he gets an air combo. Air combos are significantly less manageable because if he holds you at a good height and prevents you from going into the stratosphere by hobbling you carefully with strategic soft hits (namely fair) and purely horizontal moves (fair again, but nair is really underrated for comboing Peach) then you can get stuck in positions where your airborne reversals and escape options can be circumvented and countered really easily. Marth is cruel. Also, f-throw > tipped u-tilt is stupid at silly KO percents if you DI the throw in (but most Marths still f-smash for some reason).

MU is mostly won by getting under him and then covering his descent with various things. Push him to the edge and keep him there since his ledge recoveries are meh compared to Fox, Falco, and Sheik's and you can zone him / pressure with turnips really effectively there (he doesn't benefit from holding the veggie so him catching it and then throwing it at you to disrupt is also less of an issue). Keep him from linking throw > kill move at all costs. Turnips are good for zoning his dash dance and pressing him to the edge but don't try to follow every single one since you're still slow and your ground covers are meh vs his dash dance & shield-WD mix - he seriously doesn't need much stage to dance around you (a lot of Peaches overextend with fair and then jab or w/e and make a move that's hard to punish easy to). Also... if you can edgeguard him decently, huge plus to you in the MU because most Peaches are terrible at it. Jumping off with attacks and trading is super pro so long as you don't get spiked or something. Same with holding the edge with lots of invincibility to force him onstage and then standing for the free hit - do your favourite combo at low percents and run by FC nair / charge d-smash otherwise. Faking the turnip throw and then going for an aerial (float the aerial or z-drop the turnip to do this), or floating out to aerial while holding a turnip and then backing off when he commits to protect himself (this is also where you chuck the veggie at him) are really good simple tricks too for disrupting his returns.

 

[Wake]

This is really cool. I've honestly never experienced fthrow->tipper utilt. Something I'm going to both implement in friendlies as Marth and watch out for as Peach. I also particularly liked what you had to say about challenging Marth's DD. That's the part I find the most difficulty with. The jab thing made a lot of sense though.

I don't know if it's any good, but has anyone messed with FC fair or any aerial I guess ->buffer roll? Maybe something interesting could come of it sometimes. I'm not sure.

 

[ShroudedOne]

I didn't read that properly. Never mind. Good advice, KK.

My issue seems to be getting fthrow > daired, lately. But that's probably just me failing to action properly.