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That sounds like a ridiculous thing to say, KirbyKaze. And yet, I must now go test it out, to see if it's worth it.
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VaNz Stuff.. about Peach (Tactical Discussion)
- Thread starter Cia
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Wake
Smash Master
probably not.
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You're pressing A before Y. When you press A while in shield, you get shield grab. Just make sure you press Y first. It isn't Y+A, it's Y, and then A right after.
And once again, KirbyKaze was right. Instant DJ landing as opposed to dash cancelling is really ****...
And once again, KirbyKaze was right. Instant DJ landing as opposed to dash cancelling is really ****...
N.A.G.A.C.E
Smash Champion
are we talking about dj landing on the ground right, like dj land to d-smash right? not dj landing on a platform. b/c if so i think i was pushing for that a while back this year and people were telling me it is to hard to do consistently
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Instant DJ landing is strictly better than wavedashing down as a braking technique. And it's faster than a shield drop.
I think dash cancel is probably better in a lot of cases, though.
I think dash cancel is probably better in a lot of cases, though.
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Wait, faster than a shield drop? As in, dropping from a platform? Or just lowering your shield?
N.A.G.A.C.E
Smash Champion
i think what he means if i understand what we r talking about. that if u wanted to drop your shield and lets say d-smash. it would be faster to dj land to a d-smash from shield
edit: looked back at my old posts and if what we r talking about is what i think it is, i was talking about this in March. so let it be known i am a trend setter and b/c of that obviously very very cool
edit: looked back at my old posts and if what we r talking about is what i think it is, i was talking about this in March. so let it be known i am a trend setter and b/c of that obviously very very cool
MacD
Banned via Administration
King5280
Smash Journeyman
is it better to instant fc nair oos of to just sh or fh nair out?
Wake
Smash Master
It really depends on the situation you're in.
King5280
Smash Journeyman
definitely situational as well. dtilt sets up awesome combos and has slightly more range in front of peach and dsmash just pours rapesauce all over them when it lands right
MacD
Banned via Administration
King5280
Smash Journeyman
lol well dtilt is still the ****
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In general, sh nair OoS is best. When you're punishing a laggy move, use FC nair OoS (like a smash attack).
Wake
Smash Master
haha I was wondering...
baka4moé
Smash Champion
so how does peach fight link? it seems like it might not really be in peach's favor? like, how do you contest his nair, and how do you approach? idk....
Wake
Smash Master
Hmm there's only 1 player that tries to go Link against me... and all I do is turnip, FC-->fair, grab... I dunno I think it's fine, but I've never played a super good Link or anything...
Fortress | Sveet
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KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
You can go berserk with aerials on Link's shield because his grab is pretty bad against airborne opponents. In exchange, down smash is less good than usual because if it does not pierce, you can be shield grabbed into an auto-combo. I'm not sure exactly what's optimal for attacking his shield, but I strongly recommend shying away from down smash unless you're behind him or you're certain it will pierce. Shield grab > d-throw > up tilt > ??? at low percents hurts, and shield grab > d-throw > uair is a real combo at medium percents and higher.
Don't jump into down airs. I know it sounds stupid, but just don't do it. He will toss that move out to come down sometimes. He's also gonna fish for it at KO percents just because he can. Think of it how Marths toss out f-smashes. Same sort of idea. Only Link's is harder to punish because he can l-cancel it.
To actually punish him for some of this stuff, I think nair oos or float nair oos work on his nair and dair when he's coming down. I also think just dash dance > dash attack, cc d-smash (vs nair, not dair) are fine options if you know he can't double jump (I think dash attack can beat his nair straight up but don't quote me on that because I'm not 100% sure; Link's nair is really good).
Regarding contesting his nair, I know you *can* beat his nair with your fair, but that's difficult because being airborne for such a long period can be risky against a character that throws explosives. Similarly, if you're above him you can aim your moves to hit him where his foot doesn't cover him but that has the same issue fair does (in addition to requiring you to be above him, which can backfire on you very easily because if he aborts mission and switches to ground game with up tilts and whatever, you have to fight your way through a sword or back off).
I think overall your best bet against nair is to work out of shield or evade > punish. Trading your nair with his nair is also a decent option because it's a very good trade; your nair does 14% and theirs does like 5% but... be careful with that sort of strategy. If they do dair instead of nair, you're gonna feel really stupid about jumping into him to trade because that... is a horrible trade for you. Similarly, timing up airs through his nair is a good way to get a beastly combo going but if they don't nair and dair instead... that can backfire. If you're thinking of trying something like that, pay very close attention to him and be very, very careful.
10chars.
Don't jump into down airs. I know it sounds stupid, but just don't do it. He will toss that move out to come down sometimes. He's also gonna fish for it at KO percents just because he can. Think of it how Marths toss out f-smashes. Same sort of idea. Only Link's is harder to punish because he can l-cancel it.
To actually punish him for some of this stuff, I think nair oos or float nair oos work on his nair and dair when he's coming down. I also think just dash dance > dash attack, cc d-smash (vs nair, not dair) are fine options if you know he can't double jump (I think dash attack can beat his nair straight up but don't quote me on that because I'm not 100% sure; Link's nair is really good).
Regarding contesting his nair, I know you *can* beat his nair with your fair, but that's difficult because being airborne for such a long period can be risky against a character that throws explosives. Similarly, if you're above him you can aim your moves to hit him where his foot doesn't cover him but that has the same issue fair does (in addition to requiring you to be above him, which can backfire on you very easily because if he aborts mission and switches to ground game with up tilts and whatever, you have to fight your way through a sword or back off).
I think overall your best bet against nair is to work out of shield or evade > punish. Trading your nair with his nair is also a decent option because it's a very good trade; your nair does 14% and theirs does like 5% but... be careful with that sort of strategy. If they do dair instead of nair, you're gonna feel really stupid about jumping into him to trade because that... is a horrible trade for you. Similarly, timing up airs through his nair is a good way to get a beastly combo going but if they don't nair and dair instead... that can backfire. If you're thinking of trying something like that, pay very close attention to him and be very, very careful.
10chars.
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Lol, Alan with the Pink Shinobi vs Germ reference.
It shocks me all the time how much Links are willing to grab. I would think that their tether is kinda risky to pull out (though it isn't as slow as Samus's, so perhaps that's the caveat). But like KK said, his D-throw is vicious on Peach, so avoid that. Uair, nair, and dair need special attention, cause those are extremely good. I just try to maneuver around his projectiles with turnips, and use those to approach. It's weird, cause he can have good spots above, below, and in front of him (this not so much), so this matchup is more difficult than you'd think. I dislike how much trouble mid/low tiers can give us.
If anyone feels like watching some Peach/Falcon. I guess general words would be nice... (It might just be because I'm the world's worst Peach, but I don't like Brinstar one bit....)
It shocks me all the time how much Links are willing to grab. I would think that their tether is kinda risky to pull out (though it isn't as slow as Samus's, so perhaps that's the caveat). But like KK said, his D-throw is vicious on Peach, so avoid that. Uair, nair, and dair need special attention, cause those are extremely good. I just try to maneuver around his projectiles with turnips, and use those to approach. It's weird, cause he can have good spots above, below, and in front of him (this not so much), so this matchup is more difficult than you'd think. I dislike how much trouble mid/low tiers can give us.
If anyone feels like watching some Peach/Falcon. I guess general words would be nice... (It might just be because I'm the world's worst Peach, but I don't like Brinstar one bit....)
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
Unrelated, but I saw this and wanted to talk about it. It seemed like an interesting, plausible way to finish a chain grab. A lot of "DI dependents" but it makes sense to hold in to protect yourself from being sent off into death from nair. More importantly, I wanted to know if anyone else had any experience with that sort of finish (nair > dash attack after up throw) and if they think it has any practical value.
ShroudedOne, you look like you have a very poor understanding of why Peach does... what she does. And why she does it a certain way. Especially in terms of follow ups. Applying pressure, combos, getting mileage out of a good position, etc. seem to be a real struggle for you.
I'll explain more later. I need to finish this reading and I'm tired.
ShroudedOne, you look like you have a very poor understanding of why Peach does... what she does. And why she does it a certain way. Especially in terms of follow ups. Applying pressure, combos, getting mileage out of a good position, etc. seem to be a real struggle for you.
I'll explain more later. I need to finish this reading and I'm tired.
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Mkay, I'll be waiting. I'm starting to realize rather quickly that while she feels natural, I am quite uncomfortable with her (if that makes sense). So I will awaiting your longer explanation, KirbyKaze.
(Don't be afraid to hurt my feelings either, I can take it)
(Don't be afraid to hurt my feelings either, I can take it)
N.A.G.A.C.E
Smash Champion
KK i am pretty sure nair to dash is DI dependent so i am not sure it has any practical value, but if i remember and get a chance i will try that next time i face a cf.
Wake
Smash Master
Yeah I'm gonna try that on Falcon next time too.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I am aware it is dependent on them DIing the nair inwards. However! Do they really have that much of a choice on how they DI the nair? If they DI it away, they can (in a lot of positions) wind up offstage in the easiest edgeguard situation of your smash career. A Falcon with no height to recover with has no options, and can be killed very easily.
I think more people should try ending their chain grabs at a random time (if the positioning's right) to see if they can get a stupid KO by preventing the opponent from getting a favourable trajectory.
Wake
Smash Master
This might be dumb but, when you guys start a chain grab on a stage with platforms, the person usually tries to DI to the closest platform. What do you guys think of sometimes throwing down at the last grab before they can reach the platform to try follow up? I was thinking of it as some sort of mix up because normally the person would be DI'ing away to reach the platform, but if they DI like that and you dthrow, couldn't Peach have some interesting follow ups? If they DI like that for the dthrow, the opponent should end up above Peach correct?
Then again, even if you could do some kind of interesting follow up, maybe Peach's follow up when she chases the opponent to the platform would be better anyways, not sure :/.
Just wondering if anyone has tried something like this.
Then again, even if you could do some kind of interesting follow up, maybe Peach's follow up when she chases the opponent to the platform would be better anyways, not sure :/.
Just wondering if anyone has tried something like this.
N.A.G.A.C.E
Smash Champion
i know u know its DI dependent idk why i wrote it like that. all i was trying to say is it was interesting and not a bad mix-up if the guy u r playing expects u to finish the cg a different way. So next time if i remember and have a chance i am going to try this.
also wake u might be right about d-throw, but my worry is d-throw is to slow and the person will be able to adjust DI when they see what u r doing. but its worth trying
also wake u might be right about d-throw, but my worry is d-throw is to slow and the person will be able to adjust DI when they see what u r doing. but its worth trying
Wake
Smash Master
Yeah I was thinking about the adjustment part too...
Degree
Smash Apprentice
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On the whole Link v Peach thing, I'm by no means a Smash expert (far from it :D) but Link was my main for years, and a good Link will make use of his 3 projectiles to try and control the space. The arrow isn't so good, but the boomerang comes back afterwards (so some will throw it in the other direction and let it come back without catching it) and Link can be mobile when pulling a bomb while you have to stay on the ground to pull your only projectile out.
Aside from that, KK mentions a lot of other things and Armada's match against HDL is a good one to study, I'm not going to pretend I can give better advice on the matchup than that haha.
Aside from that, KK mentions a lot of other things and Armada's match against HDL is a good one to study, I'm not going to pretend I can give better advice on the matchup than that haha.
N.A.G.A.C.E
Smash Champion
so i decided to go back to practicing dj landing. and back in march i found this to be very hard to do. but today it seems so easy. i feel like she jumps slow enough i can see her animation and easily get the dbj off so i dont leave the ground. I say i got it at least 80% of the time today (back in march last time i tried i was maybe 30%). the hardest part is its a fast twitch type of action and b/c of that i could see stamina coming into play. but i think its a cool thing to learn just for the swag of d-smash oos
Silly Kyle
Smash Champion
Hey guys! I didn't think my set vs. HugS at Genesis 2 was recorded, but I was wrong!
Silly Kyle vs. HugS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeW-465dhUo
yay
Silly Kyle
vs. HugS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeW-465dhUo
yay
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Tournament tomorrow...it'll be my second actual tournament...and while I'm not really planning on "going home with the gold," I do plan to learn quite a bit. But I don't know how to prepare. I know I should get some sleep, but that's about as far as I know. I'm also not sure if anything people tell me face-to-face will make sense, but I will try. (Unknown will be there, and I'm looking forward to that. Maybe I'll get JV 5 stocked for the first time ever! Yay!)
Maybe I'll just get a good rest and improvise.
Maybe I'll just get a good rest and improvise.
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Good luck
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I've been JV 5 Stocked once. I think my butthole got a bit bigger.
EDIT: Oh, this isn't the social thread. Sorry.
EDIT: Oh, this isn't the social thread. Sorry.