Upstate New York Tournament Thread

[da K.I.D.]

@Cross
because cura wont give it back to me because hes a douchebag jackhole.

@everyone asking questions about my tournament.
all the questions are going to have the same answer.

Because if it works out the way it did with the Smash 64 tournament that they ran at RIT (64+ people with 5 set ups, with one of the school clubs doing massive advertising on campus the 2 weeks before the tourney) the attendance is going to be absolutely rediculous, and I need to make sure that everything will finish on time, since smash tourneys are notorious for NOT doing that.

lower stocks= faster matches.
tons of RIT people at the tourney = me not caring about the attendance of other tournaments.

 

[MetalPat]

so glad to see KID is trying to unite his so called region that he cares so much about...
why do we want him to have this thread again? o_O

oh yeah... we dont...

 

[da K.I.D.]

right pat, because you have a bearing on who runs the thread....

Despite what people think, im still here more than anybody.

Plus, beggars cant be choosers, I got dudes asking me to run a tournament every other day. and most of the reason I dont is because of ungrateful A-holes like you.

Im also doing what is best for the community. Biggest tournament possible = more exposure for smash community. more exposure for smash community = more people playing the game seriously. more people playing the game seriously = higher attendance at tournaments all around. higher total attendance = everybody wins.

Just because the 5-10 people in this thread want to do things a certain way, shouldnt mean that I disregard whats going to work best for the 60 plus people that arent on this thread that are going to be at my event.

 

[huMps]

I still think you should try to not change the stock count.
RIT let's us play on fridays til whenever pyro gets tired and takes his set ups it seems? They let us play really late anyway.
Would it not be possible to get that same kind of treatment for this tourney? I know we would be starting earlier than 8pm but I'm just trying to figure out what you're working with that would make you consider changing the stock count.
Melee's just so fast. Sometimes it takes a stock or two to figure the opponent out. Taking away stocks could change more than just the time of the match, it could possibly change who wins.

 

[da K.I.D.]

it gives the rewards to the person who adapts faster.

if you and me are on equal ground and I figure out your strategy and tendancies before you figure out mine, why do you figure you still deserve to win?

Conversely, if I come at you with a character you didnt take the time to learn or figure out before playing me, and thus I gimmicked you out, why do you feel that its mandatory that you should have X amount of time to figure me out?

Next, RIT doesnt 'allow' pyro to do anything. To them its just a couple guys using whatever free space they can find until the place closes at 2am.
If you want to have an event with any more than a dozen people for an event that people are paying for, you have to ask to book a room ahead of time, which is why Im talking to the club that held the last tournament, since I think only clubs can reserve rooms anyway. Theres also the added fact that when you do book those rooms, you get set hours, you cant reserve the biggest room in the building for the whole day. They will give you 1pm to 9pm and send people to kick your narrow behind out the minute you dont have that room reserved for yourself anymore

And like I said earlier, just because you are willing to stay somewhere and play in a tournament until 2 am, doesnt mean everyone else is too. Could I run a tournament the normal way, and hope that I run things effectively enough to get things taken care of in the alloted time? Sure I could try, but why not put some measures in place to MAKE SURE that that happens?

Needs of the many >>> Needs of the few.

 

[huMps]

Well I guess it's what ever you think is better for the community/community growth. But I definitely disagree with the changing the stock count. Hope it's possible to keep 4.

Even if it's a one stock match the winner deserves some sort of merit, but obviously a match played with more stocks will portray a much more accurate separation in skill.

 

[Spamus43]

First of all, thanks for trying to host something. It'll be nice to drive < 3 hours to get to a tournament.

Regarding an alternate stock count, have you read any of Cactuar's thread about an overhauled ruleset? I skimmed the first few pages and there seemed to be some interesting discussion of this sort of thing.

As far as:

if you and me are on equal ground and I figure out your strategy and tendancies before you figure out mine, why do you figure you still deserve to win?

Conversely, if I come at you with a character you didnt take the time to learn or figure out before playing me, and thus I gimmicked you out, why do you feel that its mandatory that you should have X amount of time to figure me out?

.

You're right that fewer stocks rewards adaptation, but do you feel like adaptation is undervalued by the current ruleset?

And lastly, when you say the club that held the last tournament, do you mean the one that did seeding by order-of-signup and whose "loser's bracket" was really just a total reset for everyone who didn't win WF? Or has there been an "official" RIT tourney since then?


Edit:

Well I guess it's what ever you think is better for the community/community growth. But I definitely disagree with the changing the stock count. Hope it's possible to keep 4.

Even if it's a one stock match the winner deserves some sort of merit, but obviously a match played with more stocks will portray a much more accurate separation in skill.

I think the point is that a shorter match emphasizes a different type of skill. Longer matches portray a more accurate separation in tech skill, or ability to (consistently) execute. I think Goggles' argument is that ability to learn and adapt is a more valuable skill, or at least that its a skill which needs to factor more heavily in the outcome of matches.

 

[huMps]

I know, but the game we play has gimps lol

This probably wont stop me from coming but I'm just arguing my opinion

 

[da K.I.D.]

I actually read every post of that thread, good info in there.

 

[ShroudedOne]

Hmmm. I can respect logistics. But I think it'd be possible to run the tournament with 4 stocks. You probably don't plan on having pools, right? I think if we have the room from 1-9, and we start at perhaps 2:30 - 3, then you could finish on time. But that'd be dependent on the number of setups, as well. So much goes into TO'ing.

With your point about adaption, if you're the better player, you should be able to mix up your strategy during those four stocks. That's just as important as adapting to the strategy of the opponent. With 3 stocks, is enough pressure placed on the winning player to make sure that they are consistently mixing up their play?

 

[da K.I.D.]

If we need more mixups, we can just do it like 64 and do 5 stock, right?

also spamus, the club im speaking of ran a smash 64 tournament in this past fall. and they did it well, considering the number of entrants (high), the number of set ups (low) and the fact that their bracket was done on a giant white board. They also brought a bunch of arcade games, and genesis and stuff to entertain people. I beat the first four levels of gunstar heroes in between getting called for my matches lol.

 

[BetaBahamut]

I just wanna state that lowering the stock count in favor of running a tourny in time is certainly fine by me if it is unavoidable. Though lowering the stock count for actual skill reasons im uncertain about.

To bring in an example from starcraft2, its generally regarded that the longer the game goes the chance for the better player to win is widened. This is because it gives more chances to outplay or make better decisions then your opponent. This same theory is applied to in sets with BO1 not regarded very highly/fair(both in smash and starcraft) ,BO3 being the normal set count, and BO5/BO7 being used for important sets (finals/semis).

I bring this up because i feel it correlates really well with smash. go try a 99 stock match against someone better then you its almost impossible to win or even lose by a small margin.this is important because in tournaments we want the better player to win.

side note: I just wanna state that unlike starcraft the better player almost always wins in smash. We went to a tourny down in troy that was BO1 with laggy tvs and cura still won. In march when we play with 3 stocks jesse will still win.

 

[da K.I.D.]

The more important question here is why are you still losing to Cura? And why the hell did I ever give him ownership of my thread?

 

[Roller]

And then you lost to yoshi

YOSHI IS ****ING BROKEN. Nobody should feel bad about losing to him. He is stupidly op and deserves to be banned, imo.

 

[dudutsai]

I won't go to a tournament with 3 stock matches.

Just because I don't like it.

 

[Erkekjetter]

... if I do it, Im probably not going to care about whether it interferes with other events or not ...

This is sorta uncool, please at least make the effort. Having to choose between two groups would be really lame :/

 

[iRJi]

Don't be the lonely person this weekend guys. Come to my tournament!! http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=311704

Attention all players: The tournament this Saturday will continue, even if there is snow or issue’s coming at hand. Nothing will cancel this event from happening. I am trying to get a livestream up and running as well. I am also debating on running a side event where it is the Japanese ruleset, single elimination, best of 5, metaknight legal. What do you guys think?

If it’s a problem we can just do a normal side event if there is a time (IE: Mid tier’s/all brawl/etc)

 

[x13mako]

I dont have any big deal with experimenting with the rules.

 

[da K.I.D.]

This is sorta uncool, please at least make the effort. Having to choose between two groups would be really lame :/

youre right, that post yo quoted, should have read, i probably wont care IF it end up being on the same day as other events.

 

[WindMajor]

Thread ownership has been given to BetaBahamut.

 

[PieDisliker]

Finally we can get some updates in here

 

[da K.I.D.]

Youre welcome.

 

[Itsnotmyfault]

Found out I'm not working this Saturday. Will be making your tournament RJ.

 

[TheManaLord]

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=317349

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=317349

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=317349


CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES CLICK *****ES

 

[dudutsai]

Yo beta update the PR and put me at the top of it we both know I deserve the spot

 

[Sharky]

dudu's the best at flatzone and YI pipes, a clear sign of mastery of this game.

edit: oh **** beta finally got the thread get hyped. Please update the op =D

 

[Gaia_x]

The more important question here is why are you still losing to Cura? And why the hell did I ever give him ownership of my thread?

You gave me the ownership because at the time no one really like you, and you have the whole everyone "everyone hates on K.I.D im regionless thing." Though that may not be the case now and while you would most likely update this thread more than anyone else, I wouldnt ever think of giving it to you because your motives on almost everything you do a partially selfish based.

The fact that you dont care if you host a tournament that corresponds with someone else's tournament is pretty bad and absolutely not helpful to the community especially when you have new people trying to TO (Metalpat/Bcb). You hosting a tournament on the same date in which one of their tournament would hurt their attendance and result in them probably not hosting again. Which in turn gives the region less TOs. We get it, your bad ***, your gonna run a tournament and its gonna be the shizz-nit grizzle-bit. But your don't have to be a douche to other TOs to do it. I worked with Zanda in terms of dates. Brought a car of players to his tournament and he brought a car of players to mine. It only helps attendance and helps community growth.

I dont know how you think you can run a regions social thread with this mentality. Which is probably why you wont ever get the thread back.

Im with beta on the stock thing, saying your changing the stock count based on skill is ********. I could understand if it was to test out time differences in matches.

Sounds to me like if you do good in the beginning on the match, then gets spanked at the end. That pretty much means your not better than your opponent and till need to work on stuff.

Some people start off strong or finish strong. Dont punish thoses that finish strong because you play gimmicky characters that suck after the 2nd stock. (Sonic/wolf/fox/ganon)

Flight-Fight response works so that people naturally get better under pressure and stress (end of match) tone your flight response down and boost your fight response up!

Also dont make a huge long post in regards to this one cause i wont be checking smashboards for a long long time.

LOVE YOU GUYS!

-smash president aka retired doubles master ( aka if i lost in doubles it was because i was retired [aka retired before i lost to dudu+beta]) aka still da best

 

[da K.I.D.]

1.Though that may not be the case now and while you would most likely update this thread more than anyone else, I wouldnt ever think of giving it to you because your motives on almost everything you do a partially selfish based.

2. The fact that you dont care if you host a tournament that corresponds with someone else's tournament is pretty bad and absolutely not helpful to the community especially when you have new people trying to TO (Metalpat/Bcb). You hosting a tournament on the same date in which one of their tournament would hurt their attendance and result in them probably not hosting again. Which in turn gives the region less TOs.

3. I dont know how you think you can run a regions social thread with this mentality. Which is probably why you wont ever get the thread back.

4. Im with beta on the stock thing, saying your changing the stock count based on skill is ********. I could understand if it was to test out time differences in matches.

5. Some people start off strong or finish strong. Dont punish thoses that finish strong because you play gimmicky characters that suck after the 2nd stock. (Sonic/wolf/fox/ganon)

Flight-Fight response works so that people naturally get better under pressure and stress (end of match) tone your flight response down and boost your fight response up!

6. Also dont make a huge long post in regards to this one cause i wont be checking smashboards for a long long time.

1. Hello, mr. Kettle. My name is Pot. Gee, you sure are black today...

2. already explained this to erk.

3. As long as it doesn't have your name on it, that's fine with me.

4. I believe I said it was for both reasons.

5. Why not make it 5 or 6 stocks then? What's so special about 4 stock that somehow makes it better than any other arbitraily decided number other than the fact that its what we use right now.

P.s. don't talk junk about my characters when you still won't money match me in melee.

6. Hope I kept it short enough for you. And just because you choose to ignore my counter arguments, doesn't mean that I'm not still right.

 

[Erkekjetter]

youre right, that post yo quoted, should have read, i probably wont care IF it end up being on the same day as other events.

I don't want to get in between the you vs Cura argument, but can you clarify what that means?

 

[MetalPat]

I don't want to get in between the you vs Cura argument, but can you clarify what that means?

ill paraphrase for you
"im goggles. im hosting a tournament and will disregard anyone elses tournaments of that time. IF you are having a tournament, i may in the slightest bit feel some form or sadness for the community in my tiny, blackness i have where my heart for this community should be. but i probably wont care, because im goggles, and i only care about what benefits me the most and makes me look good."

 

[da K.I.D.]

What I meant is that, Im not going to intentionally plan a tournament specifically on a date that another one is taking place. But if I talk it over with the people Im working with, and it turns out that the best date for the massive RIT crowd that Im expecting is the same date as another tournament, then so be it.

Im going to make this as accessible as possible for new players so I can get the large local numbers that I want. Because the 60+ people that will show up to a properly timed smash tournament from RIT is more important to me than the 15 or so people that are spread out throughout the entire state and will drive out to Rochester. No matter how vocal you are.

Lastly, if I cared about what made me look good then the following statement wouldnt be there.

If you dont like my tournaments, or how I do things, Dont show up, Dont ask me to run events and throw your own tournaments.

 

[Gaia_x]

fest at my place during goggles tournament

 

[da K.I.D.]

because im goggles, and i only care about what benefits me the most and makes me look good."

fest at my place during goggles tournament

10laughoutlouds

 

[Sharky]

fest at my place during goggles tournament

you're just being stupid

ill paraphrase for you
"im goggles. im hosting a tournament and will disregard anyone elses tournaments of that time. IF you are having a tournament, i may in the slightest bit feel some form or sadness for the community in my tiny, blackness i have where my heart for this community should be. but i probably wont care, because im goggles, and i only care about what benefits me the most and makes me look good."

Going off of his explanation posted after this, I'm going to side with goggles. He's not trying to screw anyone over, but rather be as accessible to the new people as possible, which really is more important than anything. BTW, I think the albany kids are being hella unreasonable anyway for planning ANOTHER TWO events in march when BCB already posted the utica tourney. I'm only going to go to one, MAYBE two of these.

 

[Erkekjetter]

Woah, two events in march? That's crazy.

Thanks for the clarification/justification Goggles. Makes sense in the end, I guess. Hopefully it won't have to though.

 

[PieDisliker]

you're just being stupid


Going off of his explanation posted after this, I'm going to side with goggles. He's not trying to screw anyone over, but rather be as accessible to the new people as possible, which really is more important than anything. BTW, I think the albany kids are being hella unreasonable anyway for planning ANOTHER TWO events in march when BCB already posted the utica tourney. I'm only going to go to one, MAYBE two of these.

To be fair, I asked about the next BEST tournament taking place after the one in February. I chose the date that would be best in between those timeframes, assuming another tourney wouldn't be posted. I knew about the one on the 31st already.

 

[Sharky]

Then the issue lies with metalpat planning an event in between these two. And erk it's THREE events in march.

edit: for the record, although I do agree with your reasoning goggles, I do think you could have said it better in the first place =P

 

[MetalPat]

my date isnt even set in stone yet. i was suggesting doing it in the middle of march should the venue owner be able to set it up then. it gives a week in between all of them. the third, then a weekend off, then the 17th then a weekend off, then the 31st..

that seems pretty reasonable to me. it seems alot more prevalent than having the tournement on the third, then nothing for four weeks... then another tournament.

i honestly never thought people would be complaining about MORE tournaments in NY....


on another side note (not talking about goggles tournament), but in regards to sharky saying there are TOO MANY tournaments in eastern ny, (albany, utica) i would suggest that if youd rather not be driving to albany for all the tournaments, then start doing tournaments in other areas of new york, instead of just complaining that they are too far away. goggles is trying to start up a tournament, and i WANT to start because i know zaandaa is gonna be gone soon and that means pretty much ALL tournaments are gonna be over.

im sorry for trying to start up another monthly tournament, and for thinking into the future of tournaments opposed to just letting it all die out.

 

[Sharky]

I'm just saying I can't give up that many weekends of work in such a short period, it's got nothing to do with travel distance lol.

 

[MetalPat]

I'm just saying I can't give up that many weekends of work in such a short period, it's got nothing to do with travel distance lol.

but yet you are still agreeing that goggles put on his tournament in march.. which conflicts with "three" events in march...
makes sense.