The Official Election 2008 Thread!

[Firus]

At least Obama has some experience with foreign policy

Exactly what foreign policy experience are you talking about?

Obama hasn't really done anything. At least Palin has, despite the fact that she does have a short term that she's served as governor. I'm not saying that she has a ton of experience, but it's certainly at least on par with Obama's. I think McCain almost definitely picked her because she's a woman, but let's face it -- it's a good political strategy. The women pissed at Obama who were going to vote for Hillary for being a woman are probably attracted to McCain now because he has a female VP. It's sad and stupid, but I'm sure there are people voting for Obama just because of his race as well. There are always going to be people voting stupidly like that.

 

[Crimson King]

I think this move will either make or break McCain's campaign.

1. I think McCain only chose Palin to (sorry to use a Smash term-I can't think of a better word) counterpick Obama's "minority" status, as if to say, "Hey, he's black, she's a woman! Whoo!"
2. McCain is officially a hypocrite. How can he criticize Obama's lack of experience, and then turn around and pick Palin? What if McCain dies in office and Palin has to be in charge? At least Obama has some experience with foreign policy, along with Biden to back him up.

1. Of course he did. Obama picking Biden will be seen as a "safe" choice, and almost a complete slap in the face to his "change" campaign.

2. Then, McCain has just created what Obama didn't - a vice-president who he feels breaks the trend. If Obama dies, we get an old, white guy. If McCain dies, we get a younger, white woman. That shows his confidence in her because, likely, he'll need her.

 

[M.K]

I know this is a bit off topic from the economics disussion, but has anyone heard that Obama is already pulling the race card and McCain hasn't really even said anything?

http://rsmccain.blogspot.com/2008/06/obama-plays-race-card.html

I think the inexperience could potentially kill obama's campaign. He's saying some really dumb stuff right now, and if he keeps it up, he could make a major slip up. I just think it's really a lame move to pull out the race card, when race hasn't even been an issue with McCain's campaign.

I agree whole-heartedly.
Obama recently made a statement regarding the potency of McCain's vice president choice; Alaskan governor Sarah Palin.

If you don't know already, Sarah Palin is the mother of five kids and the wife of a man in a union (Pro-Women Voters? Check! Union Workers? Check!). She is 44 years old and has an almost impeccable record. Most people who follow women in government say she is an excellent role model for the powerful female in poltiics.

Palin's youngest son had been diagnosed with Down Syndrome some time between concepetion and birth, meaning that they knew about it before she had the baby boy.

The baby boy has been the subject of many criticisms from the Obama Campaign.

Senator Obama has stated that "her lack of proper judgement" can be seen when she did NOT abort the pregnancy when she found out about the baby's down syndrome disorder. He believes that the baby should have been aborted instead of allowed a life. How cruel, how inhumane, how intolerable, and how sickening is this statement to me? Incredibly cruel, inhumane, intolerable, and sickening. It is the epitome of a man who is on the verge of falling apart.
Obama is saying stupid things right now, but he has ALWAYS been saying stupid things. Obama is all smoke and mirrors. NOTHING will get done with him.
To quote a popular bumper sticker on Facebook:

"I hope you join me in Canada if Obama is Elected"

 

[Amide]

1. Of course he did. Obama picking Biden will be seen as a "safe" choice, and almost a complete slap in the face to his "change" campaign.

2. Then, McCain has just created what Obama didn't - a vice-president who he feels breaks the trend. If Obama dies, we get an old, white guy. If McCain dies, we get a younger, white woman. That shows his confidence in her because, likely, he'll need her.

1. Why is picking a running mate to cover up Obama's inexperience a slap in the face to change? Isn't it important to stay realistic too?

2. If Obama dies, we get an old, white guy. If McCain dies, we get a younger, white woman. That shows his confidence in her because, likely, he'll need her.
That's not a strikingly positive way to look at things, but on the inside, Biden actually would be a bigger change than to Palin. Biden disagrees with the president with everything, and is liberal, while Palin is Republican. Do you really think 'breaking the trend' is that important?

 

[IWontGetOverTheDam]

TLink_King: Don't go throwing around the word Republican like it's a bad thing. Not all Republicans are bad. Not all Democrats are good.

(I'm a Democrat, BTW)

 

[Amide]

TLink_King: Don't go throwing around the word Republican like it's a bad thing. Not all Republicans are bad. Not all Democrats are good.

(I'm a Democrat, BTW)

I'm not saying it in a bad way. It's just that when someone in a political setting says change, (believe me, I'm quite tired of that word) that would usually mean to swap in a new set of ideas. After the Clinton era, which ended rather poorly, some thought Bush was change. And from what change means, he was.

 

[M.K]

After the Clinton era, which ended rather poorly, some thought Bush was change. And from what change means, he was.

Be careful, that can go both ways in the political world.
Now that I mention it, almost anything can.
The only good reason to see Obama in office, in my opinion, is to watch him totally flop on all his plans and drive this country right off a cliff. Then I can laugh while paying my $15.35 gallon of gas to drive to the airport to go to Iraq because I was drafted.

 

[Deleted member]

Crimson King, Obama's pick with Biden has nothing to do with racial issues, and seeing it like that is just thinking pessimistically, which is hurting everyone. Sorry to inform you, but no one cares that you hate both candidates, and especially that you aren't going to vote. Be as rebellious as you want - it's not going to mean diddly. I suggest strongly you invest more thought and time into looking into both candidates and understand that your votes are needed in choosing the lesser evil.

I see Meta Kirby is taking text dumps in this thread too.. *sigh*

Anyway, Obama said that he needed someone that would constantly challenge his thinking. Biden is that man. They disagree just enough on certain issues, which effectively makes him a conscious second thought. Which is extremely healthy.

This election is really exciting. Obama really feels like the next JFK. America, don't **** this one up like last time.

 

[Aesir]

1. Of course he did. Obama picking Biden will be seen as a "safe" choice, and almost a complete slap in the face to his "change" campaign.

No offense to those who buy into that "Unite for change" Or "there needs to be change in Washington" garbage because every Candidate has been doing that. Obama Coined it and now everyone's riding the trend, it's been like that since Iowa.

Picking Biden is probably the smartest thing he could have done since we know he wasn't going to pick Hillary, as logical as that might have been. Biden brings a lot to the table.

- He takes the Criticism off Obamas lack of experience in foreign policy.

- Biden was also Obamas biggest critic, best way to shut up your opposition have them join you.

2. Then, McCain has just created what Obama didn't - a vice-president who he feels breaks the trend. If Obama dies, we get an old, white guy. If McCain dies, we get a younger, white woman. That shows his confidence in her because, likely, he'll need her.

So? I had no idea sex and age had anything to do with politics I'll be sure to remember that in the near future.

has anyone actually ever heard of this woman? I'd be surprised if they did maybe that was McCains intent bring someone into Washington who isn't part of Washington. But in Reality this just shows McCains hypocrisy he ragged on Obama for lack of experience so Obama picks a VP with experience and what does McCain do? brings in a no name inexperience VP.

100 years from now when students are learning about American history they're going to think this was a punch line to a joke.

 

[RDK]

IMO, I side with Crimson on this one. Both VP picks were utterly atrocious, and hurt their respective campaigns more than it helped.

Joe Biden? Are you kidding me Obama? Biden is the antithesis of the change movement Obama's pushing so vehemently. Plus, Biden's character is degenerate. His bid for the Democratic nomination a few elections back was destroyed because he was found to have lifted a speech off of another politician verbatim.

And Sarah Palin? Gimme a break. McCain obviously expected to coast off of the expected Obama-Clinton nomination by picking a female for VP. Did anybody even know who she was before McCain picked her? Not only is she an Alaskan governer, but she's pro-life. Way to be a liberal republican, McCain.

 

[cman]

Be careful, that can go both ways in the political world.
Now that I mention it, almost anything can.
The only good reason to see Obama in office, in my opinion, is to watch him totally flop on all his plans and drive this country right off a cliff. Then I can laugh while paying my $15.35 gallon of gas to drive to the airport to go to Iraq because I was drafted.

I think this is the point where you need to think to yourself something along the lines of 'Have my opinions been affected by propaganda?'

Rabid undead zombies aren't going to rise up because god is angry with America for choosing Obama in much the same way that choosing bush didn't end the world either. It probably won't make THAT much of a difference if Obama wins over McCain or vice versa.

But I don't think you have any opinions that weren't given to you by your pastor or parents or whoever. Am i wrong? /rantover


Anyway, the fact that McCain chose someone without much experiance doesn't seem like a very big deal to me. He already has the experience/foreign-policy side of the ticket covered right? She might provide a nice counter-balance to his opinions (though i doubt it because of how intellectually dull she seems to be). Am i the only one with the opinion that the VP should be an expert in the areas that the president is not?

Generally many opposing opinions lead to a better solution(except when they can't agree, but people who can't compromise should run and jump off of a large cliff...), do they not?

 

[lonejedi]

IMO, I side with Crimson on this one. Both VP picks were utterly atrocious, and hurt their respective campaigns more than it helped.

And Sarah Palin? Gimme a break. McCain obviously expected to coast off of the expected Obama-Clinton nomination by picking a female for VP. Did anybody even know who she was before McCain picked her? Not only is she an Alaskan governer, but she's pro-life. Way to be a liberal republican, McCain.

I totally disagree with you on McCain choosing Palin. How in any way did he hurt himself? All he did was help patch all the cricicism he has taken.

He was accused of being too liberal by Rebublican conservatives.

Palin is as conservative as they come, she's pro life, pro gun, and pro tax cuts. She's everything the conservatives have been asking of McCain, and then some.

He was accused of being too old school and couldn't compete with Obama's Change

Having a woman as a VP just proves that statement wrong now. Now people can't claim he's not one for change, theres not much else he can do to prove that he can be just changing as Obama.

And to those who attack her "credibility and experience" She's done alot to improve Alaska. She's done what anyone could do in a two year term as Govenor, and then some. She has an approval rating of 90% which is amazing.

It's already shown in polls that 21% of Clinton voters are now voting for McCain, and another 21% are undecided. If McCain can get half of the Undecided and bring it to 30%, thats a huge number. If anything, McCain just got a huge boost, not a obstacle to his election.

 

[Eor]

That 21% was before the announcement, and I honestly think that will go down. PUMA voters didn't vote for causes, they voted for Hillary, and they don't want to see someone else replace her.

And I think it hurt him because his main point was his experience, which Palin does not have. Change doesn't equal being young

 

[Crimson King]

I thought about it, and Eor, I'm not so sure. Well, the people who wanted Hillary will vote for Obama. But, I think them Feminist, ie people who JUST wanted a woman president, will see this as a great opportunity to jump on McCain, because if he dies she's president, or she can definitely campaign herself in a few years, which is great for her.

Basically, we are at an interesting junction: a relatively inexperienced president/experienced vice-president or experienced president/inexperienced vice-president. Jam said it best when he said the McCain hit Obama where it hurt: he chose "change" and something new in image, where as Obama stayed with the safe route.

It does not end either man's bid for president, but instead, it makes things interesting.

 

[Eor]

But the 21% are not pure feminists, there democratic feminists. How many of them do you honestly think are so spiteful that they'd actually vote for McCain? besides that most of them just want Hillary, it's more likely that they just won't vote.

And why does everything think young=change. That doesn't even make sense

 

[lonejedi]

But the 21% are not pure feminists, there democratic feminists. How many of them do you honestly think are so spiteful that they'd actually vote for McCain? besides that most of them just want Hillary, it's more likely that they just won't vote.

And why does everything think young=change. That doesn't even make sense

I think when people talk about palin as change, it's because she's a woman.

 

[Jam Stunna]

I think that Palin was a brilliant choice for McCain, for several reasons:

1) Change- I mean, when you're going against the man who wants to be the first black president, it's hard to position yourself in a change election with two white guys as your ticket. By having a woman as his VP, McCain takes away Obama's monopoly on the "obvious change" part of this election.

2) Appearance- Obama is a young, slim, attractive man with an attractive wife, while McCain looks like he has a goiter growing out of his neck, and his obviously mismatched marriage to a trophy wife just looks all the more glaring when compared to Obama's family. So you bring an a young, slim, attractive VP to counterbalance that. Think about it: McCain is just doing the same thing Obama did by bringing an old white guy aboard his ticket, just in reverse.

3) Surprise- I can honestly say, as an Obama supporter, I'm more excited about McCain's VP pick than Obama's. When I heard he picked Joe Biden, I thought, "That's nice," then went about my business. When I heard McCain picked Palin, I said, "Wow, she's hot, but who the hell is she?", and then proceeded to do some research on her. That right there is worth it's weight in gold: the instantaneous interest that McCain has generated around his campaign.

4) Attack/Damage Control- McCain essentially has a bulletproof VP in Palin. After all of the accusations of misogyny thrown around by the Clinton camp during the primary season, the Obama camp (and the news media in general) are going to go out of their way to not give the appearance of being overly harsh towards Palin. Obama's press release regarding her selection is the perfect example of that. The only person that can openly attack Palin is Hillary, and putting her out in the spotlight brings its own perils (like reminding all of those bitter women that Hillary lost).

5) Crossovers- Now this one may be a bit of a stretch, but I think it's pretty reasonable to assume that at least some independent voters are going to be swayed over to McCain's side thanks to his VP selection. I know a black Republican woman who is voting for Obama just because he's black, and I know she' not the only one. If people will cross over for race, who's to say that people won't cross over for gender?

If nothing else, his VP selection has made the race much more interesting.

 

[M.K]

Well, Palin's 17-year old daughter is pregnant, and plans to keep the baby. What does everyone think?
At first I believed Obama to be all over this, but to my surprise, he told the media to lay off the family, seeing as he was born to an 18-year old mother as well.

 

[Grandeza]

Does anyone else find it weird that Palin goes everywhere stressing how her son is serving in Iraq. Wouldn't that put her son in danger. I would think that raises her son's chances of say getting ambushed and taken hostage. I don't know maybe i'm crazy. Does anyone agree with me?

 

[Knyaguy]

Does anyone else find it weird that Palin goes everywhere stressing how her son is serving in Iraq. Wouldn't that put her son in danger. I would think that raises her son's chances of say getting ambushed and taken hostage. I don't know maybe i'm crazy. Does anyone agree with me?

I agree, This is like when Prince Henry of Wales was in Iraq. He will now be downgraded to a "safer" position.

 

[Crimson King]

Her daughter having a baby means nothing. It's really sick when the media attacks things like that. Had her daughter been valedictorian, a straight-edged student, no one would have said a thing, but since her daughter decided to not protect herself, they try to turn it on Palin.

 

[RDK]

I totally disagree with you on McCain choosing Palin. How in any way did he hurt himself? All he did was help patch all the cricicism he has taken.

He was accused of being too liberal by Rebublican conservatives.

Palin is as conservative as they come, she's pro life, pro gun, and pro tax cuts. She's everything the conservatives have been asking of McCain, and then some.

He was accused of being too old school and couldn't compete with Obama's Change

Having a woman as a VP just proves that statement wrong now. Now people can't claim he's not one for change, theres not much else he can do to prove that he can be just changing as Obama.

And to those who attack her "credibility and experience" She's done alot to improve Alaska. She's done what anyone could do in a two year term as Govenor, and then some. She has an approval rating of 90% which is amazing.

It's already shown in polls that 21% of Clinton voters are now voting for McCain, and another 21% are undecided. If McCain can get half of the Undecided and bring it to 30%, thats a huge number. If anything, McCain just got a huge boost, not a obstacle to his election.

I just think it's ridiculous of Obama, after toting the "change" montra for his entire campaign, to go the safe route and pick Joe Biden for VP.

I also think it's unfair at this point for the McCain camp to keep bashing Obama for being inexperienced after picking a relative nobody from Alaska as his VP.

Am i the only one with the opinion that the VP should be an expert in the areas that the president is not?

I would hope you're the only one with that opinion. The whole point of a VP is so that if the president dies or becomes unable to continue in his duties, the VP can take over exactly where he left off and run things. I just don't think Palin is ready to do that.

 

[Aesir]

The fact that the media is attacking her family is rather low I can understand if you found actual dirt on her personally. However trying to find dirt on the family and smearing her for it is just down right pre-school.

McCain obviously had to of picked her for a reason, I don't want to think McCain would pick her just to say. "hey look it this fine woman I chose as my running mate." Though McCain does like the attractive ladies so we'll just have to see.

She's one of those die-hard religious conservatives IE: Creationism in schools, pro-life, opposes gay marriage. This would just turn me off from McCain even more so then I already was. I just honestly see this as a way of McCain to get the conservative republicans to back him and possibly get some feminists as well, the ones who just want to see a woman in power. I don't see any true Hillary supporters backing McCain because of this, if they do they clearly didn't understand what she stood for. Because Palin and Clinton are absolute polar opposites.

 

[Tom]

I don't see any true Hillary supporters backing McCain because of this, if they do they clearly didn't understand what she stood for. Because Palin and Clinton are absolute polar opposites.

When someone was going to vote for Hillary and then now decided to support McCain instead of Obama, it is usually not because of the issues. Obama is as close as you are going to get to Hillary '08. What you usually hear is that they were voting for someone 'with experience,' and they would rather have the devil they know, etc... which isn't logical to me. But, oh well. More supporters is fine by me ;3

 

[DoH]

If McCain actually picked Palin in an attempt to woo jilted Hillary supporters, he must not think too highly of these women if he thinks that they will vote against their own beliefs on abortion, Iraq, taxes, and generally the conservative movement.

 

[manhunter098]

He didnt do it to take Clinton supporters. He did it because it helps him gain some appeal among younger voters and woo some of the more disillusioned feminists. Personally I do like the choice. She is a governor and even if she is new to politics, experience as a governor is extremely helpful when it comes to being prepared to act as a president. She also has a very high approval rating, and granted Alaska is run different than mosts states are, she is still certainly doing something right to have such a good approval rating. I would say she has at least as much credible leadership experience as Obama.

 

[M.K]

Interesting Factoid: If Hilary Clinton ran for Senator in her state of birth (Illinois), Barack Obama would have never gotten the job, therefore never having a say in politics, therefore, she would have had little competition in the run for president.
Just goes to show you....

 

[Jam Stunna]

Is McCain's speech scheduled for Thursday? Because if so, that's the same night as the season opener for the NFL. NFL > politics.

 

[Eor]

Interesting Factoid: If Hilary Clinton ran for Senator in her state of birth (Illinois), Barack Obama would have never gotten the job, therefore never having a say in politics, therefore, she would have had little competition in the run for president.
Just goes to show you....

If McCain hadn't been born the son of a general, he'd of never been involved in politics. If Obama had run in his home state of Hawaii, then he would of still probably been a senator. If Kerry had won, we'd of never paid much attention to either of them.

 

[Aesir]

He didnt do it to take Clinton supporters. He did it because it helps him gain some appeal among younger voters and woo some of the more disillusioned feminists. Personally I do like the choice. She is a governor and even if she is new to politics, experience as a governor is extremely helpful when it comes to being prepared to act as a president. She also has a very high approval rating, and granted Alaska is run different than mosts states are, she is still certainly doing something right to have such a good approval rating. I would say she has at least as much credible leadership experience as Obama.

There in lies the hypocrisy of McCain, he spent months criticizing Obama for the lack of experience he had and blasted him for knowing little about the current state of iraq.

Then what does he do? He picks someone who has just as much experience in politics and foreign affairs as he does. Clearly experience isn't a big deal to McCain.

McCain will probably grab votes from the Hillary supporters who just wanted a woman in office.


Another thing to point out, what the hell is Obama on? I know I said previously that picking Biden was a good choice, in all honesty it was, Biden can be a pretty good attack dog against McCain. But in all honesty I can't help but correct myself and say wtf are you thinking? you advocate change and say "we need a change in Washington." Then he sides with Biden? Mr. Credit Card Company? Give me a break.

I can't help but look at McCain and Obama and just think to myself "We're Screwed."

 

[Deleted member]

I can't help but look at McCain and Obama and just think to myself "We're Screwed."

That's okay. I'd rather you didn't vote at all then, because you don't know what you're talking about.

And believe me when I say American politics affects not only the US, not only Canada and Mexico, but the entire world. A decision so important shouldn't involve the uninformed.

So don't vote, kay?

 

[Aesir]

That's okay. I'd rather you didn't vote at all then, because
you don't know what you're talking about.

Please explain how I don't know what I'm talking about, because I'm pretty sure I'm far more informed about both Candidates then most Americans twice my age.

 

[CorruptFate]

Is McCain's speech scheduled for Thursday? Because if so, that's the same night as the season opener for the NFL. NFL > politics.

Ya it is today.

 

[M.K]

Sarah Palin's speech just exponentially soldified my trust in their leadership. Deep down, she is a hard-working mother who wants nothing but the best for all of her children. On her facade, however, she exemplifies change in the government, and is a true role model for all aspiring to be a part of politics. She proves that you don't have to be a hard-hitting, cold-hearted MAN to be sought after by one of politic's finest.

Here are some quotes from her speech last night:

I had the privilege of living most of my life in a small town. I was just your average hockey mom, and signed up for the PTA because I wanted to make my kids’ public education better. When I ran for city council, I didn’t need focus groups and voter profiles because I knew those voters, and knew their families, too. Before I became governor of the great state of Alaska, I was mayor of my hometown. And since our opponents in this presidential election seem to look down on that experience, let me explain to them what the job involves. I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a ‘community organizer,’ except that you have actual responsibilities. …"

“I’m not a member of the permanent political establishment. And I’ve learned quickly, these past few days, that if you’re not a member in good standing of the Washington elite, then some in the media consider a candidate unqualified for that reason alone. But here’s a little news flash for all those reporters and commentators: I’m not going to Washington to seek their good opinion - I’m going to Washington to serve the people of this country. …"

“Our opponents say, again and again, that drilling will not solve all of America’s energy problems - as if we all didn’t know that already. But the fact that drilling won’t solve every problem is no excuse to do nothing at all. Starting in January, in a McCain-Palin administration, we’re going to lay more pipelines…build more nuclear plants…create jobs with clean coal…and move forward on solar, wind, geothermal, and other alternative sources. We need American energy resources, brought to you by American ingenuity, and produced by American workers. …"

“Here’s how I look at the choice Americans face in this election. In politics, there are some candidates who use change to promote their careers. And then there are those, like John McCain, who use their careers to promote change.”

 

[RDK]

Sarah Palin's speech just exponentially soldified my trust in their leadership. Deep down, she is a hard-working mother who wants nothing but the best for all of her children. On her facade, however, she exemplifies change in the government, and is a true role model for all aspiring to be a part of politics. She proves that you don't have to be a hard-hitting, cold-hearted MAN to be sought after by one of politic's finest.

She's also a conservative nutcase who doesn't support abortion and no doubt believes the Earth is 4,000 years old.

Not that the McCain camp is any better than the Obama camp. I'm a libertarian, so I'm automatically pre-disposed to not like liberal ideals, but Obama is just atrocious.

 

[manhunter098]

There in lies the hypocrisy of McCain, he spent months criticizing Obama for the lack of experience he had and blasted him for knowing little about the current state of iraq.

Then what does he do? He picks someone who has just as much experience in politics and foreign affairs as he does. Clearly experience isn't a big deal to McCain.

McCain will probably grab votes from the Hillary supporters who just wanted a woman in office.


Another thing to point out, what the hell is Obama on? I know I said previously that picking Biden was a good choice, in all honesty it was, Biden can be a pretty good attack dog against McCain. But in all honesty I can't help but correct myself and say wtf are you thinking? you advocate change and say "we need a change in Washington." Then he sides with Biden? Mr. Credit Card Company? Give me a break.

I can't help but look at McCain and Obama and just think to myself "We're Screwed."

Well the key with what I said was that Palin has at least as much experience as Obama. Now I dont think she has nearly as much experience dealing with Washington politics which I do think Obama knows how to handle very well, or just can simply because he is black and everyone is afraid of being labeled a racist, either way though the effect is still the same. But when it comes down to it I dont see McCain as likely to die during his term, and if that should happen probability says it is more likely to happen as the term goes on, so Palin will probably have her chance to get the experience she needs to be president should McCain die in office.





@ Meta:

I really like Palin. She seems to have the charisma that McCain desperately needs and she seems to be very resolute in her views which is also a good thing for a leader. She seems like the kind of woman who wont take **** from anybody and I think that will definitely help her in her political career especially when it comes to dealing with Washington politics. I really dont share many views in common with her though, but I trust our democratic congress to make sure that republicans cannot push their Christian ideals onto America.

 

[Eor]

She proves that you don't have to be a hard-hitting, cold-hearted MAN to be sought after by one of politic's finest.

Guess Geraldine Ferraro didn't do that, then?

And since our opponents in this presidential election seem to look down on that experience, let me explain to them what the job involves. I guess a small-town mayor is sort of like a ‘community organizer,’ except that you have actual responsibilities. …"

She left her small town of Wasila with a debt of almost $19 million, when it had none before.

“Our opponents say, again and again, that drilling will not solve all of America’s energy problems - as if we all didn’t know that already. But the fact that drilling won’t solve every problem is no excuse to do nothing at all.

Palin in July of this year

“I beg to disagree with any candidate who would say we can't drill our way out of our problem or that more supply won't ultimately affect prices."

 

[M.K]

Palin in July of this year

“I beg to disagree with any candidate who would say we can't drill our way out of our problem or that more supply won't ultimately affect prices."

Uh, how does that statement contradict her?

In the speech, she says the fact that drilling won't solve all the problems, but not doing anything is even worse.

In your given quote, she argues that the canidates who oppose drilling aren't solving the problem any other way.

That statement matches with the speech.

Also, can we end this "McCain/Obama is Old Washington/Inexperienced, but they picked Palin/Biden who is Inexperienced/Old Washington, so they contradict each other! Therefore, Obama/McCain is better!"?

That whole argument goes both ways, and that general statement gives no edge to either candidate! The more in-depth stuff is what is good here, not the blatently obvious things.

 

[Eor]

Uh, how does that statement contradict her?

In the speech, she says the fact that drilling won't solve all the problems, but not doing anything is even worse.

In your given quote, she argues that the canidates who oppose drilling aren't solving the problem any other way.

No, no she is not. She is saying she disagrees with anyone who thinks we can't drill our way out, but in her speech she says that it's obvious drilling won't solve all of our problem.

Either way, http://www.palmbeachpost.com/state/content/state/epaper/2008/08/01/0801obama1.html

 

[Steck]

Just a question: What is this "change" I keep hearing that Obama is going to bring? As far as I can tell it means "not bush". Is that all? It's not that radical (except for health care and the fact that same sex marriage won't get vetoed) It's not like our government will change drastically in the way its run. Corporate lobbying will still have more impact than the american people. Washington will still carry on the same way. It's not like the mechanics in our government which have lasted since the founding fathers is going to change. It's not like we are becoming socialist (or even social-democratic ie Sweden or Denmark). We will just get a president who's policies will be different from the last 8 years. So Joe Biden does not actually undermine the whole "change" thing. He is a liberal democrat and therefore is not Bush therefore he is "change". If he does then its an image thing (I guess young=change). Am I missing something?