Should Metaknight be Banned? ***Take 3***

[Viny]

Wat is the WHOBO inccident? the top 3 was all MK??

 

[krazyzyko]

What's with the "Not sure" option? It just takes off more "no" votes. If the voter's not sure about the topic then DON'T vote until he/she actually DOES know. You know?

Still, I voted YES! It takes much more effort to win with other characters than MK, he barely lags unlike the rest of the crew and he can recover with ANY B-attack, has 6 mid-air jumps, 2 options to glide and he simply has to grab an edge to be able to glide again.

Seriously, (IMO) if MK's allowed in tournaments the fairest thing would be that both of the players decide to play MK dittos. Or if your opponent doesn't mind to play vs. MK. (But it will be his/her choice)

 

[Mew2King]

The best MKs in the world are

1) me
2) dojo
3) spam/Tyrant
5) DSF

and all of them except spam were at that tourney

no other character was represented there well at all, so WHOBO has EXTREMELY biased results

 

[Red Arremer]

Wat is the WHOBO inccident? the top 3 was all MK??

Many of the Top Meta Knight players were there, and hardly Top non-Meta Knights were there, so...

But yea, here you go:
1: M2K=meta
2: Dojo=meta
3: DSF=meta/snake/wario
4: Lee Martin=lucario/meta
5: Tyrant=meta
5: Co18=ddd
7: Domo=meta
7: Melee1=ic/meta
9: Infinity=meta
9: RoyR=marth
9: Light=meta/gw
9: Ultimate razer=snake

Still, I voted YES! It takes much more effort to win with other characters than MK, he barely lags unlike the rest of the crew and he can recover with ANY B-attack, has 6 mid-air jumps, 2 options to glide and he simply has to grab an edge to be able to glide again.

So your only reason to ban Meta Knight would be his good recovery? lol

 

[Kinzer]

^^

Why vote for a liberal party when obviously only a Republican or a Democrat will win the election?

Maybe those "unsure" people think like "kay, so MK is good, but is he good enough to warrent some kind of handicapp on him?" This isn't me but/and it's still just an example of people who aren't extreme in their thoughts if keeping him around/outright banning the death ball.

Also polls don't mean @#$%, many random people vote on the polls, but of course the debate is where it's at.

Edit: No u Spade, posting before I did.

 

[NeoCrono]

Marth has arguably 2 disadvantageous matchups other than Meta Knight, and those are no hard counters.
He also outright destroys more characters than Meta Knight does.

So... it's really extremely similar to SF3 Third Strike - with Meta Knight being Yun and Marth being Chun-Li.

But Chun-Li won big tournaments......

 

[Kinzer]

Oh that reminds me.

Yo Spade, who does Marth wreck that aren't the mother boys with a 7/3 MU at worst?

I don't think Marth makes any character unviable, but if you were saying that Marth is a harder MU for some characters (Sonic) than MK is, you're right here.

 

[krazyzyko]

Many of the Top Meta Knight players were there, and hardly Top non-Meta Knights were there, so...

But yea, here you go:
1: M2K=meta
2: Dojo=meta
3: DSF=meta/snake/wario
4: Lee Martin=lucario/meta
5: Tyrant=meta
5: Co18=ddd
7: Domo=meta
7: Melee1=ic/meta
9: Infinity=meta
9: RoyR=marth
9: Light=meta/gw
9: Ultimate razer=snake



So your only reason to ban Meta Knight would be his good recovery? lol

I mentioned other things, feel free to re-read, but I guess the other details are obvious he's just too broken!

 

[P. O. F.]

Raven-Yeah, exactly.....you basically get lucky if you stop his tornado. Thats about it.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Oh that reminds me.

Yo Spade, who does Marth wreck that aren't the mother boys with a 7/3 MU at worst?

I don't think Marth makes any character unviable, but if you were saying that Marth is a harder MU for some characters (Sonic) than MK is, you're right here.

Stop sucking, Marth isnt harder for Sonic.

 

[Brinzy]

Shield the whole thing and punish, or punish the ending lag. MK should be using this to punish your own mistakes, and really, it doesn't do enough for it to be revered as much as it is, especially considering you have a chance at DIing out of it and you can potentially stop it cold if the MK uses it at the wrong time (which is pretty much anytime except for when you cannot do anything about it, which is not often at all). Sure, damage is damage, but if the Tornado is really wrecking your game (irl, since it'll easily wreck you on WiFi), you should examine what you're doing.

The Tornado should have zero bearing on this subject. I find **** like G&W's bair and Snake's tilts more irritating than that.

 

[Red Arremer]

Yo Spade, who does Marth wreck that aren't the mother boys with a 7/3 MU at worst?

I don't think Marth makes any character unviable, but if you were saying that Marth is a harder MU for some characters (Sonic) than MK is, you're right here.

That was what I was saying - Marth is a harder matchup for more characters than Meta Knight is.

I mentioned other things, feel free to re-read, but I guess the other details are obvious he's just too broken!

No he isn't.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Shield the whole thing and punish, or punish the ending lag. MK should be using this to punish your own mistakes, and really, it doesn't do enough for it to be revered as much as it is, especially considering you have a chance at DIing out of it and you can potentially stop it cold if the MK uses it at the wrong time (which is pretty much anytime except for when you cannot do anything about it, which is not often at all). Sure, damage is damage, but if the Tornado is really wrecking your game (irl, since it'll easily wreck you on WiFi), you should examine what you're doing.

The Tornado should have zero bearing on this subject. I find **** like G&W's bair and Snake's tilts more irritating than that.

Di up and towards G&W.
I think you can actually hit him but I am not very good at DI'ing on reaction.

 

[Kinzer]

Stop sucking, Marth isnt harder for Sonic.

No u, all lies, liek teh cake!

Mk has a 55:45-6:4 (some could argue 65:35 for this but it's highly debatable), Martha at best has a 6:4 advantage over Sonic!

But this would not be the place to argue who would be a more tougher MU for Sonic, we could/should take this back to the boards/Profile Messages.

I can't go on the Xat because I'm at school but yeah.

Let's get it on! Rah! MK < Marth in terms of who is a harder MU for Sonic. Get at me!

 

[Brinzy]

Di up and towards G&W.
I think you can actually hit him but I am not very good at DI'ing on reaction.

I can deal with those moves just fine. I'm just saying that I find them more threatening than the Tornado, for various reasons of course but the end point remains.

 

[DanGR]

Many of the Top Meta Knight players were there, and hardly Top non-Meta Knights were there, so...

1: M2K=meta
2: Dojo=meta
3: DSF=meta/snake/wario
4: Lee Martin=lucario/meta
5: Tyrant=meta
5: Co18=ddd
7: Domo=meta
7: Melee1=ic/meta
9: Infinity=meta
9: RoyR=marth
9: Light=meta/gw
9: Ultimate razer=snake

That's funny. I see 5 top players (or at least 2nd best for their character) for their characters in just the top 9. Let's take a look at the top 33 now.

13: error=Olimar/ic
13: Hylian=gw
13: Dphat=meta/marth
13: Dmg=wario
17: Fliphop=diddy
17: T-rex=snake
17: Inui=meta
17: UtdZac=gw (I'm not sure)
17: Santi=toon link
17: Gnes=diddy
17: Kosmos=peach
17: Mike Haze=marth
25: lain=ddd/ic
25: Rockettrainer=lucario
25: Espy=sonic (not sure)
25: bwett=yoshi
25: furiousduffman=gw
25: Zeton=fox
25: Bad news bear=pika/marth
25: Affinity=meta
33: Kashakunaki=wolf
33: Fogo=ddd/lucario
33: Xyro= SAMUS!!!!!!!
33: Cyphus=dk
33: burrito=ike
33: Le Thien=diddy (not sure)
33: CY=wario/falco
33: JnewPo=Falcon/marth
33: Jerm=toonlink
33: phantomx=wario
33: Dekar=diddy
33: Esca=pit
33: Magitek=lucas
33: Ozz=falco
33: Rudy=fox
33: Mr.3000=sonic

In this section, there's at least 9 top players for their character (or at least top 3-ish. "9" isn't including the players I'm not sure of, but may be top players for their characters) Many of these are higher tiered characters. My point is that, yeah, the top MK players were there, but so were a lot for the other characters. It's not a legit arguement to say that "Oh, well M2K, Dojo, DSF, Tyrant, Domo, Infinity, etc. were there for MK. No one was there for the others." Take this however you want.

 

[Kinzer]

What's "(Not sure)" next to their names?

'Cause I'm pretty sure Espy for example was grilling dat Steak the whole time he was at WHOBO.

 

[Nic64]

most of the people there you bolded are either at least out of the top 3 for their respective characters or play unviable characters, where as MK had the 3 best MK's in the country attending and a few other top ones. you are kidding yourself if you don't think that WHOBO's results were at least somewhat skewed.

 

[Affinity]

People are still trying to use the WHOBO results to prove their point?


The Pro-Ban side is dead lol

 

[|RK|]

Raven-Yeah, exactly.....you basically get lucky if you stop his tornado. Thats about it.

What is this I don't even.

 

[Conti]

oops double post.... =[

 

[Brinzy]

Or the fact that it disproved arguments that MK is so dominant that he would **** everyone in sight.

It's not about the fact that MK didn't dominate as much as people expected him to (or at least that's not the main point). It's about the fact that many pro-banners made arguments that basically said that MK would dominate hardcore at pretty much all times and that APEX would be their guiding light towards the ban, when it in fact shut that part of their argument down.

 

[Conti]

I was afraid people would use the Apex results as an excuse to cover up the fact he still needs to be banned. Just because MK's didn't rule one tournament, does not mean he isn't banned worthy, even if it is a major.

or maybe its the fact that people are starting to find ways around MK.... LOL


People do learn, and adapt to things... in this case, an MK Matchup... Thats how good players become great players, being able to adapt quickly to your opponents playstyle and counter it...

unfortunatly i dont have a wii and i barley get to play, so its hard for me to do this when all i play is at my friends house against his D3,
and well, its the same thing over and over, when i went to APEX and versed other D3s and other characters, i was getting F'd up...
especially in MK Dittos....
i lost every MK ditto [normally by 1 stock] because i didnt know what to do against myself, (and i SD'd ALOT [nervous as hell] lolol)... But im a quick learner so im figuring things out quick, if i can like learn the game more i can figure it out...

To prove a point, in ANY Game, being able to adapt and counter-act your opponent will always put the game in your favor, people know what MK is capable of, and they ARE finding ways around him... He's not perfect, he just has alot of advantages....

 

[napZzz]

Am I one of the few people who doesn't want him banned so much for being broken, but banned because he's so overplayed? Tourneys and competitive play are no fun when half the time you beat someone they switch to mk....if they aren't already using him -_-

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

[DanGR]

What's "(Not sure)" next to their names?

'Cause I'm pretty sure Espy for example was grilling dat Steak the whole time he was at WHOBO.

I put "(not sure)" if I wasn't sure whether they are top players for their characters... but I thought I remember other people saying they were.

most of the people there you bolded are either at least out of the top 3 for their respective characters or play unviable characters, where as MK had the 3 best MK's in the country attending and a few other top ones. you are kidding yourself if you don't think that WHOBO's results were at least somewhat skewed.

Did you even look at the list? There's DDDs, ICs, Warios, G&Ws, and a Diddy. Those 5 are more than viable. And I didn't say anything about it not being skewed. I'm merely pointing out that there were top players for other characters other than just Metaknight.

 

[Brinzy]

If everyone plays MK, then more power to you as you should know the match-up to the point where most of them aren't a threat.

 

[napZzz]

If everyone plays MK, then more power to you as you should know the match-up to the point where most of them aren't a threat.

he's not fun to fight, and he's everywhere. -_-

 

[RDK]

Am I one of the few people who doesn't want him banned so much for being broken, but banned because he's so overplayed? Tourneys and competitive play are no fun when half the time you beat someone they switch to mk....if they aren't already using him -_-

So if CF suddenly becomes overplayed for no apparent reason, despite the fact that he sucks balls, I suppose we should ban him too then? Let's replace MK with CF in your statement and see how stupid it looks:

Tourneys and competitive play would be no fun if half the time you beat someone they switched to Captain Falcon.

Personally I think that would be fun, but meh. Each to his own.

 

[Nic64]

I didn't say anything about it not being skewed. I'm just pointing out that there were top players for other characters other than just Metaknight.

No one said other characters had no representation at all, just that pretty much no other character was represented by their best except IC's while the best 3 MK's in the world were there.

he's not fun to fight

I have a lot more fun fighting against meta knight than snake, wario, diddy, IC's, falco, pikachu, or olimar.

 

[napZzz]

So if CF suddenly becomes overplayed for no apparent reason, despite the fact that he sucks balls, I suppose we should ban him too then? Let's replace MK with CF in your statement and see how stupid it looks:



Personally I think that would be fun, but meh. Each to his own.

thats horrible logic. horrible, terrible, logic. first of all, captain falcon would never be overplayed unless he was broken like mk. Noone would care if cf was overplayed because he's such a bad character anyways.

but MK is broken, horribly over played, and annoying to fight. Truefax.

EDIT: He's not fun to fight simply because he's used so much. I'd like to play brawl plz, not "lets fight mk all day"

 

[RDK]

thats horrible logic. horrible, terrible, logic. first of all, captain falcon would never be overplayed unless he was broken like mk. Noone would care if cf was overplayed because he's such a bad character anyways.

but MK is broken, horribly over played, and annoying to fight. Truefax.

You're ********.

I was attempting to show you that saying MK shouldn't be banned for his brokenness but should be banned for being overplayed is imbecilic. If I recall correctly, you said:

Am I one of the few people who doesn't want him banned so much for being broken, but banned because he's so overplayed? Tourneys and competitive play are no fun when half the time you beat someone they switch to mk....if they aren't already using him -_-

The only horrible logic here is your own.

 

[Red Arremer]

thats horrible logic. horrible, terrible, logic. first of all, captain falcon would never be overplayed unless he was broken like mk. Noone would care if cf was overplayed because he's such a bad character anyways.

He was taking that overplayed "argument" to another character and simply was asking that if Captain Falcon was overplayed despite him being so bad, if that would warrant a ban.

but MK is broken,

No.

horribly over played,

Nope.

and annoying to fight.

Not at all, one of the most interesting fights.

Truefax.

Niet.

 

[brinboy789]

wow, annoying to fight is one of probans points?

 

[Kinzer]

Apparently so.

Also DanGR, Espy is legit, and so is Thien.

 

[xXTACXx]

he's not fun to fight, and he's everywhere. -_-

I disagree MK is the funnest matchup imo and my personal best.

 

[Vorguen]

I'll fight Meta Knight 10 times over before I have to face a Falco.

As for Ice Climbers... hmm, maybe just 3 times over.

 

[SyOn]

Marth is the most annoying to fight IMO.

Let's ban him.

 

[Popertop]

Marth is the most annoying to fight IMO.

Let's ban him.

This man speaks the trush

 

[Red Arremer]

This man speaks the trush

This man quotes the truth.

 

[Veril]

A new poll should be taken now that the Apex results are here. Seriously, lets end this thing.