Q&A Sheik Strategy & QnA

[knightpraetor]

thanks for the tip. i'll try mixing those in then so that he is forced to use multiple options.

 

[soap]

it's not real practice unless they are realllly trying to get away from you tho

just play lots and lots of friendlies

 

[gm jack]

And most people suck at getting out of the tech chase, except a few who try and buffer a spot dodge or whatever, so be prepared for them to be better at getting out of it as well as you improving.

 

[SonuvaBeach]

It is in your benefit to point out your opponents flaws in their tech chases. I always point out things like "you always tech in place after X" or "you always do this then this," "you never tech in place shine," etc.

Unless it is tournament, it only hurts you to get used to specific patterns. Odd's are they will fall back into the same patterns regardless when they are under pressure, most people do. Good people won't, and have a more random tech pattern last stock/under pressure, both are good to try and note.

 

[Sweet™]

Thanks for the advice guys. :D

 

[KirbyKaze]

Mew2King your Sheik is godlike <3

 

[Jolteon]

m2k is not bad.

 

[Beat!]

I'd even go so far as to call him pretty good.

 

[Sinji]

Wish M2k won Zenith .

Edit: Ive been doing a lot of lv 7 vs falco practice since last week to work on my defensive options OOS. It's been good for me because I faced a human falco player on friday and I did every thing I was working on in the match up correctly. I remember PP telling me back in january after Apex to play on lv 1, 3, sometimes 7 cpu's, but I was a fox main then. So I wanted to get feedback from you guys. Is Lv. 7 cpu good for training?

 

[Zoler]

I'm depressed.

 

[Jolteon]

I'd even go so far as to call him pretty good.

Let's not get ahead of ourselves here.

 

[odinNJ]

m2k was on fire at zenith.

 

[Van.]

i've never seen his techchases that perfect before

 

[omgwtfToph]

I have lol. ever played m2k in friendlies?

 

[Van.]

^ nah

I think the biggest differences between this and his last few sets with pp were definently those techchases though.

 

[The Great Gonzales]

againts spacey's if your drop tech-chases you lose. Hence he lost to PP as sheik and decided to go the rest of the set as Marth

 

[Van.]

^ Not at all.

 

[The Great Gonzales]

In grand finals M2K was defenatly dropping tech-chases. If you dint see that, watch the set again.

 

[Van.]

Sure, but it wasn't the reason he switched, if past activity was any evidence.

 

[silentSWAG]

he played sheik/marth depending on stage counterpick

 

[Salevits]

Yo PAL Sheiks,

Is there an ideal formula for tech chasing fast fallers?

I used to think
1. D-throw
2. WD Forward
3. React (sometimes guess a tech away becuz it's too hard to react unless close to the edge)

..But lately i've realized i miss punishes on tech in place against fox&falco all the time, because the wavedash forward makes it so much harder to make it in time, than it would be if i just dashed -> JC grabbed. So it makes me wanna dash after the throw and not wavedash..

But THEN i can't jab reset if they don't tech.

How the heck do i cover it all. ****. Halp.

 

[hectohertz]

okay i'm on NTSC, but what Zoso and some other players have been telling me about punishing tech-in place/missed-techs is just to downsmash. it comes out fast, it has some invincibility, and it covers both tech-in-place and missed-tech if you time it right. the timing is a little easier to get down then regrab esp. against species that like to shine as soon as possible after a tech

 

[Nedved]

You can just walk to follow their DI. So you will be able to jab reset (or double jab reset), DSmash (high percent to get an edgeguard) or react to a tech with regrab/Dash Attack / Tilt

I choose between WD forward, walk to follow the tech or just WD on place. It depends on the character, my opponent, myself and the position on stage.

 

[Jolteon]

dthrow -> walk forward -> react, if they tech in place and shine then you're spaced so it doesn't hit.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

What if they don't DI and tech in place? you will not be spaced

 

[Jolteon]

It's really easy to react to them DI'ing in and just not walk. @_@ It's not necessary to be spaced anyway, it's just nice if you struggle with regrab timing on tech in place since most people will try to shine after doing so.

 

[Yomi-no-Kuni]

You can just walk to follow their DI. So you will be able to jab reset (or double jab reset), DSmash (high percent to get an edgeguard) or react to a tech with regrab/Dash Attack / Tilt

I choose between WD forward, walk to follow the tech or just WD on place. It depends on the character, my opponent, myself and the position on stage.

I actually find walk->dash to techchase really hard, i always mess up the dash (dont aske me why, i dunno)
I prefer Wavedash->techchase.

Downsmash on neutral or no tech allows you to continue techchasing alot of times, so don't be afraid to use it alot instead of difficult grab decisions. (my thoughts) ofcourse its also nice to get them offstage with.

 

[stelzig]

Whenever I wavedash I feel I get too much lag afterwards (like tech in-place, the space animal will suddenly have frame advantage). My timing out of the throw is probably off or something.
I usually prefer dashing forward instead of walking and if they tech behind me, I can fox trot back - sheik's initial dash is just long enough for me to be able to choose to hold the direction or not on reaction. You can also crouch>dsmash/jab out of the dash if they don't tech (at least on DI away), or just straight up jab/dsmash if you don't hold dash (which i'm confident you can do on reaction, don't really see the advantage in wavedashing over this)

I really suck at techchasing with sheik though.

Edit: Just realised the hold direction thing might not really make much sense... Well foxtrotting is weird. Doesn't seem to work well to me if you do too long dashes. Maybe it has to only be initial dash to intial dash, I don't even know...

 

[Salevits]

I tried some stuff today..

I didn't find the walking that good.. Sheik started to move too slowly and fox got away.

For example I couldn't catch a non teching fox by walking after like 10%. If i wanted to catch him i had to Dash and if I dash (as soon as I see fox hitting the ground) the only option I can do at that point is dash attack (because you cant crouch at the beginning of the dash) and fox can crouch cancel that so...

The walking covered everything else, tough.. If fox techs in place, I Dashed -> JC grabbed. If he teched in, i dashed behind and grabbed.. But yeah i would like to cover those AND have the ability to jab reset and stuff.. Like in NTSC.. Amsah do you have any thoughts? I see you up throwing fox at low percent, Would be great to know some theory/idea behind that one, too..

Btw The dash -> Dsmash thing worked if i predicted he wouldn't tech, but what I wanna do here is react..

E: So in short, I think that vs Fox in PAL
D-throw > Wavedash > React = Weak agaist tech in place
D-throw > Walk > React = Weak against not teching

Still not satisfied... :/ Would be great to have some general formula for covering the options..

 

[Jolteon]

You can jab reset them from walking if they don't tech, it can be annoying to react to di+tech away on pal when you do it though. :/

 

[Sinji]

What's the main difference between PAL sheik and NTSC sheik?

 

[gm jack]

PAL dthrow sends them much further forwards. Against most characters, it gets rid of the guaranteed combos and chain grabs, but against fast fallers, it just serves to make tech chasing perfectly a bit harder.

Uair is quite a bit weaker, and Usmash is slightly weaker too.

 

[Sinji]

Ah I see.

It's really hard to use her in PAL then lol.

 

[The Great Gonzales]

PAL sheik does not exist in my book lol.

 

[Zoler]

I'm pretty sure wavedash forward is the best after dthrow. You just need to practice it so you do it as soon as you can after you throw.

Ah I see.

It's really hard to use her in PAL then lol.

PAL sheik is the real one, the NTSC one is an abomination. Missing a techchase in NTSC just shouldn't happen, ever.

 

[KirbyKaze]

I really dislike PAL.

It might be more balanced but I really do like the brokenness of NTSC.

 

[Zoler]

It's way more fun to play sheik in NTSC tho, but way more fun to play vs sheik in PAL

 

[Sinji]

Agreed with KK. I appreciate the broken dthrow>fair against most match ups on NTSC.

 

[silentSWAG]

it doesn't matter to me, as long as im a ninja on heroin

 

[joejoe22802]

So at neutral position what thoughts do you have in deciding whether to space facing away, facing forward, or dashdancing?