Q&A Sheik Strategy & QnA

[The Irish Mafia]

quick heads up chad ***** sheiks. iirc he plays them frequently and knows all the dirty combos

also lordy make sure you dont confuse player ability with character ability

****kkkkk

 

[Teczer0]

****kkkkk

Are you still gonna go sheik? .

I mean.. I would =3

Go with your most comfortable character if you dunno what to do, if you're not a fox main you're gonna be facing disadvantageous match ups somewhere down the road.

 

[Lordydennek]

Ok my friend Seig and I keep going back and forth on whos main is better. His peach is now beating my sheik quite a bit. I think i need some more out of grab options. Im starting to see why Amsah says peach>sheik.

also-im attending a tounry in St. Louis on the 31st. anyone here goin?

Just posting this again on the current page.

 

[Spife]

Go link and just spam nair.
This is good advice *nods*

 

[Teczer0]

There really isn't much in terms of after grab options against peach.

I usually go for a ftilt and then react to what the other peach does. Typically I try to go for like dash attack for the peaches that tend to try to nair out of everything. You can however just fair and chase them looking for a regrab.

Or uptilt if they don't DI and just bair them or something.

Just hit them there you go.

 

[KirbyKaze]

****kkkkk

Ask N64 what I did.

Then do the exact opposite.

Tec0 is gay, listen to him.

 

[Lordydennek]

ya just hit em! Peach is broken. Right when i get a stock up here comes a bombom or stitch face bull****. ugh. i do like catching that **** and throwing it back in her dumb face.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

i see this place still sucks.

 

[Lordydennek]

?
If you have nothing nice to say dont say anything at all. I like our thread.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

i say what i want.

Guys i know the secret to beating Tec0's sheik

 

[ChivalRuse]

Guys i know the secret to beating Tec0's sheik

Play Jiggs and just duck?

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

If you're strategy is anything like mine it involves one handed controller mastery and ambidextrous leg massaging

 

[KirbyKaze]

Play Jiggs and just duck?

At the first RoM I picked Fox and pushed buttons really fast.

Seemed fairly effective.

 

[Lordydennek]

whoa. Sveet. thats... ouch

 

[Spife]

If you're strategy is anything like mine it involves one handed controller mastery and ambidextrous leg massaging

Same, including the "leg" part
p.s. I'm talking about my *****.

 

[soap]

There really isn't much in terms of after grab options against peach.

I usually go for a ftilt and then react to what the other peach does. Typically I try to go for like dash attack for the peaches that tend to try to nair out of everything. You can however just fair and chase them looking for a regrab.

Or uptilt if they don't DI and just bair them or something.

Just hit them there you go.

i've always wanted to do this to peach

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqBfocPGc_8#t=0m35s

but they always DI

i've gotten pretty decent combos on peach though. Dair over their breakout nair is a cool trick

 

[Lordydennek]

Thats an awesome vid. btw i challeged Darkatma to a mm(my sheik vs his peach) at the stl tourny on the 31st. woo...

 

[soap]

that combo is actually when i realized u could combo better by spacing, delaying the fair and autocancelling it on the way down, instead of fairing asap on the way up.

 

[Lordydennek]

thats true. i usually fair on the fast fall. it messes with their mind. i do nair on the way up tho. better to get that out fast.

 

[ChivalRuse]

You guys should empty SH FF -> grab more. Smexy.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

You guys should empty SH FF -> grab more. Smexy.

Trail Games!

 

[KirbyKaze]

At 50 u-throw u-tilt is a combo on Fox if you do the u-tilt really fast and they don't DI. If they DI away in front of you, d-tilt auto combos.

If they go behind, then you get nothing.

Hmmmm.

Possible throw mixup? I know my percent game goes to hell after I pass 40 sometimes and my reaction time's just ever-so-slightly off.

I figure if you do this facing the middle of the stage you could probably create a "no way out", where they either don't DI, and eat u-tilt, DI away and eat d-tilt, or DI behind and hit a platform and therefore be stuck on a platform. Against Sheik. Which basically means free Bair or Uair.

Thoughts?

 

[nicaboy]

Let me see hmm. I have short hop walked pass turn around grab people who like to sit in there shild. Also punish get up attacks or when they lay down in a neutral position with double jumps. Usualy a d air or something its pretty gay. Oh my favorite you would be surprised how many people don't know you can grab out of a crouching position. So good and my favorite wd back grab.
@ kk i gotta see that for myself or try it . Im not fond of sheiks up throw since im used to d throw tech chase etc. In my experience people have tendencies to di left or right almost always. The auto combo into d tilt sounds good but at the risk they di behind you and no follow up doesn't sound great. Like you said you could use it as a mix up but eh i don't like so far. Imma try it tomorrow and see how it works.

 

[DJRome]

At 50 u-throw u-tilt is a combo on Fox if you do the u-tilt really fast and they don't DI. If they DI away in front of you, d-tilt auto combos.

If they go behind, then you get nothing.

Hmmmm.

Possible throw mixup? I know my percent game goes to hell after I pass 40 sometimes and my reaction time's just ever-so-slightly off.

I figure if you do this facing the middle of the stage you could probably create a "no way out", where they either don't DI, and eat u-tilt, DI away and eat d-tilt, or DI behind and hit a platform and therefore be stuck on a platform. Against Sheik. Which basically means free Bair or Uair.

Thoughts?

lol, i just did this today. but i think i started at 45%?

 

[KirbyKaze]

I was just screwing around with Fox preset to 50% because I was looking at dash attack stuff. I could believe 45 easily.

Also, nicaboy, I know this isn't as good as d-throw tech chase because of the DI behind, which is why I noted that it's mixup and not a main strategy. It's undoubtedly situational, much like D-throw U-tilt on Falcon. But it's an interesting thing that doesn't go seen, or even explored.

If it's there and it has just a bit of promise we might as well look at it just a lil' bit, right?

 

[nicaboy]

Hmm true although i did agree with you about it being strictly a mix up. Its kinda like d throw and throwing up smash out there seeing as if they tech either left out right you cant follow up. As you said its situational but even so ( and im sure you agree) d throw is generaly the better answer. Up throw sometimes works for me if i want them to land on a platform then i wave land to grab or up tilt. I never thought of using it center stage which is why im intrested in messing with it. But would platforms interfere with the combo? Or fox just cant even go that far assuming he di in front of you?

 

[DJRome]

iirc, dthrow at those percents isn't guaranteed to cover all options but rather requires a guess using calculations of normal human reaction time. if the platform situation arises, this potentially gives the guarantee of covering all options

 

[nicaboy]

Down throw covers alot actualy. Well more like it has better follow ups. Assuming your good at tech chasing and watching rolls you cover 4 out of 7 options. The 4 covered are techs and rolls left and right. Then they either can tech in place not tech and land in place or get up attack. You should be able to react properly but the getting up animations are kinda tricky to detect. You should be able to do something re grab down smash before they can react. Up throw doesn't present similar options which is why its used in certain situations.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Reaction time defeats everything. And memorizing Fox's tech animations and getting good control over your boost grab makes reaction time have a lot of room for error on the tech rolls.

Below 32 it's not even hard because non-tech Fox can't even roll or rising attack if you tap reset.

Anyway, I think the more important part of this is that U-throw D-tilt combos on one type of DI away. So if you're under a platform, they have literally nowhere to go and you can go for stock-eating Uairs fast, or get an actual combo going. Even if they DI D-tilt away, you can still tech chase it because it will knock them over and you've gotten a bit more percent in that increment than you would have if you just d-threw them.

The fact that non-DI loses to this means it also works closer to the middle of the stage on some levels.

 

[nicaboy]

Hmm intresting like i said imma try this tomorrow against my brothers fox and maybe some of the guys here. Nicaboy must sleep now

 

[KirbyKaze]

sleep is for the weak

 

[DJRome]

kk, i can't believe ur on ec canada

 

[KirbyKaze]

I'm ****ing crazy like that.

 

[Tero.]

heres another one... what do you guys think about tech chasing falco at low percents with uthrows. It seemed to be working unusually well (the tech comes later and i think its easier to chase). was his DI just bad or something?

At 50 u-throw u-tilt is a combo on Fox if you do the u-tilt really fast and they don't DI. If they DI away in front of you, d-tilt auto combos.

You sure?
Normally good Fox/Falcos will just neutral DI your uthrow and shine out of it.

I'm not really fond of uthrow to anything and I think we europeans use uthrow in general more often because we don't have a mother****ing broken dthrow.

You guys should empty SH FF -> grab more. Smexy.

That's the Amsah Jump!

 

[KirbyKaze]

You sure?
Normally good Fox/Falcos will just neutral DI your uthrow and shine out of it.

I'm not really fond of uthrow to anything and I think we europeans use uthrow in general more often because we don't have a mother****ing broken dthrow.

I tested in training mode. I got consecutive hits. Granted, training mode is buggy, but I feel it seems legit enough to warrant exploration.

If nobody wants to try it then whatever.

I thought empty SHFF grab was the everyone.

 

[soap]

I thought empty SHFF grab was the everyone.

it admittedly works better when u are a marth or sheik and can land outside other peoples grab range and still grab them

 

[GOD!]

If nobody wants to try it then whatever.

I thought empty SHFF grab was the everyone.

It is the everyone. Doesn't work more than once or twice though.. or it shouldn't.

I'm pretty sure that if you're getting shined after uthrow, your not using uptilt in time.

 

[Teczer0]

Dunno bout everyone.

Personally I never do that **** with Bowser. Koopa klaw all dai

lol at upthrow shenanigans.

 

[ChivalRuse]

it admittedly works better when u are a marth or sheik and can land outside other peoples grab range and still grab them

It works with every character whose grab comes out in 7 frames. When you hit someone's shield with an aerial, the game slows down a tad bit. They'll always time the shield grab according to that muscle memory. But if you fastfall without the aerial, the game speed remains unchanged, and your grab should come out before theirs. If you land behind their shield and grab, it's all the sweeter.

 

[h!tboxexplo!ter]

speaking of that how does grabbing people that are behind you work?