Recovery Tier List

[Fortress | Sveet]

i support kotu's list

 

[MalwareDie]

Ok about this thread, I've already made a few recovery tier list, although it might be a little outdated. Check my user page on Smash Wiki.

Although I could use some of these ideas to make a 4th one if I need to.

Your list sucks.

 

[Doc King]

Your list sucks.

Like I said, I would have to fix some of the things on there like maybe putting G@W higher and Link lower and stuff like that.

Also: Which one did you see, the 1st and 2nd one were not that good I have to admit, but the 3rd one is decent. And explain how it sucks?

 

[MalwareDie]

Like I said, I would have to fix some of the things on there like maybe putting G@W higher and Link lower and stuff like that.

Also: Which one did you see, the 1st and 2nd one were not that good I have to admit, but the 3rd one is decent. And explain how it sucks?

I looked at the third one.

G&W should not be higher. Fire is hard to sweetspot. Falcon and Ganondorf being that high up is not right at all. Their recoveries are very easily edgeguarded. Luigi's recovery is very slow and the misfire chance is too low to really make his recovery good. Kibry's recovery is quite bad. Despite having 5 midair jumps, they are really slow and the last couple don't even add much height. Very easy to edgeguard. Falco is not that bad because of the low amount of lag and mixups. Ness is definitely the worst. His double jump can't sweetspot and his PK Thunder is terrible.

 

[1048576]

Well, to be fair, I have a hard time committing to edgeguarding Luigi when I'm above 100, because of the threat of misfire. He prolly won't get it, but if he does, I die, so I have to let him recover until he's close enough to the stage for me to be able to avoid a potential misfire.

I also don't get why lack of a double jump sweetspot is that big a deal for Ness. He has an airdodge, and the dj is huge.

 

[CheeseBurger]

you guys don't think kirby has one of the best recoveries?

5 jumps, an up b with decent invincibility frames on it, and excellent vertical range

i used to think of it as jigglypuff's recovery, just with an up b, but that's not exactly the case

 

[Doc King]

I looked at the third one.

G&W should not be higher. Fire is hard to sweetspot. Falcon and Ganondorf being that high up is not right at all. Their recoveries are very easily edgeguarded. Luigi's recovery is very slow and the misfire chance is too low to really make his recovery good. Kibry's recovery is quite bad. Despite having 5 midair jumps, they are really slow and the last couple don't even add much height. Very easy to edgeguard. Falco is not that bad because of the low amount of lag and mixups. Ness is definitely the worst. His double jump can't sweetspot and his PK Thunder is terrible.

You know, one person actually thought Kirby should have been higher.

 

[X1-12]

much worse aerial mobility, no pound, and you lost your jump if hit out of up+B

its average

 

[KAOSTAR]

you guys don't think kirby has one of the best recoveries?

5 jumps, an up b with decent invincibility frames on it, and excellent vertical range

i used to think of it as jigglypuff's recovery, just with an up b, but that's not exactly the case

****s pretty not good. I think average is correct. Its not hard to edgeguard. He doesnt have lots of options. He doesnt have purely safe options. He merely has the ability to recovery to the stage, on an average level. vertical range is average. There are plenty that are better. and plenty that are worse.

kirby sucks too lol

Well, to be fair, I have a hard time committing to edgeguarding Luigi when I'm above 100, because of the threat of misfire. He prolly won't get it, but if he does, I die, so I have to let him recover until he's close enough to the stage for me to be able to avoid a potential misfire.

I also don't get why lack of a double jump sweetspot is that big a deal for Ness. He has an airdodge, and the dj is huge.

Doesnt make it good. It just means u arent optimally edgeguarding. Pretty much kill luigi during his side b cool down. Its easy. you are safe from misfire, and u can still punish non missfires. from the edge just use inv frames and swat him away. but lol it does depend on ur character.

 

[Kanelol]

i'm gonna go ahead and argue for luigi as god tier for recovering

 

[MalwareDie]

Top Tier: Jigglypuff
High Tier: Mewtwo, Peach, Pichu, Pikachu
Upper Tier: Samus, Link, Fox
High Middle Tier: Falco, Zelda, Marth
Middle Tier: Ice Climbers, Young Link, Donkey Kong
Low Middle Tier: Sheik, Mr. Game & Watch, Mario, Dr. Mario
Low Tier: Luigi, Captain Falcon, Ganondorf, Kirby
Bottom Tier: Yoshi, Bowser, Popo, Roy, Ness

I edited my original list. What do you guys think?

 

[KAOSTAR]

I think peach has a better recovery than the chus

 

[Plairnkk]

zeldas recovery should be WAY down that list lol

her recovery is total ***. not being able to move at all after your up+b or turn around and grab the edge is just absurd. not to mention while her up+b starts shes still vulnerable for a sec, and she has a decent bit of landing lag. you can trick people sometimes and get to the ledge but that's not a good recovery, that's people not knowing the character. lol

 

[KAOSTAR]

if you go straight up you can turn around and grab the ledge.

 

[X1-12]

its not easy to do though :/

 

[P.C. Jona]

lol@ ppl saying doc has a terrrible recorvery

lrn2 di and recover

its like impossible to edge guard doc

 

[Doc King]

Actually, It's easy to. Doc has one of the worst recoveries in the game.

Also, Peach's recovery isn't that good, she has many problems with spikes, semi spikes, and meteors.

 

[P.C. Jona]

lol yea right

 

[MalwareDie]

zeldas recovery should be WAY down that list lol

her recovery is total ***. not being able to move at all after your up+b or turn around and grab the edge is just absurd. not to mention while her up+b starts shes still vulnerable for a sec, and she has a decent bit of landing lag. you can trick people sometimes and get to the ledge but that's not a good recovery, that's people not knowing the character. lol

Where do you think Zelda should be? Pretty much everybody after Young Link has mediocre or worse recovery anyways.

 

[MalwareDie]

Actually, It's easy to. Doc has one of the worst recoveries in the game.

No. Doc's recovery is better than Luigi's slow as hell recovery and he can actually defend himself with the cape. Falcon/Dark Dive are both useless to opponent's on a ledge, making Falcon/Ganon really easy to edgeguard. Kirby's recovery isn't better than Doc's either. It's slow and predictable. All you need to do is knock him away until he's out of jumps.

 

[1048576]

Doesnt make it good. It just means u arent optimally edgeguarding. Pretty much kill luigi during his side b cool down. Its easy. you are safe from misfire, and u can still punish non missfires. from the edge just use inv frames and swat him away. but lol it does depend on ur character.

If I'm in a position to hit Luigi within his 30 frames of cooldown, either he's close enough to the stage that I can dodge a misfire and not be edgeguarded by him afterwards, or we're both offstage and I just got lucky.

Smart Luigi's will keep their DJ for when they get that close.

 

[-ACE-]

Actually, It's easy to. Doc has one of the worst recoveries in the game.

Also, Peach's recovery isn't that good, she has many problems with spikes, semi spikes, and meteors.

I'm more on Jona's side on this one... Doc's recovery isn't quite as bad as a few people here are making it out to be. It's not great by any means, but it's not trash either. Good DI and intelligent use of pills/jump/cape/down-b goes a long way. Just a gimped version of mario's recovery.

Peach has a good recovery.

 

[MalwareDie]

Lol @ Sveet thinking that Marth is Ganon's worst match-up.

 

[PB&J]

icy's have a good distance in recovery but i think it is so easy to punish so i think it suks..i rather have falco's

 

[KAOSTAR]

If I'm in a position to hit Luigi within his 30 frames of cooldown, either he's close enough to the stage that I can dodge a misfire and not be edgeguarded by him afterwards, or we're both offstage and I just got lucky.

Smart Luigi's will keep their DJ for when they get that close.

you jump out during the travel of side b. you should already know if its a missfire by then. its more prediction than reaction when you jump out but definitely usable.

works decently as fox. other characters may need to edge guard from the ledge. just depends on who you play as.

and ive played good luigi's b4 who know how to recover.

 

[MooseEatsBear]

zeldas recovery should be WAY down that list lol

her recovery is total ***. not being able to move at all after your up+b or turn around and grab the edge is just absurd. not to mention while her up+b starts shes still vulnerable for a sec, and she has a decent bit of landing lag. you can trick people sometimes and get to the ledge but that's not a good recovery, that's people not knowing the character. lol

YOU obviously don't know the character, because you CAN turn around after her up-b, during the teleport.

 

[Silk]

My question is how do you define recovery, just getting back or actually getting onto and taking stage control again? (ie Falcon can make it back to the stage in many situations, but his recovery is easily punished once he gets there)

 

[JPOBS]

lol@ ppl saying doc has a terrrible recorvery

lrn2 di and recover

its like impossible to edge guard doc

lrn2 edge guard.

oh wait, u play falcon, nvm he sucks at..everything.

 

[MalwareDie]

My question is how do you define recovery, just getting back or actually getting onto and taking stage control again? (ie Falcon can make it back to the stage in many situations, but his recovery is easily punished once he gets there)

This.


I don't think Zelda's recovery is that bad. She has the option to get far back into the stage (Hopefully, far enough to not get punished) if taking the ledge isn't an option. A lot of characters don't even have that option because of their recoveries lack distance.

 

[JPOBS]

the only definition of recovery is being able to make it back to relatively even ground safely.

it doesnt matter if you make it back on stage every single time but just get knocked off again, your recovery still sucks.

 

[Doc King]

Alright, the thing about Peach's recovery is that it's VERY vulernable to spikes semi spikes and meteors. just like 2 up airs from Ganon or a Ken Combo and Peach is screwed. Also, It's somewhat slow. She might be able to float and all of that, but the vertical problems basically screws her from becoming Excellent Tier.

 

[JPOBS]

i find it amazing that every time you post, you almost never say anything correct or useful.

 

[RuKeN]

i think yoshi > doc

wtf???

falco cancel him second jump with shine

tier list:

Top 5

1 Jiggs
2 Peach
3 Kirby
4 Fox
5 Ganondorf

 

[Geist]

Why do people keep randomly making completely wrong posts without regarding any discussion from the past pages?

 

[CloneHat]

wtf???

falco cancel him second jump with shine

tier list:

Top 5

1 Jiggs
2 Peach
3 Kirby
4 Fox
5 Ganondorf

Kirby? Ganondorf?

Let's be serious.

 

[KirbyKaze]

I also don't get why lack of a double jump sweetspot is that big a deal for Ness. He has an airdodge, and the dj is huge.

It significantly reduces the amount of work someone gimping or edgeguarding him has to take into consideration.

DJ sweetspot is the reason Sheiks run off DJ into aerials to cover options; without that one available she can just wait onstage and do moves. The only restriction is that she has to do low lag moves so if one misses because of air-dodge, she just has to do another and then they die.

This applies for like every character.

The size of the double jump is crippled by the fact that it's also extremely slow and telegraphed.

 

[Cosmo!]

zeldas recovery should be WAY down that list lol

her recovery is total ***. not being able to move at all after your up+b or turn around and grab the edge is just absurd. not to mention while her up+b starts shes still vulnerable for a sec, and she has a decent bit of landing lag. you can trick people sometimes and get to the ledge but that's not a good recovery, that's people not knowing the character. lol

rofl

upB to ground and its a third of a second of lag (they have to guess right in order to kill you.)

you can turn around during upB

stop upBing from below the stage.

the one point you made that is legit is that she is vulnerable during startup, which is why airdodge is oftentimes good if you're close

its not the best recovery but it certainly is good enough

 

[Megatron1]

Alright, the thing about Peach's recovery is that it's VERY vulernable to spikes semi spikes and meteors. just like 2 up airs from Ganon or a Ken Combo and Peach is screwed. Also, It's somewhat slow. She might be able to float and all of that, but the vertical problems basically screws her from becoming Excellent Tier.

In general, 2 jumps will give you enough vertical distance to reach the edge. Horizontal distance is then used and can be dropped at anytime. Seeing as how you view mindgames in such high regards, mindgames anyone? Her vertical distance is just about enough to reach the edge's horizontal line of distance and float there.

 

[MalwareDie]

rofl

upB to ground and its a third of a second of lag (they have to guess right in order to kill you.)

you can turn around during upB

stop upBing from below the stage.

the one point you made that is legit is that she is vulnerable during startup, which is why airdodge is oftentimes good if you're close

its not the best recovery but it certainly is good enough

This. Zelda's recovery is not crap and is IMO better than half the casts' recoveries.

 

[RuKeN]

Kirby? Ganondorf?

Let's be serious.

ey ey ey

kirby is meta knight of melee

only need more time to discover all combos and really match up

and recovery of ganon no is bad

you hates ganondorf??

you hates kirby??

you are my enemy ¬¬