Recovery Tier List

[KirbyKaze]

if he's close enough to up+b to the level immediately after caping most characters should have a guaranteed way of gimping that from the edge. he doesn't have much height in his up+B so it's not too difficult to hit him. moves go through the cape because of invincibility, so it doesn't really protect him either.

also, even if you mispredict and stall on his up+b, unless you messed up and got hit by his up+b, he still gets hit because he then lands onstage with tons of lag and then you just get up and hit him.

 

[otg]

I do think that Doc's recovery is better then the other 3, but Kirbykaze has pretty much covered why it's bad and I stand by my placement of it in the bottom tier

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I can see either way. There are lots more chances/opportunities to live than ness/roy recoveries, even if the distance sucks. Every recovery has weaknesses, if you just judge on how weak ness/roy's is compared to doc's, i think they simply belong in a tier lower than the rest. SoPo's is significantly better than ness' and roy's too.

 

[otg]

So just based on peoples input into my list, I've made the following lil changes. And I'm sorry Kaostar, but I'm not putting M2 next to Jiggs, stop riding his Nuts so hard on everything, hes bad.

Nearly Impossible to Edgeguard Tier:

Jiggs

m2/peach

pichu/pika

Characters with Solid Recovery Options but can still be exploited tier:

Falco/Fox/Link/Samus/Y.Link

Our UpB's have 0 Vertical/horizontal movement Tier or We Get ***** by Landing Lag Tier:

Bowser/DK/Falcon/Ganon/GnW/Kirby/Luigi/Mario/Marth/Sheik/Zelda

Doc Tier:

Doc/Yoshi

Clearly Bottom Tier:

Sopo
Ness/Roy

Limbo:

Icies



Yeah

 

[Doc King]

I think that Roy should be switched with Yoshi since he has an up B and he can use the side B move to recover across the stage. Also he can use his up B (unlike Marth's) to get more horizontal range.

 

[KevinM]

" Also he can use his up B (unlike Marth's) to get more horizontal range."

Game breaking mechanic change tier list immeadiately and call the NY times.

 

[1048576]

if he's close enough to up+b to the level immediately after caping most characters should have a guaranteed way of gimping that from the edge. he doesn't have much height in his up+B so it's not too difficult to hit him. moves go through the cape because of invincibility, so it doesn't really protect him either.

also, even if you mispredict and stall on his up+b, unless you messed up and got hit by his up+b, he still gets hit because he then lands onstage with tons of lag and then you just get up and hit him.

All that applies to Marth, and Sheik, and most everyone else with a linear recovery. In fact, Sheik is a good example, both recoveries are short and hard to intercept.

 

[Winston]

Well, I get that you can edgeguard Doc through use of invincibility, but doesn't that apply the same to Mario?

The differences in their recoveries are that Mario gets more height from his stalls, right? but if it's the case that ledge invincibility > stalling, then why is Mario significantly better than Doc at recovering?

 

[Stevo]

Well, I get that you can edgeguard Doc through use of invincibility, but doesn't that apply the same to Mario?

The differences in their recoveries are that Mario gets more height from his stalls, right? but if it's the case that ledge invincibility > stalling, then why is Mario significantly better than Doc at recovering?

Mario Fireballs can hit the ledge from further out, so you can force them to get off the ledge before you get there. It's not perfect mind you, but it helps. His cape can stall you in the air quite a bit to if you need to wait a second before up-b.

Doc you have to come in from high to use pills.

 

[ponylover123456789]

mario's is slightly better than docs then. Pill angle, fall speed, height of side b, etc.
Awesome

 

[otg]

Fireballs and pills are pretty obsolete when they both recover. Mario gets the edge because of a wall jump and his cape gains height upon use. Any differences between their projectile and ptp are negligible when examining their recoveries on the whole.

 

[Stevo]

I disagree, I find that Mario's fireballs help under more circumstances than pills because you can use them from further out.

you are right, it's not a big difference, but small differences can really add up.

Mario being able to wall jump is pretty negligible too if we are gonna go down that road, but you mention that.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Don't Doc and Mario have exactly the same physics?

 

[MarsFool!]

Pretty sure doc is heavier. Pills < fireballs off stage imo. Simply because doc jeopardizes himself more with that phd weight.

Edit: sheiks recovery isn't as short as mario/doc. It actually goes a lot farther than people think. Complete invincibilty during the part where she actually travels is godlike @_@
Whenever she gets back on the stage she always takes the one hit every character in the games takes when they airdodge/upb/sideb (lag) onto the stage.

 

[Doc King]

Pretty sure doc is heavier. Pills < fireballs off stage imo. Simply because doc jeopardizes himself more with that phd weight.

Edit: sheiks recovery isn't as short as mario/doc. It actually goes a lot farther than people think. Complete invincibilty during the part where she actually travels is godlike @_@
Whenever she gets back on the stage she always takes the one hit every character in the games takes when they airdodge/upb/sideb (lag) onto the stage.

Actually Mario and Doc have the same weight.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Pills cover doc's body much much better than fireballs, as in, in order to jump offstage and hit doc with a bair you'd have to be right where those pill are.

I actually don't see how fireballs are better. The argument that they can reach farther forward seems to make sense until I realize that nobody is going to be pressured by that fireball at all.

Not saying I think doc's recovery is better, just saying I think the fireball argument is bad.

 

[X1-12]

unless its extremely high% and dreamland, fireballs are easier to use to force your opponent of the edge due to their trajectory

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Pop quiz: During Scorp's many incredible recoveries, how often would u attribute him recovering to his use of fireballs compared to his mixups in timings with his side, down and up b?

 

[Stevo]

I agree pills cover doc's body better but thats not as useful as fireballs being used from long distance IMO

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

so when u actually have good DI, fireballs are less effective? interesting.

 

[Stevo]

not necessarily,
sometimes even with good DI it is better to recover low
or even attacks like the knee or falco d-smash that send pretty low.

even with pills you can hit a doc floating in from high


double jump to fireball then up-b is pretty good as long as you position yourself well, throwing in side-b stalls if needed.