PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

[unknown522]

Yo, if PeePee still actually checks this thread, how could I actually implement more laz0rz in my game? I'm one of those "non-blaster" Falco's, moving him waaaay down the tiers, so I wanna figure out when to laser more often. Hints?

every time is a good time to laser. Just not point-blank sometimes. Even then, it might benefit you.

 

[MooseEatsBear]

Good stuff. Thanks guys, I'll be sure to remember that. But just one more question.
Best times to get off a shine? I can do it occasionally, but I can rarely get one when I'm playing, like, Vist, or Hat. or something.

Also, (sidebar), PeePee, I saw someone driving around my neighborhood in Maryland license plate that read "PPMD", and I thought it was you for a sec, then I remembered that you live in NC.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Good stuff. Thanks guys, I'll be sure to remember that. But just one more question.
Best times to get off a shine? I can do it occasionally, but I can rarely get one when I'm playing, like, Vist, or Hat. or something.

Also, (sidebar), PeePee, I saw someone driving around my neighborhood in Maryland license plate that read "PPMD", and I thought it was you for a sec, then I remembered that you live in NC.

Shines usually come from connecting with an aerial first or when you laser approach and your opponent thinks you're gonna grab and then you shine(some examples to start you off). That's mostly an experience/watching videos thing lol.

Or you could just shine out of shield. =p

And heck no I've never been in Maryland except for Pound 4 haha. I'm glad people are such big fans though. =p

 

[ChivalRuse]

Shine out of shield!

 

[everlasting yayuhzz]

sooooooooooooooooooooooooooo broken

 

[#HBC | Mac]

every time is a good time to laser. Just not point-blank sometimes. Even then, it might benefit you.

i get hit out of my lasers way too much

lasering is def more of a commitment than you make it seem in this post

 

[FoxLisk]

i get hit out of my lasers way too much

lasering is def more of a commitment than you make it seem in this post

troof, gotta be careful. lasering point blank is too **** though. especially against characters where it's really dangerous. ive gotten countless point blank lasers off against marths that never saw it coming and then got free grabs or shines out of it.

 

[X1-12]

You can actually Shine OoS on a platform by doing a shield drop, then shine straight away and stay on the same platform (or fall through then waveland). It comes out faster than traditional shine OoS and some people might find it easier to do. You can also buffer shied drops so that might be an advantage but beyond that theres not much going for it. Thought I'd mention it though.

 

[AvengerAngel]

OMG BUFFER SHIELD DROPS? o_o

How? Just holding down with the control stick while you're in shield stun? :o

 

[X1-12]

OMG BUFFER SHIELD DROPS? o_o

How? Just holding down with the control stick while you're in shield stun? :o

Basically shield drop like normal, by rolling the direction stick slowish from either side to the down position (you only actually have to go just past 45 degrees down) If you do this motion during hitstun and remain holding down when hitstun ends, you fall through on first available frame. You can also B-air or something out of this, Even platform cancel Bair if you're a tech-genius.

With the buffer-shield drop i generally point the shield towards them, even if its above you, then roll it round the side just after they hit your shield


EDIT:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQA7vbttZkQ#t=4m02s

Thats fox doing the Shielddrop -> shine and stay on platform thing i was talking about

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Whats the best way to beat someone who is shield camping? Because people usually end up shielding vs falco's lasers, i feel that a large part of falco's game is covering shield options. Right now if i approach with an aerial im always good about avoiding the grab and roll behind, and roll away is automatically disfavorable to them. My biggest problem i think is stopping fullhops out of shield on platform stages and letting them get above me.

When someone gets above me i'm not really sure how to defend it as falco other than shoot lasers. What is the best way to approach a shielding opponent who is on a platform? With marth its much better to wait under the platform, is that true for falco too, or should i be using a lot of shine->wavelands and then going from there?

 

[JPOBS]

if they are in sheild above me, the first thing i do is usually try to short hop upair shield poke their feet.
if this doesnt work because they naturally tilt their sheild down defensively too cover their feet, i try to full hop bair poke their face

shine waveland-> stuff is the best and covers the most options if you really wanna pressure them.
i hate just waiting under the platform cuz its easy for them to get away and reset

 

[unknown522]

i get hit out of my lasers way too much

lasering is def more of a commitment than you make it seem in this post

are you sure about that?

 

[joeplicate]

I knew it was a fluke.

hahaha sad graduate

good **** yayuhz
even if it was a 'fluke' don't let anyone take that victory away from you
no reverse-johns, man
all you can do is win the matches you gotta play

 

[FoxLisk]

dude even if it was a fluke, there's no way that even Dr. PP on a bad day is anything less than a solid opponent. that's a victory to be proud of and I can't wait to see the matches.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Unknown doesn't know if there's a way to beat a Falco lasering under a platform and camping really hard as Fox. That doesn't involve the Falco being an idiot, and without camping back.

To be fair, I don't know how to beat that with Fox (and many other characters) either.

Can someone good provide an answer? Specifics. I don't care about "OVERWHELM THEM WITH TEK SKILLZORZ, BE SUPER AGGRESSIVE, AND NAIR SHINE". No. If that's a good solution then dandy, I solved my own problem. But I want to know why it works, and I want to know whether or not it can be beaten by Falco simply spacing his lasers better or doing decently spaced moves (or CC Shine). Because if the strat loses to either, then it won't work vs a campy, smart Falco because they'll just do those and it will suck.

 

[stingers]

falco under a platform is the safest character in the game.

 

[Mogwai]

Unknown doesn't know if there's a way to beat a Falco lasering under a platform and camping really hard as Fox. That doesn't involve the Falco being an idiot, and without camping back.

To be fair, I don't know how to beat that with Fox (and many other characters) either.

Can someone good provide an answer? Specifics. I don't care about "OVERWHELM THEM WITH TEK SKILLZORZ, BE SUPER AGGRESSIVE, AND NAIR SHINE". No. If that's a good solution then dandy, I solved my own problem. But I want to know why it works, and I want to know whether or not it can be beaten by Falco simply spacing his lasers better or doing decently spaced moves (or CC Shine). Because if the strat loses to either, then it won't work vs a campy, smart Falco because they'll just do those and it will suck.

QQ MOAR

JUST L2techskilZ AND YOU'LL OVERWHELM THEM

 

[AvengerAngel]

I suppose powershielding a few lazors could work? I dunno if that's the solution you're looking for xP

I play Falco and when I'm playing dittos, to be honest, I have a hard time when the other Falco is ABOVE me, camping on the top platform. He can come down in like half a second and Dair **** me x(
When he's under a platform I'll just camp back staying on another platform and coming down as soon as I see an opening :O

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Find a way to approach him. Overall i find approaching falco from the air to be a bad idea, but defending from the air is usually good. If you can be out of your shield and close enough to punish a laser, he can't shoot one without retreating. The closer you get falco to the edge, the closer you are to taking his stock.

 

[Mogwai]

try doing it vs. PC Chris and just emulate what he does to counter it.

though, tbh, I think if the Falco has superior or equal reaction time and skill level, I think camping under platforms plays out very strongly in his favor.

 

[joeplicate]

1. see lasers
2. reflector
3. wait in reflector
...
PROFIT!

 

[KirbyKaze]

Doesn't work if they're winning.

Mogwai eat a dick.

(though you're probably right)

 

[joeplicate]

then u shoot one laser first!!


in all seriousness though, campy falco is hard to deal with on dreamland, i know (like DP from norcal >_>). it seems like it wouldn't be as big a problem on other stages.

in paper, there might be no way to deal with it. in practice, my bet would be on feigning an approach, then countering their response. and then being really effective with your grab combos/pressure.

 

[FoxLisk]

campy falco on dreamland is broken

campy falco on battlefield is good too, and against some characters it ***** on neutral pokemon stadium. hard to pull off on YS FD and to some extent FoD though

 

[Kanelol]

Nair Shine or Dair Shine for shield pressure

since i hate nairing

 

[Jartravious]

I keep getting hit by a nair out of my shine->dair combos. What are somethings I might be doing wrong?

 

[FoxLisk]

I keep getting hit by a nair out of my shine->dair combos. What are somethings I might be doing wrong?

um... trying it on samus? acting slowly? i dont know. more details or vids.

 

[Jartravious]

well i get the shine and the dair but mainly sheik and luigi nair me after it so i think i might be missing a fastfall

 

[FoxLisk]

well i get the shine and the dair but mainly sheik and luigi nair me after it so i think i might be missing a fastfall

nah that **** doesnt work on luigi. on sheik it's hard to pull off unless you like fh, hit with weak dair, and land on a platform or some ****.

 

[Winston]

It definitely works on Luigi, just not at really low percents. (<20? I don't know exactly).

Shine has more hitstun that you think, so you need to get above Luigi and start fastfalling before you start the downair. You should have time to do this if you jump immediately out of the shine instead of doing a wavedash like you would on fastfallers.

 

[X1-12]

how important is wavedashing onto the stage from holding the ledge as falco? I learn to do it real fast as fox and its a real pain to get it down on falco, plus it can be disastrous if done wrong

 

[Melomaniacal]

how important is wavedashing onto the stage from holding the ledge as falco? I learn to do it real fast as fox and its a real pain to get it down on falco, plus it can be disastrous if done wrong

I honestly rarely do it, but for some reason I find that it's way easier to get a good waveland if I shine off the ledge first.

 

[Jartravious]

So I'm going to my first out of state tournament tomorrow, POE3. Any advice? Of course I'll be playing my Falco

 

[#HBC | Mac]

cc shine, don't always approach the same way.

um, try to stay calm?

 

[X1-12]

So I'm going to my first out of state tournament tomorrow, POE3. Any advice? Of course I'll be playing my Falco

Make sure your hands can run on auto-pilot but your brain does not

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

when you guys shffl dair->shine, do you keep holding down after the fast fall and press b or do you press down to fastfall, reset the stick, and then press down b?
im asking technical people who **** not scrubs

 

[Kanelol]

if it's for shield pressure, hold down

if it's for combo'ing purposes, play it by ear. holding down seems better, you're CC'ing in case the person you're dairing comes at you with an f-smash or something

 

[Sanu]

is there any vids of a typical falco v marth low percent shine dair combo online? i always do it but tend to screw it up so that marth gets out of hitstun before i can shine him again after dairing him... and get punished

i read that pp said to stop after 35% but i can't even get to 35% without ****ing it up haha. thanks

 

[unknown522]

do d-air -> shine -> d-air -> 2 u-tilts -> shine -> d-air -> move of choice. It's better anyway.