PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

[Lightsyde]

Not the tech skill. You can get the required tech down in a month, tops. The rest is a mental game and that takes years of practice.

The basics maybe. You're insane if you can even do half of his more advanced tech stuff after a month, much less apply them.

 

[Druggedfox]

I've been playing this game almost 7 years and its just been in the last year or so that I've felt truly proficient in every technical aspect; even then there's STILL stuff I'm working on learning...what is this one month talk >_>

 

[linkoninja]

How do you guys wave-shine? Do you slide the control stick from Down
to Down left/right
or do you let the control stick return to neutral?

 

[Lightsyde]

Down to diagonal.

Wave shining and running/walking out is a traditional fireball motion. If you look at your number pad, it's 2-3-6.

Somebody should link to a tech skill explanation thread if there is one. >_>

EDIT: And yeah DF, it took me like 3 years before I felt decently fast and 4 before I was really over almost all the serious tech skill barriers. One month is like O_o

 

[Rubyiris]

Darksyde, I asked you to fix your sig. :\

 

[Lightsyde]

I've gotten so many compliments/laughs on it and it's not mocking you at all. What's the problem?

 

[Bones0]

If someone practiced 2-3+ hours every day for a month, they could easily get down the basic Falco tech (shining consistently after aerials, wavedashing out of shines after you hit them, following up shines with appropriate moves like SH or FH dair, then linking the end of that to a new combo with shine or utilt). The issue is applying all this to an opponent who is actively DIing and who you can't just do the same thing to every time. You have to know when to end the combo and get them off stage instead of just dair shining until they get away. But as far as having the tech skill to 0-death a level 9 fast faller on FD, it shouldn't take that long. Even if you aren't doing it as fast and smooth as possible, it's usually doesn't make a difference against a CPU.

 

[Divinokage]

Darksyde, I asked you to fix your sig. :\

Insecure, much?

Pretty sure we're all friends here. Rainbows and stuff.

 

[Druggedfox]

Just being able to do all the technical movements isn't really the same as "having the tech skill down" imo. I'm sure anybody could learn "okay shine, wavedash, downair, l-cancel, shine, repeat", but to be able to think of it all as one fluid, practiced motion and have it be something so intuitive they could do it in their sleep... that doesn't happen that quickly. Just being able to do the motions really doesn't mean much in the long run, its just one step closer to being proficient.

This thread is boring; somebody tell me how to fight sheik as falco :D

 

[SSBM_or_GTFO]

If someone practiced 2-3+ hours every day for a month, they could easily get down the basic Falco tech (shining consistently after aerials, wavedashing out of shines after you hit them, following up shines with appropriate moves like SH or FH dair, then linking the end of that to a new combo with shine or utilt). The issue is applying all this to an opponent who is actively DIing and who you can't just do the same thing to every time. You have to know when to end the combo and get them off stage instead of just dair shining until they get away. But as far as having the tech skill to 0-death a level 9 fast faller on FD, it shouldn't take that long. Even if you aren't doing it as fast and smooth as possible, it's usually doesn't make a difference against a CPU.

When did CPUs come into this discussion?

Falco's combos give you a lot of time to think and makes it easier to follow DI.

Bolded part is what I would consider the mental game of Melee.

 

[Bones0]

I used CPUs as a basis for what is technical vs. what is mental. That's why I included the bolded part.

 

[linkoninja]

I don't think there is a thread that tells how to do all of Falco's advanced techniques.

 

[SSBM_or_GTFO]

I used CPUs as a basis for what is technical vs. what is mental. That's why I included the bolded part.

Then perhaps I am arguing with someone who was agreeing with me? If so...I feel stupid. T_T

@linkoninja I think there's a Smash glossary that lists all/majority of the advanced techniques in Melee.

 

[Bones0]

Yeah, I was agreeing with you that the basic technical aspect of Falco can be achieved with just a month of solid training. It is the mental application of tech that takes a million years, plus some more advanced tech stuff (like altering aerial timings during shield pressure, multishining, wavelanding for general movement, spacing on your opponent, etc.) LOL >_>

 

[linkoninja]

Then perhaps I am arguing with someone who was agreeing with me? If so...I feel stupid. T_T

@linkoninja I think there's a Smash glossary that lists all/majority of the advanced techniques in Melee.

Yeah but not character specifics for Falco

 

[Dr Peepee]

This thread is boring; somebody tell me how to fight sheik as falco :D

Find out how Sheik handles lasers, bait it or stuff it, then combo until Sheik's offstage(doesn't take long if they SDI) and force the double jump to whatever you want to do to punish that. Don't get cornered. Scare Sheik with jumps and/or lasers if she decides to chill on platforms(unless it's a smaller stage your moves can hit through).

 

[Druggedfox]

When dealing with how sheik deals with lasers, what can you really stuff? That's the main thing that bothers me; I feel like I can only rely on baiting her stuff, but if she doesn't take the bait I don't really get anywhere. What options does she have to deal with my approach that I can just stuff?

Haha I asked twice whoops

 

[Dr Peepee]

Well I'm talking about OOS things(mainly Nair but WD or another aerial works too) there for the most part, unless you're just close enough to beat out like take a laser to Ftilt or something.

 

[Druggedfox]

Hmm mkay; sounds good. I feel like sheik's fair OoS usually beats my dair when they position it right, but I guess I'm just getting annoyed that I can't straight up beat everything she has >_>

Btw, are you going to anything big before genesis2? Or is your showdown with mango just gonna be based on your thoughts from now until then, rather than experience? =P

 

[Dr Peepee]

I don't like Dair vs Sheik if she's shielding due to that reason lol.

I'm not totally sure what all I'm doing yet, I'll know within a week or two. Not doing Zenith I'm pretty sure, but beyond that plans are kinda up in the air still.

Don't worry, I'll be on that thinking either way lol. =)

 

[JPOBS]

im so excited to see a tryhard mango again.

which of his characters do you think is the best? more importantly, have you played his puff to any meaningful extent? if so what'd you think? if not, are you worried at it all?

 

[SSBM_or_GTFO]

im so excited to see a tryhard mango again.

which of his characters do you think is the best? more importantly, have you played his puff to any meaningful extent? if so what'd you think? if not, are you worried at it all?

If Mango won't use Puff now, why would tryhard Mango would use Puff again? imho, he'd probably go Fox, Falco, or CF.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Never played his singles puff, so I'm not sure. His Falco is definitely his best character he uses somewhat often though, I know that much. Socal seems to think it's his Fox, but I've never had that much trouble vs it once I got going(he's gonna play differently vs me so maybe that'll change).

To be honest, yeah I'm worried. Stupid personal BS is keeping me from thinking about this as much as I want to so I'm worried I won't be prepared in time and he'll be great seeing as he just needs to play. And I mean there's the general unknown of how he will improve in this time frame too.

 

[linkoninja]

PP vs Mango Falco dittos at Genesis 2 Grand Finals
I'm calling it

 

[JPOBS]

Never played his singles puff, so I'm not sure. His Falco is definitely his best character he uses somewhat often though, I know that much. Socal seems to think it's his Fox, but I've never had that much trouble vs it once I got going(he's gonna play differently vs me so maybe that'll change).

To be honest, yeah I'm worried. Stupid personal BS is keeping me from thinking about this as much as I want to so I'm worried I won't be prepared in time and he'll be great seeing as he just needs to play. And I mean there's the general unknown of how he will improve in this time frame too.

Either wayI'm very excited. Do you know what triggered this apparent sudden revived interest in him?

 

[Veetaak]

PP vs Mango Falco dittos at Genesis 2 Grand Finals
I'm calling it

NO!

Armada and PP in GF. But as long as PP or Armada is in the finals I'll be happy. I don't know how Armada could become so good at this game when he mostly plays people he only wins against. USA is his only threat really.

btw, I saw Armada do a kind of weird edge guard at Beauty last week when he played Falco in friendlies which contained of him jumping (I think it was full jump) out towards the recovering enemy, using 1 laser shot and then DJ--> Dair.

Is this something no one knows about or what? It looked to be very effective at certain heights. I have just never seen it before ^^

 

[Dr Peepee]

Either wayI'm very excited. Do you know what triggered this apparent sudden revived interest in him?

He says he got tired of being called washed up or something, but I'm almost positive that's not what it is(basically I don't know).

NO!

Armada and PP in GF. But as long as PP or Armada is in the finals I'll be happy. I don't know how Armada could become so good at this game when he mostly plays people he only wins against. USA is his only threat really.

btw, I saw Armada do a kind of weird edge guard at Beauty last week when he played Falco in friendlies which contained of him jumping (I think it was full jump) out towards the recovering enemy, using 1 laser shot and then DJ--> Dair.

Is this something no one knows about or what? It looked to be very effective at certain heights. I have just never seen it before ^^

It's actually pretty good but kinda risky. Ron, from NC, was playing around with that stuff a ton a few months ago but I never really saw how much he did with it(mostly told me on the phone about it).

Anything edgeguard related would be cool to play with so it couldn't hurt to test out.

 

[Druggedfox]

Why is everybody so hung up on mango's puff? Just throwing that out there for anybody to answer... I just don't really see anything special to it

 

[JPOBS]

^ Neither do I. Im one of those that resides in the camp that his puff honestly can't magically be any better than his fox or falco.

But

its a puff of legend lets be honest. stormed through losers bracket at pound 3 to beat m2k in his prime, plus there's the epic dual at Genesis 1, and whenever him and lucky are somehow losing in teams, he switches to puff and then they win.

history mostly i guess.

 

[leffen]

Lol veetaak you're such a fan boi

 

[Sage Osaka]

Why is everybody so hung up on mango's puff? Just throwing that out there for anybody to answer... I just don't really see anything special to it

i think it's less the fact that it's puff, and more than it's mango controlling it. mango makes any character he plays very unique and look sometimes overpowered, or at least better than any other player makes them look. so all in all, i think it's just mango, and not any specific character he's playing.

 

[Rubyiris]

I've gotten so many compliments/laughs on it and it's not mocking you at all. What's the problem?

Elaborate on how it isn't mocking me.

I'm sure tje people laughing about it are laighing at the fact that tjey think I posted something stupid

@kage: yes I am insecure. :/ also where are you getting this friend business from? I hate the falco boards. :/

 

[FoxLisk]

we hate you too.

mango's puff is not worth worrying about anymore. and PP will beat his fox with ease. if Mango goes Falco the set will be close but like... idk, unless PP chokes because OMG ITS MANGOO000HNOO i think he'll win. mango's great and he had his era but you can't maintain that with absolutely no effort. even if mango wins it's not gonna be a shut down. he's gonna have to work his *** off.

jumping off and lasering sounds too risky. lasers dont cover a lot of space (vertically speaking) so if you just, like, miss, **** could go wrong. and then you're off stage with no DJ and that's just... that's just not good.

 

[Brookman]

I don't think there is any point in theorizing about mango vs. pp.. .. .. ..

;]

 

[Dr Peepee]

Why is everybody so hung up on mango's puff? Just throwing that out there for anybody to answer... I just don't really see anything special to it

It's kinda like....the original. What Mango used to become good and it set his foundation as a player and what he does with every other character(all of them play like his Puff). So, I feel like it's possible he could play his best with Puff simply because he gets her the best and she's most intuitive to him now.

And yeah the legendary thing is what most people are probably hung up on lol.

 

[tarheeljks]

we hate you too.

mango's puff is not worth worrying about anymore. and PP will beat his fox with ease. if Mango goes Falco the set will be close but like... idk, unless PP chokes because OMG ITS MANGOO000HNOO i think he'll win. mango's great and he had his era but you can't maintain that with absolutely no effort. even if mango wins it's not gonna be a shut down. he's gonna have to work his *** off.

jumping off and lasering sounds too risky. lasers dont cover a lot of space (vertically speaking) so if you just, like, miss, **** could go wrong. and then you're off stage with no DJ and that's just... that's just not good.

as in no one knows so there's no point in speculating, or as in it's not good anymore?

 

[Divinokage]

He's not passing me this time...

 

[Strong Badam]

NO!

Armada and PP in GF. But as long as PP or Armada is in the finals I'll be happy. I don't know how Armada could become so good at this game when he mostly plays people he only wins against. USA is his only threat really.

lol you mean like how Amsah beat Armada at Pound 4?

 

[Brookman]

blame it on the pa-papa-pa-pa-pal-pa-pal

 

[Deleted member]

PP, what do you think of Falco's match ups vs Fox on different stages?

What are your preferences and beliefs?