[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Pieman0920]

I think you missed the first line of his post, Pieman.

Oh I saw it, and I still don't know what he's trying to proove with the list. Its not like I said everything has to be expected. I just said that things that are expected don't translated out to things that are bland all the time. We all pretty much expect Little Mac, but that doesn't make him bland. That being said, I don't expect everything to be simply expected like he is.

@Shortie: You're not thinking things through with that. While certain characters like Mario can pull off four costumes, others can't. While I wouldn't mind original costumes for some characters, making four for some is just too much.

 

[Shorts]

@Shortie: You're not thinking things through with that. While certain characters like Mario can pull off four costumes, others can't. While I wouldn't mind original costumes for some characters, making four for some is just too much.

I dont see why people dont like orginal costumes? I mean whats the big deal?

I would love to play as polarbear/penguin ice climbers!

 

[Big-Cat]

I dont see why people dont like orginal costumes? I mean whats the big deal?

I would love to play as polarbear/penguin ice climbers!

The reason why some people don't like original costumes is because the vast majority of the stuff if the games are derived from Nintendo games which is the point of the series. Original costumes take away from this to some people, but I'm fine with it as long as they're tasteful.

Another thing to consider is that the Super Smash Bros. series isn't all that good when it comes to original content. Look at the Subpar Emissary and it's clear as day.

 

[Pieman0920]

I think original costumes could work well enough for certain characters, but I feel that its a bit too much to make three different original costumes for those who don't have anything. The ICs would have to have three different forms from scrap, and what about characters like G&W? I think its just too much when you try to expand it by that much, and thus I feel that one alt costume is enough.

 

[Shorts]

True, I just think that the Mario, Zelda, Metroid and Pt's have soo many good costumes, none isnt acceptable, and just I couldnt decide between all of marios costumes if i had to.

Ive taken the liberty of giving Mario franchise characters their alt costumes:

Mario frog Suit:
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/958/178879-frog_suit_mario_large.jpg

Peach Soccer Gear:
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_TJWccbWs7CY/RicNS3XDX0I/AAAAAAAAAZI/Gx3VkCgNHKY/Peach_SoccerOutfit.jpg

Luigi, as Mr. L:
http://sites.google.com/site/palaceofshadow/spm-mrl.jpg

Bowser as dry bowser:
http://media.photobucket.com/image/dry bowser/Rufrky/dry.jpg?o=4

Possible newcomers:

Bowser Jr, soccer gear:
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/0/727/411103-strikers_bowserjr_thumb.png

Daisy, tennis clothes:
http://images2.fanpop.com/image/pho...r-Tennis-peach-and-daisy-9339458-853-1024.jpg

Toad, as toadette:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_QXybMfeXlHw/SX9XCk2Qf6I/AAAAAAAAAHc/sSoI19VERIk/s320/Toad+y+Toadette.jpg


i set up links, if on the off chance you didnt know/remember what the other costume looked like. I hope they work! I have terrible luck w/ links

 

[Fatmanonice]

I didn't think of that whole thing as a psychological headlock. Do you have a link to that 2009 interview by the way? I'm still feeling iffy about this interview:

http://www.levelfortytwo.com/2010/02/discussion-sakurai-and-kamiya/

The fact that he wants to make games for beginners, while thoughtful and all, bothers me. Especially in a multiplayer game (competitive or not) since I don't want these kind of games to be completely noob friendly. Accessible? Yes, but not where the skill gap is incredibly small.

Ah, sorry, I meant 2008. Here are the various interviews anyway.

The GDC interview:

http://wii.ign.com/articles/853/853748p1.html

This article in this link talks about the interview that was had a few months later:

http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/32197/t1188095-sakurai-talks-brawl-sequel/

This article talks about it more:

http://www.officialnintendomagazine.co.uk/article.php?id=5437

It's understandable that he wants to make easy games because, afterall, he's the one who created the Kirby series. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If the learning curve of the next SSB is a big enough issue with the fans, I'm sure he'll catch on. Granted, he doesn't give the fans everything they want but he does have a good track record for securing the big things (like online play in Brawl).

Add in: I would say that it was a headlock. It was the equivalent of taking a favorite painting of an artist and saying that they were going to paint more on it. For some people, that wouldn't be a big deal but I'm pretty sure that hit a big nerve with Sakurai considering, like I said before, it was his pride and his distinguished mark in the gaming world.

 

[DekuBoy]

Well SMG2 looks amazing. I can only hope Nintendo are learning from their mistakes and SSB4 will blow us away.

 

[Big-Cat]

It's understandable that he wants to make easy games because, afterall, he's the one who created the Kirby series. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If the learning curve of the next SSB is a big enough issue with the fans, I'm sure he'll catch on. Granted, he doesn't give the fans everything they want but he does have a good track record for securing the big things (like online play in Brawl).

Not only that, but considering that he had no intention of it appealing to strictly to casuals, it's a glimmer of hope that the sequel will right the wrongs in Brawl (IMO). Just make it like Melee, learning wise, where it was easy to learn, but the mental game is what makes the mechanics and such hard to master. Other than that, make all skill barriers actually useful (no L-Canceling) and get rid of random tripping (or at least give us a switch to turn it off).

 

[Shyguytheninja]

:|

1)

Some desired characters are:



Master Chief: Because

If they added Master Chief it would no longer be a Smash game. Master Chief has NEVER been on a nintendo system, and he has nothing to do with nintendo. The company that made him isn't even Japanese! He might be a cool character, but you have to remember, Super Smash Bros isn't a gathering of video game characters to battle, its a gather of NINTENDO characters to battle, excluding certain companies that have been on Nintendo systems.




Now that thats done with, here's my character wishlist, with a cool final smash.

ShyGuy: Well duh, he's the coolest guy ever. Their final smash could be they take off their mask, and scare the sh*t out of every character, raising their HP to 500%

Isaac: He's pretty awsome, but I can't think of a final smash for him.

MewTwo: They should bring him back. His final smash could be like from the movie, were he grabs them with psychic powers, and tosses them away.

Mew: I love mew :3 It's final smash could be where it pops up behind someone, and 'mews' and disapears when they turn around, and just does that, before it eventually smashes them away.

Custom mii: You could choose any mii from your plaza, and your final smash could be a mii parade! Where every mii you owns charges across the screen, and the attack does more damage depending on how many miis you have.

Pokemon trainerS: Emphasis on the plural. I know, I know, it would basically just be a clone, but it could just be different skins. My choice for a Johto trainer would be: Typhlosion, Bayleef, and totodile. And for hoenn, A grovyle, blaziken, and a mudkip. The final smash for hoenn would definetly be annoying the opponent together with the mudkip, by going "mud! kip! mud! kip! mud! kip!" >:3 And I don't really know the new series that well, because I don't own Diamond or pearl, but I know the starters. I'd want a monferno, Torterra, and Piplup.

Thats about it. I can't think of any others.

 

[Starphoenix]

If they added Master Chief it would no longer be a Smash game. Master Chief has NEVER been on a nintendo system, and he has nothing to do with nintendo. The company that made him isn't even Japanese! He might be a cool character, but you have to remember, Super Smash Bros isn't a gathering of video game characters to battle, its a gather of NINTENDO characters to battle, excluding certain companies that have been on Nintendo systems.

Megaman is the only third party franchise character that "deserves" to be included, even above Sonic the Hedgehog.

Dragon Quest IX is being released overseas as a Nintendo game. Just wanted to point that out... That's a little more than Intelligent Systems helping SE to develop Dragon Quest Wars.

 

[Cyn]

Megaman is the only third party franchise character that "deserves" to be included, even above Sonic the Hedgehog.

He's not the only one, but I'm not going to get into that again for the sake of repetitiveness.

 

[Starphoenix]

He's not the only one, but I'm not going to get into that again for the sake of repetitiveness.

Which other series are you referring to? Castlevania? I can agree with that, since I do not care for the series it is not one that comes to mind every time.

 

[Cyn]

Which other series are you referring to? Castlevania? I can agree with that, since I do not care for the series it is not one that comes to mind every time.

That be the one But yes, I agree that MM definitely deserves a spot on the roster and has a better shot than other remaining third parties.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Not only that, but considering that he had no intention of it appealing to strictly to casuals, it's a glimmer of hope that the sequel will right the wrongs in Brawl (IMO). Just make it like Melee, learning wise, where it was easy to learn, but the mental game is what makes the mechanics and such hard to master. Other than that, make all skill barriers actually useful (no L-Canceling) and get rid of random tripping (or at least give us a switch to turn it off).

I've been meaning to ask you and others here what they think of the idea of the game featuring dual mechanics or a mode that allows you to tweak them. Do you think that would be practical or do you think that would take a lot on the developers part to make possible? I imagine there would be a mode where you could pick SSB, Melee, Brawl, or SSB4's mechanics or just adjust certain factors like fall speed and hit stun accordingly.

 

[Big-Cat]

I've been meaning to ask you and others here what they think of the idea of the game featuring dual mechanics or a mode that allows you to tweak them. Do you think that would be practical or do you think that would take a lot on the developers part to make possible? I imagine there would be a mode where you could pick SSB, Melee, Brawl, or SSB4's mechanics or just adjust certain factors like fall speed and hit stun accordingly.

I'd rather not see that kind of thing for a few reasons.

1. By giving you the options to change the engine as you please, you'll have at minimum four different communities due to the preference of one engine over the others.
2. There's the balancing in each of these engines for all the characters. You would be balancing an around 50 character roster four times for each character.
3. The customization of hitstun and fall speed would just screw up a lot of characters and benefit the others dpending on the settings.
4. New characters added from Melee and on would need to have movesets for those individual engines. The newcomers in SSB4 would need four movesets for each of the engines.

I'm all for customization, but you and I know these games require enough balance to begin with. Then there's the time involved. I'd rather have more stages and characters than several ways to screw with the engine.

 

[n88]

I'd rather not see that kind of thing for a few reasons.

1. By giving you the options to change the engine as you please, you'll have at minimum four different communities due to the preference of one engine over the others.
2. There's the balancing in each of these engines for all the characters. You would be balancing an around 50 character roster four times for each character.
3. The customization of hitstun and fall speed would just screw up a lot of characters and benefit the others dpending on the settings.
4. New characters added from Melee and on would need to have movesets for those individual engines. The newcomers in SSB4 would need four movesets for each of the engines.

1.So what? People can play what they wanna play. Providing a bit of customization is more likely to create a few small, cheerful communities rather than a single large, disgruntled one. Fine by me.

2.True, but if there's anything heinously wrong with the balance, could it not hypothetically be patched? I'm not saying the possibility of a fix completely negates the point, but it is something to consider.

3.Meh. There'd still be a default setting to go by. I imagine people wouldn't be experimenting too much in the case of a match that actually meant something. More likely, it would just be a for-fun thing.

4.I'm not sure whole new movesets would be necessary. A setting that emulated the physics of older Smash games wouldn't by necessity require the removal of attacks that weren't in the game.

 

[Big-Cat]

1.So what? People can play what they wanna play. Providing a bit of customization is more likely to create a few small, cheerful communities rather than a single large, disgruntled one. Fine by me.

Are you aware of how we have all three SSB games in distinct camps?

2.True, but if there's anything heinously wrong with the balance, could it not hypothetically be patched? I'm not saying the possibility of a fix completely negates the point, but it is something to consider.

It depends on how big the patch needs to be. Not only that, but there's a lot of data, from my understanding, that goes in the balancing process. By this, I mean "What if a character is 7-3? How do we fix it so it's 6-4?" Then there's the data to compile and present to give evidence that something needs to be fixed.

Not everything can be fixed with a patch.

3.Meh. There'd still be a default setting to go by. I imagine people wouldn't be experimenting too much in the case of a match that actually meant something. More likely, it would just be a for-fun thing.

It still seems like a pointless feature.

4.I'm not sure whole new movesets would be necessary. A setting that emulated the physics of older Smash games wouldn't by necessity require the removal of attacks that weren't in the game.

If you go by what I said about there having to be a balancing for each engine, it's not too hard to explain. You would likely have to change the frame data, kockback properties, frame properties, etc. You're not making brand new movesets, but there would be three movesets that are modifications of the brand new one.

Simply put, this kind of thing is worth too much time and money to really go through with it. I'd rather have more characters, stages, music, and other assorted fanservice with an excellent balance in one gameplay engine than four engines in one game that may be of varying quality.

 

[Starphoenix]

Gotta go with Kuma on this one, way too much work for something that is not necessary. Let alone the possible ramifications the feature would have on wifi matches.

If user A is using an engine drastically different than user B it would set up for possible dis/advantages. Not that the engine itself would carry over into the matches, but if user A is not used to the "set" engine his/her matches will be difficult online. It comes to the point where it becomes needlessly complicated.

 

[Shorts]

Im sorry, but Megaman and Casltevania arent the "only" ones who deserve a spot. I could name like... ten! In fact i will.

1. Megaman Series
2. Final Fantasy Series
3. CastleVania Series
4. Dragon Quest Series
5. Soul Caliber Series
6. BomberMan Series
7. NiGHTS series
8. Goemons Great Adventure Series
9. Bubble bobble series
10. Tales Of Symphonia Series
11. Murumasa the demon blade.
12. Street Fighter/DarkStalkers Series

There, now dont you agree these series "deserve" a spot? Or at least would be cool in SSB4?

You all make it sound like Nintendo, Castlevania and megaman are the only good game series, but their are tons! I would love for any of these sreies to get a rep. yes i would love to see a castlevania character in smash

 

[Joe420]

seriously, captain falcon just needs to get back up to a very high tier for ssb4
the rest can be extras and surprise us like always

 

[Big-Cat]

You all make it sound like Nintendo, Castlevania and megaman are the only good game series, but their are tons! I would love for any of these sreies to get a rep. yes i would love to see a castlevania character in smash

No one's saying those series are bad or anything. It's more of the question of which ones are "worthy" so to speak. Out of your list, I'd say Final Fantasy, Castlevania, Dragon Quest, Megaman, Tales (debatable, but other than Pacman, I can see Lloyd from Namco), and Street Fighter are the only ones that could be considered as such.

seriously, captain falcon just needs to get back up to a very high tier for ssb4
the rest can be extras and surprise us like always

Tiers just happen. The developers don't necessarily decide which is the best and which is the worst on the roster. Tiers are products of the metagame.

 

[Pieman0920]

Shortie, that list is pretty bad. For one, you've got SF below SC...and you have SC in there in the first place which is pretty bad. Out of all those, Bubble Bobble, Soul Calibur, NiGHTS, Muramasa, Tales, Goemon, and Bomberman don't deserve to get in at all. I'd say that Dragon Quest is stretching it too, but I'm just giving its popularity in Japan the benefit of the doubt. FF, MM, SF, and Castlevania are the only iconic enough series I think would really stand a chance, and in Castlevania's case, we already have a Konami franchise. (And in SF's case, we'd get MM before it)

 

[Fatmanonice]

Im sorry, but Megaman and Casltevania arent the "only" ones who deserve a spot. I could name like... ten! In fact i will.

1. Megaman Series
2. Final Fantasy Series
3. CastleVania Series
4. Dragon Quest Series
5. Soul Caliber Series
6. BomberMan Series
7. NiGHTS series
8. Goemons Great Adventure Series
9. Bubble bobble series
10. Tales Of Symphonia Series
11. Murumasa the demon blade.
12. Street Fighter/DarkStalkers Series

There, now dont you agree these series "deserve" a spot? Or at least would be cool in SSB4?

You all make it sound like Nintendo, Castlevania and megaman are the only good game series, but their are tons! I would love for any of these sreies to get a rep. yes i would love to see a castlevania character in smash

Deserve is a really strong word and I really don't like to use it all that much anymore because of how its really driven by opinions rather than fact. You can argue that any character deserves to get in and, within your own logic, you'd still be right. As my posting history would tell you, the word is pretty much debate bait.

Now, for what I think:

1. Megaman has a long history that goes back to 1986, he has close to 100 games, and he has appeared on every Nintendo console except the Virtual Boy. If I had to tag the word deserve to any third party character, it'd be him.

2. Final Fantasy's weird. It really doesn't have a main character to represent the entire franchise. There's Mog and the Chocobo but I still say its iffy if either could effectively carry the weight of representing such a major franchise in gaming. Definitely an important franchise but freakishly hard to effectively represent.

3. Castlevania also has a nice history with Nintendo and has also had a game on every Nintendo console except the Virtual Boy. The only problem will be if Snake stays around because both Castlevania and Metal Gear are Konami franchises. Third party spaces are limited and it's assumed that third party representation will be spread evenly to avoid any one third party getting more share of the game's profits then another.

4. Enix and Nintendo have had a strong relationship even before Enix became a part of Square to form (Oh my God, what is he going to say?!) Square-Enix. Dragon Quest is a titanic franchise... in Japan. It is one of the top selling video game franchises... in Japan. Sakurai said that he didn't want to show bias to any one particular region when it came to character selections and with third party spaces being so limited, he may want to step over this option altogether.

5. Soul Caliber is Namco-Bandai. It has only had two games released on Nintendo systems since 2003 despite 4 being made since that time. I'm also not sure how well the characters of Soul Caliber would work in a Smash Bros setting. Granted, Snake worked but they pretty much made him a clean slate to make him work. Like with Final Fantasy, who would be the main character to represent the franchise? Nightmare? Mitsirugi? Ivy? Once again, a very tough call.

6. Bomberman has had games on Nintendo systems since 1986 and has appeared on every Nintendo consle except the Virtual Boy. He is owned by Hudson Soft which is an extension of Komani. There's one problem. Another is that Bomberman's influence has definitely fallen in recent years. It was never really a huge franchise to begin with but now it's reached a level of meh-ness that's seen in other franchises like Crash Bandicoot and Spyro. Is he iconic? Even if you asked me this question 10 years ago, I would have told you that it was debatable.

7. Two games with shattered cameos through-out probably close to a dozen games. The first roadblock is that its own by SEGA which already has Sonic has their main man and unless things drastically change in the next five years, Sonic isn't leaving Smash Bros. Is NIGHTS iconic? Not really. If anything the first NIGHTS was a cult classic while the second game got average scores. If you ask me, SEGA should just stay with Sonic because when it comes to their other characters, no one else really comes close to the star power that he has. (I'd personally say that Ai-Ai's in a distant second place.)

8. Great franchise but it hasn't had an installment since I believe 2006. Also, it's owned by Konami. It also doesn't really help that the franchise is virtually unknown outside Japan and hasn't had a game in North America since, I believe, the year 2000. I'd love to see Goemon come back eventually though but I don't think Smash Bros is the place for that.

9. I have virtually no opinion on Bubble Bobble. I can't really think of any good reasons for them though aside from the franchise having as long a history with Nintendo as Megaman, Castlevania, and Bomberman. How iconic they are is also debatable.

10. Tales of Symphonia was just two installments out of twelve in the Tales of... franchise. Lloyd has been playable in three games making him, I believe, the Tales of... character with the most playable appearances. As he's Namco-Bandai, he has competition with several other characters including Pac-Man.

11. Muramasa will probably end up being a one hit wonder. There's not really anything else to discuss unless more installments come in the future or the fanbase for it really upsurges.

12. I don't really have an opinion on Street Fighter aside from how I'd prefer to see Megaman represent Capcom. Darkstalkers hasn't had a game since 1997 so that's not really up for debate. It's had loads of cameos since then but that's about it.

 

[ChronoBound]

A few notes on fatmanonice's assessment of various third-parties series:

On Final Fantasy:
There has not been any big Final Fantasy games on Nintendo home consoles since 1994. The main series will likely never return to Nintendo consoles since Square has said they prefer tech-power over console sales.

On Dragon Quest:
Dragon Quest has almost as an extensive history on Nintendo consoles as Mega Man and Castlevania. Heck, only few main installments, remakes, or spinoffs were made for non-Nintendo consoles. Also, the main series got brought back to Nintendo consoles with Dragon Quest IX being released for the Nintendo DS, and Dragon Quest X being in development for the Wii. Also, a crossover title between Mario and Dragon Quest was made for the Nintendo DS (but not released outside Japan). NOA is planning to publish and market Dragon Quest IX in North America, so we will see if Dragon Quest's overseas popularity gets a boost.

On Bomberman:
There WAS a Bomberman game for the Virtual Boy. It was called Panic Bomber.

On Street Fighter:
The best thing going for a Street Fighter character being playable in Smash Bros. (most likely Ryu) is that characters from that series have been in MANY crossover fighting games, and secondly the series has seen a resurgence in popularity. It also helps that crossover titles with Ryu and company have been made for recent Nintendo consoles (most notable Tatsunoko vs. Capcom).

Overall, you provided a nice assessment regarding those series fatmanonice.

Secondly, new announcements at E3 (which is only a month away) should provide new fuel for new speculation regarding character probability and predictions. I am very curious to see what Nintendo has in store.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Good ol' E3. Just for a quick reference, this is how the main Nintendo franchises have been spread out since their last major release or announced release:

Mario- Super Mario Galaxy 2 (2010)
Legend of Zelda- Zelda Wii (2010/2011)
Pokemon- Pokemon Black and White (2010/ 2011)
Donkey Kong- DK Jungle Beat Wii version (2009)
Wario- Wario DIY (2010)
Yoshi- Super Mario Galaxy 2 (2010) or Yoshi's Island DS (2006)
Kirby- Kirby Superstar Ultra (2008)
Fire Emblem- Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragons (2009)
Mother- Mother 3 (2006) *Itoi has little interest at this time in making a sequel*
Star Fox- Star Fox Command (2006)
Metroid- Metroid: Other M (2010)
Animal Crossing- Animal Crossing City Folk (2008)
Nintendo/Advance Wars- Advance Wars: Days of Ruin (2008)
Sin and Punishment- Sin and Punishment 2 (2010)
Golden Sun- Golden Sun DS (2010?)
Starfy- The Legendary Starfy (2009)
Custom Robo- Custom Robo Arena (2007)
Pikmin- Pikmin 3 (2010/2011?)
F-Zero- F-Zero Climax (2004, Japan only)
Smash Bros- Super Smash Bros Brawl (2008)

I think that covers all the big ones. Looking at this has made it even more clear that Star Fox and F-Zero are definitely long over due for new installments.

 

[ChronoBound]

Good ol' E3. Just for a quick reference, this is how the main Nintendo franchises have been spread out since their last major release or announced release:

Mario- Super Mario Galaxy 2 (2010)
Legend of Zelda- Zelda Wii (2010/2011)
Pokemon- Pokemon Black and White (2010/ 2011)
Donkey Kong- DK Jungle Beat Wii version (2009)
Wario- Wario DIY (2010)
Yoshi- Super Mario Galaxy 2 (2010) or Yoshi's Island DS (2006)
Kirby- Kirby Superstar Ultra (2008)
Fire Emblem- Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragons (2009)
Mother- Mother 3 (2006) *Itoi has little interest at this time in making a sequel*
Star Fox- Star Fox Command (2006)
Metroid- Metroid: Other M (2010)
Animal Crossing- Animal Crossing City Folk (2008)
Nintendo/Advance Wars- Advance Wars: Days of Ruin (2008)
Sin and Punishment- Sin and Punishment 2 (2010)
Golden Sun- Golden Sun DS (2010?)
Starfy- The Legendary Starfy (2009)
Custom Robo- Custom Robo Arena (2007)
Pikmin- Pikmin 3 (2010/2011?)
F-Zero- F-Zero Climax (2004, Japan only)
Smash Bros- Super Smash Bros Brawl (2008)

I think that covers all the big ones. Looking at this has made it even more clear that Star Fox and F-Zero are definitely long over due for new installments.

A few clarifications:

On Donkey Kong:
Donkey Kong's last retail releases were back in 2007 (Donkey Kong: Jungle Climber and Donkey Kong: Bongo Blast). I would be hesitant to call a port with Wii-controls Donkey Kong's last release.

On Yoshi:
The last true installment for the "Yoshi" series was indeed Yoshi's Island DS, which was all the way back in 2006. His appearances in the recent main Mario series, do nothing to prove the vitality of his own series.

On Kirby and Fire Emblem:
Funny enough, the most recent installments for both of these series were remakes of previous titles within their own series. Funnier still, they were both announced at the same time.

On Advance Wars:
Days of Ruin has never been released in Japan, despite a Japanese translations being built into the North American version of the game. This does not bode well for the future of the series.

On Starfy:
If we are going by Japanese release dates, Starfy's last game was released close to two years ago. However, Starfy sold quite well outside Japan, so I feel its only a matter of time before a new title is announced, heck, the developers even expressed interest in making a console installment for the series.

Star Fox and especially F-Zero seem overdue for new installments. I have a hunch that we will definitely be seeing an announcement related to Star Fox at this year's E3. As to F-Zero, I think that series is dead, sadly.

 

[Big-Cat]

I'm certain we're going to see something on Pikmin 3 at E3. We've known that this game is in development for quite some time so it'd be surprising to NOT see it at E3. Starfox is another one I could see being announced considering that not only has Miyamoto been disappointed with in Japan sales of Starfox, but Hideki Kamiya would like to make one.

For all we know, maybe Kamiya was giving a hint that he is working on one, but I doubt it with his project Vanquish also in the works. At the same time though, this game is near completion as we'll see it by the end of the year.

Donkey Kong needs a proper console platformer, STAT! MOTHER will always be a vague one until a sequel is ever announced. The reason is that, like FMOI said, Itoi has no interest in doing another one, but he did say that he wouldn't mind if someone else made the next one.

I'm curious to see though if Kid Icarus Wii will be announced or if it'll remain vaporware.

As for F-Zero, I have no idea where this series is going.

 

[ChronoBound]

I personally think the Mother series is FINISHED. The ending has a sense of finality (there is no cliffhanger like there was with Mother 1 and Mothe 2/EarthBound), and Itoi himself said he has no plans for Mother 4, even saying in a recent interview at the end of 2009 that he is DONE with the series. This is understandable considering that he had a nervous breakdown during the development of Mother 3 when it was being made for the Nintendo 64, and it took him three years to just complete Game Boy Advance Mother 3 despite using a lot of his ideas from Mother 3 for the 64. The only new thing I see for the Mother series is a game that has all three installments to the series on it.

 

[Big-Cat]

You have a source to this interview? Mind you also that the MOTHER series can easily pull a Final Fantasy on us. Not only that, but there's still a lot in the MOTHER universe that's still left unexplained, particularly Giegue's race.

 

[ChronoBound]

You have a source to this interview? Mind you also that the MOTHER series can easily pull a Final Fantasy on us. Not only that, but there's still a lot in the MOTHER universe that's still left unexplained, particularly Giegue's race.

Itoi: ...games demand many more lines of dialogue despite the fact that the main characters don’t talk, so I couldn’t keep making them. That’s why I felt deep down after making three of them (Earthbound titles), “Well, that was a neat experience.”

Shiraiwa: So you’re done with them?

Itoi: Yes, that’s right.

Interview done on June 22, 2009.l

Source: http://earthboundcentral.com/2009/11/still-no-future-mother-games/

 

[Starphoenix]

You have a source to this interview? Mind you also that the MOTHER series can easily pull a Final Fantasy on us. Not only that, but there's still a lot in the MOTHER universe that's still left unexplained, particularly Giegue's race.

I highly doubt the series will continue. Nintendo will probably never release Earthbound on the Virtual Console, and Mother 3 will remain in Japan where it sold poorly.

I know what interview ChronoBound is referring to, just need to find it.

 

[ChronoBound]

I highly doubt the series will continue. Nintendo will probably never release Earthbound on the Virtual Console, and Mother 3 will remain in Japan where it sold poorly.

I know what interview ChronoBound is referring to, just need to find it.

Eh, Mother 3 sold 350K, which is hardly poor. Also, I linked to the latest interview in which Itoi addresses his feelings about continuing the series.

 

[Big-Cat]

Call me a denier, but that just says that HE is done with the series. A sequel can be made without him working on it; never say never. Look at the Kirby games after Sakurai left HAL.

 

[Starphoenix]

Eh, Mother 3 sold 350K, which is hardly poor. Also, I linked to the latest interview in which Itoi addresses his feelings about continuing the series.

That's interesting, I thought Mother 3 sold less? Not as bad as I thought, but still not enough incentive for a sequel to be made.

Call me a denier, but that just says that HE is done with the series. A sequel can be made without him working on it; never say never. Look at the Kirby games after Sakurai left HAL.

Seeing as how they haven't pushed the Mother titles that already exist. I don't see them committing resources to making a new title. Plus without Itoi I do not think such a title could come together.

 

[Fatmanonice]

A few clarifications:


On Advance Wars:
Days of Ruin has never been released in Japan, despite a Japanese translations being built into the North American version of the game. This does not bode well for the future of the series.

On Starfy:
If we are going by Japanese release dates, Starfy's last game was released close to two years ago. However, Starfy sold quite well outside Japan, so I feel its only a matter of time before a new title is announced, heck, the developers even expressed interest in making a console installment for the series.

Star Fox and especially F-Zero seem overdue for new installments. I have a hunch that we will definitely be seeing an announcement related to Star Fox at this year's E3. As to F-Zero, I think that series is dead, sadly.

I listed the remakes because they do have new content that distinguishes him them from the games that they're based on. For example, Kirby Super Star Ultra has new games in it and Shadow Dragons has a lot of features from the newer installments that weren't available in the first game like the ability to change classes. The Wii version of DK Jungle Beat had a few new minor things too but is definately less "new" compared to the other two.

I agree; Nintendo/Advance Wars is probably dead. The series was one that was heavily designed for truly dedicated gamers making it extremelly frustrating for those bad at strategy games or with little paitence.

For Starfy, I was going by North American releases except for F-Zero whose last installment was Japan only.

 

[Starphoenix]

I agree; Nintendo/Advance Wars is probably dead. The series was one that was heavily designed for truly dedicated gamers making it extremelly frustrating for those bad at strategy games or with little paitence.

Funny you mention that, in recent documents published by Nintendo cataloging their upcoming releases there is a "Famicom Wars DS2" listed as "TBA" for Japanese release. Now I realize this may just be Japan's localization of "Days of Ruin" it still is at least something for now.

 

[Shorts]

Deserve is a really strong word and I really don't like to use it all that much anymore because of how its really driven by opinions rather than fact. You can argue that any character deserves to get in and, within your own logic, you'd still be right. As my posting history would tell you, the word is pretty much debate bait.

Now, for what I think:

1. Megaman has a long history that goes back to 1986, he has close to 100 games, and he has appeared on every Nintendo console except the Virtual Boy. If I had to tag the word deserve to any third party character, it'd be him.

2. Final Fantasy's weird. It really doesn't have a main character to represent the entire franchise. There's Mog and the Chocobo but I still say its iffy if either could effectively carry the weight of representing such a major franchise in gaming. Definitely an important franchise but freakishly hard to effectively represent.

3. Castlevania also has a nice history with Nintendo and has also had a game on every Nintendo console except the Virtual Boy. The only problem will be if Snake stays around because both Castlevania and Metal Gear are Konami franchises. Third party spaces are limited and it's assumed that third party representation will be spread evenly to avoid any one third party getting more share of the game's profits then another.

4. Enix and Nintendo have had a strong relationship even before Enix became a part of Square to form (Oh my God, what is he going to say?!) Square-Enix. Dragon Quest is a titanic franchise... in Japan. It is one of the top selling video game franchises... in Japan. Sakurai said that he didn't want to show bias to any one particular region when it came to character selections and with third party spaces being so limited, he may want to step over this option altogether.

5. Soul Caliber is Namco-Bandai. It has only had two games released on Nintendo systems since 2003 despite 4 being made since that time. I'm also not sure how well the characters of Soul Caliber would work in a Smash Bros setting. Granted, Snake worked but they pretty much made him a clean slate to make him work. Like with Final Fantasy, who would be the main character to represent the franchise? Nightmare? Mitsirugi? Ivy? Once again, a very tough call.

6. Bomberman has had games on Nintendo systems since 1986 and has appeared on every Nintendo consle except the Virtual Boy. He is owned by Hudson Soft which is an extension of Komani. There's one problem. Another is that Bomberman's influence has definitely fallen in recent years. It was never really a huge franchise to begin with but now it's reached a level of meh-ness that's seen in other franchises like Crash Bandicoot and Spyro. Is he iconic? Even if you asked me this question 10 years ago, I would have told you that it was debatable.

7. Two games with shattered cameos through-out probably close to a dozen games. The first roadblock is that its own by SEGA which already has Sonic has their main man and unless things drastically change in the next five years, Sonic isn't leaving Smash Bros. Is NIGHTS iconic? Not really. If anything the first NIGHTS was a cult classic while the second game got average scores. If you ask me, SEGA should just stay with Sonic because when it comes to their other characters, no one else really comes close to the star power that he has. (I'd personally say that Ai-Ai's in a distant second place.)

8. Great franchise but it hasn't had an installment since I believe 2006. Also, it's owned by Konami. It also doesn't really help that the franchise is virtually unknown outside Japan and hasn't had a game in North America since, I believe, the year 2000. I'd love to see Goemon come back eventually though but I don't think Smash Bros is the place for that.

9. I have virtually no opinion on Bubble Bobble. I can't really think of any good reasons for them though aside from the franchise having as long a history with Nintendo as Megaman, Castlevania, and Bomberman. How iconic they are is also debatable.

10. Tales of Symphonia was just two installments out of twelve in the Tales of... franchise. Lloyd has been playable in three games making him, I believe, the Tales of... character with the most playable appearances. As he's Namco-Bandai, he has competition with several other characters including Pac-Man.

11. Muramasa will probably end up being a one hit wonder. There's not really anything else to discuss unless more installments come in the future or the fanbase for it really upsurges.

12. I don't really have an opinion on Street Fighter aside from how I'd prefer to see Megaman represent Capcom. Darkstalkers hasn't had a game since 1997 so that's not really up for debate. It's had loads of cameos since then but that's about it.

The point i was trying to make is, Castlevania and megaman are fine and dandy, but the third party world has awesome characters with huge potential.

No these were NOT in Order in any sense.

I wouldnt mind seeing any of these franchises in super smash bros.

(And my three biggest wishes for third party characters are Morrigan, Bomberman and Casandra )

 

[augustoflores]

@FMOI
why isn't Kirby Wii listed in that list? is it vaporware?

also, i believe the f-zero franchise to not be dead, but rather consider it as finished. after all its last title was called Climax right? FLCL's last anime episode was cald FLClimax right? the word dead to me means that it died without resolution.

one more note: what are everyone's position on Magical Vacation/Starsign. i have no position btw.

 

[Fatmanonice]

@FMOI
why isn't Kirby Wii listed in that list? is it vaporware?

Pretty much. It's been eluding release since 2005 (if I remember right) and is slowly becoming the Duke Nukem Forever of Nintendo. Nintendo keeps putting it on its "upcoming games" list but after 5 years of no new footage, it's really hard to say what the future of the game is.

 

[Starphoenix]

one more note: what are everyone's position on Magical Vacation/Starsign. i have no position btw.

I don't think we are going to see much more out of the "Magical" series seeing as how Golden Sun has taken the mantle of "Nintendo's RPG". Golden Sun sold twice as many copies as Magical Adventure (GBA) did, but Magical Adventure never received localization outside of Japan. To sell half as many copies as Golden Sun in Japan alone is pretty good (this is assuming I am using VGChartz correctly). However it's sequel, Magical Starsign, was infact released in America as well as Japan and sold less than the prequel!

Considering we have Golden Sun DS, Xenoblade, and The Last Story (which is intended to be a series) being developed means Nintendo will not be looking back.