Official Metaknight Discussion

[Omni]

I'm mad. You have to main Snake in order to use this amazing quote.

dude, you're talking about the guy who figured out how to kill Snake at 0%.

i live and breathe metal gear solid. ridiculously amazing series

 

[Tien2500]

nah, he hasn't answered it specifically. and if he did answer my question then it means he didn't have a problem with it being "

Not to jump on the hate bandwagon but this made me lol.

 

[Orion*]

LOL what scrub reopened this pointless thread?

 

[Omni]

ugh, sooo annoying

if u guys really want me to respond to his post so badly fine

if im MK's last hope, you're in deep **** anti-ban. get your ish together!

 

[Espy Rose]

What?

I had no idea the anti-ban had any data...

 

[Raziek]

ugh, sooo annoying

if u guys really want me to respond to his post so badly fine

if im MK's last hope, you're in deep **** anti-ban. get your ish together!

I look forward to reading it during history class in the morning. I'm going to sleep.

 

[Eddie G]

there is a lot you don't know about me and a lot of things you are very ignorant of. i am a well-respected member of the community and i have contributed to more than just this MK debate.

People must be easily impressed because I have yet to witness anything spectacular.

step down, King Beef. step down.

My parts, service them.

 

[Takeover1806]

My opinion on this thread.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeGvOTFJvN4

LMAO very random vid but hilarious..

To people that want everything answered in specific detail back nd forth are crazy...
Im not being biased about anyone on the boards but people do have lives to here..
Im pretty sure Omni has a life to live too where he cannot answer everything in detailed essays... He already explained why mk should stay & if he wanted to he can go on..
But there is no rule saying he has to keep arguing just because he is the 'leader' of the anti-ban group.. Idk OS but im pretty sure he has a life other than smash to live too..
But I know alot of wild people in the community so I may be wrong

 

[GeneralWoodman]

mk's nair dude, look at dat **** leik 20 damage, great knockback, full body hitbox and its fast.
get that stupid bat outta here!

 

[Tien2500]

ugh, sooo annoying

if u guys really want me to respond to his post so badly fine

if im MK's last hope, you're in deep **** anti-ban. get your ish together!

Lets say you play a lot of hockey and you're a goalie. You have other things to do in your life so you give up on hockey... but you hang around the hockey rink all the time. Eventually people are going to start yelling at you to put on a pair of skates.

I get that you have **** to do but given your reputation and all its going to be hard to be a half-hearted participant in this. If you truly don't want to be bothered the best course of action would be to absent yourself.

 

[GeneralWoodman]

hockey players don't run around with a pair of wings and a sword pulling tornadoes out of their ***'s
just saying....

 

[Tien2500]

hockey players don't run around with a pair of wings and a sword pulling tornadoes out of their ***'s
just saying....

I don't think Omni does that either O_O...

 

[GeneralWoodman]

well it sure would be BROKEN if he did.

 

[demonictoonlink]

ugh, sooo annoying

if u guys really want me to respond to his post so badly fine

if im MK's last hope, you're in deep **** anti-ban. get your ish together!

As much as I appreciate what you're doing, you really aren't. People can rage over it all they want but at this point it just doesn't look like MK is going to be banned for awhile. Pro-ban can interpret the data to say he's too dominant/broken and anti-ban can interpret the data to say he's just fine.

Many anti-bans have simply stopped posting as there is no need for them to. It is pro-ban that wants something done. Maybe if they were the only side to post at all it would be effective, but as anti-ban seems to be backed by the SBR posting is not as necessary as it is to pro-ban.

TL;DR
You're not MK's last hope. You are just our last representative.
=]

 

[Spelt]

uuuuuuuuuuuuh let's get back to meta knight...



ganon can infinite him with side b so he hard counters meta knight.
no reason mk should be banned if he's hard countered by ganon.

MK is/will never be banned, dylan.
time people realize this and move on.
anytime MK gets more broken the term broken will get more strict to suit anti ban.
end of story.

 

[demonictoonlink]

That's what I said.

 

[Orion*]

they wont ban him, i wouldnt waste my time omni

 

[Spelt]

kinda.
i said he's never gonna get banned.
you said he might in the future, but not now.


also i never even mentioned data. just brokenness in general

 

[demonictoonlink]

I know he won't be banned as well. I'm just trying to not anger people :/

 

[Spelt]

i hate you!



meta knight's ftilt is pretty good i hear.

 

[The Brigand]

ganon can infinite him with side b so he hard counters meta knight.

And he can kill MK at like 30% with a Reverse WP, so obviously MK is terrible against him. Obviously. Don't forget Wizard Foot: It doesn't actually have a hitbubble for his foot, so MK will think he's being hit when he's actually not! Think of the mindgame potential! And Dark Dive, **** that's a great move right there. MK will be so confused by the lack of hitstun and the pathetically weak knockback it has that he won't even bother to recover.

There is no way MK can avoid those slow, incredibly telegraphed specials. It ain't happenin'. He certainly can't dodge Flame Choke on reaction, or punish it severely if it misses. And if he actually gets caught, he certainly doesn't have the comfort of knowing that his opponent needs to know exactly what to do the very next frame after he inputs his next command in order to follow up with another Flame Choke.

So yeah, 80:20 Ganon. The only way he's losing is if his player sucks. Or counterpicks Frigate. Because that would be stupid.

 

[demonictoonlink]

And he can kill MK at like 30% with a Reverse WP, so obviously MK is terrible against him. Obviously. Don't forget Wizard Foot: It doesn't actually have a hitbubble for his foot, so MK will think he's being hit when he's actually not! Think of the mindgame potential! And Dark Dive, **** that's a great move right there. MK will be so confused by the lack of hitstun and the pathetically weak knockback it has that he won't even bother to recover.

There is no way MK can avoid those slow, incredibly telegraphed specials. It ain't happenin'. He certainly can't dodge Flame Choke on reaction, or punish it severely if it misses. And if he actually gets caught, he certainly doesn't have the comfort of knowing that his opponent needs to know exactly what to do the very next frame after he inputs his next command in order to follow up with another Flame Choke.

So yeah, 80:20 Ganon. The only way he's losing is if his player sucks. Or counterpicks Frigate. Because that would be stupid.

Don't forget Down Air!

 

[The Brigand]

I did, about halfway through typing that up. I just went ahead with it anyways because I'm an idiot.

... you sly awesome guy you.

 

[Spelt]

lol guys, you're unintentionally trolling each other.

 

[Omni]

Alright, let's do this: Overswarm's Criteria for a Ban.

As with most "grey" areas, I consider it a variable based on the game at hand. One game can have one criteria and another game can have another.

Agreed. Oh, and for future reference, anything omitted from the previous post should be assumed that it is fact and/or I agree with the statement.

Pretty simple, no? But a lot of BAD games can be competitive with the above criteria.

A video game is competitive if there is an audience for it. Generally, the audience who competes enjoys the game and does not consider it bad. If a video game was BAD there generally would be no audience and with no audience there is no competition.

Unless we're using your interpretation of "bad". In this case, 'bad' is going to be whatever GOOD isn't.

I really wish you didn't use the term "bad". It's such a... eh word.

For a GOOD competitive game, one that is ultimately going to be healthy, enjoyed, and accepted by a wider range of players you see the above and the following:

No optimum strategy
This doesn't necessarily mean that everyone doesn't take similar actions. Halo 1 was competitive with the pistol being the overall weapon of choice, but getting three shot kills with the pistol wasn't the optimum strategy. It was too inconsistent, and so people made up for it first by using overshield and camo and powerweapons like sniper and RLs, and as the game matured people used teamwork to get around this base weapon. While the game had a central axis, the use of strategies on said axis were numerous in nature and individual playstyle could foster

You can really see this in games like Starcraft; there is no "optimum strategy". It's cyclical in nature.

Very, very surprised to see Overswarm using other games to support his points when he's very quick to criticize others for doing the same. Let's not get into that.

However, I agree with this point. Most notable competitive games like Chess and Starcraft allow the player to achieve victory using several routes.

The game is fun

How can we forget?! If people don't think it's fun, it can't be a healthy competitive game. It has to appeal to a broad audience. At ALL levels of play. This is why games like Street Fighter have such small numbers in comparison to smash; Smash is fun for little kids playing with items just the same as it is fun for grown men to be playing with items. We can wean ourselves towards a game that fits the above criteria more strictly to create a finer tuned game.

Except we didn't.

If Smash is fun for little kids playing with items why were these items removed? There are many players out there who still wonder why items are removed. Then there are more who question why people who consider items.

Fun is EXTREMELY subjective. It correlates directly with how well the competitive game is, and determining how well a competitive game is directly correlates with its audience. This is why when Brawl was first released there were dozens of Melee players who dropped Brawl because it was not "fun" to their standards. Yet those who stayed more than likely enjoyed Brawl enough to continue playing for these past 2 years.

Fun can not measured directly. It is a perception based upon our current audience attendance which could be more or less given several different reasons.

I'm interested where this fun factor will take us in the future.

Street Fighter 4: Evo 2009: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijhUJTZrxLk
Street Fighter 3: Evo 2004: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeM0rH_4ung
And just for fun a pretty famous local that took place: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4G_QnTfBvA

Street Fighter has always had an amazing attendance number. The 2004 Evo was the earliest footage I could find that showed the audience of a Street Fighter tournament while the 2009 Evo footage is the most recent. Needless to say those are not small numbers.

In Japan and Korea, Street Fighter has MORE attendance on a local, regional, and National level than the US. If you combine the entire SF player database around the world and compare it Smash, SF looks like a giant. Their most recent regional as of Feb 11 had 178 players and 58 teams.

Seriously, you don't eve know. Overswarm harps on SF so much yet he knows diddly squat about the community. The top players become national celebrities and star on tv shows and face-off against idols and all these other ridiculous events. I won't say anymore about this subject at the moment.

Sources:
http://nsb.blog.shinobi.jp/
http://www.trftrf.com/
http://www.arcadiamagazine.com/

The game is fun to watch
This one is tough, but if it isn't fun to watch it leads to a less competitive game. This doens't mean laymans watching, this means players of the game watching.

Oh, it's here again. That was fast. Hm.

Fun is subjective again. Most people who look at Starcraft at the first time won't even know what's happening. It isn't appealing eye from a new player or newcomers perspective. Even as novice, you may look at high levels of play and not even realize what you're looking at.

Whereas hundreds of kids may look at Mario Party or Brawl and instantly their eyes will light up without ever second guessing it's competitiveness.

Simply put, fun to watch =/= good game. It adds to it being more appealing, but it has nothing to do with it being competitive.

So looking at the above and knowing what a competitive game is, one part of my criteria is any character that breaks the aforementioned requirements for a competitive game should be banned.

Yikes.

So if any character fits this criteria:
1.) Negates having a universal optimum strategy
2.) Makes the game unfun
3.) Makes the game unfun to watch

They need to be banned?

...

Am I reading this right? This your criteria? Uhm... alright. I can't argue with you if that's how you feel. Uh... right moving on. I won't even touch this since there's so much odd about it I wouldn't know where to start.

So if a character is too easy to win with? Yes, ban him. This doesn't mean easy to use, this means easy to win with. If we add two hypothetical characters into the game, GUY A and GUY B, and GUY B can beat the entire cast by spamming forward smash incredibly consistently to the point that just about everyone plays GUY B to win, but then we find out that GUY A can beat GUY B by timing his f-tilt within a few frames but only one or two people out there can do it, I'd still ban GUY B because it saves the game. This is an obviously exaggerated example and it is never this clear, but the principle is the same.

Nah, yo. The principle is not the same and an obviously exaggerated example does not support your explanation of ease of use. That was a horrible metaphor.

Are you suggesting that Mew2King sits at home and practices f-smashing in place? Just because Metaknight is an easier character to win with does not mean he is easy to win with. Did you catch that? Mew2King pours LITERALLY hundreds to near thousands of hours into Smash. He is the only Metaknight out of a good solid 13 great ones to win a National. His wins aren't gimme's and they aren't easy.

Here's a more important point: Why does ease of use have anything to do with banning a character? In Brawl, DDD is extremely easy to use when compared to say Pikachu. In Melee, Sheik is extremely easy to use when compared to say Fox. How does this configure into warranting a ban? I guess you believe ease of use constitutes the warranting of a ban, but I don't. I think that's silly

Looking in Brawl we have an extraordinary amount of evidence showing that counterpicks are indeed an incredibly important part of the game. Outliers such as Ally and ADHD are losing to Ice Climbers, Dededes, Marths, and other matchups with non-outlier players from time to time, yet we don't see these isolated incidences with the Metaknight outliers. This is curious, and looking at trends in the lower level of play we do indeed see that these bad matchups are common and, generally, are what actually take out top players!

Metaknight is an exception to this.

Interesting post you have here. Did you notice what you did?

You used "isolated incidents" to prove a point that Ally and ADHD lose to non-MK characters from time to time. However, you do not approve of "isolated incidents" where non-MK characters outplace MK's being used as an argument. Really now?

Maybe you should define "isolated incidents" because it seems to have a different definition depending on when it is most useful for you to use it.

Regardless, counterpicking can be used in any competitive fighting game but it is not mandatory nor required for it to be competitive. There is no set "system" that Brawl is confined into following except for the system you have painted to be the most appropriate in your own eyes.

The thing about Smash is that it revolves around counterpicking. We've made it this way by not using "all stages random" as our base to make it more competitive. Because of inherent imbalances and the admitting that there IS no "fair ground" in this game, we've come at the problem in such a way that it brings about the most fair collection of games.

As stated earlier, Metaknight is an exception to this.

As I said, there is no "set" counterpicking system that establishes that every character needs a counter and/or the loser of the match should be able to put themselves in an advantageous position in the next game.

See Pikachu. No counters. Best character on every viable stage. Pikachu could not be counterpicked yet he was tournament viable with contenders such as Kirby and Fox trailing behind.

Because of this, Metaknight has become a huge issue in tournament. He can be mained solo and never get "bracket gayed". You saw DEHF lose to a kirby and an IC, and both are bad matchups. You see Lain's ICs losing to two MKs. You see all these top players losing to characters on a consistent basis.... but not MK. This give MK an added advantage.

See above.

When a character breaks one of the fundamental aspects of the game, he should be looked at closely for a ban

Whether or not he breaks a fundamental aspect is generally subjective, and the effect definitely is. Metaknight does break a few fundamental aspects (recovery, edge play, IDC, counterpick system) but IDC can be banned globally and fairly, recovery isn't huge. Edge playi s a big deal to a lot of people (planking, scrooging), and the counterpick system has shown to be huge.

In short, Metaknight exists outside of Brawl's normal gameplay.

I disagree.

Snake has ridiculous weight that allows him to live to 200%+, one of the most versatile and useful projectiles in the game, the capability of wracking damage from a distance and up close, and one of the fastest and strongest kill moves in the game.

Diddy's weight is abnormal if you look at his speed and mobility. He is equipped with possibly the best projectiles in the game that allow him to bring ITEMS into play. Think about it. The banana is an ITEM. His bananas drastically change how a player has to play and guarantees lock combos that can lead to deaths just by tripping on a banana.

Ice Climbers can grab you once and you lose a stock.

Falco can chaingrab people off the stage into spikes that set for automatic deaths. His lasers and overb give Falco one of the better and more safer runaway styles in the game.

A broken character is a character that does not fit the standard laws within a game but rather ignores some or all of these laws giving the character a substantial advantage against the remaining characters.

The "laws" that exist in Brawl relate to a character's attributes that include strength, speed, versatility, weight, recovery, range, size, and other unique attributes that only certain characters have such as invincibility frames on attacks, projectiles, and chaingrabbing.

With that said, I see several characters that separately possess specific attributes that create the contenders that they have become. In a realm that allows all of these extremes and special events happening, I do not see Metaknight as out of place.

Overswarm also mentioned the IDC which is pretty much allows MK to be invisible and invincible. This isn't new. In Melee, Ice Climbers' freeze glitch is banned. In Tatsunoko vs. Capcom, Viewtiful Joe had a glitch where he could force his momentum to send him forever to the top of the stage where he could not be touched. That, too, was banned. Any glitch that a character has that can prevent gameplay does not contribute to if that character needs banned. A simple ban easily fixes the problem.

It's similar to if we found a character that could cancel all vertical momentum so they could always stop from dying off the top, or a character that could stop horizontal movement so they could always DI down. This doesn't necessarily remove them from normal gameplay, but it DOES lead them into question. Same with master hand; he just doesn't fit in the game because he can't lose a stock, so you have to ask "should he be here?" and look at it

Another big thing in competition is dominance.

Dominance simply means that something is a significant step higher than the rest in terms of competition, and it doesn't have to have a reason why.

When something is dominant in a competitive game for an unusual amount of time, it needs to be looked at for a ban

This is everything. Stages, characters, what have you. If you see a large number of characters always picking a stage, you ahve to ask yourself "should this exist?". If you see one character always picking one stage 100% of the time, you have to ask the same question. If you see a large majority of people all picking the same character, you have to ask the question.

A large majority of players choose Smashville from what I've noticed. That does not mean you have to question if it should exist. If you see one character choosing a stage 100% of the time it means that character can execute its abilities to the fullest on that stage. That doesn't reflect dominance in the least bit.

Undisputed dominance in conjunction with other criteria can lead to a ban. Undisputed dominance means there is literally no statistical hope for a changing of the guard. This piece in your game is the best, gives you the best chance of winning, and not picking it is anti-competitive in nature, thus inevitably swirling the game down the toilet.

aka best character in the game.

Choosing any character that is not the best character in the game does not equate to losing just as choosing the best character in the game does not guarantee a win. See: ADHD, Ally, M2K or every single instance where a Metaknight loses to a non-MK player.

Best characters DO exist in competitive video games. As long as that character fits within the realm of the game when compared to the rest of the cast then it is fine.

Metaknight is not a broken character. He does not possess special abilities that cannot be compared to other character's special abilities in terms of usefulness although he may possess the best of them. Players can abuse Metaknight's light weight (Snake). Players can abuse Metaknight's lack of projectiles to force Metaknight to approach (Snake, Diddy, Falco). Unlike most broken characters he has several weaknesses that can be exploited.

These are not traits of a broken character nor are they traits of a character that need to be banned. The premise of a best character existing is not a reason that constitutes a ban.[/QUOTE]

 

[Omni]

@Orion: I already did. It's fuggin' 3:40. I ain't dealin' with this **** again. I totally regret all the time I wasted writing that up.

MK's not going to be banned. Hylian stated in the official BBR statement that he "overstayed his welcome" so at this point in the game he's practically family.

 

[Omni]

Lets say you play a lot of hockey and you're a goalie. You have other things to do in your life so you give up on hockey... but you hang around the hockey rink all the time. Eventually people are going to start yelling at you to put on a pair of skates.

I get that you have **** to do but given your reputation and all its going to be hard to be a half-hearted participant in this. If you truly don't want to be bothered the best course of action would be to absent yourself.

u make a really good point. i think i'll do just that actually.

As much as I appreciate what you're doing, you really aren't. People can rage over it all they want but at this point it just doesn't look like MK is going to be banned for awhile. Pro-ban can interpret the data to say he's too dominant/broken and anti-ban can interpret the data to say he's just fine.

Many anti-bans have simply stopped posting as there is no need for them to. It is pro-ban that wants something done. Maybe if they were the only side to post at all it would be effective, but as anti-ban seems to be backed by the SBR posting is not as necessary as it is to pro-ban.

TL;DR
You're not MK's last hope. You are just our last representative.
=]

nope, not anymore! i'm done.

let's just let pro-ban develop points and arguments and data and when the time come watch as MK does not get banned again.

entertaining pro-ban everytime they have a complaint is getting old. how many polls have we been through? jesus.

 

[AllyKnight]

Anti Ban is so gay. Pro Ban has better points than Anti Ban.

 

[Browny]

Because a character that is 'healthy' for the metagame and doesnt overcentralise it would totally not dominate in post count the majority of all topics in tactical forums while many other threads die and half of them are locked (MK related).

Pro-ban 'proof' is hard to take when I wake up to this every day.

 

[etecoon]

Anti Ban is so gay. Pro Ban has better points than Anti Ban.

I think you just hate MK because you lose with him to bowser and ganon

what a broken character

 

[iRJi]

@Orion: I already did. It's fuggin' 3:40. I ain't dealin' with this **** again. I totally regret all the time I wasted writing that up.

MK's not going to be banned. Hylian stated in the official BBR statement that he "overstayed his welcome" so at this point in the game he's practically family.

You know, Overstaying your welcome is normally a bad thing. Just sayin, lol.

Also, Hylian is only one of the "many people" in the BBR. To my knowledge of this, a lot of people from it are looking both ways on this, of course with a select few who already mad their choice of pro or anti.

This is done. Leave it end here. The next step is the vote, so let it start with that. I'll be more active for this one too. I must say this has been an interesting couple days, lol.

 

[etecoon]

You know, Overstaying your welcome is normally a bad thing. Just sayin, lol.

what was said was that the meta knight ISSUE had overstayed it's welcome, it wasn't supposed to be discussed again for a year. we might as well just ban him now and get it over with though seeing as it will be done eventually since they can take as many attempts as they want as frequently as they want. just have to opportunistically wait for the right moment(like after a tournament where MK dominates, then you just cite that one tournament over and over and over again)

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Lol i feel sorry for the people who play this game if the community bans the best character because he is the best character.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Anti Ban is so gay. Pro Ban has better points than Anti Ban.

You heard it folks. From the top player who is actually cool. :V M2KFTL

 

[etecoon]

Lol i feel sorry for the people who play this game if the community bans the best character because he is the best character.

aside from former MK mains, the brawl community would be much happier with MK gone.

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

GUYS

NO ****ING VOTE UNTIL OVERSWARM FINISHES HIS GOD**** VIDEO

Dammit...

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Your post is surprisingly limited, Vrael.

Arguing in such a way so as to promote an inferior balancing of a game can't lead to a good result; if someone says "this leads to a poor competitive game" and you say "yeah, so what, play another game", you can't possibly come to an agreement.

I know, I should probably argue on pro-ban now. I just saw Flayl's post and I felt like replying.

Vrael, you are truly terrible at this. You have no idea what competition is and you show it. People don't play a game competitively if there is a clear line between winning and losing.

Everyone knows that MK is the best character, and can probably beat their character. Yet people still obviously play this game competitively using characters that aren't Meta Knight.

I'm terrible at what? I don't even play Brawl or care about the result of this, I think it's funny that you have to resort to calling me terrible at one thing or another.

Nobody who wants to win money will bet on a horse that limps.

*cough*adhd*cough*

I'm not making any ratios up and if I did I don't see how they would be bull****. Real experience counts more than anything, any competitive player will tell you that.

Then WHERE ARE YOU GETTING THE RATIOS FROM? It's a simple question.

You don't know what competition is.

Really? Well according to your definition, Brawl is not competitive as it does not give everyone the same tools and does not rely on skill alone.

This is the dumbest part of your post. You had the tools to pick the best character, yet you chose the worst. The tools were available to you, you just chose not to use them. The other player doesn't have to risk losing because you were dumb.

You either misread my post, or decided to twist what I was saying into something else in order to make me look stupid.

You stated that in order for a match with MK to be a true battle of skill, the other player would have to pick MK as well. This is obviously true. But it is also true for EVERY OTHER CHARACTER IN THE GAME. Like I said, in order for a Ganon, Sheik, ICs, Marth, Snake, Falcon, etc, etc, etc. match to be based on skill alone, the other character must pick the exact same character. I don't see why this is so difficult to understand.

There are several reasons:
a) They think their character can go even
b) Their only goal is to be the best with their character, they don't care about being the best
c) They don't really care about prize money

I know you'd fit in c) for sure.

What about Ally? He's arguably the best player in the world, iirc he thinks the matchup is MKs favor (I may be wrong), and he obviously wins a lot of money.

Also wow, good joke. You're hilarious. I DO NOT PLAY BRAWL. I don't even care about the outcome of the debate, I just enjoy the debate. Don't bring me into this, you don't see me doing the same to you.

 

[Nanaki]

As much as I appreciate what you're doing, you really aren't. People can rage over it all they want but at this point it just doesn't look like MK is going to be banned for awhile. Pro-ban can interpret the data to say he's too dominant/broken and anti-ban can interpret the data to say he's just fine.

Many anti-bans have simply stopped posting as there is no need for them to. It is pro-ban that wants something done. Maybe if they were the only side to post at all it would be effective, but as anti-ban seems to be backed by the SBR posting is not as necessary as it is to pro-ban.

TL;DR
You're not MK's last hope. You are just our last representative.
=]

let's just let pro-ban develop points and arguments and data and when the time come watch as MK does not get banned again.

entertaining pro-ban everytime they have a complaint is getting old. how many polls have we been through? jesus.

Anti Ban is so gay. Pro Ban has better points than Anti Ban.

I'm starting to sense a pattern forming...

 

[OverLade]

In all seriousness Omni, this game is dying. Tournament attendence is going down, and a lot of top players are getting sick of it and quitting.

Is it because of MK? In many cases yes, but even if he's not the sole reason for it, if we don't ban MK brawl will definitely die (or become a shadow of its former self). Unfortunately, a lot of the community sucks because of MK and if he's banned, people will feel like they have a chance. We'll see more diverse results and tournaments will be more interesting. You come from MD/VA which is a diverse region where a variety of characters place well but that's not a reality in most regions. And if MK mains kept playing but picked up characters like Snake/ZSS/Diddy/Falco/Lucario then we would see the gap in diversity we've been missing everywhere.

If there isn't a better reason to support the ban, it's to better the community and make this game more enjoyable and exciting. I even LIKE watching MK dittos, but at a lot of tournaments people don't even stick around for grand finals because they know one player is using MK and is going to win anyway (Will vs Anti at Bums gamer tourney?).

 

[Renegade TX2000]

In all seriousness Omni, this game is dying. Tournament attendence is going down, and a lot of top players are getting sick of it and quitting.

Is it because of MK? In many cases yes, but even if he's not the sole reason for it, if we don't ban MK brawl will definitely die (or become a shadow of its former self). Unfortunately, a lot of the community sucks because of MK and if he's banned, people will feel like they have a chance. We'll see more diverse results and tournaments will be more interesting. You come from MD/VA which is a diverse region where a variety of characters place well but that's not a reality in most regions. And if MK mains kept playing but picked up characters like Snake/ZSS/Diddy/Falco/Lucario then we would see the gap in diversity we've been missing everywhere.

If there isn't a better reason to support the ban, it's to better the community and make this game more enjoyable and exciting. I even LIKE watching MK dittos, but at a lot of tournaments people don't even stick around for grand finals because they know one player is using MK and is going to win anyway (Will vs Anti at Bums gamer tourney?).

I agree................................................ I agree! I sooo agreee, AGREED. "shakes hand business like", GOOD DOING BUSINESS SIR... "goes to a big national tourney for the first time". Oh hold up "checks to see if mk's banned; He's banned!!" "goes to first offline national tourney".


Bad results....

"Goes to a big national tourney for the first time". Oh hold up "checks to see if mk's banned; ****... "Calls up the airline reservation". Just canceling my flight that's all... bah bye