Official MBR 2010 NTSC Tier List

[leffen]

Peach Usmash is stronger than Fox's btw (or as strong in ntsc, stronger in PAL)


Her utilt has enourmous priority, it wins vs ganons stomp and can be used to extend combos.

Ftilt has good combo ability, nice priority and is fast.

Her Side B is a awesome recovery move, (only Fox can really keep her from gaining height) and Toad can be used as a stall (you lose minimal height) and a situational counter.

Peach's fsmash makes her hitbox retardedly good and the racket and the pan are both really good... golf club can be used occasionally too but is mostly kept away by using Fsmash between stocks until you get the club.



Why the hell did you take peach as an example anyway, if anything take Jigglypuff or Sheik ;o

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

i like peach's up-smash, it has some invincibility on it which is useful its pretty strong and it can be combo-ed into.

I also like her f-smash but its not really that good.

her up-tilt is trash imo even if her head is invincible during part of it. Also her side B is for swag points but sucks. and her neutral B is pretty terrible.

Also even if her f-tilt can beat falcons nair but its not the fastest move so sometimes u need to predict to use it, at least against falcon

Also i disagree that wall teching and meteor cancels r to strong. i almost feel that these to things keep other things from being to strong. (wow thats a crappy sentence)

 

[ShroudedOne]

Peach's utilt beats Ganon's dair? LOL. You learn something new every day, I guess.

 

[N.A.G.A.C.E]

like my post said her up-tilt has invincibility on her head. so its not as much beating. its more ganons feet get hit b4 they reach a hurtbox on peach when done correctly. also b/c her up-smash has invincibility on it as well it can also beat the dair when done correctly

 

[Strong Badam]

If you're still grounded while CCing after hitlag, it cancels stun.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Peach Usmash is stronger than Fox's btw (or as strong in ntsc, stronger in PAL)


Her utilt has enourmous priority, it wins vs ganons stomp and can be used to extend combos.

Ftilt has good combo ability, nice priority and is fast.

Her Side B is a awesome recovery move, (only Fox can really keep her from gaining height) and Toad can be used as a stall (you lose minimal height) and a situational counter.

Peach's fsmash makes her hitbox retardedly good and the racket and the pan are both really good... golf club can be used occasionally too but is mostly kept away by using Fsmash between stocks until you get the club.



Why the hell did you take peach as an example anyway, if anything take Jigglypuff or Sheik ;o

I really think you're exaggerating the uses of these, but its really not the issue. My point still stands.

 

[Strong Badam]

also ppl keep saying that G&W/Luigi/Peach are the only random chars
when Ice Climbers are ****ing annoying to use cuz Nana does random stuff

 

[ShroudedOne]

If you're still grounded while CCing after hitlag, it cancels stun.

Oh, okay. Thanks. And if I recall correctly, Nana isn't totally unpredictable. She always forward throws near the ledge, I think. She probably has other things, too...

But yeah, generally, she is random.

 

[john!]

i like how this thread is now about how peach's bad moves aren't bad

 

[KirbyKaze]

0 landing lag would be horrible in Melee IMHO and it would quickly devolve into Marth/sex kick spam.

 

[Strong Badam]

Oh, okay. Thanks. And if I recall correctly, Nana isn't totally unpredictable. She always forward throws near the ledge, I think. She probably has other things, too...

But yeah, generally, she is random.

In some desynced situations, her behavior is predictable. In others, no. Additionally, even when she's at a ledge, you don't know how many times she's going to pummel before throwing.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

0 landing lag would be horrible in Melee IMHO and it would quickly devolve into Marth/sex kick spam.

I agree. I do think some moves definitely need tweaking. Theres so many cool character concepts in the lower tiers that never make it off the ground because the numbers dont match up

 

[Winston]

I wouldn't equate "some of the characters aren't well designed for competitive play" with the game having overall design flaws.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

I wouldn't either

 

[GhllieShdeKnife]

nana has add..
o your getting comboed i wil just roll away now because your trying to get back to the ledge
strong bad knows

 

[Strong Badam]

You're damn right I know.

 

[Xyro77]

Can anybody find the older american tier lists for this game? as many as you can and as far back as possible please.

edit: i found them on smash wiki but thats famous for being way off. What do you guys think?

http://super-smash-bros.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_NTSC_tier_lists

 

[Strong Badam]

I think those lists can be believed. I definitely remember seeing old lists with Zelda/Mario ridiculously high. Check the External Links at the bottom, there are some links to tier list postings.

 

[Anthon1996]

Real SmashWiki link here (which, as you can see, actually organizes the previous tier lists for each game in their own individual articles).

But yeah, those are the real previous tier lists, as you can see by the links at the bottom.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

People should stop spreading the old-SSB wiki link.

 

[Mew2King]

"CCing is too strong, aerials have too much lag, most move sets don't go together very well, wall teching/meteor canceling is too strong."

^ you said this but I do not think aerials have too much lag. If they do it's only by like 10 percent. If you think they will try to grab immediately, then just do an empty hop into a dash, or waveland back. It is very balanced... most people just do the same generic things though, but the options are easily there, and there's plenty of them in this game.

Without wall teching there are too many guaranteed kills whenever somebody goes below the stage. I find them balanced too. Very balanced. I think it simply separates good from bad players a lot of the time. You can do things like wall jump tech bair to kill momentum, or an immediate air dodge onto the stage and then land (even though you have 10 frames landing lag when you do and will probably get hit off again if they are fast, at least you get your jump back because you landed back onto the stage).

I love CCing =( but I will admit it is overpowered.

you should message me Sveet; I'm interested in your Game Maker game. I want to make games too some day!

 

[Strife]

People should stop spreading the old-SSB wiki link.

People should really look into updating Smashwiki. If done right it could really be an awesome source for smash related information.

 

[choknater]

agreed. i might go ahead and fix the article of myself. haha!

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

"CCing is too strong, aerials have too much lag, most move sets don't go together very well, wall teching/meteor canceling is too strong."

^ you said this but I do not think aerials have too much lag. If they do it's only by like 10 percent. If you think they will try to grab immediately, then just do an empty hop into a dash, or waveland back. It is very balanced... most people just do the same generic things though, but the options are easily there, and there's plenty of them in this game.

Without wall teching there are too many guaranteed kills whenever somebody goes below the stage. I find them balanced too. Very balanced. I think it simply separates good from bad players a lot of the time. You can do things like wall jump tech bair to kill momentum, or an immediate air dodge onto the stage and then land (even though you have 10 frames landing lag when you do and will probably get hit off again if they are fast, at least you get your jump back because you landed back onto the stage).

I love CCing =( but I will admit it is overpowered.

you should message me Sveet; I'm interested in your Game Maker game. I want to make games too some day!

I pretty much agree with everything you said M2K. I am not, however, making any games in Game Maker anymore. I did that for a class and I found the program to be cool for design concepts but poor for making real content.

 

[KirbyKaze]

CC holds this game together.

Without CC this game would be horrible.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

On the subject of making games, I've written one game in C++, and rewritten it in Java. Message me for the link if you want to try it, I'd be very interested in getting feedback.

 

[Vyzor]

Uh yea, Sheik is better than Jiggs.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

On the subject of making games, I've written one game in C++, and rewritten it in Java. Message me for the link if you want to try it, I'd be very interested in getting feedback.

What kind of game?

 

[BairJew]

Is Doc so much higher up than mario just because of damage from moves and better pill spamming? or i there more to it?
Also shocked on how close it is between ganon and doc.

 

[KirbyKaze]

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13566746&postcount=3220

That should answer your question.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

tl;dr dthrow fair

 

[BairJew]

Alright awesome I understand the mario < doc now, how about ganon < doc? I see a lot more ganon players than doc players which is suprising honestly.

 

[RaphaelRobo]

What kind of game?

I wrote an RPG. It's text-based, so there aren't any pictures. It has turn based combat, which I modeled after the combat in the Golden Sun and Phantasy Star series.

The sequel, which I'm working on at the moment, is also going to be text based, but has a tactical combat system. Actually, it's very similar to D&D. I'm planning to let users choose which combat system they use.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Search: "Doc Ganon"

By user: KirbyKaze

Look for a massive post that answers all about it. It explains my thoughts on the mid tiers. The only glitch is that I forget Luigi actually exists.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

cool how many people have played it? i wouldnt mind playing around with it

 

[RaphaelRobo]

cool how many people have played it? i wouldnt mind playing around with it

Probably about 5 or so people have played it. They're mostly other programming students in my classes. I haven't gotten too much testing done on the Java version, so there are more bugs in it. Unfortunately the C++ version used Wav files, which makes it too large to upload. I lost the code to it when my hard drive had to be replaced and parts of the backup were corrupted, so I unfortunately can't changed that.

Here's the link to it: http://filesmelt.com/dl/Super_Purple_Chocolate_Raphael1.zip

For everyone that downloads it, I'd appreciate it if you could message me with your opinion on the game, and tell me if you find any bugs. There is one I know about where the textbox to enter your name doesn't show up on a Mac, but if you wave the mouse around it'll appear.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Lol im having fun with it :D

only thing i can say so far is to allow enter to work when you input your name. So many games/programs have this issue lol

 

[RaphaelRobo]

I actually meant to add that, but forgot about it. I'll try not to leave it out in the next version. Glad to hear you're having fun.

Also, there are a few inside jokes in the game you probably won't get, since you weren't in my programming class. For those of us that were in the class, you can actually look at the game to see references to various events that happened throughout the semester.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

Btw check the text at the area directly west of where snorlax is blocking the path.

 

[Strong Badam]

Search: "Doc Ganon"

By user: KirbyKaze

Look for a massive post that answers all about it. It explains my thoughts on the mid tiers. The only glitch is that I forget Luigi actually exists.

Doc can't be a search term. Only 3 characters.