Official BBR Tier List v7

[bubbaking]

Respond to me in pm, I don't want to cause too mcuh of a scene

Responding to you in PM right now is like stopping a car on the highway to respond to road rage. Ain't gonna happen.

Edit: We can talk when I come up to Stony Brook again in about a week. You can also try to regain your honor in Melee, or beat me in Brawl, or do whatever the heck you wanna do, lolz!

 

[Z'zgashi]

Can we just all agree that Jiggs is a terrible character and move on? Lol.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Responding to you in PM right now is like stopping a car on the highway to respond to road rage. Ain't gonna happen.

Edit: We can talk when I come up to Stony Brook again in about a week. You can also try to regain your honor in Melee, or beat me in Brawl, or do whatever the heck you wanna do, lolz!

He's telling you to pm him. Private Messaging. Not Project Melee, which I assume you thought he was talking about given that you typed P:M instead of PM

 

[bubbaking]

I understood that the first time. "P:M" was a typo, as evidenced by my hasty edit. My message still stands exactly as is. I really don't understand what Project M had to do with that post..... <__<

 

[deepseadiva]

Ganon and Jiggs can tie last place. But "Hyrule Tier" needs to be dissolved. I thought we got over game affiliations after we broke up Ness and Lucas.

 

[bubbaking]

You put waaayyy too much stock in the BBR/MU panels/whatever. I'd namesearch Fuujin for Zelda's match-ups... but he's super banned :/

As I've already said, I'm not putting stock in them because I'd like to or because that data is extremely accurate, because it's not. I'm using them because it's the only true reference point that we have between the H+ Tier chars. Extreme heavy-duty theorycrafting does little to prove that one char is better than another. It helps with MUs, but not really with tier list placement. As I pointed out earlier, theorycrafting is technically why Ganon is still last even though results strongly suggest otherwise.

Whatever happened to Fuujin anyway?

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Where do you think the numbers on the match-up chart came from?

I don't know what Fuujin did specifically, but his spam should've technically gotten him banned ages ago.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Fuujin got super banned.

And imo, Link > Falcon > Jiggs/Zelda > Ganon

Honestly dont care between Zelda and Jiggs, and to be prefectly honest theyre both so terrible and under represented that its hard to distinguish who is worse imo. Also, I think Link is better than Falcon the more I think about it, I mean, Falcon is the least represented character in the game, obviously that means he must be pretty bad. I mean, hes Captain Mother ****ing Falcon, if he wasnt terribad, people would flock to his manliness. And also I think Link is a somewhat decent character (like low mid) if you dont count recoveries, fall speed, etc, but all those things are SO easy to abuse on him that it makes him really bad. I also dont know whether or not I think Link is bottom tier, hes pretty much sitting on the border of Low and Bottom imo.

 

[bubbaking]

Where do you think the numbers on the match-up chart came from?

At least those numbers came from weeks of debate between the chars' best and most active players. That's like the closest thing to 'applicable theorycrafting' that you can get.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Again; that isn't what happened.

The reason I mentioned name-searching Fuujin before was because in his signature he had a picture of the Zelda MU panel, which had exactly 0 real Zelda players.

I imagine that kind-of thing would be pretty common amongst low tiers; hell, Espy is on the Puff MU panel as far as I know.

 

[bubbaking]

Even more food for my argument that H+ Tier should just be all tied.....

 

[ぱみゅ]

Again; that isn't what happened.

The reason I mentioned name-searching Fuujin before was because in his signature he had a picture of the Zelda MU panel, which had exactly 0 real Zelda players.

I imagine that kind-of thing would be pretty common amongst low tiers; hell, Espy is on the Puff MU panel as far as I know.

Only Darkmusician was in the Zelda panel last time.
In this one, the hardest panels to get people to are Lucas, ROB and Kirby.
This time, panelists are being chosen among every character board, BBR or not.

 

[bubbaking]

That's interesting. Mekos isn't active anymore? I guess you could always use Blacktwins..... I'm fairly certain that Stingers is still active in this game. Is he on board for ROB? Chudat and MikeKirby for Kirby? I believe MikeKirby was still pretty active last time I checked. Does RRR actually play this game?

 

[deepseadiva]

This makes more sense to me.

Global Threats


National Threats


Regional Threats




State Threats






Bad Characters




Jigglypuff is worse than Ganondorf.

Zelda always felt on par with Mario.

Bowser never lived up to even lower expectations.

 

[SoulPech]

*logs back in after not being on for the weekend*

*sees discussion about Puff stuff and Delta telling people Tiers are for Queers*

*misses Puff stuff again*

..............

godammit.

 

[bubbaking]

[COLLAPSE="Threats"]This makes more sense to me.

Global Threats


National Threats


Regional Threats




State Threats






Bad Characters




Jigglypuff is worse than Ganondorf.

Zelda always felt on par with Mario.

Bowser never lived up to even lower expectations.[/COLLAPSE]

ICs are a pretty global threat. Doesn't Vinnie travel out there and place well? Meanwhile, the Japanese come over here and also do well, right?

 

[Neon!]

Guys I can settle the Jiggs vs GW discussion.

I live 10 minutes from UTD Zac and Jiggs is one of my best low tier characters.

We'll upload the matches and you guys can decide how bad the matchup is based on how bad I lose.

 

[SoulPech]

Guys I can settle the Jiggs vs GW discussion.

I live 10 minutes from UTD Zac and Jiggs is one of my best low tier characters.

We'll upload the matches and you guys can decide how bad the matchup is based on how bad I lose.

LOL

i dunno. I feel the GW/Jiggs MU is +2/+3. It's not impossible to win, but Puff has to put in so much effort to dodge, bait, etc. Always stay in the air and space with Bair and Pound...never approach GW's Dtilt.

In regards to who's the worst character? It should go based on the character's overall MU spread and I feel that Ganon has the worst spread. Jiggs is down there, but she's not the worst character.

 

[Delta-cod]

*sees discussion about Puff stuff and Delta telling people Tiers are for Queers*

I did?

Maybe my memory is shot...

 

[Grim Tuesday]

I agree with SoulPech

Guys I can settle the Jiggs vs GW discussion.

I live 10 minutes from UTD Zac and Jiggs is one of my best low tier characters.

We'll upload the matches and you guys can decide how bad the matchup is based on how bad I lose.

lol

 

[Uncle]

Ha, I like the categorization going on in Meno's list, because it's quite realistic.

Global threats are the characters you EXPECT to win tourneys. MK should be there, but so should ICs, arguably.

National threats have at least a handful of strong players to do great (but not necessarily win) with them at nationals, and dominate all lower tourneys. Snake and Diddy make sense here, but one could make the argument for Falco and Olimar being there, as well.

Regional threats don't have the sheer results power of the higher threats, but they usually are decent at nationals, and are regular powerhouses at regionals. My only possible change would be MAYBE adding Wolf and TL.

State threats seldom do well at nationals, but they often perform respectably at regionals. It takes an exemplary player to make up for the character's faults, but it is doable. Players of these threats almost always have constant placements in their state/province/whatever's PRs.

Bad characters are..............bad. They're not going to win nationals or regionals, let alone do decently at them. It takes an impressive amount of skill just to be on a state/provincial PR using only one of these guys, unless your region is seriously lacking in good players.

Hey, another 5-tier list! Sounds like something we touted the virtues of not too long ago.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

I imagine that kind-of thing would be pretty common amongst low tiers; hell, Espy is on the Puff MU panel as far as I know.

This is true, but we're trying our best to make sure that doesn't happen again. lawl

All low tiers have to have some leeway, Jiggs especially seeing as there's no one who uses her.

 

[Luco]

That's interesting. Mekos isn't active anymore? I guess you could always use Blacktwins..... I'm fairly certain that Stingers is still active in this game. Is he on board for ROB? Chudat and MikeKirby for Kirby? I believe MikeKirby was still pretty active last time I checked. Does RRR actually play this game?

I think what kyokoro meant was this list - as in, MU chart v2, not the one we're all working on now, v3.

Mekos is still around and although Ish hasn't included it yet, Lucas panel has plenty of appliers. Ness is a bigger problem but I think he'll reach quota too.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

This is true, but we're trying our best to make sure that doesn't happen again. lawl

All low tiers have to have some leeway, Jiggs especially seeing as there's no one who uses her.

Well there is me; the only competitive Puff main, as far as I know - who didn't get picked because I live in Australia, would disagree with the other panelists too often and haven't sucked Mink's ****.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

That seems a bit inappropriate to say, Grimmy.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

It was a joke, I'd suck his **** if he let me.

 

[DMG]

?????


Well that escalated quickly

 

[Flayl]

Zelda always felt on par with Mario.

Bowser never lived up to even lower expectations.

Vex and Kingkong's results were always comparable to Boss's (when he solo'd Mario) and KirinBlaze's, so I'm not sure how you're putting them in different tiers

 

[deepseadiva]

Being big, having no projectile, and relying on a weeny recovery is kind of the worst combination of traits in this game. Hitboxes are nice though. I could see him in the same tier, but he's obviously a much much worse character than Mario.

 

[Shaya]

Grim, if I beat your Jiggs with G&W with just jab/grab/fair/nair/bair/hard read smashes/bucketing to survive can we all agree Jiggs loses really really badly? I don't think air dodging in works either

 

[-LzR-]

There really isn't enough lag for GW to lose to airdodges. Either way he is fast in the air so he can just follow the other guy around. Also a SH nair ends JUST before he lands so he can immediately double jump to another aerial of his choice, just dair to the ground to extend the hitbox so no airdodge will last or just GTFO with the tried and true upB.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

Grim, if I beat your Jiggs with G&W with just jab/grab/fair/nair/bair/hard read smashes/bucketing to survive can we all agree Jiggs loses really really badly? I don't think air dodging in works either

If your G&W beat my Puff under any conditions, the match-up is probably terrible.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

I don't know if Bowser is worse than Mario. Mario is really, really ****ing bad.

 

[[FBC] Papa Mink]

Grim. Espy is on my panel because his puff is good and I picked him.

Anyone on the puff panel is because I put them there.

 

[Grim Tuesday]

That's why I mentioned the **** sucking thing

 

[Z'zgashi]

Being big, having no projectile, and relying on a weeny recovery is kind of the worst combination of traits in this game. Hitboxes are nice though. I could see him in the same tier, but he's obviously a much much worse character than Mario.

As someone who plays both characters, no. Theyre pretty even.

 

[Sinister Slush]

Please don't use the ESAM effect, Gashi.

 

[Z'zgashi]

?

Im just saying I think Bowser and Mario should be pretty much in the same spot on the tier list, which imo is 6th/7th worst.

 

[Ghostbone]

BOWSER USED FLAMETHROWER
IT'S SUPER EFFECTIVE
DONKEY KONG FAINTED

Bowser has a projectile.

 

[PMC66]

Your "understanding" of Rob is flawed. A character that goes even with Marth and ICs, beats or goes even with most of mid tier, and that wrecks all of low tier is in no way a low tier character. He has some horrible MUs such as MK, ZSS and d3 but most of his other high/top MUs are only -1's. He's not top of mid but he's not really bottom of it either.

He's even with the majority of mid tier. high/top tiers he's rendered completely unviable, and he doesn't destroy low tier that badly other than Ganon and Jigglypuff everyone is about 0 or +1 which isn't really destroying. Quite a few mid tier characters have one decent top tier matchup though take Ness and Olimar. I still don't see how a character who's completely bodied by any character above average can be considered average, might just be me, though Germany have the right idea with this character .

'Mario is really really F***ing bad'

^ So is Lucas but some people are deluded into believing he's mid tier.