Meta Knight Q&A Thread

[Shameus]

OK so i am having an argument with a buddy who 1)feels Meta should be banned but 2)after looking up as much as possible believes that just using the dimentional cape desevres a penalty due to the possiblilty of the infinte dimentional cape being used.

i believe that this may depend on a tourney by tourney basis, or just how the move is being used (as i see M2K do it all the time to ledge stall after a kill).

Anyone that could enligthen me on this would be great

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Tell him he's wrong. Infinite dimensional cape is banned. Performing it accidentally is improbable and irrelevant.

And discussing a MK ban is against the rules IIRC. :/

 

[Shameus]

Tell him he's wrong. Infinite dimensional cape is banned. Performing it accidentally is improbable and irrelevant.

And discussing a MK ban is against the rules IIRC. :/

i know he is wrong but he persists that the use of the normal cape is penalizable, and i know the technique is difficult to perform.

i expected as much but the guy feels he is OP and i just do not care because i love the Bat Ball

 

[Player-4]

Halberd is pretty good for MK imo

You can shark and camp the platform super hard, then get early kills with GSL and Utilt if they try to approach through the platform

 

[Nic64]

OK so i am having an argument with a buddy who 1)feels Meta should be banned but 2)after looking up as much as possible believes that just using the dimentional cape desevres a penalty due to the possiblilty of the infinte dimentional cape being used.

i believe that this may depend on a tourney by tourney basis, or just how the move is being used (as i see M2K do it all the time to ledge stall after a kill).

Anyone that could enligthen me on this would be great

Plank him in friendlies and laugh at him

People should be beyond making a huge fuss about whether or not MK "should" be banned by now, because it's obvious that it's not happening. It's one thing to be idealistic, it's another to completely lack any sense of pragmatism and to be so intransigent that you can't adjust. You can deal with it, main MK yourself, or quit the game, but this games reality is pretty well defined by now

 

[Joaco]

People hate MK because is too good, I also hate Pikachu on SSB64 and Fox on Melee. Deal with it.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

I'm just in the background laughing at all of this.

Stop discussing the MK ban. GGs.

 

[KassandraNova]

Halberd is pretty good for MK imo

You can shark and camp the platform super hard, then get early kills with GSL and Utilt if they try to approach through the platform

Yes, but I hate the low ceiling, also the claw and bomb annoy me. The claw ALWAYS goes after me, everytime. :< I've lost sets to that ****ing claw. Yeah, I got 2-0'd by the claw so what?

 

[ぱみゅ]

Yes, but I hate the low ceiling, also the claw and bomb annoy me. The claw ALWAYS goes after me, everytime. :< I've lost sets to that ****ing claw. Yeah, I got 2-0'd by the claw so what?

Plank against the Claw :V
Really, is easy to avoid, after swinging a couple times it stops and then dives.
You can do whatever you want in the meantime and shield/AD/Plank against the claw and be safe.

 

[Kaffei]

People hate MK because is too good, I also hate Pikachu on SSB64 and Fox on Melee. Deal with it.

lol @ fox for melee.

 

[-LzR-]

But melee For is hell. Shoots **** you can't realistically avoid since it's so fast and safe so it racks up like 70% in a second and suddenly he gets a guaranteed usmash on you and you die.

 

[Exdeath]

Yes, but I hate the low ceiling, also the claw and bomb annoy me. The claw ALWAYS goes after me, everytime. :< I've lost sets to that ****ing claw. Yeah, I got 2-0'd by the claw so what?

Learn to avoid the claw, hit people into the bomb, and vertical KO moves are irrelevant against MK in most MUs. In fact, it usually makes MK's Up-B as good as Dsmash at killing.

 

[Luco]

Ok i have a question. This will probably sound noobish but...

I was playing as lucas versing my brother, whom i asked to be meta knight so i could train and learn a little more on weaknesses and strengths relating to lucas. Fairly early in the battle my brother did something, and we don't know how. I threw an item at him as he was running at me. He doesn't know how he did it, but his meta knight threw his sword to the ground although it looked like two at the time), used it as a kind of pole vault, and completely avoided the item, which went past his sword. What move is this? How can we do it regularly?

 

[Kaffei]

......what

 

[!!!RM!!!]

dash attack?

 

[Kaffei]

grounded shuttle loop?
glide toss?

 

[Luco]

I don't know how he did it or even what it is, but it was cool.

 

[Luco]

Hey again. Listen, i just saw my last post again and i'm really sorry for any thing i did. Umm, i'm kind of confused though. Are you saying i shouldn't post knowledgable(or possibly not) posts because they are wrong, or because they are right? Grr, i wish i understood more!

Just realised i double posted. Sorry!!!

 

[Staco]

It´s called spot dodging.
When you shield (L or R button) press downwards on your controller.

 

[JonT]

what move cant mk use to punish a diddy who air dodges back on the stage from the ledge, it seems like he can go right into shield and beats my stuff..

 

[SaveMeJebus]

what move cant mk use to punish a diddy who air dodges back on the stage from the ledge, it seems like he can go right into shield and beats my stuff..

Everything can punish diddy once you see the airdodge (you just have to time it right). Air dodging into the stage is usually a bad idea when facing MK since he can punish you with charged F-smash or tornado

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Does anyone have any frame data on MK's ground release? I need to know what everyone has guaranteed on a ground released MK(if they even have anything that is).

 

[Budget Player Cadet_]

Everything can punish diddy once you see the airdodge (you just have to time it right). Air dodging into the stage is usually a bad idea when facing MK since he can punish you with charged F-smash or tornado

...Something that almost no regular wifi opponent of mine has figured out...

 

[KassandraNova]

Has anyone played samurai kirby, and have you seen how smexy mk looks in that game? xD

 

[C.J.]

Does anyone have any frame data on MK's ground release? I need to know what everyone has guaranteed on a ground released MK(if they even have anything that is).

This applies to almost every character:
The releaser has 29 dead frames (I always thought 30, but someone recently told me it's 29 which is why ZSS/Squirtle can get guaranteed jabs/why it appears you can't buffer out of grab releases)
The one being released has 30 dead frames (for a ground release, air releases are 50 frames iirc)

Exceptions:
When Bowser releases someone, he has 20 dead frames which allows him to do a ton of stuff to everyone (he actually has a grab release infinite on MK, make sure to mash out between hits so you air release)

When DK is released he only has 20 dead frames so he is immune to bowser's stuff, and if someone other than bowser releases him, he can punish you for it (I think his dsmash is frame 8, so you very well may be eating a dsmash)

Ness/Lucas when release have 40 dead frames... which everyone knows and abuses.

 

[Albert.]

The thing that's hard to punish about Diddy's air-dodge to the ground is that he has two frames less landing lag than the majority of the cast (C.J. back me up on this factoid please?)

Now a lot of air-dodge frame traps rely on "slow hitting" moves or rather, moves that have their hitbox out for a longer period of time. That's why Save Me Jebus mentioned Fsmash and Nado. Charging Dsmash is also cool.

Alternatively, once you get a better sense of the timing, multiple Dtilts or staggered Ftilt can also do the trick.

 

[C.J.]

Idk, I remember Junk talking about the fact that he's really good at punishing landing lag of characters and that he thinks that Diddy has less landing lag, although it seems really arbitrary (although far from the first random arbitrary thing in the game) and weird. IF it was true, I'm not confirming or denying it because I never actually checked anything, it would probably be one on a soft landing and 2 on a hard landing.

Regardless, if they're ADing into the ground, just trap their landing w/ nado. If they're made a habit of AD into spotdodging, punish the spotdodge, not the landing, w/ a charged fsmash.

 

[Flayl]

Just to clarify some stuff about Bowser's grab release: He doesn't have an infinite on MK, just an extended chaingrab that you will never see in tournament.

He has 11 frame advantage on ground releases, not 10 (and 1 against Donkey Kong). If Bowser is trying to force a MK to ground-release, you can expect a DTIlt, which can kill pretty early depending on where you are.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

And his grab comes out on frame 9. So he'll have to buffer it too. Definite wall infinite though I'm assuming.

 

[Flayl]

It depends on the wall, seeing as Bowser can't force a ground-release 100% of the time.

 

[Albert.]

What characters is Short hop fastfall Fair Safe on block VS ?

 

[etecoon]

if spaced out of grab range it's safe vs anyone who doesn't have a 2 frame ground attack or a 4 frame aerial/usmash/up B, though some characters have less leeway than that as jump OOS isn't constant as shield drop is

this is for guaranteed punishes, some characters can force situations where they may punish by guessing your next move. for instance marth can up B if you try to attack again because he is invincible 2 frames before you've recovered, if you shield he can't hit you...but this leaves you open to grab(shield increases your size which can make you grabbable sometimes, and he can instant pivot grab)

 

[YUNq PHR3$H]

How Does MK Cancel His Up-B Like That?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdMbffrk
0:13

Edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdMbffrkShY

 

[etecoon]

The URL contained a malformed video ID.
Sorry about that.

 

[!!!RM!!!]

Buffer Down B then hold back as you reach the apex of the shuttle loop. You're trying to cancel the glide with the B button as soon as you can while pressing down to put you in a fast fall so you land quicker and have less landing lag. Holding backwards after that will push you further away from your opponent, preventing some of their possible followups.

 

[Albert.]

if spaced out of grab range it's safe vs anyone who doesn't have a 2 frame ground attack or a 4 frame aerial/usmash/up B, though some characters have less leeway than that as jump OOS isn't constant as shield drop is

this is for guaranteed punishes, some characters can force situations where they may punish by guessing your next move. for instance marth can up B if you try to attack again because he is invincible 2 frames before you've recovered, if you shield he can't hit you...but this leaves you open to grab(shield increases your size which can make you grabbable sometimes, and he can instant pivot grab)

Hmm thanks for your input and time.

I'm just trying to think of match-ups where I can gay people by just spamming walling Fairs LOL

Thinking Wario, DK, Lucario ?

(inb4 you're going to need other moves, dumb***. Yeah, no s***)

Edit: and yes I understand the concept of sliding shield

 

[etecoon]

fair can be pretty unsafe on whiff, be careful of characters with dart approaches like MK, snake, sheik etc.

and ice climbers, you need to space that **** perfect because they can just dash grab you at the end of it, they have like 19 frames to act IIRC?

it works pretty well against wario, be aware of DK and lucario's long range attacks like lucario's fsmash and factor those into your spacing, and don't do it if lucario has a charged AS

 

[Kaffei]

Hmm thanks for your input and time.

I'm just trying to think of match-ups where I can gay people by just spamming walling Fairs LOL

Thinking Wario, DK, Lucario ?

(inb4 you're going to need other moves, dumb***. Yeah, no s***)

Edit: and yes I understand the concept of sliding shield

Junebug told me that vs Lucario it's not that good because he can sneak in uncharged auras and hit you if you fair at nothing

 

[Exdeath]

Just to clarify some stuff about Bowser's grab release: He doesn't have an infinite on MK, just an extended chaingrab that you will never see in tournament.

He has 11 frame advantage on ground releases, not 10 (and 1 against Donkey Kong). If Bowser is trying to force a MK to ground-release, you can expect a DTIlt, which can kill pretty early depending on where you are.

IIRC, Bowser has a ground-release>pivot grab infinite on Meta Knight.

 

[Kaffei]

IIRC, Bowser has a ground-release>pivot grab infinite on Meta Knight.

LMAO infinite