MBR Official Rule Set

[x After Dawn x]

he honestly probably is, he's not really the "play dirty to win" kind of guy, despite the fact that he's really good lol.

but in essence, I think he's trying to say that...like, if you compared a couple professional hockey players to a couple others who have never played before, and they were just to have a 2v2, there shouldn't be any advantages for the worse team simply because they're worse, it should just be played out normally.

that's kind of like the best analogy I could use to explain that. sorry. and just so people are clear on this, no I don't support his opinion. I like stage striking a lot more than the traditional system, that hockey player analogy is just what I'm interpreting from his opinion (hopefully people can understand it?).

 

[Mogwai]

if that's the best analogy, I believe we should move on from this point because it's nonsensical.

 

[Charlesz]

Thanks for posting this!

 

[x After Dawn x]

if that's the best analogy, I believe we should move on from this point because it's nonsensical.

agreed .

 

[Kyu Puff]

Is freeze glitch legal or left out intentionally (like wobbling)?

 

[x After Dawn x]

freeze glitch is always banned...unless you're trying to get at something that I missed here

 

[Kyu Puff]

No, it just doesn't make sense to ban it when wobbling is legal. I'm a fan of the time limit/"if you can't unfreeze them you lose" clause.

 

[AlcyoNite]

I hate Fountain of Crap.

Here's my two cents on stages:

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8980022&postcount=16

I read everything; I completely agree. I am saddened by the lack of counterpick stages.

One more thing: i dont think fox can infinite the wall on corneria

 

[KAOSTAR]

Actually somebody made a point towards the beginning and I skimmed to see if it was addressed.

Why does the loser Ban their stage first?

Was this something just wasnt addressed or is it an additional reward to the winner of the first round(the first reward is that they play the final match on their picked stage in a 2/3).

Or is it that they get to CP so they have to ban their stage first?

It seems kinda small but could be a big deal in the right situation.

 

[Mogwai]

No, it just doesn't make sense to ban it when wobbling is legal. I'm a fan of the time limit/"if you can't unfreeze them you lose" clause.

I know I already posted this in Jam's tourney thread, but again...

Kyu, seriously?

 

[JPOBS]

Actually somebody made a point towards the beginning and I skimmed to see if it was addressed.

Why does the loser Ban their stage first?

Was this something just wasnt addressed or is it an additional reward to the winner of the first round(the first reward is that they play the final match on their picked stage in a 2/3).

Or is it that they get to CP so they have to ban their stage first?

It seems kinda small but could be a big deal in the right situation.

it was me who asked this and stil lhavent got a answer yet :/

 

[KAOSTAR]

Weak lol .

 

[pockyD]

it's been "fixed"

 

[D1]

**** the list of stages just decreases and decreases. I like the ruleset regardless.

 

[Overswarm]

Wow, melee community turned into noobs. Banning the majority of the stages and complaining about PS1 being a counterpick? QQ more.

 

[Ballistics]

im sad the MBR no longer stands behind wobbling

 

[Dark Hart]

I'm so glad that people who host tournament aren't forced to use this rule set, since I hate that fact that all of the counter-pick stages are gone. (Besides Mute City)

 

[Overswarm]

This isn't so much a standard ruleset as a "standard conservative ruleset". It works very well for its intended audience. Other than that, not so much.

 

[otg]

This isn't so much a standard ruleset as a "standard conservative ruleset". It works very well for its intended audience. Other than that, not so much.

Back to the brawl boards you go!

 

[Overswarm]

Back to the brawl boards you go!

You leave me alone, I helped make your first melee list =P

 

[Wuss]

I'm loving this ruleset. Stage striking rules, and I'm a fan of less stages (fox only, fd only *****es!) I'm not sure I completely understand the winner of the previous match being able to ban a stage right before the loser picks one vs each player just bans a stage at the beginning, but I'll take it. Does it really make that much of a difference? and if so, pleas enlighten me.

 

[pockyD]

You leave me alone, I helped make your first melee list =P

the first melee list? with rainbow cruise on random?

i've never been to a tournament that used those rules so it's a good thing you didn't contribute to this one, which i've already seen get plenty of play

 

[KAOSTAR]

I'm so glad that people who host tournament aren't forced to use this rule set, since I hate that fact that all of the counter-pick stages are gone. (Besides Mute City)

you have to use these rules. The mbr is in complete control of your life when it pertains to smash.

you cannot host a tourney at your own house with your own equipment unless you use these new rules

 

[Overswarm]

the first melee list? with rainbow cruise on random?

i've never been to a tournament that used those rules so it's a good thing you didn't contribute to this one, which i've already seen get plenty of play

No, the first Melee list from the SBR goof. The one that was pretty close to FC + MLG rulesets >_>

 

[Skler]

The ones that used Green Greens?

 

[Overswarm]

Yes. We refused to ban anything until it showed broken in high-level competitive play, making our list the most "liberal" list there is, but you knew **** well if we didn't have a stage on there was no argument for it. It shortened naturally over time as we got more evidence (I think Corneria should have gone looooooong before it did) and would have gotten shorter, but not quite this short I don't think.

 

[Deleted member]

You leave me alone, I helped make your first melee list =P

oh, you mean in 2002? oh ****-

 

[Overswarm]

oh, you mean in 2002? oh ****-

Yes, and every year thereafter.

 

[Deleted member]

you have a 2005 join date.

I've never seen anyone so motivated to proactively **** himself in any given verbal exchange as you are.

 

[x After Dawn x]

normally I don't like umbreon's smug tone comments, but...a brawl player with meta knight in his dp calling the melee community noobs...?

it'd be a little more credible if you were still in the MBR to prove that you still know what you're talking about. but whatever.

 

[Overswarm]

you have a 2005 join date.

I've never seen anyone so motivated to proactively **** himself in any given verbal exchange as you are.

No, because we're the same person.

 

[Deleted member]

you know, I always thought my personal hell would be listening to a drunken secretary singing michael bolton karaoke in a room full of chronic smokers and mosquitoes. it now entails being an english major and watching the spice channel and eating mustard packets, aka your life.

 

[The Good Doctor]

I realize that this is a heated discussion, but being a mod should you really be insulting someone everytime you post.

Jeez dude, be the least bit respectful, you as a mod are representing the site...

 

[AlphaZealot]

I don't really agree with this list either but I know why it happened and I know there is no point in arguing about it. This is the direction the MBR (or rather a small group of MBR members) wants to take post-Brawl. Frankly it is amazing the list isn't only 3-5 stages (and some wanted this). The game stopped being about appealing to a broader audience years ago. It is more now about keeping the people who still play it happy. That, and if you check the results of Melee tournaments its so dominated by top tiers that the opinions of low-mid tier players is essentially non-existent these days. What is worse is that everyone who mains Fox thinks they understand completely what stages are good for like, Bowser and Mewtwo and Link and hell even upper tiered characters like Samus and Doctor Mario (which are incredibally rare these days).

Quick example, Saffron City 3 Results:

1: HAX The cheese wizard ($187.50)
2: VaNz ($93.75):shiek:
3: Darc ($56.25)
4: HBK ($37.50)
5: th0rn
5: Eggm
7: Zoso
7: Scar
9: G$
9: Alukard:shiek:
9: Tec0:shiek:
9: Tec9
13: XYT:shiek:
13: Banks:shiek:
13: Tag$
13: Plank:shiek:
17: The newb
17: Chopz
17: DJ Nintendo
17: GRILL!!:shiek:
17: MDZ
17: Ben
17: Phantom
17: Vist

In the top 17 a whopping 3 people used characters not in the top 5 in the game. THREE OUT OF TWENTY FOUR PEOPLE. This is likewise typical of Melee results these days. Also typical is a ****-ton of Fox/Sheik players in the mid-ranges of 9-17th. Also,while it should be obvious, I'm talking about your average once a month Melee tournament where 20-40 people show. Not your Genesis type tournaments (though results are still similar, there is simply more Jiggly's and Falcon's and Ice Climbers and maybe a smattering of Doc's/Samus'/Peach's).

Also funny: there is almost more characters represented in just the 2nd place player (Vans) then in the entirety of the 23 other players.

---

The point is, when everyone has been playing the same top tier characters for years and perpetuating the mentality of those characters, you get
-People who think alike
-People who only see the point of view of the top tier characters

Easy/Simple Question: "If everyone plays the same character, will they like the same stages?"

And the situation is further exasperated because the community isn't growing, its just the same people talking to the same people over and over, which means the opinions will slowly align and dissenting voices will eventually fade cause they will lose interest.

A Broader Ruleset (read stagelist) = inclusive = more people
A Narrower Ruleset (read stagelist) = exclusive = less people

You aren't going to convince a casual player who is use to items and every stage that the game should be played with just the top 5 characters and on only 8-9 stages.

---

The Good Doctor: please don't take Mow's attitude as a reflection of the entire staff of Smashboards or the community at large. We attempt to have staff/mods who are courteous to all members (unless otherwise provoked and even then a level of professionalism is expected). Actually, Mow's name is not red anymore, and he is not in the "moderator" group anymore. He could still be a mod, I do not know, I'm just pointing this out cause I thought he was a mod as well.

 

[pockyD]

most of the "broken" stages were removed because they FAVOR the top characters, so I don't know why you think it's going in the wrong direction diversity-wise

bad characters are just bad

 

[Skler]

Mute City is a terrible stage. No edges, no platforms and cars that, while not random, can severely gimp anyone who can't stay in the air for very long (or at least make them stop fighting their opponent and start fighting the stage).

As a low tier player I'm psyched that Pokemon Stadium is gone and it's now stage striking. No more PS/YS/FD against Fox, no more worrying about getting FD or DL against Sheik, no more FD/PS against Falco! Also no more corneria, green greens, floats or mute. Those stages gimped most low tiers to hell and back.

It's almost like you don't play low tiers in tournament, AZ. Peach and Jiggs are not low tier, Samus is not low tier (she's **** close though). Low tiers HATE the stupid CP stages because they can't abuse them.

Your prediction will probably be right because people tend to play to win, and winning usually entails using a competitive character.

 

[Overswarm]

you know, I always thought my personal hell would be listening to a drunken secretary singing michael bolton karaoke in a room full of chronic smokers and mosquitoes. it now entails being an english major and watching the spice channel and eating mustard packets, aka your life.

1. I'm an English graduate

2. I don't have TV

3. They're ketchup packets


Also, I figured you were just attempting to troll me when you quoted my post that said I helped make the first melee list to say "IN 2002?!" when there was no melee list in 2002. Or 2003. Or 2004. Or 2005. My reply of "yes, and every year after" was facetious in nature; you're not normally one to completely miss something so I thought you were just attempting to troll me and figured I'd play along. XD

I realize that this is a heated discussion, but being a mod should you really be insulting someone everytime you post.

Jeez dude, be the least bit respectful, you as a mod are representing the site...

He mods like pokemon boards or something random, he's not a real mod.

even if that's true (it's not), that's because peach simply isn't good enough to begin with. The fact that you think the removal of one crutch stage hinders her so much speaks volumes about how effective she is as a base character, independent of the stage.

Just to clarify something here, if every stage in the game was legal, Captain Falcon and Ice Climbers would be bottom tier. Fox would still be amazing, and Sheik could still do her thing. Marth would be weakened considerably. Falco'd be alright. Other than that? Mid and low tiers would get muuuuuuuuuuch better.

If you're going for character diversity, you want more stages. Not less. Characters don't fight in a vacuum, they are always affected by the stage. A stage like Final Destination affects characters just as much as a stage like Green Greens.

Walk-off edges were banned frequently in Melee simply for being walk-off edges. I disagree with this, but understand the principle and enjoy the consistencies. I felt Corneria should always be banned for the same reason walk-off edges were banned: the game devolved around camping one area and multiple low % deaths. The only time this didn't happen was when you had a character like ICs playing "get the lead" and then camping top mid or a Fox player (aka Vidjo) laser camping only to run past you and laser camp more ad infinitum.



But yeah, this list isn't really a list for the masses or anything. Its just the conservative viewpoint without a balance, so I don't think too many TOs that didn't already use a list similar to this will suddenly say "OH! A small handful of melee players made this list and now I will use it too".

It is interesting to me that we'll have the older list with starters/CPs in comparison with this more conservative list. I wish there was still a big melee community with both groups around so we could see them fight over the lists. :[

 

[pockyD]

like i said, nobody ever used the old list anyway, whereas i've been to at least 3 different tournaments run by different TOs that use the current list

I'd consider that a successful list compared to the dud of the old one

legalizing every stage is terrible when you're only going to play on 3 of them; the amount of variance that it introduces is HUGELY anti-competitive

 

[Skler]

Why do people keep saying low tiers are better on bad stages? Roy is complete and utter trash on every stage that makes him jump because the poor guy has no useful aerials. Yoshi is gimped on any stage that makes him use his double jump and same with Ness. Pichu is only viable if he's close enough to a walkoff edge to bthrow you, but that's it!

Low tiers do not become good because they're playing on Brinstar Depths or Big Blue. They get worse because most of them have glaring weaknesses that can be easily exploited on those stages. Roy's weakness is being in the air, Ness and Yoshi need to conserve their double jump. Fox and Sheik? Nothing at all, they'll **** you ten ways to next Tuesday regardless of where they are.

Edit: Give me an example of a low tier who suddenly does better on awful stages that doesn't involve walkoffs. The only one I can think of is MAYBE Link/Young Link because they can can't cancel their projectiles, meaning their spam isn't crippled by having to dance around on a stage. However they have laggy *** aerials that mean they're crippled if they go air to air for long periods of time.

 

[Overswarm]

like i said, nobody ever used the old list anyway, whereas i've been to at least 3 different tournaments run by different TOs that use the current list

I'd consider that a successful list compared to the dud of the old one

The "old list" was by far the most used and most popular while Melee was still a common tournament game. As it has died down, you have less new blood come in and its mostly just the same group of people with the same mentality. It's not so much a success as it is a natural successor.

legalizing every stage is terrible when you're only going to play on 3 of them; the amount of variance that it introduces is HUGELY anti-competitive

?

Legalizing every stage would be a bad idea, obviously, but individual character viability would shoot through the roof. My point is that less stages = less viable characters, while more stages = more viable characters. The only exceptions to this rule are when certain stages result in an auto-win for a single character (sometimes two) or when one character does the best or near best on all stages (Fox is close to this).