Jigglypuff General Discussion Thread (Q&A)

[Noobicidal]

Why those?

Mostly due to their incredible range, great killing power, camping abilities; I could go on.

 

[Noobicidal]

Ignore the double post

Could anyone link me to the "Jigglypuff changes from Melee to Brawl" thread if there is one? Thanks. I've gotten really frustrated searching for it.

I'm not aware of it's existence, but I can still help.

Her transition to Brawl wasn't exactly great. Jigglypuff is lighter, her F-Smash and D-Smash aren't near as effective, Rest isn't near as strong, limited hitstun and multiple airdodges make her offstage WoP's and gimps suffer, Rising Pound can no longer stall, and she's a bit slower. I'm not sure if she has anything positive going for her though aside from the multiple airdodge thing...

 

[BEHR]

So I came back from a tourney.


Did not so so well since I play Jiggs nad everybody in NC plays High Tiers lol.

Anyways.

Won my First Match which was Falco.

Lost me second to a Wario and the player is Ranked second in NC.

then I lost to Lucario(Roll Spam and Aura Spam)

My one question how do you beat Lucario with Jiggs?


I knew the Jiggs vs Lucario match up is horrible but **** that Aura.

I feel that Lucario vs Jiggs Match up is 90:10 in Lucarios favor.

Any tips?

 

[Kishin]

So can you or can't you rest an opponent sleeping? Veril's thread Sing -> Rest but it didn't clarify exactly how.

 

[t3h n00b]

...her offstage WoP's and gimps suffer, Rising Pound can no longer stall, and...

Why not?

So can you or can't you rest an opponent sleeping? Veril's thread Sing -> Rest but it didn't clarify exactly how.

I'm not sure if you can rest them while asleep, but I think you're forced to stand straight up after your character wakes up, so it should be a good Rest opportunity either way if you get them in the right wave of Sing I guess.

 

[Spoonbob]

Why not?

Because you lose altitude. He meant in the banworthy-stalling sense.

I'm not sure if you can rest them while asleep, but I think you're forced to stand straight up after your character wakes up, so it should be a good Rest opportunity either way if you get them in the right wave of Sing I guess.

You can rest things/people that are sleeping. It's way easy with characters like Bowser, and I'm sure you can just run into most smaller characters until you can get it done.

 

[Cold Fusion]

then I lost to Lucario(Roll Spam and Aura Spam)

My one question how do you beat Lucario with Jiggs?


I knew the Jiggs vs Lucario match up is horrible but **** that Aura.

I feel that Lucario vs Jiggs Match up is 90:10 in Lucarios favor.

Any tips?

I'm pretty sure the Lucarion vs Jigglypuff match-up is not that bad. The only tip I have though is that you need to learn how to punish roll spammers.

 

[PND]

I hate Wallcario, he's one of *my* worst matchups.

Get the percent lead and plank. Otherwise, you have to approach, and that sucks against him. He has a pretty good air game, but a ****tastic recovery. If you can pressure him offstage, gimp him. As in, if you fail to, you will lose the match. On the plus side, we can kill him fairly early (if we can get past his wall) to try and get around his aura bonus. You can beat out his aura spheres until he's at ~90%, watch out for that.

Getting past the wall: The best thing I can say is try and get him to commit to an fsmash by baiting him with your aerial mobility and get him (if you can) afterward. I find dash grabs are incredibly important in this matchup, slowly walk forward, powershielding auraspheres as they come, and be ready to shield the ftilt / fsmash and attempt to grab him. Throw him towards the edge of the level, his dair makes uthrow pretty much useless.

Speaking of, be wary when chasing him in the air, that dair can screw with us A LOT. Don't uair him, and if he's anything like the Lucario's I've faced, he'll DI up after I bair him once and immediately dair to prevent me from following up.

If he's forced to recover and you fail to gimp him, but he lands on the stage, you can rest him out of the landing lag. Do this (or rollout, if needed).

 

[RhedKing]

'cario spam is best avoided at an advancing diagonal angle. You can then (sometimes~usually) falling pound him. Obviously if he sees it coming he's going to roll or uair, so try to be a fuzzy little stealth assassin an get him when he's not on the defensive. For my patented Awkward Zones (C) try to... **** what am I saying he's lucario, he doesn't care where the **** you are he's still going to aura/push A at/dair you.

also a minor problem with that pound thing, he's not going to care if you pound him, approach and get the Dair, don't and you just raised his damage level by 10% yay.

I got to agree with mike, just throw him off the edge.

 

[Olimar369]

Ok, so I'm running a bottom tier list tourney which means only characters from the bottom half of the tier list are allowed for selection. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=230071 Basically it's pit and downward. My goal is to surprise people with my jiggz. I'm a little worried about a few matchups (Luigi, Wolf, Shiek, and Squirtle [in that order]). I've read up on them in the guides, but would like to know what some of the top jiggly players last minute advice and tips would be that I might have not noticed or that you could think of off the top of your heads. Also I would like to know who you think would be a good secondary that would BEST compliment jiggz style within that available char set?

 

[PK-ow!]

How does one truly practice Jigglypuff?

You must admit, Jigglypuff behaves differently from other characters. It is in a pool with at least Peach on this.

See, the thing about the guide here is, it gives lots of advice and data and 'strategies' of a sort... but it still somehow feels like it is assumed I will 'get' how the whole "floating. baiting, punishing' thing works.

Getting how that works is precisely what I want the guide for.

I want to use Jigglypuff a little bit in competition - and the staleness of these boards is just. . . *shiver* Man. . .

 

[t3h n00b]

Play people. Play different people so that you don't become predictable. That's the only way to get good with any character.

 

[PND]

Ok, so I'm running a bottom tier list tourney which means only characters from the bottom half of the tier list are allowed for selection. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=230071 Basically it's pit and downward. My goal is to surprise people with my jiggz. I'm a little worried about a few matchups (Luigi, Wolf, Shiek, and Squirtle [in that order]). I've read up on them in the guides, but would like to know what some of the top jiggly players last minute advice and tips would be that I might have not noticed or that you could think of off the top of your heads. Also I would like to know who you think would be a good secondary that would BEST compliment jiggz style within that available char set?

I'd recommend Ness. I generally don't have problems with Sheik or Squirtle, but I use Ness versus Wolf and Luigi (When I'm not using Snake. . . which in this case doesn't apply)

Either Ness, or no joke, Captain Falcon. My Captain Falcon eats Low Tiers for breakfast and doesn't afraid of anything (Except Falco and MK)

How does one truly practice Jigglypuff?

You must admit, Jigglypuff behaves differently from other characters. It is in a pool with at least Peach on this.

See, the thing about the guide here is, it gives lots of advice and data and 'strategies' of a sort... but it still somehow feels like it is assumed I will 'get' how the whole "floating. baiting, punishing' thing works.

Getting how that works is precisely what I want the guide for.

I want to use Jigglypuff a little bit in competition - and the staleness of these boards is just. . . *shiver* Man. . .

She does behave differently, I'll give you that. As far as how to practice, aside from obvious basic tech stuff like jumping backwards versus turnaround jumping, to more intermediate stuff like perfect rests, maximizing her aerial control, and spacing, the only other way to practice her is play against real people and observe what's going on. Grab them and toss them forward, watch how the react. Learn what they do in what situations, and work around it.

Baiting: Jump forward, bair their shield, retreat to safety. Next time you jump toward them they'll expect the bair. Hover out of their range, and pound through whatever attack they used to attempt to hit you. That's probably the most basic bait I can impart, she's all about making the opponent guess what she's going to do. Sometimes you should just land and dash grab, or land and run away, pivot grabbing if they give chase.

Really, the only way to get better is to practice reading opponents, the rest will come naturally.

 

[-Axle-]

Any good strategies for versing Diddy Kong? He's one of my suckier match-ups, and it takes most of my focus to avoid his attacks and nanner ****.

 

[PND]

Any good strategies for versing Diddy Kong? He's one of my suckier match-ups, and it takes most of my focus to avoid his attacks and nanner ****.

Stay in the air, pound through whatever he tries, DI like mad if he hits you, play safe, and try and catch his nanners and use them against him.

His nanners are actually useless against us -- worse, even, because we can turn them against him. I've played a few notable Diddy's (Backroomers and Diddy Backroomers alike) and after a few matches they just stop pulling nanners out altogether. We won't be on the ground and we should be floatign high enough to avoid glide tosses. Watch out for peanut camping, it's pretty much all Diddy can do. You should be able to completely outspace him, do it. Watch out for his aerials, that's how he will attempt to net his kills. Specifically, bair and fair. Keep an eye out for those.

As far as levels, neutral wise take him to FD. The platforms of BF or anything else can allow him to leave a nanner, just to attempt to limit our approaches. He doesn't have such a luxury on FD. Also, the blastzones are fairly large on FD so even if you get hit by a kill move with decent DI you should be able to drastically out live him. Go for the gimp whenever possible. As far as counterpicks are concerned, I found Norfair was a solid choice, but overall I preferred Frigate and Rainbow Cruise. Norfair is a great anti Diddy level because it negates his nanner tricks, but by playing Jiggs we've already negating those enough. I prefer the missing edge on Frigate to assist in gimps, that coupled with the claustrophobic size of the level preventing him from peanut camping excessively makes it a solid choice for taking him out. Cruise is just Cruise, and fun to torture a Diddy on. Watch out for camping though, although it's not terribly hard to get around in this level. Don't let him get ahead, force him to have to approach you at all times and you're golden.

Really, I think the biggest factor in this matchup is knowing Diddy. I play Diddy, I use to second him before I fell in love with Snake, so I know his tricks. I know how to spot dribbling setups from miles away, and I know his glide toss lengths, I know his kill moves and set ups. Learn them and exploit them. Jigglypuff absolutely wrecks Diddy, and every Diddy main I've faced agrees with me (after some "convincing").

Hell, I think Nynjalink said it was 70-30 Jiggs favor and that was before all these prefect resting shenanigans were discovered.

Hope any of this helped, but probably not lol. I just entered rant mode and didn't let up.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

JP has a 70:30 adv?! *faints*

 

[t3h n00b]

Any good strategies for versing Diddy Kong? He's one of my suckier match-ups, and it takes most of my focus to avoid his attacks and nanner ****.

I used to main Diddy, before I switched to Falcon because he's too good. So I don't really know what to do as Jiggs here, but I can say what to avoid. Bananas make people trip on the ground. They don't make people trip in the air, which is already a good place for Jiggs, and why the matchup vs. a high tier character is considered close to even. When I would face Jiggs with him, instead of trying to combo/**** with bananas, I had to use them defensively and camp, mainly to break up rollout attempts or just to rack up damage and try to make an opening for an aerial. Diddy's aerial game is good, but not as good as his ground game with bananas, so if you can remove those options, that is a very good thing. On the ground, Diddy has three KO options- dsmash, fsmash, and utilt. You can mostly avoid these by staying in the air, once again, but with fsmash, you can SDI out after the first hit and survive, or at least DI behind Diddy. Dsmash is his best kill move, so just watch out for that one, it can kill around 110% (Diddy has problems killing, but Jigglypuff makes it easier).

Anyway, what I'm getting at, is if you avoid his bananas, he basically is forced to use ftilt (which does have decent range, but isn't a great move) or his aerials, which aren't as good as Jigglypuff's. Just watch out for fair for kills and his spike. His recovery can be gimped easily if he has to use his barrels when he's close to you, but his sideB is a reliable move, and can be canceled into a high-priority kick. Sorry for the longness :/

Edit: Since my post was so long, there were like two before it lol, but as the Diddy, I don't really think it's a bad matchup for Diddy, fsmash, usmash, and multijab are the only things that can be SDIed into for a rest, and... I don't really use those moves that much. Diddy still has options, like ftilt to space and utilt to kill if he stales dsmash. Just my opinion.

Edit2: Norfair really isn't a bad stage for Diddy, see: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=230510

 

[kirbywizard]

Um what is the best way to handle a ROB, the camping did not work to well against my JIgglypuff, but I tried using the bait tactic and it seems that worked teh best. Baiting Nair was one of teh few ways I manages to rack up damage. That down smash, Nair, were what kept me from approaching . I also managed a stage spike almost twice, I was also a bit timid when it came to trying to juggle him off stage for a KO. The most way I got a KO was by spamming Rollout when he messed up with Nair, or when I grabbed the spinner.

Please I can not fight ROB to well with My other mains.

 

[Airgemini]

I approach him with airdodges or Pound...
Don't take my word for it though.

 

[GeneralWoodman]

dont use pound unless its a sidestep happy rob. dont fast fall behind them but airdodge is useful

 

[Glick]

Yeah I agree with woodman here. Unless you already weakened his sheild that is. In that case raising pound his head and di away from him with a bair. Hopefully putting you out of reach of his dair.

 

[san.]

I have a question concerning jigglypuff + other characters. For any jigglypuff player who plays with another floaty character or mainly aerial character, how easy would you think it would be to transition to those playstyles from jigglypuff?

I've been thinking of using wario a bit more, but I've never actually used him seriously as of yet. I'm extremely used to aerial combat with the characters that I use, and since wario seems to be a lot aerial too, seems like a good complement in that it seems to require similar skills.



Also, against good players, how well does air dodge--> grab work? I almost always air dodge after aerials if I'm approaching the ground (bad habit? I don't know), and love to, for example, bair then AD behind and grab or just AD a lot in general, most notably after pounds. Seems like a predictable tactic to me, but it's been working... Just don't know how much of a good/safe idea it is.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

i play lots of floaty/aerial characters along w/ JP. i don't find the transition too bad really its just annoying when i go from like peach to JP and i feel like someone just robbed me....

never seriously tried Wario, i think outside of SSE i only picked him in a match once, but my opponent wasn't hard and i just played him like JP w/o 5 jumps.

i've never gotten AD>grab to work, but i think it can. you shouldn't always AD after an aerial to landing unless you plan to buffer someting or your about to be hit like w/ pound you can normaly just float away and easily Bair/Fair them back if they miss a retaliation.

i don't AD much anyway cause i use peach and she sends that habit to everyone else....

 

[RhedKing]

I have a question concerning jigglypuff + other characters. For any jigglypuff player who plays with another floaty character or mainly aerial character, how easy would you think it would be to transition to those play styles from jigglypuff?

When playing other characters similar to jigglypuff it becomes easier to pick them up since their general method of play is similar. Kirby is a great example since he has very different moves, but his floaty-ness, or play style is extremely similar, so he's quick to learn.

That came out rough around the edges, but when you give the same character a different moveset, it's still kinda like playing with that character.

In summary, it is much easier to transition to a kirby/MK/squirtle/wario when you've already played jigglypuff.

Of course, this doesn't mean you're just as good with any of those as you would be with puff.

Also from page previous, a few of you said the reason shadow moses was banned was for DDD. Although i agree he's insane there, kirby is not to be overlooked. Kirby kills all characters at around 25-40 just by doing his U grab near the pylon. He lands on the tip top and they die instantly, no DI or anything.

 

[Kishin]

Does a rest OoS only work well when you have tap jump on? I main Marth so we keep tap jump on since an up+b OoS would come out instantly for whatever reason or something so could this be similar with Jigglypuff's down+b OoS?

 

[kirbywizard]

What is this? I can not find the Jigglypuff Match UP Discussion thread! Was there even one to begin with. Also Jigglypuff isnt even listed in the meteknight match thread <_<

 

[PND]

It's 55-45 MK. Yes, it's seriously that close.

 

[Metatitan]

It's 55-45 MK. Yes, it's seriously that close.

oh how we wish

 

[JigglyZelda003]

better to face MK back to back than face Snake though.......

 

[Cold Fusion]

It's 55-45 MK. Yes, it's seriously that close.

I wonder what the Meta Knight boards would say if they saw that.

 

[PND]

To be honest, I don't care what the MK boards would say if they saw that ratio. *I've* faced top and high level MKs and I've seen other Jiggs users face top and high level MKs.

The matchup is deceptively even, and this comes from A LOT of experience. Most of the users here agree on this ratio anyway (although ratios are bull**** to begin with)

Ask the MK users who actually have faced Thinkaman, Jiggernaut, me, and a few others. They'll probably tell you something similar.

 

[GeneralWoodman]

lol then tell them how to stop rollout 100% of the time and u get ***** again.
but honestly, f-tilt nado and up b are all u need to beat jiggz

 

[kirbywizard]

lol then tell them how to stop rollout 100% of the time and u get ***** again.
but honestly, f-tilt nado and up b are all u need to beat jiggz

It does not take much to kill meteknight with our godly rollout and godly Fair <_<. Meteknight can not gimp us as well as meteknight can to other characters.

 

[PND]

lol then tell them how to stop rollout 100% of the time and u get ***** again.
but honestly, f-tilt nado and up b are all u need to beat jiggz

Wrong. This is complete BS.

A) Rollout doesn't matter at all anyway, every character should know how to beat it anyway.
B) Ftilt can be beaten by pound or grab.
C) Shuttle loop can be beaten by not being stupid. Shield it, dair it from above, whatever. I've even rested through it before.

 

[san.]

Wrong. This is complete BS.

A) Rollout doesn't matter at all anyway, every character should know how to beat it anyway.
B) Ftilt can be beaten by pound or grab.
C) Shuttle loop can be beaten by not being stupid. Shield it, dair it from above, whatever. I've even rested through it before.

By the way.. are all of jigglypuff's aerials safe on collision with MK's glide attack? I've had fair (and maybe Bair) clash the last time I played against an MK with jigglypuff.

Point C kind of irks me, because if the MK is playing smart he wouldn't use shuttle loop in a disadvantaged position or in a way to get punished so bad. If the MK doesn't really make any big mistakes and truly knows the matchup, what can jiggs do who also knows the MK matchup just as well?

Even though I try to SDI as much as possible, tornado seems really hard to get out of consistently. I have heard a poster say that dair vs tornado is good and possible rest interrupt(??)

I think jigglypuff is pretty disadvantaged, but it shouldn't be too hard to outplay metaknight with the characteristics of her moves.

 

[kirbywizard]

I wonder if the jigglypuff boards should try a match up discussion with the meteknight boards.

 

[SexTornado]

Sigh... Jiggly's matchup vs mk is like 60-40 mk's favour imo. Jiggly can easily escape nado because of her floatyness and from there the matchup isn't too difficult. Mk's fair is a pain, but by being smart it isn't too hard to beat. And yes, shuttle loop isn't a problem unless you don't know how to air dodge.

 

[rinoH]

how do you beat a grenade spamming snake on FD ive been playing stabbedbyahippie alot and hes always abit ahead of me since of his grenade spamming and its actually prtty hard to gimp a snake if he knows how to recover =(

 

[MrEh]

how do you beat a grenade spamming snake on FD ive been playing stabbedbyahippie alot and hes always abit ahead of me since of his grenade spamming and its actually prtty hard to gimp a snake if he knows how to recover =(

Approach. Don't let him camp.

 

[Tektite]

I have a question.

Does jigglypuff do good at FD?