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Ike Boards General/Q&A Thread

Teh Brettster

Teh Brettster

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ZSS is doable, but definitely not in our favor.

She just has so little lag on anything she does, it's hard for us to hit her. If she sits back and uses neutral B, we have to get creative in an approach, because as much as we'd like to think we can hit her with Nair for it, she'll have recovered and be ready to retaliate.

I feel like reading her utilt up close is big in the match-up. As is recognizing when she's going to use Dsmash as an "anti-air" or air dodge-reading move.

If she's side-B happy, we can run in, PS and jab.

If she's jabbing... before her jab3, can we interrupt with our own? Anybody know? I think I've done this before.

Either way, definitely not one of the worst match-ups, but a challenging one.
Enough to still be fun without crossing into ultra lame.
 
#HBC | Ryker

#HBC | Ryker

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Not bad from my limited perspective. I've played DRN with him multiple times. She doesn't really hold up well to Ike. His fall speed works to his advantage in escaping her juggles and she's not particularly difficult to approach compared to other MUs that I have more problems with. No worse than +1, imo.




So, I placed 7th last weekend at a fairly large LA tournament. I did not play Ike outside of one game, but he did win for me against a player who has beat me the last (and only) tournament set we played. He's my best friend and he plays G&W. I pulled game one out on BF and banned RCruise because I wanted to force this issue on Brinstar. I'd like to ask about that MU on that stage and Ike in general on Brinstar. I've started really playing Ike seriously while working away from home, so he hasn't gotten much exposure to my Ike past troll sets before I decided to attempt something more legitimate, but he has played the MU before against a good player (Billy, an AL/GA Sheik/Snake who probably plays Ike more than any other character outside of tourney) and was the one who told me everything I knew about the MU and was the key reason that I stomped AML (GA G&W) the previous weekend.

Brinstar is something I want to know a lot about because I'm comfortable on RCruise against a lot of characters with Falco, but Brinstar/Delphino Ike just seems so much more appealing if I know I'm going to get CPed to a stage they want to play against Falco on.
 
#HBC | Ryker

#HBC | Ryker

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Teh Brettster said:
If she's jabbing... before her jab3, can we interrupt with our own? Anybody know? I think I've done this before.
Click to expand...
Definitely can. Most characters can. It was one of the first things I tested coming from a Falco background. Thing is, good ZSS almost never wants to finish the jab combo. She'll cancel the jab into something else. The fact that Ike DOES have a good jab, however, makes that a hard decision. She doen't like playing that range with anyone who has a good, fast CQC option and a grab behind it.

EDIT: You can beat Jab3 with our Jab1 assuming that you haven't gotten some strange funky DI that has you too high off the ground or you were caught with it too high through some odd serious of events. If you have to fall too far, she can finish the jab combo, but using it in that situation is rather situational, pardon the pun.
 
Ussi

Ussi

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Basically if she jabs you on the ground she's really going for catching you off guard with a 1 frame move. It combos when you're in the air
 
Blubolouis

Blubolouis

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I think ZSS Ike is only a slight advantage for ZSS. Her safe-on-shield arsenal is annoying but then again, she has a hard time dealing with our own range and traps. We kill her ridiculously early too. Jab>utilt is relatively easy to get, jab>bair even more.

IF her SideB is fresh she can kill us super early and super easily by hitting us while we use aether. losing a stock at like 120% isn't fun. But in my experience, ZSS rarely has fresh killmoves apart from when we kill her first though (or dsmash) which makes it a match-up in which our survivability does work.

The pieces of armor are a huge problem though.

I forgot how to play the snake match-up :( Nair on shield gets ftilted, Fair doesn't do much, and approaching from the ground is so hard. Quick input ?
 
Berserker Swordsman

Berserker Swordsman

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jamlosingthegame said:
What is this move?
Click to expand...
Pretty sure he meant ZSS, but a valid question nonetheless.

I've only played against solecalibur way back ago, but the MU overall seems mostly about longevity against SideB and DSmash. Uair can be a problem to kill you off the top, but I think Ike should stick ahead of the game most of the game if he keeps jab pressure on and doesn't panic spot dodge up close. I like going for grabs in this MU because ZSS likes the option of spot dodge->Utilt so much that looking for that option actually gives me enough patience to follow up pretty well after Fthrow. And of course, Bthrow -> DA is always going to put you at an advantage.

My only question is... how do people (myself included) get hit by the DownB kick? @.@ Outside of DSmash combos, of course.

Edit: Ooh, forgot about armor. I usually just stay away, force them to either throw and whiff or let them disappear eventually. Also, on BF/SV, we should be able to avoid get SideB'd out of Aether, right? Pretty sure we can get Aether to reach that far before we jump up to catch the sword.
 
Heartstring

Heartstring

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Fighting ZSS feels very similar to fighting marth from my limited experience fighting the former, the difference being she has much less cooldown on things with the tradeoff of being much easier to land a Jab on.
 
smashkng

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Snake shouldn't be able to Ftilt OoS before you can shield if you fast fall the Nair correctly (except if he MAYBE powershields). Well spaced Nairs are a decent approach, if spaced well you can hit Snake without blowing the Grenade. It's harder to space without blowing it when he faces backwards though, but it's still possible. Approaching from the ground is hard I agree, you have to be unpredictable with it and mix up with walking, shield dash and occasional dash grabs to catch a Snake offguard with a Grenade, but DON'T pummel if the Snake has a Grenade nearby as that makes it explode. You want to get inside Snake to at least the jab range, which is at about the range where Ftilt is punishable without the need of PS (I think Ftilt 2 is unpunishable for us if spaced well and not PS'd, it pushes us even outside our Bair range), but watch out for his dash attack and dash grab as they have pretty good range. Ike kinda sucks at punishing things that aren't like -30 or something like that on shield that also has so much shield push that it pushes us outside the jab range due to our pretty poor dash grab range and our very slow dash attack. Good thing though is that whenever we get in we can deal so much damage before Snake can get back into his neutral position.
 
Heartstring

Heartstring

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silly BS

Guys, what am i going to do? my good copy of brawl is in london, which means i have to deal with an old copy that barely works! This means im going to get wrecked next tournament, ways how i can stay well oiled for the 29th july without uying a new game?
 
Heartstring

Heartstring

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ive just realised it doesnt matter, because Ill be at the olympics for that tournament anyway, and just collect the disc after the olympic event is done and i go home lol
 
Ussi

Ussi

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DJ Arcatek said:
Is Falco vs Ike really bad vs Ike? After playing Ryo I believe it isn't THAT bad for Ike.
Click to expand...
-1 MU as we put on the chart, there are some (random people) who think its -2 though

Comes down to how well Ike avoids dying to Falco's subpar kill options and lands his jab more than falco
 
Slaps

Slaps

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shield grab>jab when you are grabbing %... at least with Dark Falco thats how I handle him.. Falco's dumb and will always get the grab by just shielding jab 1/2 so best option especially vs falco's always looking for early grab is beat them to the punch(grab).. Even if you miss (they spot dodge) you should be able to roll before he can grab you..
 
Heartstring

Heartstring

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Teh Brettster said:
I found out what Craysyn has been up to.

Click to expand...
*like*
And ike-falco isn't as bad as you would initially think, he can't really take advantage of ike's weaknesses as much as some other top characters. Plus the whole laserlaserlaserlaserPHANTASMlaserlaserlaserlaserlaser thing doesn't work that well on ike once you get the racist shield down. This is because all of our aerials beat out phantasm thanks to transcendant priority :D
oh, and falco can't kill
 
#HBC | Ryker

#HBC | Ryker

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Dude, with good timing, any move that hits people can beat phantasm and a good many of the ones that don't. Nothing feels better than jab-jab-dtilt on a recovering Falco.

But yeah, Ike scares the **** out of me. Mechanically, Falco wins, but when you factor reads into it, Ike gains more than Falco (and everyone else in the game) which is odd for Falco because the momentum he fails from 2 correct reads normally gives him that advantage, IMO.

:phone:
 
Heartstring

Heartstring

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Ryker said:
Dude, with good timing, any move that hits people can beat phantasm and a good many of the ones that don't. Nothing feels better than jab-jab-dtilt on a recovering Falco.
Click to expand...
well yeah, but timing isn't my best asset, so ike makes up for it with glorious ****ing hitboxes everywhere
 
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