Ike : A Detailed Matchup Guide; #33 - Ness

[Ussi]

I think its impossible for the Ike fan base to compare to the Link fan base, Link has been here much more longer than Ike. Link has the advantage now.


Even i like to use link out of the good old OoT days ;o

 

[Kinzer]

Oh that reminds me, what way do you want to DI/(SDI?) when you're caught in Link's Upsmash slashes?

Also is it possible to DI/(SDI?) properly once Link has locked you in the first Fsmash slash and dodge the second Fsmash slash or not?

 

[sasook]

To answer someone's question earlier, Link's zair is capable of hitting a Kirby standing still. It can go that low. It's just hard to time.

I think its impossible for the Ike fan base to compare to the Link fan base, Link has been here much more longer than Ike. Link has the advantage now.


Even i like to use link out of the good old OoT days ;o

Both characters are pretty cool, IMO

 

[Ussi]

Hard to time + Ike's not normally at that height + mindgames = win.

Ike probably doesn't go as low as Kirby standing, but he goes low enough to dodge Pit's arrow going straight.


Not about coolness, its just more people know about Link than Ike so he would get retro gamers in his fan base. Ike is pretty recent.

 

[XACE-K]

Oh that reminds me, what way do you want to DI/(SDI?) when you're caught in Link's Upsmash slashes?

Also is it possible to DI/(SDI?) properly once Link has locked you in the first Fsmash slash and dodge the second Fsmash slash or not?

For me, I usually DI down when caught in the U-smash slashes but that's just me. When caught in the F-smash, once you're locked in I'm not sure if you can dodge the second hit. For DI, I usually DI in the opposite direction of where the hit is coming from.

Also, did we talk about counterpicks for this match-up? I haven't really seen anything on it but I would like to know. I would say Rainbow Cruise because there aren't many ledges you can tether to so it would you can take advantage of Link's Up-B.

 

[sasook]

RC is apparently one of Link's best CP's. Don't ask me how, I personally fail on that stage. But according to the rest of the Link players, RC and Norfair are his best CPs.

As for the upsmash, I dunno which way you should DI out of it. It doesn't have too much knockback because it's usually used as a damage racker, so it gets decayed pretty often.

The second fsmash will only hit at low percents, so I wouldn't really view it as that much of a threat. The first is the one to watch out for. At high percents, the first sends the opponent too far for the second to connect.

 

[HeroMystic]

You should just be worried about dodging Link's F-Smash altogether. Link's F-Smash doesn't double hit unless you're at low percentage, about under 40%. After that the first hit sends you to far for the 2nd slash to hit reliably.

Seriously, you guys worry too much about the minor stuff. XD

 

[Ussi]

I personally think Pirate ship does good. If you can't get gimped, you can live to 200% if you're good at living.

But RC works too since Link's 2nd jump is almost like Peach's.

 

[Swordplay]

Pirate ship is a good counter pick against Link.

Zair edgaurd has little affect and The stage is catered to Ike's playing style.

Stages to avoid (Norfair and Rainbow Cruise).

Think of the way Links projectiles work. Pick stages you think he doesn't have a good projectile game on. Or his mobility is limited due to the field layout.

remember. link makes up for his mobility by having great stage control so choose your stage wisely.

 

[Deva]

Ike does well against Link when he closes in. Choose something small like BF.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Would Green Greens work? (I think thats the name). The blocks would block projectiles, and the wind from the tree could really screw over Link while recovering: More so then Ike due to the fact Link falls faster.

 

[Deva]

Well, the stage has small enough sides that recovering isnt really a problem, if you're getting hit out too far to recover, you're probably already dead from a blast zone lol. But still, it's a good stage just due to how small it is. Only things to watch out for are the blocks can also create camping situations. Link can jump around the stage pretty well throwing down bombs and stuff. Also, Link likes low ceilings for his Dair, and even his d-smash becomes a quick kill move on that stage.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Well, the stage has small enough sides that recovering isnt really a problem, if you're getting hit out too far to recover, you're probably already dead from a blast zone lol.

-True enough. There would still be a small margin where you could normally make it back, but the wind screwed you over. And that margin would be a bit bigger on Link then on Ike due to fall speed.

But still, it's a good stage just due to how small it is. Only things to watch out for are the blocks can also create camping situations. Link can jump around the stage pretty well throwing down bombs and stuff.

-Don't the ledges stop bombs? Or is Ike to tall and will still get hit? Or am I getting 2 stages mixed up due to the fact I haven't unpacked my Wii from moving yet....But I do know Link is good at jumping around. I've found out the hard way before. >_<

Also, Link likes low ceilings for his Dair, and even his d-smash becomes a quick kill move on that stage.

-Same applies to Ike's Utilt and Dsmash however.

The other thing I can think of is that there is more opportunities to spike at that stage, like if enough blocks have been destroyed. And the apples can be projectiles, which would help Ike a lot, more then it would help Link, who already has 3.

 

[Kinzer]

Well that's for CP stages, how about the best neutral stage CP against Link? I think the best one in this case is Lylat Cruise. It's been deemed neutral right? (I'm not sure I've heard somewhere that some people make LC a CP for whatever reason and it isn't considered a starting stage?) Anyway if for whatever reason you can't use Lylat Cruise there's...really any neutral stage that won't make any signifigant difference because they really are neutral (LC has leaning sides and stuff like that), although you don't want to pick FD because that gives Link a lot of room to work with.

And Hero, I just want to consider EVERY option, you know that they say that "knowledge is power", and apparently Ike is helluva smart guy.

 

[4Serial]

It's very possible to DI out of Link's U-smash before the last hit comes out. I play Link dittos with a friend and if I see it coming, I can smash DI the first 2 hits out of it. If you're near the tip of the u-smash, you can get out of after 1 of the hits. Smash DI is very strong. You smash DI the closest way out.

I wouldn't pick RC with Ike vs Link.. I'm not sure how exactly Ike plays on the stage with his aerial mobility, but I always thought that Ike was the type of character that controls the stage like a tank. Link has excellent stage control on RC with his versatile projectiles and Link can take advantage of Ike's recovery has much as Ike can take advantage of Link's.

BF is a good counterpick, Yoshi's Story is good too. I dunno about Lylat, it's pretty big and the platforms can help Link's projectile game. The only downside to the stage is really the lame edges can gimp Link, it's the same for Ike and almost every character, right?

 

[MysticKenji]

I wouldn't pick RC with Ike vs Link.. I'm not sure how exactly Ike plays on the stage with his aerial mobility, but I always thought that Ike was the type of character that controls the stage like a tank. Link has excellent stage control on RC with his versatile projectiles and Link can take advantage of Ike's recovery has much as Ike can take advantage of Link's.

^^ this is correct
Something like Frigate would work if you really want link to die at like...30% lol (Make sure it doesn't happen to you first!)

The only downside to the stage is really the lame edges can gimp Link, it's the same for Ike and almost every character, right?

Depends on where Ike is relative to the ledge...but it most likely won't gimp him.

 

[Kinzer]

Lylat can lean slightly to it's sides, therefore making an unevened stage temporarily. Link can probably still angle the Gale Boomerang to go up, however I think throwing bombs directly in front of you when you're on the lower edge of the leaning Cruise stage is kind of idiotic, and arrows will go nowhere because their trajectory can only be controlled by how long it is charged, and even so it still only makes the arrows go further forward. Maybe to even prevent a Link from Arrow-cancelling are the platforms above the heads (although I'm not sure how tall Ike is an watehr his head passes through or not.), which can be used as a shield.

Although I don't know how this will affect Link if he is on the higher end of LC, maybe it just makes the arrows more useless because they fly too far to hit Ike from below, and trading off to make the Gale Boomerang useable at any angle again.

 

[sasook]

Generally the boomerang is used more than arrows, so a lack of arrows because of the stage tilt for like...30 seconds...doesn't affect Link too much. Also, if Link pulls a bomb, don't expect him to always throw it. Seriously, bombs are what make up most of Link's mindgames.

 

[Kinzer]

I know they won't be throwing it but I'm saying if they tried to throw it in front of them, it wouldn't work too well. I'm considering every way to shut down my opponent, it's the way I am.

 

[YagamiLight]

I find it rather humorous that Link got such a gigantic amount of responses, it's pretty cool. I'll be able to do an awesome character like Link justice with the analysis, then.

 

[Kinzer]

Hey Light, while you're here, what're your two cents on the Hero of Time? Anything that hasn't already been mentioned (which I know we haven't covered Link 100%, that guy has a lot going for him) by this point?

 

[XACE-K]

I find it rather humorous that Link got such a gigantic amount of responses, it's pretty cool. I'll be able to do an awesome character like Link justice with the analysis, then.

Than I dare you to do Peach. The Ike boards will be overcome by Peach mains if she's next.

Besides, we should do a character repping the Mario franchise next because we have done at least one character from each column in Brawl except the first column.

 

[YagamiLight]

Hey Light, while you're here, what're your two cents on the Hero of Time? Anything that hasn't already been mentioned (which I know we haven't covered Link 100%, that guy has a lot going for him) by this point?

Link is the awesomeness of Captain Falcon, given a whole bunch of medieval weaponry, and a green tunic.

Than I dare you to do Peach. The Ike boards will be overcome by Peach mains if she's next.

Besides, we should do a character repping the Mario franchise next because we have done at least one character from each column in Brawl except the first column.

Hm...Peach, eh? We'll see.

 

[Kinzer]

Than I dare you to do Peach. The Ike boards will be overcome by Peach mains if she's next.

Besides, we should do a character repping the Mario franchise next because we have done at least one character from each column in Brawl except the first column.

Xace, there's still the F-Zero Series, The Medal Gear, The Sonic team...ah hell you get it, if we wanted to cover franchizes we still have a lot of them to take care of.

As for the matchup itself, I guess it's up to Light from this point on, most everything I think has already been mentioned, unless somebody out there reading this right now comes up with something.

 

[XACE-K]

Xace, there's still the F-Zero Series, The Medal Gear, The Sonic team...ah hell you get it, if we wanted to cover franchizes we still have a lot of them to take care of.

I'm talking about the columns on the character selection screen.

Column 1-Nobody
Column 2-Wario
Column 3-Link, Zelda
4-Zero Suit Samus (even though she doesn't appear on screen)
5-MK, DDD, Olimar
6-Falco
7-Pikachu
8-Marth
9-Snake

 

[Kinzer]

It's-a Super Mario Luigi time then?

I see what you mean now.

 

[YagamiLight]

Remember that the character order is decided using a combination of two thing: 1) Generally, higher tiers will be done first. 2) I must find a cool picture of said character. (This is the main reason G&W hasn't been done yet)

 

[Kinzer]

And here I thought you were just taking care of Ike's worse matchups first.

Uhm, I hope you don't mind asking but do you think you have enough information as of now to get a write-up on Link or is it too early for that?

 

[YagamiLight]

And here I thought you were just taking care of Ike's worse matchups first.

Uhm, I hope you don't mind asking but do you think you have enough information as of now to get a write-up on Link or is it too early for that?

Ike's worst matches (Dedede, Falco and probably Olimar) are all fairly high and have ample pictures.

And I think I can write something up on Link right about now, I'll see what I can do. The secret is: Link is my secondary (For casual matches, more or less), so I have no lack of information on him.

 

[Kinzer]

Awesome, can't wait to see what you brew up and who we will be examining next.

Spoiler

*Insert perverted line here* *Cough Peach cough*

 

[4Serial]

Depends on where Ike is relative to the ledge...but it most likely won't gimp him.

The same could be said for Link and any character in the game. It just happens =/

@Kinzer: LC's stage tilts can be bad for Link because they do mess him up in some situations. It can mess up arrows, but arrows aren't nearly as important as Link's z-air. The stage tilt can shift just slightly enough so that Link's recovery won't reach, which is really lame... it can also help him sometimes too. Other than that, the stage tilting isn't much of a problem to Link. The stage in general isn't too bad if you can make use of the space that you have. I wouldn't know how Link vs Ike is on LC, but I think Ike has more of an apparent advantage on Battlefield.

@Light: If you're a Link secondary, why don't you ever post on the Link boards =[ Is this where your heart belongs?

 

[Kinzer]

Yeah, I was just trying to find the best neutral stage to use Vs. Link, trouble is, they're all rather the same thing anyway...owell.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

Kinzer calm down. You had like 800 posts yesterday and in this page every other post is yours.


I also feel like you think very highly of yagami for some reason, that just makes me laugh a bit. Not trying to make fun of you or anything just appeals to me.

 

[Kinzer]

Now I'm going to feel ******** for being the next poster to reply to you, Burrito... And most of those posts came from the Sonic Boards, it's fun down there.

As for me appealing to Light...you know, why don't you just call me that annoying fanboy that constantly spams the boards?

 

[•Col•]

Link is the awesomeness of Captain Falcon, given a whole bunch of medieval weaponry, and a green tunic.

Captain Falcon is pretty awesome. That reminds me...

Everyone watch this match: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfCZCqNh7uM

Yeah, I know it's off topic, but it's literally THE MOST epic Brawl match I've ever seen... xD

Kinzer calm down. You had like 800 posts yesterday and in this page every other post is yours.

Yeah, looks like someone is striving to get 1000 posts... *cough*



Anyway, do you have any idea what the next character will be Light? o-o

Spoiler

Lol, I just realized I never posted the rest of my stuff on Link... I'm lazeh. D:

 

[Guilhe]

I hope it will be Luigi or Pit.

 

[YagamiLight]

@Light: If you're a Link secondary, why don't you ever post on the Link boards =[ Is this where your heart belongs?

I'm actually working on collecting videos of my Link, then I'll eventually post a topic with those in it. I should probably get more videos of my Ike while I'm at it.

I also feel like you think very highly of yagami for some reason, that just makes me laugh a bit. Not trying to make fun of you or anything just appeals to me.

This wasn't a thinly veiled insult at me, was it? Haha, just joking around. As for my part, I hold everyone here in high regards, but I might just be old fashioned.

I hope it will be Luigi or Pit.

You read my mind.

 

[Kinzer]

Hey Light, is it just me or is the picture for Zero Suit broken?

Oh, and I noticed the matchup is now open to Pit, he may have heaven by his side, but Ike has his God Strength!

 

[HeroMystic]

Ike's sword is blessed by the Goddess, so I guess that's accurate.

And I got nothing on Pit besides his somewhat gimpable recovery, so can't help there.

 

[YagamiLight]

Hey Light, is it just me or is the picture for Zero Suit broken?

The image appeared to have been taken down. There is a new one up, of course.