General Discussion & Character Rankings

[swordsaint]

yep

if you can cancel mks tornado, he has time to punish with like dsmash or something, i've seen it happen against snakes, snake tries to up tilt a grounded nado, clash, mk dsmashes. really gay

 

[J-Birds]

So the metagame is still based around beating that move...

 

[Attila_]

not so much.

most high tiers have good enough ways of either avoiding or punishing it, and sdi helps heaps too.

it still can be gay, and it still destroys most mid/low tier characters.

 

[Vlade]

You can't SDI the tornado though, how many times do I have to tell you Attila

 

[MTGod]

You can PK Fire that fizz*****.

 

[Attila_]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcYpRwY5L74

so i suppose i keep getting out because earl's doing it wrong?

 

[Vlade]

Yeah, earl must be doing it wrong. I think in the first game of the vid you lin[/I]ked Earl connected with like 2 tornados. The first did the full damage but the second one he didn't get you in the right part to keep you in for the max length, giving you the false illusion that you SDI'd it.

Tornado doesn't have hitlag, and if there isn't any hitlag then it just can't be SDI'd no matter how hard we try.

 

[Attila_]

watch the set, i only get trapped in 3-4 out of about 10. compare this to sets from a year ago, where i would literally not get out a single time.

you people and your 'frame data'. it only holds you back!

 

[Zxv]

Scoot gets out of tornado a lot (more than 95% of the time which is ridiculous). Even M2K commented on this.
Ergo M2K doesn't know how to tornado properly?

Beliving blindly in theories simply hinders you. You end up contorting results to fit hypotheses rather than constructing hypotheses to fit results.

 

[Vlade]

Yes, believing blindly in the theory that SDI-ing the tornado is possible certainly does hinder you

 

[swordsaint]

vlade you're a ****ing idiot.

 

[Vlade]

Scoot want to say something more constructive than that?

 

[swordsaint]

Scoot want to say something more constructive than that?

Vlade that comment you made was ****ing stupid.


...

no?

 

[Vlade]

I thought it was clear I was kidding around, but apparently not

I'd appreciate it if you didn't just call me a "****ing idiot" though, that wasn't very nice

 

[swordsaint]

I thought it was clear I was kidding around, but apparently not

I'd appreciate it if you didn't just call me a "****ing idiot" though, that wasn't very nice

I thought it was clear I was kidding around, but apparently not

but 4srs times, turning something in to a joke when theres legitimate evidence/example brought up against is just a piss poor way to handle something.

 

[Vlade]

The comment I made in response to what Zxv said was a joke, but I'm still an adamant believer that tornado cannot be SDI'd.

As far as I'm concerned the evidence that was brought up doesn't counter my point, because to me it looks like that it was incorrect positioning of the tornado. We can argue this all day but ultimately it's not gonna make either of us a better person since it will just lead to us not accepting the other person's argument as that's how the internet usually works. If you think I'm an idiot, so be it because I'm not changing my views on this matter anytime soon but like I said before that personal attack was pretty uncalled for.

I would've preferred something along the lines of "Vlade that post was dumb"

 

[Attila_]

You should probably inform all the top mks that they aren't nadoing properly. A video tutorial perhaps?

 

[swordsaint]

The comment I made in response to what Zxv said was a joke, but I'm still an adamant believer that tornado cannot be SDI'd.

As far as I'm concerned the evidence that was brought up doesn't counter my point, because to me it looks like that it was incorrect positioning of the tornado. We can argue this all day but ultimately it's not gonna make either of us a better person since it will just lead to us not accepting the other person's argument as that's how the internet usually works. If you think I'm an idiot, so be it because I'm not changing my views on this matter anytime soon but like I said before that personal attack was pretty uncalled for.

I would've preferred something along the lines of "Vlade that post was dumb"

no, see you're misunderstanding. You can keep that opinion all you want, but not even acknowledging what was said, instead going in to a joke was just a bad way to handle it. joke + response is much more acceptable imo.

This post was much better. if you said this in response to zxv then I wouldn't have said anything.

 

[Vlade]

You should probably inform all the top mks that they aren't nadoing properly. A video tutorial perhaps?

It's not feasible to be able to tornado 100% perfectly every time because I think it depends on where the tornado initially hits the opponent

EDIT: That's fair enough Scoot, I can agree with that

 

[swordsaint]

does tornado hit on EVERY frame?

 

[Vlade]

I don't think it does, otherwise it'd hit 60 times in 1 second

This is the video I saw which makes me believe that tornado can't be SDI'd: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kAX5O1ftpo

Make of it what you will

 

[swordsaint]

I put to you this, even if non-SDI-able, the fact it doesn't have hitlag, and doesn't hit on each frame suggests that even REGULAR DI during the tornado is feasible.

 

[Attila_]

tornado hits every 4-6 frames, depending on how hard the mk player is mashing 'b'.

di/sdi is the only real explanation as to why top players get out fairly often now; unless your saying that top mks just got worse.

 

[Vlade]

Yeah I think regular DI is more plausible

 

[Splice]

i am under the impression its just if ur chars whole body is trapped in the middle (this normally happens when the MK nados from below or starts the Nado at your position) then there isnt really anything you can do. I dont think SDI would help there.

Its plausible it works around the edges of the attack.

Still, SDI has never gotten me out of a Nado from any angle except if im only barely getting hit by it.

Is there anything particular on how you are supposed to SDI nado differently to other moves?

 

[swordsaint]

you go towards the centre. then airdodge/quick attack/footstool. thats what i do anyway.

no hitbox in centre, only on the bottom, top left and top right.

 

[Splice]

Ok I havent been doing that. ty
Ill see if i get any results.
I should just mash UpB anyway as I am a GaW main :D

If you're trapped in the bottom you cant actually get out though can you?

 

[Attila_]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvkYyjbMbuM#t=38s

right in the centre, got out of a rising nado (fast-ish b presses).

scoot's right, not sure if i told him that or not. did so much testing on this while i was in japan; all the mks over there are spammy b*tches.

 

[swordsaint]

you didnt tell me

i just know what nado does.

I probably get out more than you lol.

also it does depend on the way they're nadoing.

There are a few factors, for good nados centre is best. but you can drop out through the corners sometimes if you notice you're close to them.

Then airdodge/jumping again is dependant on whether they're rising nado or holding it solid.

edit - i dont think that was you getting out of that nado attila, earl dropped the nado at the end which can sometimes pop you out.

 

[Attila_]

its a hell of a lot harder to get out with a heavy tall character lol

falcy is easy :D

 

[swordsaint]

lol yeah falco is so easy. i admit it.

 

[Scabe]

Actually nevermind.

 

[Shaya]

Omg scabe.... I'm suddenly feeling extremely scared/disgusted.

 

[Rad]

Well you probably should be.

 

[Shaya]

You don't know what that post was.

UGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

 

[Rad]

Yes, I do.

10sea mans

 

[Shaya]

uGHHHHHHHHHH RAD KNOWS EVERYTHING.

 

[Attila_]

New tier list...

About time Diddy took over snake. This took way too long.

And why us pit so low?

 

[Jei Jei]

Cuz he needs to work so hard. Planking and camping lololol

 

[swordsaint]

wheres the lsit?