Silent Wolf
...
you can back throw re grab combo on spacies that DI right.
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Q&A -Fox Advice/Questions Topic-
- Thread starter Silent Wolf
- Start date
Fortress | Sveet
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this ***** knows whats good
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I've thought about B-throwing Falcon at low percents because he's easy to tech chase and U-throw doesn't legit combo into anything tangible. And because then you can be silly and be like "MINDGAMES SON BETCHA DIDN'T THINK I WAS GONNA THROW THAT WAY".
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I do that too. It's alright.
Got anything cool for onstage work?
Got anything cool for onstage work?
Metà
Smash Master
what percent does up-throw stop comboing falcon at?
Metà
Smash Master
it depends on what you're doing
when I want to full-jump or double jump out of shine, I use up
when I want to multishine or SHDL, I use Y
when I want to waveshine or SH, I use X
when I want to full-jump or double jump out of shine, I use up
when I want to multishine or SHDL, I use Y
when I want to waveshine or SH, I use X
Kanelol
Smash Lord
I only use Y to SHDL out of shine :\
Winston
Smash Master
Using up is good for doing uthrow uair
keep using the button to jump for most things
keep using the button to jump for most things
unknown522
Some guy
haha, every time I do that I say "KDJ".
I stole that from some crew battle match where he did that to Jiano.
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
yea lol. I was hella surprised when you did that.
voorhese
Smash Master
yeah, pretend ur doing a dair shine, but dont press down untill after your "dair"...no seriously tho, nair shining is the only way to nair shine...as far as i know =/
Just need to practice it.
Kanelol
Smash Lord
just hit all the buttons really really really fast
if that doesnt work, practice practice practice
it's been a few months since I started getting consistent nair shine chains, (note that I do tech skill shenanigans a few hours everyday) and I still can only do it like 4-5 times before ****ing up
not that you need any more than that for shield pressure, but still
if that doesnt work, practice practice practice
it's been a few months since I started getting consistent nair shine chains, (note that I do tech skill shenanigans a few hours everyday) and I still can only do it like 4-5 times before ****ing up
not that you need any more than that for shield pressure, but still
omgwtfToph
Smash Master
Tautologies are tautologies.
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
doing **** **** is the only way to do **** ****.
Nair up smash. CC up smash. up smash up smash. shine up smash.. pretty much anything into up smash or up tilt @ low-mid. back air eats him alive. Just try to pin him in his shield, punish rolls and watch out for stomps/forward b/random knees.
I think, vs. more experienced players (people who tech chase well) I recommend missing your first and maybe even second tech.
If they're reaction time is on it shouldn't matter either way but .... most experienced players expect other experienced players to know how to tech.
Me too!!! I miss those days.
JPOBS
Smash Hero
what do u mean by first and second tech?
and i def agree about the second sentence and it turns into a mindgame
edit: lol i read "missing" as "using" for some reason. i see now. still, why do u say that?
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I meant with throw, but all of that is good.
Your common falcon player is going to look for a tech, so they won't exactly be ready when you miss it. Unless they're reaction time is good and they're literally expecting a tech in place.
On stage? with throws??
on FD I usually just nair. I mean, it's hard cause I havent had much exp vs. any good falcons since I stopped going out to pounds n stuff. but way back when (raynex will vouch for me) I was pretty solid lol.
So off the top of my head (no percents :/.) I usually use up tilt (or jab/turn if he DIs) to regrab @ the lowest percents. Once Falcon goes up a little higher I nair regrab or nair nair. or nair up smash. I don't usually like up smash unless its near the edge or I can combo out of it. Once it starts sending to high I just nair as much as possible.
While KK is here I think we should talk about fox vs. sheik.
My usual strats involving DD right outside of ftilt or full jump down air over ftilt. Pretty much, if sheik likes to ftilt then I like to win. back air on short hops. down tilt sometimes comes in handy. any sort of grabbing <3.
Ok. I know, this is probably the most ******** thing anyone has ever suggested. but please, bear with me people.
Does anyone want to try 'UP AND B' IN A COMPETITIVE ENVIRONMENT
At 0, you can do uthrow > utilt > regrab to Falcon. If he DI's left or right you can CG (I don't know the percents), if he doesn't DI you can utilt > stuff.
Uthrow combos aren't as good against Falcon as they are against spacies though, so I frequently uthrow and just wait for their jump since a lot of Falcons will frantically try to jump out.
You can also beat or trade with pretty much all his moves with usmash. Good times.
Uthrow combos aren't as good against Falcon as they are against spacies though, so I frequently uthrow and just wait for their jump since a lot of Falcons will frantically try to jump out.
You can also beat or trade with pretty much all his moves with usmash. Good times.
good times, good times.
KAOSTAR
the Ascended One
up throw up smash into nairs is pretty good.
Tomacawk
Smash Master
that backthrow to nair to usmash on marth was sooooo ******
pretty solid damage but the combo ends if they DI usmash right, I think uthrow will bring you more damage instead of bthrow
I'm interested to see how big of a combo you could get by nairing/bairing instead of usmashing after that first nair--I think the combo potential is actually HIGHER than uthrow
pretty solid damage but the combo ends if they DI usmash right, I think uthrow will bring you more damage instead of bthrow
I'm interested to see how big of a combo you could get by nairing/bairing instead of usmashing after that first nair--I think the combo potential is actually HIGHER than uthrow
unknown522
Some guy
General stuff:
You really need to learn to JC your grabs. I see you trying to dash-grab a lot.
You also need to learn to shine OoS. It's one of the best options in the game OoS.
Chain-grabbing is good, or just have solid tech-chasing.
SDI falco's shine. Give him a hard time when he's comboing you.
More b-air. It's not a bad idea to have your back turned to falco. You can b-air his approaches, or u-tilt through his aerials if you time it well.
If you can PS lasers, then do it. It might come in handy sometimes.
Learn to ledge WD. It's your safest option.
Control yourself. You sidestep randomly a lot, and seem to DD uncontrollably a lot of times.
Game 1:
0:13 - Jumping on top of your opponent like that is bad, even when they aren't invincible.
0:26 - messed up that grab. Good try.
0:27 - drill if you're that close to the opponent. CC is incredibly gay. Alternatively, if you hit a very low n-air, the shine will still combo. It's really risky vs spacies though.
0:31 - you messed up that n-air, though you should've d-air'd. After you missed the n-air, he tried to d-air OoS. You could've waited and u-tilted him, or DD -> grabbed/drill him since you were still really close to him. Alternatively, you could've just waited to see what he does OoS, then put some pressure. You never want to give falco any breathing room
0:34 - shine OoS.
0:40 - CG him a bit, then do the u-tilt.
0:43 - u-tilt -> re-grab
0:45 - drill -> grab. The ledge is gay and combo-breaks you when you shine that close.
0:48 - that sucks.
0:56 - shine OoS
1:08 - you could've JC u-smashed him for missing the tech. It may not have killed him, but you at least get him above you and possibly off the stage.
3rd stock: You got the kill pretty quickly, though you messed up some re-grabs.
1:50 - shine OoS
2:00 - You approached from directly above again, while he wasn't really committed to much. After that, you hit a n-air -> shine. Not bad, but you could've drill -> grabbed.
2:03 - when you were waiting in shield and he Short hopped close to you, you could've b-air'd OoS.
2:05 - try to avoid drilling the opponent when they're in the air. They can punish you most of the time for it. Use b-air/n-air/shine.
2:10 - after you n-air'd his shield and went far away from him, you could've u-tilted to keep a safe block string, or it will hit him if he tries to retaliate.
2:24 - he was way too far away for you to get that tech chase. You should've tried to make him do something, with your DD. Then react.
2:37 - you rushed into that tech chase, Don't guess. React.
2:40 - you could've beaten out his b-air with your own. He put it out early.
2:43 - you could've u-smashed OoS after he b-air'd your shield.
2:59 - after you whiffed that u-smash. You could've f-tilted right after, while he was trying to laser you. You did a sidestep, then a jab but you could've f-tilted there as well. It would put him off the stage because of his damage. The jab was risky, because if he CC'd it, you may have lost the match.
Game 2: You gotta shorten those illusions.
3:20 - You jumped over him and he was waiting to CC your aerial. You could've b-air'd him, because he wouldn't be able to punish it with that spacing. Also, you put yourself at the edge of the stage, which is kinda bad.
3:22 - after hitting that shine. You WD'd out, but didn't do a thunder's combo for some reason. When he got up, you approached with a full hop n-air. Though you jumped on top of him, you should've drilled, because he was just crouching there.
3:28 - 3:32 - you were keeping good pressure on him. Failed the edgeguard though.
3:37 - could've u-smashed right through that d-air.
3:38 - you got read pretty hard. You did DI it really poorly too.
3:46 - He was too far away for the tech chase again. Try to bait him in those situations.
3:48 - You could've held the ledge, then d-air'd him to make sure that he can't walltech.
3:53 - 4:15 - you seem really frantic and are just throwing out moves, desperate for the kill. With that, you keep running into moves. Be careful with what you're doing.
4:24 - u-tilt
4:25 - u-tilt after that n-air.
4:27 - your oppenent did what I was talking about, though he is too close. You could've shined OoS.
4:34 - 4:36 - You had a punish.
4:37 - when you landed behind him, you could've u-tilted, or DD -> grabbed on him.
4:42 - too slow on the tech-chase.
4:49 - u-throw -> u-tilt -> re-grab -> etc.
5:01 - sweetspot.
less jabs in general.
Game 3:
6:01 - ledge hop d-air -> shine
6:03 - could've tech-chased with JC u-smash, or another grab.
6:04 - thunder's combo.
6:09 - edgeguard with full hop n-air, or jump out and shine him.
6:17 - same thing. Maybe b-air instead of n-air.
6:24 - what you did was risky and hard to time. You should've either taken the ledge, or SH d-air'd him while you were onstage, or just d-smashed him.
6:28 - go diagonally upwards.
6:32 - u-smash OoS.
6:45 - thunder's combo.
6:47 - DI or something.
6:55 - too slow again.
7:04 - shine OoS
7:08 - 7:12 - Good, but you mis-spaced the second u-air.
7:26 - You had the right idea with the edgeguard, but it looks like you were guessing on where he was going.
7:46 - That was really obvious and done really slow. He could've hit you out of it, but fortunately you didn't get punished for it.
7:50 - 8:40 - It seems like you guys are kinda just spamming moves. You gotta make those hits lead to something (a tech-chase, or combo).
8:44 - he finally punished it. You could've survived, if you DI'd the u-air though. He should've b-air'd you offstage.
9:01 - shine OoS at any point when he was close to you.
9:07 - free grab.
That sucks at the end. You had it, but didn't make sure it was done and it costed you. ****.
I'll watch the rest later.
unknown522
Some guy
tough call.
M2K, Jman, SilentWolf, Lucky, Raynex, lovage, PC chris, KDJ (old but still good)
Pick any, or all of them. I'm probably missing a few people.
I'd say to watch me as well, but I have no good recent footage up. Except vs Chu.
M2K, Jman, SilentWolf, Lucky, Raynex, lovage, PC chris, KDJ (old but still good)
Pick any, or all of them. I'm probably missing a few people.
I'd say to watch me as well, but I have no good recent footage up. Except vs Chu.
unknown522
Some guy
wooooooooah
DUUUUUDE! Up and B does SOOOOOO much %!! It combos into finishers too!!!
RaynEX
Colonel RTSD
cough Falco cough
Hmm.
Theory-crafting combos that would only work off d.i. in single direction, from a so-so throw, when better options from the grabs are available (regardless of d.i.!)
SKIP
Honestly it looks cool. But like all of Fox's incredibly colourful and exuberant trixies, use with extreme caution. Gambling positional advantage (referring to Yay's vid) for damage that may or may not happen (you'd have to KNOW he's d.i.ing in) isn't worth the risk. In tournament uthrow, bair, he's still cornered, done.
Tomacawk
Smash Master
true and point duely noted
this is going to be fun as **** to do in friendlies though
this is going to be fun as **** to do in friendlies though
Winston
Smash Master
Raynex, do you suggest going for uthrow bair on marth even at low percents? (like in the situation in yay's vid)
I was under the impression that uthrow uair is harder to DI out of at lower percents since the uair will hit him more squarely and he'd have to SDI farther to escape it or something.
also I feel like Marth can recover from the bair stun and fair fox or something?
I was under the impression that uthrow uair is harder to DI out of at lower percents since the uair will hit him more squarely and he'd have to SDI farther to escape it or something.
also I feel like Marth can recover from the bair stun and fair fox or something?