Fourth and final community vote about Meta Knight.

[iRJi]

This thread has come to a standstill for more then 20 min. Congrats =D

 

[DFat2]

This thread has come to a standstill for more then 20 min. Congrats =D

I think I killed the thread :<

 

[bobson]

I think I killed the thread :<

If you did, you deserve a medal.

 

[Kamikaze*]

This thread has come to a standstill for more then 20 min. Congrats =D

Correction: 18 min

 

[iRJi]

I think I killed the thread :<

It was unclear on what side you was on for some of it, unless you were pointing out on both sides of course. I am assuming you are Pro-ban?

Edit: Its late. If its obvious, which it most likely is, I am going to miss it. i can barley stay up anymore lmao.

 

[BarDulL]

I've watched you play vs MK and you make a lot of bad decisions so it just looks like you don't know what you're doing.

My bad though I thought you were just on some Fiction type sh*t and just wanted MK gone because he beats you, my apologies xD

if you're referring to my matches with a certain texas MK, i'll admit that i've never played worse in my life. i shuddered multiple times while watching our set from genesis just a couple minutes ago. surprisingly, i did much better against M2K in winners...not sure how that happened...

as for fiction's stance...it's...mind boggling at best. you're not the only one who thinks that way.

 

[SmashChu]

Not really. A vast majority of the cast would lose one crappy matchup but, as others have said, the mid/lower tiers would still have match ups that keep them from becoming viable. As you said, it would mostly affect high tier characters and several of them would become viable/more viable. For example, with Metaknight gone, Olimar, Toon Link, ROB, Pikachu, and some people would argue Pit would become viable and King Dedede, Mr. Game and Watch, Wario, and Marth would become more viable. Depending on what characters became popular after Metaknight was banned, it is argued that Falco, Snake, and Diddy Kong would lose some viability though.

Uhh, sorry, but I still think Mr. Game and watch is a Meta-Knight counter. He out prioritizes him and out powers him (meaning his weight is more of a flaw). Funny enough, I've killed MK with Game and Watch with his forward smash at 60% from FD. No charge. He's pretty powerful and has a lot more killing moves.

 

[Kamikaze*]

It was unclear on what side you was on for some of it, unless you were pointing out on both sides of course. I am assuming you are Pro-ban?

Edit: Its late. If its obvious, which it most likely is, I am going to miss it. i can barley stay up anymore lmao.

Click the number next to yes or no to see who voted what. use ctrl-f to find his name.

 

[iRJi]

Click the number next to yes or no to see who voted what. use ctrl-f to find his name.

Completely forget about that. lololol. I wanted to draw it from his post though, as it was well written and thought out. But TY xP

 

[cutter]

Uhh, sorry, but I still think Mr. Game and watch is a Meta-Knight counter. He out prioritizes him and out powers him (meaning his weight is more of a flaw). Funny enough, I've killed MK with Game and Watch with his forward smash at 60% from FD. No charge. He's pretty powerful and has a lot more killing moves.

UTD Zac told me on AIM that MK/G&W is a "free win" for MK.

Not surprisingly, he then said he wanted MK banned.

 

[DFat2]

It was unclear on what side you was on for some of it, unless you were pointing out on both sides of course. I am assuming you are Pro-ban?

Edit: Its late. If its obvious, which it most likely is, I am going to miss it. i can barley stay up anymore lmao.

Pro Ban, but I can understand both sides of the argument, and explained it in the post. That's why I came across as both sides.

But seeing as this is a "Fighting Game", I can understand the Time, effort and Facts/events that have to be carefully discussed before making an official descicion.

 

[En.Ee.Oh]

if you're referring to my matches with a certain texas MK, i'll admit that i've never played worse in my life. i shuddered multiple times while watching our set from genesis just a couple minutes ago. surprisingly, i did much better against M2K in winners...not sure how that happened...

as for fiction's stance...it's...mind boggling at best. you're not the only one who thinks that way.

Yeah I heard fiction doing commentary about Wario not being able to kill MK and how Tyrant runs from him and I was just thinking.. "Dude wtf... you're WARIO, WHO DOESN'T RUN FROM WARIO?!"

 

[salaboB]

I was always told that the IDC was banned (Rather than MK being banned) because it was so easily identifiable.

With mini-IDC's slipping in and the EDC now showing up, not to mention the whole trouble with planking MK causes, what part of "no longer easily identifiable" means MK shouldn't be banned solely because the rules can't be reliably enforced against a skilled player using him?

 

[deepseadiva]

We have Yuna and Amazing Ampharos on the case, pro-ban should leave before making too big of fools of themselves.

 

[A2ZOMG]

What in the hell does low tier tournaments do in regards to MK? Really now, use your head.

I didn't say "MK". I said "this thread" is the reason why there needs to be more low tier events so that nobody has anything to complain about when it comes to character viability in tournaments. If you separate the upper tiers from the lower ones and view them without regarding the other group, the game starts looking a lot more balanced.

Considering that there are a lot of arguments about Snake being better than MK (which if correct would render the point of the pro-ban argument moot), a better solution for promoting character tournament viability would be of course hosting more events with the upper tiers banned.

Says the Mario main....

lol <3 what's up ZOMG.

Viewing and voting in this topic merely for the lulz.

 

[iRJi]

We have Yuna and Amazing Ampharos on the case, pro-ban should leave before making too big of fools of themselves.

I am normally not the one to point this out, but if people are afraid to debate against them, they shouldn't be here. It is a debate, and they are good debaters, but it shouldn't mean that we are going to be locked down by 2 people, even if they are amazing at drawing conclusions.

Instead of pointing out that you have such and such on your side, how about posting what you think should happen. A good thing for the community is to cast your own voice, and not have people debate your ideals for you while someone chant from the sidelines. Know what I mean?

 

[Fatmanonice]

Well, there would be a little more diversity it seems, but at the cost of many, many people getting angry and possibly leaving Brawl. Not enough IMO for that price. I stick to my vote - anti-ban.

Now that, my friend, is a gross exaggeration. As far as I know, the only noteworthy Metaknight player who has threaten to leave is Mew2king. Everybody else would stick around and try to win with somebody else if they were real competitive players. As I said in an earlier post, the only players that would be greatly affected by Metaknight being banned are Metaknight (duh), Jigglypuff (as she gets ***** worse by just about all the other top/high characters), and Yoshi (pretty much one of the only reasons why people still use him is because he comes close to being a counter to Metaknight on some stages and, like Jigglypuff, gets ***** up the wazoo far worse by other top/high tier characters) players.

As I pointed out in another post, 29 out of the game's 39 characters would benefit in some form from Metaknight being banned. If anything, more people would be willing to play Brawl due to the characters I mentioned earlier becoming viable/more viable. Basically, you would have 5 (Toon Link, Pikachu, Olimar, ROB, and argueably Pit) new characters who would reasonably be able to win tournaments and 4 characters (King Dedede, Marth, Ice Climbers, and Mr. Game and Watch) who would be more likely to win tournaments with Metaknight gone. With that being said, I think Brawl would be made more attractive to more players with him gone thus heavily outweighing the few people who would initially leave.

I'm fully aware of the competitive standard in how, in hard situations, you buck up and try to win and you do whatever you can to win in legal limits. With this being said, Metaknight players are not at any fault but I do believe that Metaknight makes a shallow game even more shallow and drives down the appeal of the offline competitive scene (truth be told, online isn't all that effected because, oddly enough, he's not that popular in online competitions). If anything, I believe keeping him around will shorten the life span of this game more than anything else that's currently in the game and I believe that, as a community, the responsible thing to do is make sure this game stays alive as long as we can keep it alive.

 

[MetalMusicMan]

We have Yuna and Amazing Ampharos on the case, pro-ban should leave before making too big of fools of themselves.

For truth.

I'm so glad that Ampharos has the will to bat off this wall of noobs, because I just don't have the patience right now.


<3

 

[DanGR]

I was always told that the IDC was banned (Rather than MK being banned) because it was so easily identifiable.

With mini-IDC's slipping in and the EDC now showing up, not to mention the whole trouble with planking MK causes, what part of "no longer easily identifiable" means MK shouldn't be banned solely because the rules can't be reliably enforced against a skilled player using him?

Well, if I were an anti-ban advocate, I might say that EDC is neither broken nor stalling, and that IDC is both and therefore banned.

A lot of people think planking should be banned/have banned it even though there's no possible way enforce it without a ledge grab rule or by an arbitrary judge ruling. For that reason, and because Meta Knight's planking and air camping game together IS game breaking, that's another reason I am in fact for a ban.

edit: But... it's not like this post matters anyways. So whatever.

 

[iRJi]

Well, if I were an anti-ban advocate, I might say that EDC is neither broken nor stalling, and that IDC is both and therefore banned.

A lot of people think planking should be banned/have banned it even though there's no possible way enforce it without a ledge grab rule or by an arbitrary judge ruling. For that reason, and because Meta Knight's planking and air camping game together IS game breaking, that's another reason I am in fact for a ban.

edit: But... it's not like this post matters anyways. So whatever.

It does. Don't carry that mentality because that will cause us to lose support in our argument.

 

[demonictoonlink]

Could someone please post a video of EDC or something? I really need to see it...
Also, yay Meno is Anti!!!

 

[Aggression]

ban mk = unbans 20 characters

ban him

 

[Gigabyte_]

this thred is gay

 

[FB Dj_Iskascribble]

ban mk = unbans 20 characters

ban him

no thats not even close. your kind is the reason pro ban is always higher numbers
you cant explain why you think that way either

 

[complexity1234]

Yeah I heard fiction doing commentary about Wario not being able to kill MK and how Tyrant runs from him and I was just thinking.. "Dude wtf... you're WARIO, WHO DOESN'T RUN FROM WARIO?!"

what surprised me was that someone who is that good with wario could have such a scrub mentality lol (and his character goes pretty even with mk rofl)

 

[MetalMusicMan]

ban mk = unbans 20 characters

ban him

Metaknight is hardly even close to being the worst matchup for most characters in the game. There are a few for which he is the worst, but those characters have almost no other bad matchups at all to begin with, and he doesn't "**** them" anyway.

Look at MikeHaze-- everyone under rates marth because MK "***** him" and MikeHaze himself realized that he was just *****ing pointlessly and admitted it-- he took M2K, the BEST metaknight to the 5th game at EVO 2009 with MARTH, now he's anti ban.

Banning MK is totally illogical and "BAN MK!" is the cry of those who wish to erase what they refuse to overcome, rather than address it.

Metaknight doesn't "destroy" anyone, and the fact that he "doesn't have any bad matchups" doesn't make him broken in any way, because he doesn't completely hard counter anyone.

Every fighting game has a best character. Just like every fighting game has lazy whiners that cry for bans against the best character. This is no different.



There is no reason to ban him.

 

[fkacyan]

We have Yuna and Amazing Ampharos on the case, pro-ban should leave before making too big of fools of themselves.

Does the work the rest of us put in not matter?

Bawwwwww.

 

[ShadowLink84]

Uhh, sorry, but I still think Mr. Game and watch is a Meta-Knight counter. He out prioritizes him and out powers him (meaning his weight is more of a flaw).

he does not out prioritize MK because of the fact that MK has a laser like sword.
So that argument is poor, especially when considering range which MK has in a greater amount than G&W.

G&W's kill moves are also very slow and predictable.

Funny enough, I've killed MK with Game and Watch with his forward smash at 60% from FD. No charge. He's pretty powerful and has a lot more killing moves.

He is very powerful but his KO moves are slow and considering MK's tools, its not easy to kill him at such a low percent

 

[Falconv1.0]

Does the work the rest of us put in not matter?

Bawwwwww.

The guys who are here from the start *cough*me*cough* always get no credit, what are you, stupid?

 

[Zolios]

he does not out prioritize MK because of the fact that MK has a laser like sword.
So that argument is poor, especially when considering range which MK has in a greater amount than G&W.

G&W's kill moves are also very slow and predictable.

LOL.

First off, bair destroys shields, is very fast, and even hard to counter if predicted. Every single one of Game and watches moves has a fast start up, excluiding usmash, and they all lack landing lag.

Anyways, back to the subject:

MK isn't going to be banned, so game over bros.

 

[Dr. Tuen]

In my opinion, I think he shouldn't be banned. My skill level is probably best described as "mid-level", as are the people I play with. And while I can't possibly speak for the entire skill demographic that I represent, I can say that a friend of mine picked up IC's and has put far less time into them than I have for MK. We've been playing and he's been doing a pretty good job of wrecking me.

He's also pretty good at ripping me a new one with Falco. We play sets sometimes in friendlies, and I pretty much have to ban Japes (who wouldn't?) but that opens up the field for Falco+Final or IC's+Final or IC's+SV... it's a very strong combination to use against my MK.

---

Anyways, I just thought I'd illustrate some of the happenings at the "mid-level". I'm not everyone, this isn't 100%, but if we want to lay down as much evidence for either side as we can to make this a final decision, I figured I would stop lurking for a post and give my two cents.

-Tuen

 

[iRJi]

Uhh, sorry, but I still think Mr. Game and watch is a Meta-Knight counter. He out prioritizes him and out powers him (meaning his weight is more of a flaw). Funny enough, I've killed MK with Game and Watch with his forward smash at 60% from FD. No charge. He's pretty powerful and has a lot more killing moves.

This... is so far from the truth it hurts. I leave tonight with this.

Its in MKs favor, Just to state this for you. Have fun everyone, ttyl tomorrow, Night =]

 

[bobson]

Does the work the rest of us put in not matter?

Bawwwwww.

You're just not as cool as them, sorry.

 

[dextasmurf]

for some of u this topic is more hotter then sex lol

 

[DanGR]

It does. Don't carry that mentality because that will cause us to lose support in our argument.

You're kidding yourself.

The only reason the SBR would ever make this poll would be to make it look like they actually care about the community's opinion. And by community I mean everyone. Not just the best of the best or the really good players that aren't in the SBR, but the average player- the people that directly fund the pros and make pretty much every weekly and monthly tournament actually happen.

It's just pathetic what the Smash scene has turn into. Good riddance.

 

[Sosuke]

Most of the points made in this thread are really sad.

 

[Eddie G]

Lol do some of you people actually enjoy sitting in here all day? I swear I've made multiple visits throughout the day and I see the same people from like...noon yesterday. xD

Sheesh...

 

[Smith]

Most of the points made in this thread are really sad.

Finally something intelligent.

 

[Orion*]

how long until everyone wants to ban ice climbers?

edit: king beef, LOLOLOL. i know. its pathetic

 

[etecoon]

My bad though I thought you were just on some Fiction type sh*t and just wanted MK gone because he beats you, my apologies xD

I thought the fiction was when you argued vehemently for your side, insulting everyone on the other side, but changed your mind as to what side that was every three months

"you're all just random scrubs who want to make the game easier MK isn't broken at all get better"

"you're all just random scrubs that don't know just how broken MK is, fight a real MK"

"I was wrong MK isn't that broken yet but maybe soon!"