Q&A "Everyone Look At Me!" The Marth Video Critique Thread.

[CA420]

what? i dont understand alot of english

 

[shadow1moon]

Just wondering, how well could you critc me fighting a lvl 9 npc?

 

[TemPesT-]

Pro tip #1 play level 1's not 9's.

 

[Diakonos]

Pro tip #1 play level 1's not 9's.

Pro tip #2, play level 5's not 1's.

 

[TemPesT-]

Pro tip #2, play level 5's not 1's.

Pro tip #3, play humans not cpu's.

 

[Diakonos]

Pro tip #3, play humans not cpu's.

Game, set, match! =D

 

[TemPesT-]

Game, set, match! =D

it was a GG

mm?

 

[CA420]

Well then I have some problems
1: What should I fight, Level 1 or Level 9?
2: I don't know anyone that plays smash

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

1. lvl 1, practice your tech skill, movement, combos, ect. DON'T FIGHT THEM, JUST HIT THEM
2. go to regional zones and find someone in your area.

 

[shadow1moon]

1. lvl 1, practice your tech skill, movement, combos, ect. DON'T FIGHT THEM, JUST HIT THEM[/B]
2. go to regional zones and find someone in your area.

what do you mean by that?

 

[Dart!]

he means learn how your moves connect and their hitboxes. don't fight cpus like you would humans. you'll pick up bad habits.

 

[shadow1moon]

Oh, ok.
When my friend comes over i will try and video tape it and post it.

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

When you play against a human you have to worry about their spacing. When you play a cpu you don't have to space them, just make sure you hit them when they walk up to you. Work on your movement and rate of fire.

 

[Diakonos]

it was a GG

mm?

Lol, deal. Are you going to apex?

Else I suggest a ledgecancel or powershielding video no-real-money-at-stake MM.

 

[TemPesT-]

Lol hmm i'll be down for that 2nd idea, i just don't have a recording set up, but i'm sure i can stop over at fluxwolf's sometime and make one

 

[Ryuker]

Euro player here. Here's some matches of mine ^^. Would appreciate it if someone would give me feedback. I feel like I make a lot of dumb spacing mistakes. But sometimes you need to hear it from somebody else before it gets through to you. I'm Joeri ^^

Vs Falco:
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Falco) 1
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (falco) 2

Vs Sheik:
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Sheik) 1
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Sheik) 2
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Sheik) 3

Vs Jiggs (Horrible play by me )
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Jiggs) 1
Joeri(Marth) vs Enig (Jiggs) 2

Thanks in advance ^^
refcode: 1Ryuker1

 

[ScrapMettle]

Euro player here. Here's some matches of mine ^^. Would appreciate it if someone would give me feedback. I feel like I make a lot of dumb spacing mistakes. But sometimes you need to hear it from somebody else before it gets through to you. I'm Joeri ^^

I feel bad that none of the pros have responded yet, so I'll try to give you some help.

Overall stuff- You're pretty good. One thing i don't remember you doing is wavedashing onto the stage from the ledge; you should practice that, since it's Marth's only good way to get on stage over 100%.

Falco stuff- There are some awkward points where you don't follow up a combo, but otherwise you look like you know this matchup pretty well. In the first match though, you let him get back on by fairing him into the stage and letting him tech; instead, every time you jab him below the stage, you should just run off and use your side-b to gimp (it's hard to tech). Note that this doesn't really work on fox.

Sheik stuff- In the first match you get hit by a lot of bairs, but in the later matches you seem to get better at spacing against it. Your edgeguarding in this matchup is really good. When Sheik is above you, but you can't combo her, try to bait her into using her double jump. For example: instead of just jumping up and upairing, try jumping, then double-jumping with an upair to catch her. Once she's used up her jump, you can just juggle her forever and hit her with nair to kill.

Puff stuff- This matchup is tricky. I feel like dashdancing is bad against jiggs, instead I just wavedash around so I can use my tilts and stuff. When you grab jiggs, I like to just throw her right away so she can't di on reaction; if she still dis, you can mix in downthrow to make her di a guessing game. Other than that... don't accidently suicide a stock?

/wall of text

 

[Ryuker]

Thanks a lot for your advice. Really appreciate it.

Overall stuff- You're pretty good. One thing i don't remember you doing is wavedashing onto the stage from the ledge; you should practice that, since it's Marth's only good way to get on stage over 100%.

Oke I'll work on that. I'm hesitant to do it at times cause I can get hit out of it or I might suicide. But I'll practise it.

Falco stuff- There are some awkward points where you don't follow up a combo, but otherwise you look like you know this matchup pretty well. In the first match though, you let him get back on by fairing him into the stage and letting him tech; instead, every time you jab him below the stage, you should just run off and use your side-b to gimp (it's hard to tech). Note that this doesn't really work on fox.

I'll try it. You saw that I did it at the end of the first match cause bair of stage wasn't working. I'll try to learn the timing cause I often end up going of to soon or too late.

Sheik stuff- In the first match you get hit by a lot of bairs, but in the later matches you seem to get better at spacing against it. Your edgeguarding in this matchup is really good. When Sheik is above you, but you can't combo her, try to bait her into using her double jump. For example: instead of just jumping up and upairing, try jumping, then double-jumping with an upair to catch her. Once she's used up her jump, you can just juggle her forever and hit her with nair to kill.

I'll try that. I try it sometimes (faab gave me this tip a few weeks back) but I find that still get hit by her arial when I try to follow up after the second jump.

Puff stuff- This matchup is tricky. I feel like dashdancing is bad against jiggs, instead I just wavedash around so I can use my tilts and stuff. When you grab jiggs, I like to just throw her right away so she can't di on reaction; if she still dis, you can mix in downthrow to make her di a guessing game. Other than that... don't accidently suicide a stock?

Hmm I'll try wavedashing more then dash dancing then. I find dash dancing works to put pressure. But you might be right that it's not giving me as much openings to attack.

 

[Diakonos]

Code: L2FoxDiakonos

There was a tournament in BC on Saturday. I have some videos that I'd like some critique on!

Against Falco:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_PbTruBnOQ

Against FOX:
This is where I'd like some more criticism. I particularly would like to hear about edgeguarding Fox when he's firefoxing above the edge. Anything other kind of advice would be greatly appreciated.

Spoiler

Johns: I was playing with a new controller, and playing against Silent Wolf is more intimidating than you'd think

Against Dieslow:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LMANKodsxgI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMLiM0yu3XA

Against Silent Wolf:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwX_0GIQ_0Y

 

[JBM falcon08]

If they are above the ledge and they go for the sweetspot im pretty sure there is nothing you can do if they are ACTUALLY sweetspotting. Otherwise, you could drop off ledge fair, dtilt, or time fsmash.

If they go above ledge your going to have to position yourself based on where they are, and cover options, or you could just read them

Diakanos Marth sucks on pokemon against Fox! what were you thinking?

 

[booshk]

If they are above the ledge and they go for the sweetspot im pretty sure there is nothing you can do if they are ACTUALLY sweetspotting. Otherwise, you could drop off ledge fair, dtilt, or time fsmash.

If they go above ledge your going to have to position yourself based on where they are, and cover options, or you could just read them

Diakanos Marth sucks on pokemon against Fox! what were you thinking?

yeah manuel, i was wondering why you were counterpicking pokemon as well!
like
i actually wanna know LOL

 

[V3ctorMan]

Ref Code V3man

Kinda just curious but would a Marth playstyle similar to these still be effective in the current metagame maybe? idk... well here if anyone could critique.. Sadly I don't play Marth, I was testing my luck vs the Cape, and was seeing if maybe I should make him an alt, (These are from a while ago), and I'm posting them cuz I never asked for help before, just wanna see if it'd do o.k. in the now metagame. ^^ <3 you guys

vs The Cape (Mario) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_Vd-XffN1k&feature=related
vs The Cape (Bowser) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBvCbga6wKg&feature=related

 

[Diakonos]

I like the combos on PS because I have lots of room to move around and uthrow combos without platforms getting in the way. Butyou're right, I never think about those stage transformations. Fox's dash attack is so **** on uneven ground, whereas my DD grab sucks.

I'll also consider jumping out to fair more often.

Are there percent-specific combos I should try to incorporate into my game?

 

[Metal Reeper]

L2FoxDiakonos

Vs Silent Wolf - My god Silent Wolf is scary, your Marth looked pretty solid against him, he's just too dam fast. The only thing Isaw wrong was that you didn't sweetspot your dolphin slash for recovery. You go a little to high and he punishes you for it every time.

 

[Dart!]

Diakonos you had so many utilts which pushed them off the stage and positioned them perfect for the dair but you didn't do it and opted for fsmash instead >.<

 

[Niko45]

PokeStadium neutral formation is amazing for Marth in all matchups. If you just camp out transformations (or at least be sure to stay out of REALLY bad spots like bottom center of the rock level) Marth does great on PS.

 

[Palpi]

Dart, I do that too. The dair from utilt doesn't click in my mind I guess. I see people do it a lot too, my mind just scream "FSMASH!!!!!!!!!!!!"

 

[Diakonos]

Thanks for the feedback, guys! Anything I can do with my combos besides utilt dair? I'm actually just learning to Cstick (I used Z before for aerials), so since I suck at immediate dair still, I went for the fsmash which is safer.

 

[V3ctorMan]

Ref Code V3man

Kinda just curious but would a Marth playstyle similar to these still be effective in the current metagame maybe? idk... well here if anyone could critique.. Sadly I don't play Marth, I was testing my luck vs the Cape, and was seeing if maybe I should make him an alt, (These are from a while ago), and I'm posting them cuz I never asked for help before, just wanna see if it'd do o.k. in the now metagame. ^^ <3 you guys

vs The Cape (Mario) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_Vd-XffN1k&feature=related
vs The Cape (Bowser) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBvCbga6wKg&feature=related

=(..........................

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

ur marth isn't bad its just weird. play marth more or something.


5 second reply from watching half the vid vs mario XD

 

[Niko45]

Vectorman:

You look like you're getting by on decent general spacing and mind games. Often times it looks like you are still "testing the waters" with Marth's spacing, especially on edgeguards and in general on his combos. Lots of characters absolutely love to go low and DJ sweetspot vs Marth because he is basically going to kill them otherwise. Look actively to steal the ledge right before that, then roll up - > tipper as they are forced to up B on stage. Either that or do a ledgehop nair immediately with invincibility frames as they up B into you to hit them backwards back off stage again.

From combos, the thing to focus most on is Marth's fair and up tilt. Tip fair and non-tip fair have their individual uses and work incredibly well together (treat them like 2 separate moves and play around with reading DI as that will make your combos more extensive and hopefully help you land an fsmash finisher. Up tilt is just an incredibly good move (personal motto - if you're landing up tilts, you're probably winning). It combos into overhead dair kills, fsmash, uairs, fairs, more utilts I mean you name it. Marth has lots of comboing options and its easy to catch people DIing wrong with a surprise fsmash earlier than expected in a combo.

Grab game: Particularly against Mario, but also with almost all non-FFers, get really good at up throwing -> sniping DJ -> death comboing. Marth is a monster with this tactic (and he depends on it against sheik). Just up tilt if you think they won't DJ. Also on floaties like doc/mario/marth/peach/jiggs you can also mix up your fthrow and dthrow to throw off their DI. Them DIing either throw into you can combo into tip fsmash at many different %. In general if you fthrow instantly out of your grabs you can very often catch people freezing up and DIing in, leading to fsmashes (works occasionally on even the best of players, Marth scares people).

Experiment with running crouch dtilt, running crouch fsmash, and WD dtilt. They can extend your combos and also, dtilt in general is probably Marth's safest approach since he can dash right away out of it (dtilt bait, dash away or overshoot their DD dtilt connect, dash grab them immediately).

 

[I.B]

hey guys. i'd appreciate critique on my matches.

I.B (Marth) vs. Unknown522 (Fox) - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5


Unknown522 (Fox) vs. I.B (Marth) - 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10

it's ok if you don't watch them all. preferably, i'd like critique on my matches vs Falco (which would be matches 6 and onwards in the second row of vids I think)

 

[Niko45]

IB, don't even bother. Falco wasn't your problem you took care of it just fine when he first started using it but you lost focus towards the end of the set. Your Marth is amazing and if you play like you did in the first 3/4 of grand finals there aren't too many people I'd bet on against you.

 

[Ryuker]

Refcode:1ryuker2

Some new matches of mine vs Zgetto's falco and Fox. Tried the advice I was given but Zgetto's too good so don't think I was able to put it all into practise. The forward B of stage gimp is definetly helping but I still mess it up a lot. Just something I gotta get used to I think (got better at it this weekend).

I think his shield pressure is the most important thing for me to deal with. It's so fast and I'm constantly in a defensive position. I can't really do the same to him. Amsah told me to wavedash out of shield sooner or just roll away but I find he chases me too fast. Might be that he's just too fast for me right now.

Vs falco:
Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Falco) 1
Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Falco) 2

set 2 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Falco) 1
set 2 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Falco) 2

Vs Fox:
Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 1
Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 2
Set 2 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 1
Set 2 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 2
Set 3 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 1
Set 3 Joeri(Marth) vs Zgetto(Fox) 2

Thanks in advance ^^

 

[I.B]

IB, don't even bother. Falco wasn't your problem you took care of it just fine when he first started using it but you lost focus towards the end of the set. Your Marth is amazing and if you play like you did in the first 3/4 of grand finals there aren't too many people I'd bet on against you.

fine, fair enough lol

 

[Diakonos]

hey guys. i'd appreciate critique on my matches.



it's ok if you don't watch them all. preferably, i'd like critique on my matches vs Falco (which would be matches 6 and onwards in the second row of vids I think)

I'll teach you Falco if you teach me Fox. Friendlies at Apex?

 

[Bob Money]

Hey IB, once again solid marth

use down throw more on falco at mid-high percents to get him to edge of the stage or a free fsmash tech chase to edge guard . this is useful for when your in the middle of the stage and and upthrow would send him on the top platform or side platforms depending on his DI. even though fsmash chase on the platform is very good but the timing is tighter if he reaches that platform faster at higher percents. its a decent mix up at the very least.

work in adding lightshielding into your game.

also have the mindset "early kills, get him to the ledge,put him in a bad spot."
dashing is better vs fox than falco, just wave dash more vs falco in general.
another thing i noticed was you had trouble controlling the distance of your dashes, work on wave dashing after a hit confirm forward air . and walking up /wd tech chases. you dont need to dash to catch tech chases all the time. this is why you never got low percentage fsmashes to punish his techs/mis techs. Overall id say work on fitting in fsmashes and ftilts into your game/techchases.. once you do that you will see falco dieing alot faster.

 

[I.B]

good ****, thanks Bob

@diakonos: sounds like a plan

 

[_Rocky_]

I'll post this here as well:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=282053

 

[Tee ay eye]

imadh,

i didn't really watch your matches with intentions to critique (and i actually only watched set 3 so far)

but you seemed to throw out a lot of really pre-emptive f-smashes assuming they'd roll/tech into them

idk if it was because of nerves, lack of focus, or extreme ballsy confidence, but i remember myself feeling pain when i saw you miss >__>