Common Knowledge that isn't so common..

[Blackrider213]

If Peach accidentally does her parasol backwards when trying to grab an edge, she can drop the parasol and grab the edge. This makes her the only character that can miss the edge doing her recovery backwards unless inputting another command.

Not quite accurate. Dedede is the other character that must input another command to grab the ledge from his Up B from any direction.

-Unlike in Melee, Ness is not helpless when absorbing something with PSI magnet; the absorption animation on PSI magnet gives Ness all of the same options as he would have out-of-shield (jump, roll, spot-dodge). This also cancels the ending lag on PSI magnet.

Doesn't this effect also apply to Lucas, Fox and Wolf? I know Lucas for sure, but I'm not positive on Fox and Wolf.

If you footstool Snake while he is recovering with Cypher, it causes him to regain his Up B.

Without any other input, Samus' zair can spontaneously not grab the ledge when it supposed to. This happens even if the zair has not decayed. In other words, the ledge grab limit of three has not been exceeded. This situation may have to do something with momentum.

 

[UTDZac]

Actually, the answer is super simple.


The way decay works depends on the number of input you do that hit.

If you got 1 input but 20 hits, its still 1 move. If you do 25 input but only 4 hits, you get 4 move of decay. This is why every pummel is +1 on the list.

I told you it wasn't that simple =P

If the move hits once, then it will restore at most one decay.
If the move hits multiple times and required a new input for each hit (Marth's Dancing Blade), then it will restore one decay per hit.
If the move hits multiple times with only one input for all hits (G&W's bair, MK's tornado), it's possible to restore more than one decay.

If you hit with the first and last hit of G&W's bair, it counts twice. Same goes for Snake's dair. Why? The hits were so far apart, the game counted them as "nonconsecutive." You can go into Training Mode and watch the consecutive hit counter. If G&W's bair hits all five times you see it show "5" and you'll only get one decay back. If it hits only the first and last times, the counter will show "1" because the hits weren't close enough to be considered a combo and therefore count as two separate attacks for decay.

Again, it's still not as simple as I've described above. When a character grabs someone and pummels them, you get one decay back. If you continue to pummel as fast as possible, you won't get any more decay back because the hits are too close to each other. But if you delay the pummels enough, it will count as multiple attacks and will restore multiple decay.

 

[Psychoace]

Without any other input, Samus' zair can spontaneously not grab the ledge when it supposed to. May have to do something with momentum.

I think that has to do with decay, if we're talking about the same thing. She can only grab the ledge with her zair like 4 or 5 times and then it will no longer grab the edge unless she touches the ground once more.

 

[Blackrider213]

I think that has to do with decay, if we're talking about the same thing. She can only grab the ledge with her zair like 4 or 5 times and then it will no longer grab the edge unless she touches the ground once more.

Dang, I always assume that people know what I talk about. In this case, I assumed that people knew that the ledge grab limit wasn't exceeded.

To make it clear, the zair has not decayed. In other words, the ledge grab limit of three has not been exceeded.

Snake's cypher explodes if you pull a second one before the first one goes offscreen. I actually have no clue if it does knockback/damage or not though until my wii's lens reader gets fixed. Someone test that for me plz.

I don't think it does any knockback or damage. The way I did it was going to training and going to Hyrule Temple. I had Snake go into the cave and some other character go above ground directly above Snake. I cyphered, landed on floor, and the cyphered again until the cypher exploded as close as it could to the other character. I even set it at 1/4 speed to get the most accurate timing.

Though cypher does explode, the explosion doesn't really seem to do anything. It is somewhat difficult to test, even on 1/4 speed, but I think it doesn't do anything.

On a related note, cypher is not reflectable.

More stuff: Game and Watch's throw speed is dependent on opposing character's weight.

 

[GwJ]

Zair won't grab the ledge if she's done it 3 times already. After that she'll whiff a grab. Range affects it too. At some point, Samus will try and reach it, but it won't grab, and if you're too close, she'll just....bleh.

 

[Blackrider213]

Everyone knows that every tether character will whiff a grab after the third successful ledge tether or zair. It's the second situation which makes me curious. I feel like it applies to Samus the most. Even though you are in range, why would it whiff?

On topic: Pit can "cape" characters using his mirror shield by timing it right.

 

[Espy Rose]

For Sonic:

Sonic's sideB gains the properties and characteristics of his downB after it has rolled off of the platform he is on. This means that he can cancel his sideB with a shield if he lands on another platform, and hit multiple times on the drop off of the first platform. This is because after the initial hop from his sideB, the roll animation is treated as the exact same move as Sonic's downB.

Meaning Sonic's downB and sideB are, give or take, the exact same move.

 

[zeldspazz]

Dunno if this is known, but if you crouch, tilt the analog stick down diagonally in the opposite direction you are facing, and press whatever button is set to attack (probably A) you jab for some reason.

Idk if its useful but it seems weird to me lol

 

[Ripple]

Dunno if this is known, but if you crouch, tilt the analog stick down diagonally in the opposite direction you are facing, and press whatever button is set to attack (probably A) you jab for some reason.

Idk if its useful but it seems weird to me lol

that was the best way to jab cancel in melee

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

Holding pikachu's jab on a pillar or a person will refresh completely. YOu do not need to stop in between each jab.

 

[UTDZac]

Holding pikachu's jab on a pillar or a person will refresh completely. YOu do not need to stop in between each jab.

I highly doubt this is true. I won't believe it until you test it.

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

I highly doubt this is true. I won't believe it until you test it.

I have tested it before >_>

 

[CaliburChamp]

When Pit walks and F-smashes he gets more range to his F-smash, than a stutter stepped F-smash. This is because Pit's walk makes him slide more than his dash.

 

[Gea]

More stuff: Game and Watch's throw speed is dependent opposing character's weight.

This is true for everyone.

 

[Brado]

I don'r think that anybody has found/seen this before, but sorry if it's already mentioned.

I'm unsure on the timings but if Mario capes when Olimar grabs him, Olimar can be facing away from Mario whilst grabbing him and can perform all his grab attacks. This looks pretty cool, but has no real use.

 

[Blackrider213]

Sorry, I didn't really describe the situation too well. Throw speed is not totally accurate wording. I meant that Game and Watch's throwing animation (when he juggles them) is dependent on the weight of the opposing character. For example, check out the speed when he throws Dedede or Bowser, and then the speed when throwing Jigglypuff or Kirby.

So, the most accurate statement is that Game and Watch's throwing animation varies due to opposing character's weight.

 

[Poltergust]

The rolling threat just reminded me of something else about Yoshi. When Yoshi's shield is hit and he rolls immediately afterwards, he would roll a different distance than normal. For example, if he just shielded Ike's f-smash and rolls back, he would roll very far, and may go over a ledge. On the other hand, if he rolls forward he would just roll in place.

 

[Acex27]

Common Knowledge: Fox can cancel his illusion to shorten it

Not So Common Knowledge: Fox can cancel his illusion to lengthen it, which also causes him to regain aerial mobility back earlier.

 

[GimR]

Short hopping gives you 2 frames of landing lag. Fastfalling, double jumping, or landing from a higher height gives you 4 iirc.

this is actually incorrect. How fast you fall determines your landing lag. the top of your jump and a short time after cause you to fall softly


that's why you fall so softly during a short hop because your so close to the ground.


If you drop from the ledge and double jump so you land on the stage at the top of you jump you'll actually only have 2 landing lag frames.

If you do that and air dodge at the right time and then roll right when you land on the stage your opponent only has 2 frames to punish you which is really hard to do.



also if you double jump air dodge onto a platform so you land at the top of your jump you'll only have 2 frames of landing lag.


Just thought I'd give the heads up

 

[Zori]

Olimars downtilt is the best move in the game


Fact.

 

[demonictoonlink]

Olimar's downtilt is a great mixup option and has combo potential.

Fact.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Olimar's downtilt is a great mixup option and has combo potential.

Fact.

*breaks fact chain*

Hey, I can now tell Underload I found a post of DemonicToonLink

I wonder if I should post info regarding grab releases... I know many people that do not understand the principals of it. *searches for traces of grab release stuff*

 

[bobson]

Sorry, I didn't really describe the situation too well. Throw speed is not totally accurate wording. I meant that Game and Watch's throwing animation (when he juggles them) is dependent on the weight of the opposing character. For example, check out the speed when he throws Dedede or Bowser, and then the speed when throwing Jigglypuff or Kirby.

Yes, this is true for everyone.

 

[Blackrider213]

Did a quick test and you're right. I was just too hasty saying that Game and Watch is the only character whose throw speed depends on opposing character's weight. Should have tested extensively before making that conclusion.

 

[Yumewomiteru]

*breaks fact chain*

Hey, I can now tell Underload I found a post of DemonicToonLink

I wonder if I should post info regarding grab releases... I know many people that do not understand the principals of it. *searches for traces of grab release stuff*

Theres a good amount of grab release stuff lying around, Susa has a thread in the tactics board regarding air release and what you can do to them. And I remember seeing a thread on the frame data regarding grab releases, though I cant remember where I have seen it, but quick summary:

Most chars have 30 frames of ground grab released lag
Ness and Lucas has 40
DK has 20
Jiggs has29

I think thats it, but I probly missed something, if someone can find that thread that would be grate.

 

[Masky]

..........

 

[Suntan Luigi]

Ice is awesome, want to know why? Initiate a dash, and almost immediatly after doing that press and hold A while still holding the control stick to the side. If you did it right your character will slide a good distance while charging that forward smash. For some it makes a great surprise approach; although I haven't tested this tech very much it does seem very handy for G&W.

You can also use this as an awsome tech chaser, especially if you're DDD.

It's also possible to charge your f-smash while sliding backwards too, all you need to for that is perform a stutter-step smash with the C-stick and hold the Z button down. You can punish dash attacks and other attacks, plus it looks too good.

EDIT: Unrelated, but I also heard that it's possible to control Diddy's rocketbarrel pack once it's off his back?
EDIT2: Fixed hypen smash, should instead be stutter step

 

[Blackrider213]

I really doubt you could control Diddy's rocketbarrel pack if it gets off. However, if this happened to be true, it could explain why people (including me) think that the barrels seem to home in.

 

[da K.I.D.]

Ice is awesome, want to know why? Initiate a dash, and almost immediatly after doing that press and hold A while still holding the control stick to the side. If you did it right your character will slide a good distance while charging that forward smash. For some it makes a great surprise approach; although I haven't tested this tech very much it does seem very handy for G&W.

You can also use this as an awsome tech chaser, especially if you're DDD.

It's also possible to charge your f-smash while sliding backwards too, all you need to for that is perform a hyphen smash with the C-stick and hold the Z button down. You can punish dash attacks and other attacks, plus it looks too good.

tl;dr. ice makes you slide when you stutterstep smash attacks.

thats actually really cool, and I never thought of that.

EDIT: Unrelated, but I also heard that it's possible to control Diddy's rocketbarrel pack once it's off his back?

the player can not control it, but it can home in on the opponent.similarly to sonics homing attack, the player has no control after the move has been initiated, but it does target characters on the screen.

 

[Blackrider213]

I forgot if I already asked about this in this thread (I think I did), but once again, is there concrete proof of the rocketbarrel homing in? Like some concrete way to test? Maybe I should just conform or whatever.

 

[da K.I.D.]

ask ninjalink

 

[teluoborg]

It's random. Just make Diddy UpB into a bumper and you'll see.

 

[Blackrider213]

Hmm, conflicting sides. Ninjalink is a definite pro at Diddy Kong, so he would know all about Diddy Kong, inside and out. However, there is possible way to test this consistently. Not sure which one I want to believe. I'm going to stop talking about this subject.

 

[Hobs]

Sorta on the Diddy topic.

Video
Thread

In short, you kinda RAR the up-b.

 

[Psychoace]

When olimar is floating in the water all of his pikmin will die, except the blue ones.

 

[Sorto]

if olimar pivot grabs (perhaps even dash grabs) on ice and grabs the opponent, olimar can continue to slide. the pikmin will not bring the opponent back to olimar (i assume it has a set retracting distance) and instead olimar can pummel and thow the opponent from across the stage. i know in pkmon stadium 2 i got the grab at the edge and slid to the center of the stage. i was at the center in my grab animation and my pikmin was all the way at the edge pummeling. kinda useless but it looks cool.

 

[Sorto]

if ganon is at the edge of final d, smashville, most stages, and down b's/ganon kicks towards the stage. The ending animation will look like he is doing an aerial roll. It has very little lag and he can wait a split second and attack out of it or jump and do an aerial out of it or super jump and reach a height close to lucases zap jump. Super jump is done by jumping and down bing during ganons strange aerial roll animation i described earlier.

 

[da K.I.D.]

in order to knock snake out of his cypher you have to hit him with a move that contains 1 hit that does at least 7% damage.

 

[Fire!]

When Mario capes someone, they gain invincibility frames for a moment.

 

[Laos Oman]

Pokémon Trainer
- Fatigue will continue to build up after your Pokémon begins to show signs of it, gradually decreasing your knockback to 70%.
- If your Pokémon is KO'd, its fatigue will be at 0 much sooner than it would if switched out manually.
- The Water-Grass-Fire triangle exists in-game, but only affects knockback.
- The line upon switching out a Pokémon with Pokémon Change depends on how many KOs the previous Pokémon made. The line when the Pokémon enters depends on how much damage the opponent has.

Squirtle
- Water Gun can not only push back enemies, but also stop projectiles.
- Getting jumped on during Withdraw leaves you wiggling helplessly on your back.
- Squirtle is agressively cute.

Ivysaur
- While b-air has heavenly range, it does very little damage.
- The sweetspot on d-air is the bulb before it bursts open, not the actual burst. It's a fairly strong Meteor Smash.
- Vine Whip has a sweetspot when not used for tethering. Edgeguarding with it kills about as early as u-smash.

Charizard
- Rock Smash can be reflected. It hurts.
- Fly has super armour in its early frames, making it a very good counter against edgeguarding.
- Your f-tilt, n-air and b-air have a sweetspot on the burning part of Charizard's tail.