Brawl+ - Official 5.0 RC1 Build is now online! (Re-Use Autoupdater, Snake bug fixed)

[Finns7]

I had trouble with the updater I hope the tedownlaod one works

 

[Skip2MaLoo]

falcon doesn't need a better up b. stop being stupid. lol.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Sheik, biologically, is a girl (supposedly). But her persona is a guy.

She didn't decrease her "bust size", she wears a thing that flattens her frontside. amazonian women hunters wear this sort of thing.

 

[Mattnumbers]

falcon doesn't need a better up b. stop being stupid. lol.

Then why did they give him one in the latest nightly?

 

[SymphonicSage12]

the increase in KBG isn't that bad. it still doesn't kill well. and who actually tries to land an up b on someone offensively? lol

 

[Mattnumbers]

the increase in KBG isn't that bad. it still doesn't kill well. and who actually tries to land an up b on someone offensively? lol

I think its to make it easier for Falcon to recover since they get knocked further back and can't edge guard him again.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

I think the slight increase in up-b knockback growth was to make it so he doesn't get punished for landing it? I think I recall someone complaining about that a LONG while ago... (But then again, increasing base knockback instead of growth would be better for that purpose...)
And I actually recall watching a match where someone would constantly trying to combo his opponent off the stage and finish with an up-b kill. He succeeded...half the time...as he also SDed three times that match. XD But to answer that question: whoever that guy was...he uses it offensively...

Oh, and since I haven't said anything about the latest nightly, I'll just say something brief...
The newest nightly...is sexy! (And it's good to see that Ganondorf and now ledge-hop without having to do an aerial...)

 

[Magus420]

The up-B was 'buffed' over a month ago. It wasn't applied to the correct grab box however, and was changed to the correct one when we ported him into PSA. The changelist notes those new numbers applied.

You can finish some combos with up-B when they go too high/you already double jumped. It's nothing like 64, but it's not bad.

 

[Kuga]

Why Sakurai put a hitbox on tip of Ganon Utilt,VERTICAL KB and VERY WEAK,WHY SAKURAI?WHY?
btw,this can be change,like making it only one hitbox(they stronger one)

 

[JCaesar]

Sheik, biologically, is a girl (supposedly). But her persona is a guy.

She didn't decrease her "bust size", she wears a thing that flattens her frontside. amazonian women hunters wear this sort of thing.

No, Amazons actually cut off their breasts so they could use a bow easier. The Greek word "Amazon" literally means "breast-less." Little history lesson for ya

On topic: People need to stop using wifi as justification for, well, anything. Zelda being good online or her up-B being unpunishable or whatever, it doesn't matter and it should not be taken into account whatsoever when balancing characters.

 

[stingers]

A Ness killed me on Wifi once, he should be nerfed...

 

[SymphonicSage12]

ganon's utilt has a seperate tip hitbox? Really? I never knew that. I agree that it should be stronger, but the trajectory should be vertical to make it unique from the other hitboxes. maybe have a little lower KBG and BKB to compensate .

 

[SymphonicSage12]

well sheik is still biologically a girl IMO.


Anyways, sorry for double post, and yes, WMN. aka WIFI MEANS NOTHING

 

[Finns7]

Others brought that into the zelda discussion im saying in all aspects bthrow isnt needed for her to be viable, all I asked about the upb were if the hitbox was included in the 20 frames.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

I like her strong bthrow, but it shouldn't be stronger than ness's, which it is. @_@
at least, it feels like it for me.

 

[Mattnumbers]

I didn't say Wifi mattered, I just said that there are some ways that zelda can cope with defensive playstyles, which I have personally come across while playing online.

I understand that they are far less effective offline but I misjudged how much lag her UpB had and thought that it must still be effective when transitioned offline.

 

[jalued]

No, Amazons actually cut off their breasts so they could use a bow easier. The Greek word "Amazon" literally means "breast-less." Little history lesson for ya

.

actually it was just their right breast that they would cut off, so that drawing a bow was easier and they were more accurate

 

[RyokoYaksa]

Zelda's bthrow is similar to Ness's, but not really stronger.
Ridiculously powerful Uthrow-uair KO removed, fairly normal % killing bthrow put in its place. Matter of compensation, and still actually a nerf in the long run.

 

[jalued]

Zelda's bthrow is similar to Ness's, but not really stronger.
Ridiculously powerful Uthrow-uair KO removed, fairly normal % killing bthrow put in its place. Matter of compensation, and still actually a nerf in the long run.

sounds good to me, that upthrow -> upair combo was lame

 

[Finns7]

You can call it that -_-, I dont think its needed, what did zelda have to compensate for fair buff a while back?

 

[GameSystem]

You misread what I said. Zelda's boobs get bigger when she goes Sheik.

Edit: Stingers, you sandbag so bad online. That allows anyone to beat you. Everyone should be nerfed.

 

[Skip2MaLoo]

Then why did they give him one in the latest nightly?

god knows. but he doesnt need it. the only thing i do agree with falcons upb is the momentum change with it.

 

[comboking]

I tried this out it is awesome.

 

[Perfect Chaos]

Would it be worth it to make Link and Toon Link always stay in the Wait1 animation using PSA (I'm pretty sure it's possible, just wondering if it'll be worth it)? That way, the character won't randomly go into Wait2/Wait3 when you're trying to block projectiles. For instance: it'll be dumb if a Samus smash-missile is coming at you, and Link just goes into Wait2/Wait3 right before it reaches you, when you are expecting to block it by standing still (in this case, staying crouched is not an option, due to that not blocking the missile). It's not completely necessary (thus why I'm questioning if it'll be worth it to change it or not), but it's something to think about.

Also, on a related note, is it possible for PSA to add the shield "hurtbox" while Link and Toon Link is in the WalkSlow animation? Unlike their WalkMiddle and WalkFast animations, they keep their shield in front of them during WalkSlow. This would allow them to slowly approach certain spammers more easily.

 

[MK26]

Ganondorf's jab is ****ing ridiculous...as marth, dying at 100 from the middle of FD because you cant recover unless you DI like a madman...and dont spew that bull about it having ridiculous endlag, because according to the frame speed mods, what was originally a 35 frame move that came out on frame 7 now comes out on frame 2 and ends at 12. It's almost got an advantage on shield hit. Absolutely ridiculous. Give Ganon a GTFO move, sure, but not the best one in the ****ing game.

Also, canceling a utilt into a utilt is fkn jkz.

 

[PKNintendo]

Ganondorf's jab is ****ing ridiculous...as marth, dying at 100 from the middle of FD because you cant recover unless you DI like a madman...and dont spew that bull about it having ridiculous endlag, because according to the frame speed mods, what was originally a 35 frame move that came out on frame 7 now comes out on frame 2 and ends at 12. It's almost got an advantage on shield hit. Absolutely ridiculous. Give Ganon a GTFO move, sure, but not the best one in the ****ing game.

Also, canceling a utilt into a utilt is fkn jkz.

Don't use Marth.
LOL, I've always wanted to say that.

=/ Can't give an opinion here.

 

[Shell]

Jab comes out on 3 through 5 (frame engine sees frame 1 as "0"), and is IASA on 22. It was IASA on 19 in Melee, and I don't believe it's power has noticeably increased or decreased since then. Why did I never hear a soul complaining about it then...?

Also, it's far from the best GTFO move in the game. Most non-sword characters have jabs that are either on frames 1 or 2. Frame 3 is almost slow by jab standards. It only seems fast because it's the fastest thing he has. Also consider that fact that he lacks a protective u-tilt to cover above him and behind him. This is absolutely huge. Bowser, DK, DDD, ROB would all be devastated by the loss of their U-tilts. Ganon just deals with it.

Multi-hit jabs are also far more useful. Take Ike's jab combo -- by canceling it after the first jab(s) you can lead into other moves, such as grabs. You and I both know how much a grab is worth. Way more than a (questionable) death at 100 due to poor DI.

Mario's jab, also, can be IASA frame 16 just to put the endlag into perspective.

I'm sorry, but you're way off on this issue.

(U-tilt does indeed look lulzy -- if you have constructive feedback I'd love to hear it.)

 

[MK26]

EDIT: scratch that. My mistake.

 

[Shell]

@22 is 0.5x not 2x.

I coded that myself and then checked it with Frame Advance.

 

[stingers]

...ROB would all be devastated by the loss of their U-tilts.

...

please dont talk about ROB ever again >.>

 

[The Cape]

Wait wait.

A jab that KOs somewhere over 150 is better than a move thats invincibile for the first 5 frames (til the hitbox) that KOs at 130?

ARoo?

 

[stingers]

Wait wait.

A jab that KOs somewhere over 150 is better than a move thats invincibile for the first 5 frames (til the hitbox) that KOs at 130?

ARoo?

are you talking about marths up b?

please say no

 

[MK26]

@22 is 0.5x not 2x.

I coded that myself and then checked it with Frame Advance.

Yeah, yeah, I caught myself. Check the edit time on my last post.

Regardless, It's still a ridiculous move.

Also, re utilt, perhaps make it go in to some sort of lag if you cancel it early? like landing lag or something? Canceling it during teh hibox is ridiculously lulzy atm.

Also, while i'm at it, get rid of dorf's down-b jump recovery. Same with yoshi and side-b. No helpless is fine, but regaining the jump? iunno.

EDIT: you cant really compare Mario's jab to Ganon's jab, seeing as how one is the first hit of a jab combo and the other is a second ftilt that we sped up to be as fast as a jab.

EDITEDIT: grounded shine is definitely a true combo into usmash. That's without jump-canceling it. Is taht a problem?

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Yeah, yeah, I caught myself. Check the edit time on my last post.

Regardless, It's still a ridiculous move.

Also, re utilt, perhaps make it go in to some sort of lag if you cancel it early? like landing lag or something? Canceling it during teh hibox is ridiculously lulzy atm.

Also, while i'm at it, get rid of dorf's down-b jump recovery. Same with yoshi and side-b. No helpless is fine, but regaining the jump? iunno.

EDIT: you cant really compare Mario's jab to Ganon's jab, seeing as how one is the first hit of a jab combo and the other is a second ftilt that we sped up to be as fast as a jab.

Jab is not a ridiculous move. it's still punishable.

Utilt is fine. the hitbox doesn't come ou until frame 89, and who doesn't like lulzy stuff.

WHY THE HELL GET RID OF THE DOWN B JUMP? He had it in melee, it was fine. Get over it.

AND YOSHI'S? WTF WHY DO YOU LIKE NERFING STUFF SO MUCH

 

[cAm8ooo]

I would support a small global speed increase for the game if it didn't mean a complete rework of all frame speed changes that have been made (which im sure it would). I would just personally love it if the game was a little faster.

 

[MK26]

I just think stuff deserves to be nerfed. Stupid stuff like recovering your jump by performing a laggy special off-stage. Stuff like characters whose names start with M and end with eta Knight. We've been continually making stiff better and better, but where does it stop? Why do we have double standards, where those characters that were weak are only buffed to teh point of viability, and those that were 2gud are nerfed just a smidge, even though they definitely can get cut down to size?

Also, I'll admit the SSS is more trouble than it's worth. However, once we go Gold and aren't hassled by constant codeset changes, I think we should reconsider implementing it.

 

[Mattnumbers]

Stuff like characters whose names start with M and end with eta Knight. We've been continually making stiff better and better, but where does it stop? Why do we have double standards, where those characters that were weak are only buffed to teh point of viability, and those that were 2gud are nerfed just a smidge, even though they definitely can get cut down to size?

Quoted for Truth

 

[grim mouser]

EDITEDIT: grounded shine is definitely a true combo into usmash. That's without jump-canceling it. Is taht a problem?

O.o Seriously?

I can't even combo into u-smash WITH JCing the shine (slow fingers).

 

[Deleted member]

Some glitches I found:

Jigglypuff: if you're on the ledge and you do a horizontal side-b, you will automatically snap to the ledge when you aren't really close to the ledge (in b+ standards, at least.)

Ganondorf: you can cancel his up-tilt after the move finished. so that means explosion -> jab instantly. is that intended? i know he has IASA frames on that move now but still.

 

[SymphonicSage12]

jigglypuff thing isn't a glitch.


and the ganondorf thing is intended.