Brawl Information Compendium & Social

[culexus・wau]

Maybe you could set a unused shoulder button to special so that you could combine it with immediate forward on C-stick to wavebounce, but I'm not sure if it's gonna help at all.

And you should totally play Touhou.

but then I'll sideB

The problem isn't me hitting the B button

its the control stick motion.

lol

 

[Kitamerby]

Does using an attack button instead of grab make the timing less strict when you dacus/dacit etc? I know it's the only way to do sheik's (well, MUCH easier at least). Would that extend to other characters as well?

No, the timing is the same regardless of what the attack input is.

its the control stick motion.

Then the only thing you CAN do is practice.

 

[teluoborg]

but then I'll sideB

The problem isn't me hitting the B button

its the control stick motion.

lol

Not if you have the right timing (hitting Cstick after hitting the "B" button).
And it actually takes the last part of the control stick motion (since you're doing it with the C stick).

 

[Tesh]

How is tripping calculated for the 1%? Is it like 1 trip out of 100 feet ran (distance), 1 trip out of 100 steps taken, 1 trip out of 100 seconds spent running (time)?

If I run across FD with Jigglypuff and Sonic, did I have more of a chance of tripping with Jiggly due to more time spent running?

If I run across FD, how many "chances" did I have to trip?

 

[teluoborg]

Every time you start a dash (or a pivot) you have a 1% chance of tripping. 2 if you're Luigi.

 

[Kitamerby]

You can't trip in the middle of a full sprint. Only at the start/during a pivot.

 

[MysteriousSilver]

Does Pit have a useful boost grab and I'm just ******* it up horribly? What characters gain a noticeable distance from their boost grab?

 

[Ussi]

Is it possible to do a reverse DACUS so that you're sliding doing the usmash backwards? My friend and I were wondering cause that'd be hilarious to watch Snake in particular doing it.

 

[rPSIvysaur]

Is it possible to do a reverse DACUS so that you're sliding doing the usmash backwards? My friend and I were wondering cause that'd be hilarious to watch Snake in particular doing it.

No. The normal reverse up-smash is actually a RARJCUp-smash. Or in easier to understand terms, a reverse aerial rushed jump canceling up-smash. Since during a DACUS there is no RAR or even jump, it is impossible to do to a reverse DACUS.

 

[Gadiel_VaStar]

Does Pit have a useful boost grab and I'm just ******* it up horribly? What characters gain a noticeable distance from their boost grab?

^^^^
This

How does one perform the boost grab?

 

[fatalsolid01]

Can someone explain how to correctly quarter circle di and its uses? Also is it true it can help you avoid blastzones?

 

[-Cross-]

Can somebody explain to me the concept of shield DI?

Quarter circle DI is the method of SDI back in melee days introduced to America by Captain Jack (a japanese melee player). Since directions are constantly inputted by the control stick without having to return it to the center (unlike the c-stick) by rotating the control stick back and forth between say the NE and SE boundaries you get maximum SDI to the left faster by inputting three directions toward the left, one down and one up. Thus giving you max SDI in a single direction in a very quick motion.

SDI will help you avoid blastzones in the sense that they alter you starting point before knockback takes place, but once you are sent flying SDI doesn`t do anything. Once you`re flying all that really matters is your character`s momentum cancel.

That being said somebody please explain Shield DI, which I have seen used very sparingly. I`m guessing it is simply the ability to control the shield`s location but then I read something like this and don`t understand what it is

If we're close enough and if we mastered shield DI we can grab you out of your first FTilt.

I`m probably over complicating it but is it just the fact that being closer to the ftilt`s hitbox with the shield allows you to shield grab with more success?

 

[theunabletable]

Shield DI is when you SDI while inside your shield, in hitlag frames.

 

[Sharky]

continuing from above, once hit, your shield will slide according to you SDI, then it will do regular shield slide from being hit. so it's just like regular SDI but with shield slide

 

[fatalsolid01]

Quarter circle DI is the method of SDI back in melee days introduced to America by Captain Jack (a japanese melee player). Since directions are constantly inputted by the control stick without having to return it to the center (unlike the c-stick) by rotating the control stick back and forth between say the NE and SE boundaries you get maximum SDI to the left faster by inputting three directions toward the left, one down and one up. Thus giving you max SDI in a single direction in a very quick motion.

SDI will help you avoid blastzones in the sense that they alter you starting point before knockback takes place, but once you are sent flying SDI doesn`t do anything. Once you`re flying all that really matters is your character`s momentum cancel.

Thanks for the info on this. But are you sure it doesn't help you avoid blastzones because I remember watching a video called "How to Di as Snake" mentioning how it helps you avoid both the top and corner blast zone to survive while momentum cancelling.

 

[uhmuzing]

"Smash School" by Vrael
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=243706
A thread aimed at newer players. This thread gets new players in contact with people whom can 'teach' them about the character they would like to learn.

I think the latest update to that mentor thread in the SWF Info Center makes this obsolete. Perhaps a link to it should be put up in place of this.

 

[Vyse]

I keep meaning to go through this thread and updating the OP, but I've been putting it off for some reason : /

I'll do it soon.

 

[Kitamerby]

Thanks for the info on this. But are you sure it doesn't help you avoid blastzones because I remember watching a video called "How to Di as Snake" mentioning how it helps you avoid both the top and corner blast zone to survive while momentum cancelling.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyEa_zUXjp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND-yi3IPKXM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgDF4YyFUBI

Yeah it helps.

 

[fatalsolid01]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyEa_zUXjp8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND-yi3IPKXM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgDF4YyFUBI

Yeah it helps.

I actually ran across these videos before but didn't watch them because of the misleading titles. So thanks.

 

[-Cross-]

Thanks for the info on this. But are you sure it doesn't help you avoid blastzones because I remember watching a video called "How to Di as Snake" mentioning how it helps you avoid both the top and corner blast zone to survive while momentum cancelling.

Like I said it helps you avoid blast zones by changing the position from where you fly from, Mr. Doom`s SDI video shows the same thing. But once you are flying the only thing that helps you avoid blastzones is your DI (which is different from SDI) and you fast fall speed, because these two options will affect your trajectory while you are flying in the air. I think you misinterpretated SDI as regular DI from the "How to DI as Snake" Video.

@Sharky, so I guess that means the window is very small for SDI`ing in your shield? Are the benefits worth practicing this technique or is the risk of accidentally rolling while trying to shield DI too high?

 

[Yikarur]

or is the risk of accidentally rolling while trying to shield DI too high?

I would say the chance on multi hit moves is too high for Shield DI but theoretically you can practice everything. I'll just take time.

 

[fatalsolid01]

Like I said it helps you avoid blast zones by changing the position from where you fly from, Mr. Doom`s SDI video shows the same thing. But once you are flying the only thing that helps you avoid blastzones is your DI (which is different from SDI) and you fast fall speed, because these two options will affect your trajectory while you are flying in the air. I think you misinterpretated SDI as regular DI from the "How to DI as Snake" Video.

Well in the "How to Di as snake" video he slowed down the steps to show what he did(hit from a Marth F-smash), and basically he said that after the D-air(while airborne) he used to momentum cancel he used quarter circle Di(while airborne) to avoid the blastzones and it apparantly worked as the quarter circle Di allowed him to live at the percent he was at while just holding up/left and momentum cancelling didnt. I was just curios to see if perhaps any high level players(maybe ally) who seem to live for longer than usual use this. Sorry if I assumed you searched and watched the video last time but I can't give links on phone.

 

[-Jedi-]

Is there anybody around here that capable of finding out frame data and willing to lend a hand? The Link boards over on AiB are in need of Link's shield advantage data on all of his moves and don't have anybody capable of getting them.

 

[Kitamerby]

Well in the "How to Di as snake" video he slowed down the steps to show what he did(hit from a Marth F-smash), and basically he said that after the D-air(while airborne) he used to momentum cancel he used quarter circle Di(while airborne) to avoid the blastzones and it apparantly worked as the quarter circle Di allowed him to live at the percent he was at while just holding up/left and momentum cancelling didnt. I was just curios to see if perhaps any high level players(maybe ally) who seem to live for longer than usual use this. Sorry if I assumed you searched and watched the video last time but I can't give links on phone.

WTF.

QCDI is for smash DI.

You can't Smash DI Marths' fsmash, so how the hell would it help? O_o

 

[Enzo]

DI'ing i know theres different types of DIing like Diing opposite of knockback and out of pikachu's dsmash, or out of a tornado, can any1 tell me how to Di from these 3 things,
thanks,

 

[Yikarur]

you can't SDI out of Tornado you should just hold the stick in either the center (so that you can escape above) or in the direction where MK doesn't travel to, but MK can chase this. You can DI out of Pikas dsmash with just holding up or smashing the stick up or rotating the stick in the upper corners + mashing c-stick up, it's so easy to DI out of Pikas dsmash there are tons of possibilities.
I don't know what you mean with "DIing opposite of knockback"

 

[YagamiLight]

I was thinking about some aspects of the initial dash and was wondering if someone could possibly answer some (or, hopefully, all) of the following questions:

1) How long does it take for the initial dash animation to turn into the top speed animation?

2) What can a character do during the initial dash animation that cannot be done during the top speed animation?

3) Is it a viable strategy (for characters who have faster dash speeds than top speeds) to continuously reset the initial dash animation to gain speed (or, rather, to not lose speed)? [This disregards the extra tripping risk]

4) If the above is true, how soon can the second initial dash follow the first? Can it be done whenever?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Yikarur]

I was thinking about some aspects of the initial dash and was wondering if someone could possibly answer some (or, hopefully, all) of the following questions:

1) How long does it take for the initial dash animation to turn into the top speed animation?
Character depending.


2) What can a character do during the initial dash animation that cannot be done during the top speed animation?
puh.. also you can only dash dance during that and empty pivot can only be done in that initinal dash frames but that kind of "initial frames" are different from the initial dash animation at all.

3) Is it a viable strategy (for characters who have faster dash speeds than top speeds) to continuously reset the initial dash animation to gain speed (or, rather, to not lose speed)? [This disregards the extra tripping risk]

well the positives about doing like that that you can do everything after the dash while you have to stop/jump at top speed running for doing jabs/other stuff, I don't know about Movment Speed, could be but never tested it myself.

4) If the above is true, how soon can the second initial dash follow the first? Can it be done whenever?

again, character depending, but you can buffer the second dash by dash, stick neutral, dash

Thanks in advance.

you can see how long a characters dash lasts by dashing + holding shield, you can't shield in your dash animation but your character shields instantly when he switches from dash to run.

 

[Enzo]

you can't SDI out of Tornado you should just hold the stick in either the center (so that you can escape above) or in the direction where MK doesn't travel to, but MK can chase this. You can DI out of Pikas dsmash with just holding up or smashing the stick up or rotating the stick in the upper corners + mashing c-stick up, it's so easy to DI out of Pikas dsmash there are tons of possibilities.
I don't know what you mean with "DIing opposite of knockback"

thanks, by DIing opposite of knockback i meant like if i get fmashdby a character like marth what should i do to be able to not die as easily (i dont kno if im sounding ******** rite now :/)

 

[Kitamerby]

thanks, by DIing opposite of knockback i meant like if i get fmashdby a character like marth what should i do to be able to not die as easily (i dont kno if im sounding ******** rite now :/)

You're not, you're doing fine. Someone here is just being an ***. :V

I was thinking about some aspects of the initial dash and was wondering if someone could possibly answer some (or, hopefully, all) of the following questions:

1) How long does it take for the initial dash animation to turn into the top speed animation?

Depends on the character and how different their initial dash and full sprint are.

2) What can a character do during the initial dash animation that cannot be done during the top speed animation?

Well for starters, you can't dashdance, pivot, or crouch(naritake step) during a full sprint, and you can't SHIELD during an initial dash. And I guess if you count it, you can technically fsmash during an initial dash too for a few frames.

3) Is it a viable strategy (for characters who have faster dash speeds than top speeds) to continuously reset the initial dash animation to gain speed (or, rather, to not lose speed)? [This disregards the extra tripping risk]

Depends on the character once again. It might be more viable for someone like Pikachu, I guess, but foxtrotting is tbh not as good in Brawl as Melee for more reasons than simply tripping. The only way to perform attacks or shield out of an initial dash is to either crouch and attack (naritake step) or to perform a pivot, both of which are pretty precise. It'd probably be more viable if you could shield directly out of an initial dash like in Melee...

4) If the above is true, how soon can the second initial dash follow the first? Can it be done whenever?

As soon as possible. If you wait too long, you'll lose the dashdance window because it's so short in brawl.

DI'ing i know theres different types of DIing like Diing opposite of knockback and out of pikachu's dsmash, or out of a tornado, can any1 tell me how to Di from these 3 things,
thanks,

For Pikachu's Dsmash, either tap control stick and C stick upwards rapidly, or simply hold up on the control stick.

For Mach Tornado, SDI up and/or towards the center of the tornado and either jump(so you can footstool), airdodge, or use a very fast aerial if your character has one. If he is traveling fast enough and has enoguh momentum going, you can try to SDI away from where he's traveling and get out that way.

For Marth, you always want to hold the control stick at a right angle from knockback for DI. So if you're hit upwards, you should hit to the side, and if you're hit to the side, you should hold up (and probably slightly backwards). By doing this, you're making your trajectory more towards the corner blast zones than the sides, allowing you to live longer by having more room to fly. If you're trying to survive horizontally, you should then use either your fastest aerial or air dodge (depending on character) to slow your momentum, and if you are still in danger, you should either jump or use a "brake" move to stop your momentum completely. If you're trying to survive vertically, you should ALWAYS use an aerial and fastfall it, meaning that you're better off simply using a c-stick dair to live longer.

 

[Enzo]

thanks a bunch kitamerby ive always been needing to learn how to DI properly.

 

[YagamiLight]

Thanks Yikarur and Kitamerby. You've both been very helpful.

I do have some (2) follow up questions though, if you don't mind.

1) Can you crouch at any time during the initial dash phase?

2) Is the crouch effectively lagless? Namely, is it possible to attack or to standing grab immediately afterwards (can you even grab after a dashing crouch?)?

 

[Yikarur]

there is no dashing crouch in brawl.

 

[fatalsolid01]

You're not, you're doing fine. Someone here is just being an ***. :V

You talk as if im making this up and got this from nowhere. So just watch the vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucKOF4U63FU

Believe the vid or not i really dont care.

 

[Kitamerby]

there is no dashing crouch in brawl.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg61XaQvqMo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ja5u-0A_vM&feature=related

Yes there is.

Thanks Yikarur and Kitamerby. You've both been very helpful.

I do have some (2) follow up questions though, if you don't mind.

1) Can you crouch at any time during the initial dash phase?

2) Is the crouch effectively lagless? Namely, is it possible to attack or to standing grab immediately afterwards (can you even grab after a dashing crouch?)?

If I remember right, you're using the crouch to stop the skidding animation at the end of a dash stop or something like that. I forget how it works exactly. There was a thread on it way back...

You talk as if im making this up and got this from nowhere. So just watch the vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucKOF4U63FU

Believe the vid or not i really dont care.

You're apparently misunderstanding something. I wasn't referring to you. :V

Either the vid was wrong or you misinterpreted it. Too lazy to check it myself. :V

10misunderstandings.

 

[YagamiLight]

Oh, so it has to be a reversed crouch to use the Naritake step or else it won't work?

Wish there was more documentation on this technique.

 

[Yikarur]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg61XaQvqMo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ja5u-0A_vM&feature=related

Yes there is.
.

no there isn't. This is a foxtrott pivot to stuff. no dash is cancelled into a crouch.

E: the second one is a simple dash. lol

 

[SaveMeJebus]

can someone give me proof(actual proof and not something that someone told you) about tripping being random?

 

[Kitamerby]

can someone give me proof(actual proof and not something that someone told you) about tripping being random?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmCtH2QTsPw

no there isn't. This is a foxtrott pivot to stuff. no dash is cancelled into a crouch.

E: the second one is a simple dash. lol

It's an alternative for true pivoting. The second video was half naritake step, and half dash pivot canceling into smashes. :V

 

[Yikarur]

it is still no crouching DURING dash/run.