Brawl+ 5.0 RC1 Tactical Discussion Thread

[CloneHat]

6 jabs wtf?

I like Leaf's idea. Let's keep the interesting part of the move, but make it easier to escape.

 

[stingers]

ganon's fair is still really good. so i dont think it matters. just take the change out completely next time, i dont really think he needs it

 

[Revven]

stingers, you are misunderstanding. It's not something we did, it was what Sakurai did, a mistake he made.

 

[stingers]

oh

LMAO

WOW

 

[MK26]

stingers, you are misunderstanding. It's not something we did, it was what Sakurai did, a mistake he made.

AHAHA its true, i just checked his pac

And also, i think the jc+ endlag isnt to make it inferior to dash cancel grabs, it's to balance it against regular old dash grabs

EDIT: this larger text is pissing me off.
Anyone know what the original font was?

 

[CloneHat]

EDIT: this larger text is pissing me off.
Anyone know what the original font was?

I thought it was something wrong with my browser! When did this happen?

PS: What's the problem with Ganon's fair?

 

[Shadic]

The best part about the Ganondorf Fair mistake is that's who Sakurai apparently mains.

 

[MK26]

Screw it, until further notice im sticking with Times New Roman... D:

clonehat, you can still get landing lag from it after it ends. Like you can full jump fair, and you can jump out befire you hit the ground, but if you dont jump, you get landing lag...

 

[stingers]

Just use Smash Blue instead of Revolution Skin...the font size is normal and the skin looks way better anyway @.@

 

[MK26]

TNR looks better in Classic Blue than it does in revolution :S

 

[jokey665]

Ugh, smash blue looks awful. Classic blue is alright, though.

 

[Shadic]

Ugh, smash blue looks awful.

Eyesight. urdoinitrong.

Seriously, Smash Blue for the win. Easy color scheme, widescreen support, win.

 

[MK26]

I do like the widescreen support

sticking with tnr tho

lets try upping the size

EDIT: and what about letting me see my signature? huh?

i suppose this is as good a time as any to lol at sakurai

and ponder about stages

and all sorts of different things like that

do we have a preliminary schedule on when the RC1 (cuz it really should be called B+5.0 RC1.0, or RC1 for short) patch will be delivered?

EDITEDIT: wow, after all that rambling, even ninja'ing plum, my sig still didnt show up? What a travesty.

I would like it more if it decided to show its face once in a while. lol @ revolution skin.

19 more characters maybe?

ok, this is getting ridiculous. You'd better show up, sig, if you know what's good for you. Seriously, i thought i jst had to surpass the length of teh text in my sig (which i just did) for it to show up...unless it includes BBCode text, in which case im not sure...theres a lot of text goin on in that sig nowadays, what with the times new roman switch, and the quote, and other stuff :S

I hope ive passed it now

PLZ?

EDIT: cool...it works now

i think i just figured out a way to make it less space-intensive and save text too

 

[Plum]

So I hear this was a thread about B+ 5.0 :V

 

[kupo15]

I thought it was something wrong with my browser! When did this happen?

PS: What's the problem with Ganon's fair?

You can't Full hop Fair without getting full landing lag. All moves should at least be able to be ACed in a full hop at least. I always thought that Ganon's fair animation was screwy "Swing.....pulling arm back....arm is back at my side.....land.....FIST ON GROUND!!!"

The best part about the Ganondorf Fair mistake is that's who Sakurai apparently mains.

Wow, how ironic.

 

[jokey665]

So I hear this was a thread about B+ 5.0 :V

You heard wrong. :/\

 

[TL?]

Back to the auto jab topic, it would be awesome to have it removed on most characters. It's fine for characters like pikachu or metaknight. But most characters would be better off without it. I would really like to try Brawl+ with no autojab. :D

 

[CloneHat]

It's the only move that can't be AC'ed? Even DK fair?

 

[MK26]

TL?, we all agree with that statement.

Also, wow. Smash Blue's background colour for quotes isnt even the same black used in spoiler tags. what's the fun in that?

EDIT: clonehat, i just checked, Dk's fair has the same thing...

 

[SymphonicSage12]

I know this veers off-topic slighty, but some moves, Like Captain Falcon dtilt, don't even HAVE an allow interrupt. Which means that they has no IASA whatsoever...is this planned or this another sakurai-did-this thing?

 

[kupo15]

EDIT: clonehat, i just checked, Dk's fair has the same thing...

Wait, DK has the same poor programming as well?

 

[SymphonicSage12]

Apparently so.


So..the timer before allow interrupt should always be asynchronous, right?

 

[MK26]

I know this veers off-topic slighty, but some moves, Like Captain Falcon dtilt, don't even HAVE an allow interrupt. Which means that they has no IASA whatsoever...is this planned or this another sakurai-did-this thing?

probably planned...it just means you go must through with teh whole animation before you can do anything else

Wait, DK has the same poor programming as well?

as far as i can tell, yes.

 

[kupo15]

wow, any other moves (fairs in particular) that anyone can think of that have the same problem? How about Ike?

 

[SymphonicSage12]

None of Ike's aerials even have an allow interrupt.

EDIT: I checked Ganon's, and the timer before the allow interrupt is asynchronous. do you guys mean the one before the bit variable thingy? EDIT: yep, you do.



EDIT: These are all the aerials that have the "Sakurai" synchronous problem:

Nairs: Fox, Marth, Ness
Fairs: Ganondorf, Donkey Kong, fair
Bairs: Falco, Fox
Uairs: Falco, Fox, Kirby, Toon Link
Dairs: Pikachu

 

[MK26]

Sage, just because an aerial has a synchronous timer doesnt mean it's incorrect. It's if the synchronous timer (which is relative to the last timer function present) goes past the asyncronous timer (which is absolute).

For instance, Kirby's uair has a synchronous timer at 6 frames with an asynchronous one at 39. The synchronous one is after another synchronous one, also at 6 frames, which is after an asynchronous one at 9. 9+6+6=21, so it autocancels at 21 frames and ends at 39. No problem there. DK's fair, on the other hand, has a synchronous timer at 55 frames, after two synchronous timers at 2 and 3 frames, which both follow an asynchronous timer at 24 frames. And allow interrupt is asynchronous at 59 frames. That's obviously a mistake, as 24+2+3+55=84 frames. The 55 frame synchronous should be asynchronous. Dorf's is synchronous at 35, preceded by synchronous at 6 and asynch at 13. 35+6+13=52, 8 greater than the 44 that's asynchronous at the end. Again, simply changing the last synch timer to asynch will do the trick.

Falco: fine
Fox: a-ok
Link and Ike: shouldn't be a problem
Pika, Marth, and Ness: all good
Sheik and TL: both fine

 

[Rudra]

Oh wow. Sakurai really made a mess of things in general didnt he.

 

[MK26]

No, it's just two simple coding errors...in a game as huge as brawl, small things can be expected.

 

[shanus]

Its because they have programmed in frame lengths that just change action after the subaction ends by returning back to actionID 33.....


nothing to see here


All of the synchronous timer ones are fine it appears

 

[Alphatron]

The best part about the Ganondorf Fair mistake is that's who Sakurai apparently mains.

I wouldn't take that single match seriously if anything. I assume Sakurai knows how to play his own game afterall.

 

[Shadic]

I wouldn't take that single match seriously if anything. I assume Sakurai knows how to play his own game afterall.

Have you seen the clips from that match? Or seen his method of game balancing?

I don't think Sakurai is the most Smash-skilled.

 

[CloneHat]

That girl must've been like, "who is this loser"

 

[Yeroc]

I just want to post that after having done tests on Samus's jab, changing values and checking trajectories at various percents, I strongly believe we ought to change it more than just "adding SDI." I've made a pac in which jabs link well at 50% and combo to nair and other moves at higher percents, which I think is just fine for a jab as good as Samus's. I would urge that this be the change we adopt in future revisions.

 

[RPGsFTW]

I have always noticed Ganon's Fair punching the ground and being just stupid. I never understood why though. If that could be fixed, that'd be great... and auto jabs. =]

Also, I'd like to see a vid of Sakurai playing as Ganon. Link, please?

 

[CloneHat]

Just YT "sakurai brawl".

And Yeroc that new jab sounds great!

 

[Magus420]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kiCcOJ7gfyo

and

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTC35GvjQbA

 

[MK26]

Its because they have programmed in frame lengths that just change action after the subaction ends by returning back to actionID 33.....


nothing to see here


All of the synchronous timer ones are fine it appears

for dk and ganon, it looks like they would ac if they were asynchronous, but dont because they are synch. changing the two of them to asynch simply makes sense, even if they dont get extra landing lag after finishing the animations before touching the ground.

 

[RPGsFTW]

Oh my goodness that entateina was funny as ****. xD
That vid should be a BRSTM.

Eww and they play standard colors. I hate seeing that unless people like that one specific color and it happens to be on standard, EX: Green is your favorite color and you play green Yoshi.

 

[VietGeek]

If memory serves, someone complained that her jab didn't connect into the second hit properly. VietGeek ventured into it and came up with a vacuum jab (sucks in) ... I do not know why it got in or how though.

It got in because at that time we were severely strained for lines in frame speed (which would've been the best tackle it I'll admit).

Either make the jabs connect with frame speed modifications or revert the change completely.

EDIT: Or we can go with Yeroc's idea. IIRC Samus's jab already begins to connect around mid-40% to 50%s naturally, does it not?

 

[GHNeko]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4fJm07TAmc

I'll just leave this here.