Ashunera’s Library - General Discussion, Q&A and Index

[Kimchi]

Wario matchup is 60:40. The grab infinite is not really viable in a tournament match, especially if you're just going to make it stale and do 1% for each pummel. It's not worth it and it is incredibly boring, unless you are an extremely patient player..
As for Olimar, I still can't see how it's 70:30. You know he's going to try to grab you every time you try to approach, so rely on quick empty fast-falled short hops to get close and short hop aerial dodge -> jab and just hold it. I did this to Icylight a lot at Viridian and I rarely got grabbed. If he just keeps his shield up, stop your jab combo and retreat or predict his attempt to shield grab and side step then punish. Frigate/Halberd /Rainbow Cruise are the ideal CP choices for obvious reasons.
@ Palpi: Yes, Bloodcross jabbed me outta Bthrow -> Dash attack. You have to reaaaaaaaaaaaally get the timing frame-perfect on Falco, because his jab comes out so fast .

 

[san.]

I see. Man, I want to play phantomX or another awesome wario to know firsthand =)

Any good warios in EC. I don't seem to recall...



EDIT: SO tired from studying nonstop 20 hours + last couple days

 

[Kimchi]

I see. Man, I want to play phantomX or another awesome wario to know firsthand =)

Any good warios in EC. I don't seem to recall...



EDIT: SO tired from studying nonstop 20 hours + last couple days

Slikvik and I think Malcolm are good Warios.

 

[Palpi]

Mr Clutch is good around here aswell.

 

[theeboredone]

Wario matchup is 60:40. The grab infinite is not really viable in a tournament match, especially if you're just going to make it stale and do 1% for each pummel. It's not worth it and it is incredibly boring, unless you are an extremely patient player..
As for Olimar, I still can't see how it's 70:30. You know he's going to try to grab you every time you try to approach, so rely on quick empty fast-falled short hops to get close and short hop aerial dodge -> jab and just hold it. I did this to Icylight a lot at Viridian and I rarely got grabbed. If he just keeps his shield up, stop your jab combo and retreat or predict his attempt to shield grab and side step then punish. Frigate/Halberd /Rainbow Cruise are the ideal CP choices for obvious reasons.
@ Palpi: Yes, Bloodcross jabbed me outta Bthrow -> Dash attack. You have to reaaaaaaaaaaaally get the timing frame-perfect on Falco, because his jab comes out so fast .

Any smart Oli player would just wait for you to spot dodge, and then grab you right after that lol. No matter how much we try to mix it up, we're very limited on our approaches, thus making it easy to read what we have.

 

[Palpi]

I doubt icylight has much ike exp kimchi, not to take anything away from you though. Still did a good job and have good ideas for the MU haha

 

[Kimchi]

I doubt icylight has much ike exp kimchi, not to take anything away from you though. Still did a good job and have good ideas for the MU haha

He actually does. I asked him right after the set ended and he said he has Ike experience against Rylix, an Ike in New England.

 

[Palpi]

Oh wow. I am mistaken, though I don't know who Rylix is, the name seems bad *** enough.

I know Ryko told me a while back that he beat a good olimar in tourney by mixing up his approaches with air dodges, spot dodging and etc. Maybe it is hard to get used to as an olimar.

 

[Kirk]

Would it be easier if the Wario used his second jump?

And another question: Will grab release on edge to full hop dair spike Wario? Or can the Wario DI towards the stage?

Easier? Perhaps. It would give you a few extra frames, since their next best option is to either Nair or air dodge. But it is still very easy to do regardless. Bairing after the release is guaranteed, remember. Just jump forward and...whack.

If you happen to connect with full hop Dair, I imagine they can DI back onto the stage, though I have not tried it myself. Not to mention they have ample time to avoid it...

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

I think it's 35:65, but I wouldn't be surprised if my mind sways to 40:60 =(
At least if I could understand if there were reasons other than you can't hit his shield with fair.

I was going to say how about you can't hit his shield at all but ryko already did

Well, can't you do it? You were the one who discovered it lol
I just think of it as an IC CG, except it's with Ike on one matchup.

Actually i think yagamilight was the one who found it during that one week he stopped obsessing over quick draw.

If you grab them out of there second jump can't you just grab release shield grab them? I remember people said this before the pivot infinite was found.

pretty much everyone said the infinite is useless cause of how hard it is but i think what really makes it suck is that a lot of tourny players can break out in 1 pummel before 100% so that kind of just leaves it for being used when you can already kill them with an Ftilt.

The only time i bothered with it was when i got a grab at 120% and my utilt was stale so i took them to 150% then after that i realized i had 2 other kill moves i could use.

 

[Rykoshet]

Ike doesnt have true combos, jab 1 to jab 1 isnt a true combo if the opponent is floaty. Jab 1-2-3 isnt a combo to MOST characters if they just DI down and away (marth isnt even particularly heavy in any way and he can DI the jab string down and power shield the third hit) and jab to grab is sure as **** not a real combo either >_>

 

[theeboredone]

Everything I do is a true combo. Px can attest.

 

[Teh Brettster]

Holy ****, you guys actually voted for the extra event in the Dallas tourney?

Whatever. Don't ask, don't tell.

I just hope they don't notice all the names they've never seen before.

 

[PhantomX]

Bored, I thought of something amazing you haven't done yet amidst all your cheating. Counter a Klap Trap and kill the opponent with the hit from counter.

 

[benaji261!]

Oh wow. I am mistaken, though I don't know who Rylix is, the name seems bad *** enough.

I know Ryko told me a while back that he beat a good olimar in tourney by mixing up his approaches with air dodges, spot dodging and etc. Maybe it is hard to get used to as an olimar.

Olimar is Ike's worst MU, isn't it? I have like no experience against Olimars. I've only played Weruop, but I don't think there are any Olimars better than him... at least from what I know.

 

[Rykoshet]

On paper olimar is ike's worst matchup. In practice, it's metakniiiiiiiiight*





* The opinions expressed above are only those of the poster and do not speak for other ikes or smashboards.

 

[san.]

He actually does. I asked him right after the set ended and he said he has Ike experience against Rylix, an Ike in New England.

Rylix isn't that good, so I wouldn't say he has Ike experience if it's only vs Rylix.

 

[metroid1117]

Bairing after the release is guaranteed, remember. Just jump forward and...whack.

How would you hit with the BAir? Would you buffer a turn during the grab release and then jump+BAir, jump forward immediately and hit with a reverse BAir, or double jump past him and BAir?

 

[Teh Brettster]

On paper olimar is ike's worst matchup. In practice, it's metakniiiiiiiiight*





* The opinions expressed above are only those of the poster and do not speak for other ikes or smashboards.

It's not just you. I'm right with you there.

How would you hit with the BAir? Would you buffer a turn during the grab release and then jump+BAir, jump forward immediately and hit with a reverse BAir, or double jump past him and BAir?

You can jump forward without turning and hit him. I usually catch him with the part of the hotbox that goes in front of Ike.
You can also reverse the Bair if you'd like. It works. And I'm pretty sure Arturo does some dumb thing where he runs under Wario and then jumps and Bairs, but I have no idea why, lol. I'd be way too scared to miss the timing.
Pretty much, think of a way to use Bair quickly on Wario. It works.

 

[theeboredone]

How would you hit with the BAir? Would you buffer a turn during the grab release and then jump+BAir, jump forward immediately and hit with a reverse BAir, or double jump past him and BAir?

Personally, I prefer the F-smash.

 

[Kirk]

Easiest is to just jump forward and Bair. One can hit with the reverse hitbox as well as the normal one. Turning around also works.

 

[-RedX-]

I remember seeing a thread about Ike's guaranteed grab releases(pretty old thread) and I saw usmash after grab release on Wario is possible O_o
Is that right or no?

Also, Palpi, I won't be able to go to Kosha Boy -.-

 

[benaji261!]

What are some good techniques to try against good Olimars? I don't know any... besides being very evasive of his grabs.

 

[Lex Crunch]

From my personal experience, there's really nothing you can do, so I try to focus more on what NOT to do, like Quick Draw, and being anywhere near the guy for any longer than a jab's time.

 

[tankzortz]

whats better for spiking, dtilt, or dair?

 

[theeboredone]

whats better for spiking, dtilt, or dair?

Situational. If you can read that your opponent is hanging on the edge a bit too long to where his invincible frames go away, or if he has a recover of some sorts (DDD) that make him viable to the D-tilt use it. Another chance to use it is the classic jab the person off the edge, to d-tilt.

D-air is all about reading the opponent, and when the opponent is below the stage. Be sure to read air dodges if you are going for a spike off stage.

 

[benaji261!]

From my personal experience, there's really nothing you can do, so I try to focus more on what NOT to do, like Quick Draw, and being anywhere near the guy for any longer than a jab's time.

I'll be accused of stalling though if I stay away too much. :/

 

[Teh Brettster]

Was that a joke?

Staying out of a grab range isn't stalling.

 

[-RedX-]

Stalling with Ike.
lol'd

If the Olimar(who can camp good and has the best grab) player is accusing you of stalling, something is very wrong.

 

[Palpi]

I am teaming with Pgn, RedX, for lowtiers and regular. Ike+jiggs/ness and MK/G&W

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

It's not just you. I'm right with you there.



You can jump forward without turning and hit him. I usually catch him with the part of the hotbox that goes in front of Ike.
You can also reverse the Bair if you'd like. It works. And I'm pretty sure Arturo does some dumb thing where he runs under Wario and then jumps and Bairs, but I have no idea why, lol. I'd be way too scared to miss the timing.
Pretty much, think of a way to use Bair quickly on Wario. It works.

its cause i'm better than you I actually do it to hit them off the stage because Ike's Utilt should be DIed in the direction of Ike's back which usually makes it so that Bair sends them strait to a KO

I'm really getting back into ike i think i used him more than snake this week and i'm using him on at least 1 counter pick in my next serious tourney sets here in el paso.


Also your all dumb if olimar isn't ike's worst match up then that olimar is just toying with you. I actually think that would probably be it because MK toying > olimar toying seeing as mk can just spam aerial up Bs and then dairs to win lol

 

[Rykoshet]

It's arguing about 2 matchups that are deemed unwinnable one wya or another. Either way which can potentially **** ike more doesnt really hinge on much

 

[benaji261!]

Now that I think about it... I would lol if I was accused of stalling from an Olimar user. XD

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Anyone on who doesn't mind facing an MK on lulzwifi?

I'm going to a free tournament today with a bunch of people who I usually Brawl with (silly UTSA, thinking tournaments with entrance fee = gambling), but I plan on CPing with MK if I lose my first match with Ike. Just to shake things up and see how far I can get.

 

[san.]

Sure, I don't mind. I need a break from homework.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Sure, I don't mind. I need a break from homework.

:D

Yay, I can get destroyed by San again!

I'll be switching it up between MK, Ike, and Falcon.

EDIT: San isn't on wifi. ;_;

 

[san.]

Odang, I forgot you don't have AIM. still on?

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Odang, I forgot you don't have AIM. still on?

Yep, still on and waiting in wifi

EDIT: Game is up

EDIT2L Do you have any idea how annoying it is when I manage to deal 67% damage to you without getting hit, and then you kill me in three blows? ;_;

GGs

 

[san.]

Sorry to make you wait like 20 minutes -__-

GGs though. I learned a couple new things Ike could do on some levels like japes, too.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Sorry to make you wait like 20 minutes -__-

GGs though. I learned a couple new things Ike could do on some levels like japes, too.

So I found out. ;_;

Ow.

Oh, and my MK sucks. Badly. Me thinks I'll stick to Ike...

And lol, Falcon VS MK is hopeless. I almost had your Pikachu, but no you had to do another 3HKO wonder with thunder. ;_;