Official 4BR Tier List v1.0 - Competitive Impressions

[Yonder]

Can someone tell me what the Mewtwo buffs are?

The thought of an official competitively viable Mewtwo is exciting as ****!

In a nutshell, he moves at mach 5 now (faster than Sheik) he got 2 units of weight (this one isn't too crazy imo but shows they listened) nair has bigger hitboxes...

And someone just found out u smash has less end lag, which I hope is correct, down from 72 to 68?

 

[RonNewcomb]

Wait, did Zelda actually get buffed?

No, Zelda didn't get buffed.

Zelda just got added to the game.

: dash attack buffed

Finally! The missing piece to his everything!

What's the likelihood of a surge in Rosalina? Is her playstyle unappealing enough to keep her relatively unpicked?

Puppet characters are usually pretty difficult to pick up n play well. It's not that the style is unappealing, it's just difficult. Especially when Mario and Sword Mario are right there.

And Luigi and Yoshi beat Sheik. /sarcasm

Just because you can break out of combos doesn't mean you automatically win.

Weeeellll, when said character has **** neutral and so-so disadvantage, breaking out of their advantage for free kinda sorta does mean an auto-win.

Did anyone ever use Dsmash or Fsmash? They seemed pretty unsafe to me.

I think people are underselling the nerfs a tad (longer charge time = less LBs per match due to interruptions during charging, Uair nerf is something I'll happily take), but in the long run his main killer of LB!SideB is still there. He lost some power, but quite noticeably less of a loss compared to some of those around him. I don't think any of his MUs got worse, just maybe some of the even ones feeling even more even basically.

Look I know LB Cross Slash is a great move, but it's a compromise between his LB FT and LB Climhazzard: FT kills sooner at the expense of more startup, LB Clim starts up sooner at the expense of killing a little later.

We could remove LB CS from the game and Cloud will still kill you with his other three LB specials, his three great smash attacks, his three spikes, and I hear that nair and BB are pretty decent gimp tools. Stop worrying about one KO option among his other eleventy bagillion KO options and start worrying about how he's getting you to kill% to begin with.

Uair damage nerf is big. Some characters who have trouble landing get nailed by it 3, 4, 5 times in a row per landing attempt. It doesn't seem big cause it isn't flashy nor a big screen-zoom salt-inducing KO finisher, but it's big, numerically speaking.

Roll nerfs? That's....weird but not largely concerning for me. Fairly understandable given his neutral and counterpoke game.

Speaking of Shulk, he has a bit more of a chance to shine now maybe? Dunno, even with the top nerfs I have no idea if it's in ways that will help him rise up. Would certainly be interesting if he could! I'd like it to be the case anyways.

Also Marth went evenish with Cloud at 1.1.4 and I doubt it's changed here. Marth got a VERY relevant range increase that actually let him hit buttons in the Cloud matchup lol. I imagine if you ask Shaya 1.1.3 Marth vs. Cloud was a silly matchup. It's been a lot better since 1.1.4.

I always see roll nerfs as a For Glory thing, since SH aerials from basically anyone in the cast shuts down excessive rolling, but yeah, it looks to dampen Limit Camping.

I hope Shaya comes and talks Marth at us. I also hope @Thinkaman talks Zelda at us. Actually I hope Thinkaman just talks.

 

[Yikarur]

We should watch at tournaments first. I have the feeling Sheik is barely different.

 

[TTTTTsd]

I'd be concerned with UAir numerically if the average Kill % for Cloud wasn't 80-95% and his other aerials + confirms didn't do the same damage.

Also keep in mind the freshness bonus, decimal damage, and the overall damage of our kit being incredibly high as is even with a 12% Uair vs. a 13% Uair. Cloud's average kill % is super low ESPECIALLY with LB CS edgeguards which still work hilariously well because the KBG nerf on LB CS was nonexistant (155 to 153, not a vast change considering the damage LB CS does).

I took him for a test run and the only nerf that I noticed actually affect my gameplay (which I quickly adapted to anyways considering how minor it is) is the Limit Charge Speed nerf. It didn't take long either, just win neutral one more time for full limit, or just grab them and throw them, those still have really high knockback and never kill so you can style later. And nah, it wasn't on For Glory the connection there is usually terrible for me.

I understand whatcha mean but for our safety and relative ease at winning neutral vs. a lot of chars, it's immediately understandable why 12% is the new damage value =P.

 

[**Gilgamesh**]

I believe that Sheik has a 50/50 off of f-throw with Uair accordingly to Anti and he likes it too.

 

[C0rvus]

Pretty weird but good patch. We can finally accept our new DLC overlords, and all of my friends' mains got nontrivial buffs. Woo.

Super happy for Zard mains, though. His air speed buff is pretty huge for him. Was playing him a bit today and he seems harder to juggle, and new followups from his speed and reduced landing lag means his punish game just levelled up. Maybe he's on par with or better than Bowser now.

 

[HoSmash4]

We should watch at tournaments first. I have the feeling Sheik is barely different.

Her issues are that the downthrow uair 50/50 percent range has been reduced with no rage, and with rage it is virtually impossible to catch.
Needle range is a bit of a problem, max range needles in 1.1.5 are punishable on block by a handful of characters. Sheik cant trap landings as easily with needles. Rising needles to BF is still a thing.
Fair hitbox reduction does nothing in terms of affecting her punish game off a fair, but reduces the overall safety. Which means fair can be much more easily punished.
Fthrow 50/50 still is a thing, just with a little twist on it.
Fthrow BF is more a string, not a guaranteed followup now.
Backthrow BF/fair hasnt been touched at all.
Sheik still has kill confirms off grab, ftilt, dtilt, nair and fair and frametraps with up smash and bouncing fish.

She was nerfed heavily but the main things that were nerfed were safety in neutral and a bread and butter kill setup, and max range camping. Her damage racking abilities are still top class. She will struggle in matchups where she cant outfirepower characters like Mario, Ryu and Ness will have a shot now needle camping isnt as potent.

Sheik is top 10 in my opinion but I dont think she is top 5 without her kill power, camping and safety in neutral.

P.S I'm happy Sheik's downsmash got buffed, was a justified compensation considering it doesnt work properly. (Neither does Fsmash)

I believe that Sheik has a 50/50 off of f-throw with Uair accordingly to Anti and he likes it too.

That was always a thing when you di fthrow in.

 

[BunbUn129]

Even though the nerf to MK's up aerial took away his best punish, I still believe he is somewhere between 5-10, and is definitely still top-tier.

What does MK have?

-Good neutral game: mobility, disjointed range, and attack speed will always ensure a good neutral game.

MK's fair has 4 less frames of landing lag (20->16, one more frame than Brawl, though Brawl's auto-cancelled in a short-hop), and has always had a 2.0 hitlag modifier (which benefits from shield mechanics), and surprisingly has longer range than in Brawl (last hit 5.0->6.5, which is significant). It's now -13 on shield, and this isn't counting shield-drop (-6) or jumpsquat(-9 vs 4 frame jumpsquat). Spaced at max range, MK's fair is now safe on shield, which is a big plus: one of MK's issues with his approach is that he had no quick, safe long-ranged move that hit in front of him. Now he does. And guess what? Fair -> dash attack is a true combo at lower percents. MK now has a safe aerial poke that also leads into other moves.

Of course, he has that in addition to dash attack, dash grab, dair, d tilt, and f tilt.

MK previously had two major issues in neutral:

1) lack of a projectile
2) all his aerials were unsafe on landing

The second has been largely remedied, and now gives him more mix-up potential with his approach.

On an important note, MK has a somewhat easier time in neutral vs Sheik thanks to the needle and fair nerfs, though he still loses pretty badly. I'd imagine the Sheik MU isn't so terrible anymore (55-45 is actually plausible in theory, though we need proof), because Sheik's neutral game has been worsened (still pretty dope though), while MK's has been notably improved. MK still goes even or beats her in KOing ability even without the staircase, because now her 50/50 has been tightened, and she can't tack on damage with needles until her fair KO's. is still considered positive for MK, and the fact that she's becoming more relevant is actually a plus. I'd argue that MK's OVERALL MU spread is better than pre-patch, because the one hard-counter he had is now up for debate.

-Advantage state: yes, the uair nerf was a major thing. What did the nerf do? It took away the ability to chain it into itself to drag opponents off the top of the screen. But the nerf didn't butcher its combo potential. It can still footstool at lower percents, and can combo into his other aerials until mid-percents, as well as Tornado and SL. The nerf specifically took away (not completely) its KO CONFIRMS, it's still one of his best combo moves.

MK still has very good KOing ability. The decreased lag on fair allows tech-chases from mid to high percents. DA into SL is still a thing. SL is still good OoS, up smash is frame 8 and kills reasonably, and f smash is safe. Up throw and back throw act as stock caps, meaning you generally aren't safe holding shield. MK players: don't let the loss of the up air combo blind you from the fact that he can still rack up damage and KO.

MK has his edge-guarding: a frame 7 bair with dumb knockback, frame 9 fair with good range, frame 4 dair that semi-spikes, and frame 6 nair that lingers and kills when clean. And all these moves make for easy, effective air dodge punishes.

-Disadvantage: 5 midair jumps make him virtually untouchable offstage, and give him great defense against juggles combined with a frame 4 down air and Cape for mix-ups.

TL;DR while the up air nerf IS a major thing, post-patch MK is more well-rounded as a character. He's strong in neutral, and still dominates in advantage, and has a very good disadvantage. He still has more than what it takes to be top-tier.

 

[Tri Knight]

I believe MK is still great as well but it doesn't change the fact that a lot of players leaned majorly on this combo/kill setup. This scares a lot of top tier players and might force a lot of them out. This can break MK's meta in reality.

For those who do stay, This will ultimately force them to take MK in a different direction.

 

[Solfiner]

Regarding Shulk: ZSS, Sheik and Meta Knight nerfs help a lot.

Sheik's Fair nerf should allow him to finally wall her out, and needles are less of a threat. ZSS is still -1 for him probably, but definitely more managable.

 

[Asdioh]

I can't keep up with this thread now that it's going crazy, which is fine because I'm going on vacation soon anyway! It's amazing though, how in the course of ~12 hours, with all the changes not completely known, people are claiming to drop their top tiers and stuff like that.

That said... Kirby gets another HUGE WALL OF TEXT of changes that looked almost copy pasted from 1.1.3, but once again they basically amount to "Your unsafe kill moves now KO one, maybe two percent earlier!" I think maybe they just buff Kirby every patch, just to say they did. Looks like Pacman got the same treatment this patch... why even bother?
Kirby's constant buffs have made him viable, in the same way Diddy's nerfs made him unviable. (Hint: they didn't)
If he got secret endlag or airspeed buffs anywhere, that might be nice, but it's not looking that way. His biggest indirect buff is what everybody else got: nerfs to the top tiers?!


I must say, I've been keeping a notepad of a "patch wishlist" for myself for months now, occasionally editing it, and some of the changes in this patch are exactly what I wanted, or very close. Here are some excerpts:

Spoiler: The prophecies are fulfilled

Official:

• Nair Landing Lag: 22F -> 20F
• Fair Landing Lag: 31 -> 22

Mine:
-Nair: Landing lag 22 -> 16
-Fair: Autocancel lowered a couple frames, allowing short hop autocancel


Official:

• Bonk: Headbonk angle changed (survival-ability improved)

Mine:
-Hydro Pump: No longer bounces off the ledge and SDs when hitting the ledge at the wrong angle.
(ok, this one is obvious because everybody wanted it)



Official:

• Upair Damage: 5 -> 4
• Upair Angle: 78 -> 69
• Upair SDI Multiplier: 1.0 -> 1.5
• Fair Landing Lag: 20 -> 16

Mine:
-Fair: Landing lag 20 -> 15
-Upair: Knockback angle slightly more horizontal.
Still combos into Shuttle Loop at KO percentages, but no longer combos into itself 3 or more times with good DI
The only other change I had listed was jumpsquat 4 -> 3, but that's a story for another time :D


Official:

• Weight: 72 -> 74

Mine:
-Weight: Increased by 2 :^)
(this is a direct quote, mind you)


Official:

• Standing Grab Total Frames: 75F -> 69F
• Dash Grab Total Frames: 73F -> 67F
• Pivot Grab Total Frames: 89 -> 83

Mine:
-Grab: FAF 76 -> 69
-Dash Grab: FAF 74 -> 72
-Pivot Grab: FAF 90 -> 80 (all grabs now have same endlag as ZSS)

I was close!
And my numbers are directly from Kurogane's website, I'm not sure why they're all off by a frame compared to here.


Official:

• Dsmash KBG: 155 -> 165
• Fair defensive Hitbox Z Postion: 3.5 -> 2.5
• Fair Hitbox Z Position: 3.5 -> 2.5
• Needle: Range Decreased

Mine:

-Fair: Remove disjoint on Fair, either by reducing the hitbox, or increasing the hurtbox
-Needles: Decrease distance. Grounded Needles are too safe. Aerial Needles are fine
-Dsmash: Increase damage by 2%
I thought the Dthrow 50-50 would be fine if her Needles/Fair were toned down, and possibly Bouncing Fish as well... I also had a damage increase for Fsmash and slight knockback increase on Bair (the intention was to have Bair, Fsmash, Dsmash, all kill about 10-15% earlier) but uh... now we have this version of Sheik. Well she's no longer OP, most likely!

P.S. hire me anytime

There were some other close calls in there as well, but those are some highlights. It's a shame I was right about a decent amount of balance changes, but they continue to disappoint every patch with Kirby changes. Despite the massive amount of quantity-over-quality buffs he's received, the only real notable things that he's gotten are the Fthrow combo buff, the Upthrow KO buff, and the Inhale startup/endlag/no longer gets punished by Dairs buffs, as well as MAYBE his tiny runspeed buff. Everything else has been utterly negligible.

Spoiler: Kirby wishlist that will never be a reality

Kirby:
-Air speed: Slight increase
-Jab: Frame 3 -> 2
-Jab: Rapid Jab connects more reliably
-Dash Attack: Connects more reliably
-Dash Attack: FAF 54 -> 48
-Dash Attack: Reduced knockback on final hit, allowing for combos or traps
-Nair: Frame 10 -> 5
-Nair: FAF 73 -> 60
-Fair: Autocancel lowered a couple frames, allowing short hop autocancel
-Dair: landing lag 17 -> 14.
-Copy: Powers are no longer lost from taking damage
-Copy, Mach Tornado: bugfix, currently does half as much damage as Meta Knight's
Just tested, Mach Tornado still does only ~11-12% compared to MK's 22%

 

[DanGR]

Asdioh , FAF (first frame you can act) is one frame later than total duration. So FAF of 90 is same as total duration of 89.

 

[Asdioh]

Ok so it's just different terms for the same concept. That must be that thing that people were talking about in here the other day in regard to that website, and confusion about FAF

edit: oh I didn't notice that Ganondorf's Jab was faster as WELL as stronger, I misread. I also had Jab startup for Ganondorf (though a more liberal frame 5) and heavy armor on Wizkick, I agree with Nobie that that's what Ganondorf wants more than anything... besides maybe a grab range that isn't abysmal.

 

[Nobie]

According to some folks on Reddit, Ganondorf's new Wizard's Foot allows it to plow through certain projectiles, including Mega Man pellets, Bayonetta's fully charged Bullet Arts Climax, and Robin's Thoron.

That AND a faster jab were really the only changes I ever wanted to see on Ganondorf.

Them balance folks is smart yessiree.

 

[adom4]

According to some folks on Reddit, Ganondorf's new Wizard's Foot allows it to plow through certain projectiles, including Mega Man pellets, Bayonetta's fully charged Bullet Arts Climax, and Robin's Thoron.

That AND a faster jab were really the only changes I ever wanted to see on Ganondorf.

Them balance folks is smart yessiree.

apparently it also goes through fire breath, fully charged shuriken, flamethrower & arcfire.
The mega man MU just got a hell of a lot easier.

 

[Dee-SmashinBoss]

Nevermind about that.
Well at least our smashes consistently get stronger.....hoping for something else, but the amount of times they do this makes me wonder if they are having a tough time deciding what else they should buff for Kirby?

 

[Yikarur]

Her issues are that the downthrow uair 50/50 percent range has been reduced with no rage, and with rage it is virtually impossible to catch.

She has still the better kill confirms in the game. The dthrow thing was something abusive, now we can see what Sheik players are real sheik mains. The really lab-hard-sheik mains don't even kill from dthrow 50:50 that often, because they use other things.

Needle range is a bit of a problem, max range needles in 1.1.5 are punishable on block by a handful of characters.

If you use needles too close it always has been punishable...

Sheik cant trap landings as easily with needles.

It's almost unchanged. The range nerf doesn't affect it that much.

Fair hitbox reduction does nothing in terms of affecting her punish game off a fair, but reduces the overall safety. Which means fair can be much more easily punished.

You should not that it's not even spacing that makes it so safe (and in that regard it doesn't really make a difference) but that frames are safe as well. So reducing the range doesn't make a huge difference here.

 

[Nobie]

apparently it also goes through fire breath, fully charged shuriken, flamethrower & arcfire.
The mega man MU just got a hell of a lot easier.

I imagine this also means it goes through baby Shadow Balls but not adult ones. The Mewtwo vs. Ganondorf matchup is one of the best and most fun in the game (on both sides), so it's nice to see that the arms race isn't pushing Mewtwo too far past Dorf.

 

[adom4]

I imagine this also means it goes through baby Shadow Balls but not adult ones. The Mewtwo vs. Ganondorf matchup is one of the best and most fun in the game (on both sides), so it's nice to see that the arms race isn't pushing Mewtwo too far past Dorf.

oh yes it's definitely fun, it's still a very close MU because M2 combos the hell out of Ganon, but Ganon has more raw damage & almost everything is safe on M2's shield, it's very intense.

 

[Rizen]

What was the amount of damage needed to overpower another attack?

 

[Radical Larry]

According to some folks on Reddit, Ganondorf's new Wizard's Foot allows it to plow through certain projectiles, including Mega Man pellets, Bayonetta's fully charged Bullet Arts Climax, and Robin's Thoron.

That AND a faster jab were really the only changes I ever wanted to see on Ganondorf.

Them balance folks is smart yessiree.

I think this can sate people's want for amazing Dorf buffs. We don't need mobility on him for a long, long time, but since Wizard's Foot just goes through things like no one's business, projectile characters beware, Ganondorf has an option to beat you all now. (Oh crap.)

Ganondorf's buffs still being found, yet I firmly believe he might end up being a low tier next tier list due to his buffs. He's got additional tools and combos in his arsenal that just make him a bigger threat now, and thanks to certain characters getting nerfed *cough*Sheik*cough*, his MUs are more bearable and some advantageous MUs are even better due to his buffs!

Here's to hoping his low to low-mid placement...as a prediction.

I'm going to just...
Lab him. Make him my main again.

What was the amount of damage needed to overpower another attack?

It depends unless the attack has transcending priority. Mega Man's lemons didn't do much damage and yet one blocks Ganondorf's WizKick. So I'm thinking Ganondorf received Transcending Priority on projectiles or autoblock on WizKick.

 

[adom4]

I think this can sate people's want for amazing Dorf buffs. We don't need mobility on him for a long, long time, but since Wizard's Foot just goes through things like no one's business, projectile characters beware, Ganondorf has an option to beat you all now. (Oh crap.)

Ganondorf's buffs still being found, yet I firmly believe he might end up being a low tier next tier list due to his buffs. He's got additional tools and combos in his arsenal that just make him a bigger threat now, and thanks to certain characters getting nerfed *cough*Sheik*cough*, his MUs are more bearable and some advantageous MUs are even better due to his buffs!

Here's to hoping his low to low-mid placement...as a prediction.

I'm going to just...
Lab him. Make him my main again.



It depends unless the attack has transcending priority. Mega Man's lemons didn't do much damage and yet one blocks Ganondorf's WizKick. So I'm thinking Ganondorf received Transcending Priority on projectiles or autoblock on WizKick.

I think it's because of the damage buff, now wizkick does just enough damage to plow through some of the weaker projectiles.

 

[Emblem Lord]

So yall realize Cloud has no bad match-ups anymore right?

 

[Radical Larry]

I think it's because of the damage buff, now wizkick does just enough damage to plow through some of the weaker projectiles.

But Thoron? Someone claims it goes through Thoron, which is basically unable to be blocked by any attack, so is that true?
If it's true, WizKick has transcending priority.

 

[Kofu]

What was the amount of damage needed to overpower another attack?

9% more IIRC.

 

[adom4]

But Thoron? Someone claims it goes through Thoron, which is basically unable to be blocked by any attack, so is that true?
If it's true, WizKick has transcending priority.

Thoron is multihit & the hits themselves don't do that much damage, wizkick apparently still clanks with stuff like Mario's fireballs.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

So yall realize Cloud has no bad match-ups anymore right?

I wouldn't call that yet necessarily. Sheik did have more kill options than just the Dthrow.

Even if she lost one of her primary 50/50s and thus some MUs are changed, I'm not calling Sheik dead yet. I'd rather wait and see if the top level Sheiks can lab out anything with her new throws first/further focus on her other kill confirms and 50/50s. Lets see what Zero and Void figure out first. If they figure out anything I'm betting Cloud still loses to Sheik.

 

[Fatmanonice]

So, all the heavies in this game might actually be kind of competent now? with their direct buffs and with the indirect buffs by gaining ground on five of his worst matchups.That's a pretty big deal.

 

[Yikarur]

So yall realize Cloud has no bad match-ups anymore right?

Except.. the same as before.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Cloud lost to sheik and maybe bayo.

Now Cloud is prolly even with Sheik and maaaaybe still loses to Bayo.

Cloud is the new king.

 

[Pazzo.]

So yall realize Cloud has no bad match-ups anymore right?

That's what scares me.

Was Rosalina never a problem?

 

[Yikarur]

Nothing on Sheik was changed that would change the match-up to even out of nowhere. Sheiks nerfs are extremely overrated.

 

[jespoke]

Ok, so Cloud has little to no bad matchups left. But he still has more even matchups and less amazing matchups than Sheik had no?

 

[UberMadman]

Thoron is multihit & the hits themselves don't do that much damage, wizkick apparently still clanks with stuff like Mario's fireballs.

Here's the thing though; Thoron is transcendant, meaning it can't clank with anything. If Wizkick goes through Thoron, then it is straight-up projectile immune now, which would be a HUUUUUGE buff for Ganondorf.

 

[Fatmanonice]

Hate to break it to you man, but Finishing Touch stopped being a factor when Cloud's realized that Limit Side-B was so much more reliable for kills.

One word: doubles. Also, even in singles, follow up combos into aerial Finishing Touches were still super janky. Yes, Limit Cross Slash is still ridiculous but this patch did help fix a number of things about Cloud that were equally ridiculous so I'll gladly take it for the time being.

 

[Pazzo.]

Nothing on Sheik was changed that would change the match-up to even out of nowhere. Sheiks nerfs are extremely overrated.

I agree. These nerfs will change how Sheik is played, and perhaps give some players an excuse to play another top-tier, but there's no way in hell that Sheik's leaving top 10.

 

[adom4]

Here's the thing though; Thoron is transcendant, meaning it can't clank with anything. If Wizkick goes through Thoron, then it is straight-up projectile immune now, which would be a HUUUUUGE buff for Ganondorf.

It is a big buff, though it's arcfire more than thoron, thoron isn't that great anyway but now that we can get past arcfire more reliably will probably make the Robin MU easier.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Ok, so Cloud has little to no bad matchups left. But he still has more even matchups and less amazing matchups than Sheik had no?

Agreed.

He doesnt decimate alot of chars.

He does **** on Rosa tho lol. Same reasons Ike does well but add a projectile and a slide that can punish all her aerials on reaction.

 

[Radical Larry]

Thoron is multihit & the hits themselves don't do that much damage, wizkick apparently still clanks with stuff like Mario's fireballs.

Ah, thanks for the input. But that's scary just seeing Ganondorf kicking through the attack like Thoron.

I wouldn't call that yet necessarily. Sheik did have more kill options than just the Dthrow.

Even if she lost one of her primary 50/50s and thus some MUs are changed, I'm not calling Sheik dead yet. I'd rather wait and see if the top level Sheiks can lab out anything with her new throws first/further focus on her other kill confirms and 50/50s. Lets see what Zero and Void figure out first. If they figure out anything I'm betting Cloud still loses to Sheik.

Well, we can learn something from our most buffed characters...
Watch out for semi-spikes and frame 6 attacks, Cloud.

will screw Cloud over with that N-Air when it connects.

That's what scares me.

Was Rosalina never a problem?

I think he's just over-estimating Cloud right now. No really, he thinks that even with the nerfs Cloud has, he's still that good?
Does he not know about ?

And this patch, it includes .

I agree. These nerfs will change how Sheik is played, and perhaps give some players an excuse to play another top-tier, but there's no way in hell that Sheik's leaving top 10.

Sheik's nerfs are actually reasonable for me; they are significant in some points (she dies earlier and has less range overall, and kills later with less reliable throws), but insignificant in others. I can believe she's a top 10.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Ryu vs Mewtwo new most awesome match in the game.

Whoever is better at footsies wins.

And the loser dies a miserable death.

It is glorious.