deepseadiva
Bodybuilding Magical Girl
You guys wouldn't happen to have a list of stages and starting positions where you lose armor pieces at the beginning of a match, would you?
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Zero Suit Samus Questions & Answers
- Thread starter phanna
- Start date
jibbyjaont
Smash Journeyman
Are you trying to look for a counter-pick against Samus?
deepseadiva
Bodybuilding Magical Girl
Nah, I just think it'd be useful info to have - for both opponents.
Adapt
Smash Lord
I'm pretty sure Meno is doing this for the counterpick list in stage discussion.
Distant Planet: left side
Lylat: sometimes the slant is such that you lose some or all of them
Green Hill Zone: they don't get lost, but you can sometimes give them to your opponent
Yoshi's Pipes: Same as green hill
Brinstar: Right platform can make you lose one but not all
I think that might be it for (possibly) legal stages.
Nope, there isn't a list, but I can tell you a few of them. It's good info to know.
Distant Planet: left side
Lylat: sometimes the slant is such that you lose some or all of them
Green Hill Zone: they don't get lost, but you can sometimes give them to your opponent
Yoshi's Pipes: Same as green hill
Brinstar: Right platform can make you lose one but not all
I think that might be it for (possibly) legal stages.
Nefarious B
Smash Champion
Rainbow Cruise can also, if you start on top of the deck it can sometimes fall to the lower level
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
Anyone ever tried to play like a wario, and air camp like a mofo.
FadedImage
Smash Journeyman
What allows Wario to do that is that he has great aerial hitboxes in every direction. Also, he's got great air control. ZSS would probably fail at this because she has a weakness below her, meaning anyone that got underneath her would own her.
DeliciousCake
Smash Lord
Her air control is also pretty bad compared to Wario's and Jigglypuff's walls of pain.
Brinstar, you actually lose all but one.
On a side note, I don't mind only having one piece. In fact, I prefer it.
jibbyjaont
Smash Journeyman
Yeah. If you're a PUNK. Jk. I prefer usuing one piece too just so you won't have to worry about having control of 3 things. I've been getting used to dealing with 2 pieces lately though.
kuenzel
Smash Ace
The people I play against are used to them and will **** me with them if I leave one alone. I NEED to throw two out right away or I can say goodbye to my first stock 
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
I've tried doing the "Marth Method." Lots of Nair and Bair to camp, I mean. It works against some characters because these moves hit hard and have high priority but they don't have the sweeping hitboxes so it's not very effective overall.
oOJaseOo
Smash Ace
Learn how to catch ^^The people I play against are used to them and will **** me with them if I leave one alone. I NEED to throw two out right away or I can say goodbye to my first stock
JayBee
Smash Champion
Kojin here.
Ive been learning ZSS for a little while, but mostly from vids. so bear with me if i dont know the technical specifics of this character. I really want to learn this character, but too often my instincts from playing Sonic are caught in the playstyle, and I'm assuming this is very bad. lol.
1: does any of her moves have IASA frames?
2: I've seen in vids how a ZSS will use either Down Smash, side B , or B, then right after do one those moves again. is it solely for mindgaming the opponent to run at them so they get caught by the second attack, or it is something else?
3: my biggest problem concerns understanding what is the best spacing for Zamus. And I also like to read about her best setups from her best moves, like Down Smash. which thread has this information in the best detail?
Ive been learning ZSS for a little while, but mostly from vids. so bear with me if i dont know the technical specifics of this character. I really want to learn this character, but too often my instincts from playing Sonic are caught in the playstyle, and I'm assuming this is very bad. lol.
1: does any of her moves have IASA frames?
2: I've seen in vids how a ZSS will use either Down Smash, side B , or B, then right after do one those moves again. is it solely for mindgaming the opponent to run at them so they get caught by the second attack, or it is something else?
3: my biggest problem concerns understanding what is the best spacing for Zamus. And I also like to read about her best setups from her best moves, like Down Smash. which thread has this information in the best detail?
DeliciousCake
Smash Lord
Useful IASA frames? Not that I know of. There was speculation a while ago that her Up-B might have had IASA frames, which could have potentially been game-breaking, but it was dropped.
Double D-smash is primarily for racking up damage. Repeatedly firing paralyzer shots is for forcing your opponents approach. Plasma Whip is her basic spacing tool, and you'll want to use it a lot if you're just learning her. The biggest problem is that she has no real setups for D-smash, aside from Plasma Wire at very low percentages. It's all about bait and catch.
Double D-smash is primarily for racking up damage. Repeatedly firing paralyzer shots is for forcing your opponents approach. Plasma Whip is her basic spacing tool, and you'll want to use it a lot if you're just learning her. The biggest problem is that she has no real setups for D-smash, aside from Plasma Wire at very low percentages. It's all about bait and catch.
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
I posted in this thread that her Paralyzer Shot might have some IASA frames.
noradseven
Smash Lord
Heh this is my game right here only add in alot of f-air, and u-air(yes even against grounded opponents as well.
But yeah these moves are like sniper rifles, you need precise spacing, normally using fastfall and c-sticking for the attacks.
I started using these attacks after I started getting punished from all but the most defensive over B play and neutral B and alot of it was learning how to fight against jerks who can run in and hit before your over B ends Snake/MK/Sheik.
Also down B mix ups are terrifying for opponents when you are doing this, example back air down B over their head, weather or not you do the second hit is the mix up, it gets beaten after people have fought against it alot, but **** it destroys even good players the first few times, and it works reasonably well as something to do occasionally as well.
I normally start doing this when the opponent is at a percentage where they will die from the attack. One of the main important parts of the mixup is to use the invulnerability of the first few frames of down B to dodge their counter attack of your approach in other words it makes them less likely to give you throw this out every once in a while.
jibbyjaont
Smash Journeyman
Keep your pieces close together.The people I play against are used to them and will **** me with them if I leave one alone. I NEED to throw two out right away or I can say goodbye to my first stock
Snakeee
Smash Master
You're right sasook o_O.
Something must be hidden in the pages!
Perhaps it's the secret to a legendary ZSS technique
Something must be hidden in the pages!
Perhaps it's the secret to a legendary ZSS technique
noradseven
Smash Lord
Actually it goes up to 82, but thanks to the way the redirecting works on smashboards, when you type in a page number of even 192312 or whatever it just goes to the last page, so there are no problems aside from the cosmetic ones.
DeliciousCake
Smash Lord
Well ****, I want to know what was deleted!
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
I haven't seen this talked about much...
I can not deal with Yoshi. Granted my only experience with good ones has been over Wifi (Jesus I wish I lived in a better area) but they seem to have an answer for everything. I can't out-camp them, obviously. Their grab is absolutely ridiculous, so most of my good approaches get squelched. The only option seems to be a really well-spaced surprise bair chain (until they drop their shield) but even that is very risky. Also, the traditional uair business I like to pull (as do most ZSS players) is hard because of Yoshi's down special that is not punishable on the ground because of the stars that knock you backward. So, you can't punish it with a grab or side-b. You can punish it with an aerial, but if Yoshi's doing his job, you won't be in a good position for that.
The saving graces are that the roll attack can be stopped with an uncharged paralyzer and Yoshi is easily edge-guarded. Incidentally, gimps are how I get most of my kills vs Yoshi (stage spiking and down-b spikes, or edge-guarding a bad recovery) because I absolutely cannot land a kill. Between that ludicrous grab range (which is only barely shorter than side-b and as long or longer than dsmash) and the eggs, a Yoshi that camps is a Yoshi I can't even get close to unless he wants me to. I have a harder time fighting Yoshi than Falco, MK, or Snake. I have to be doing something wrong, or at least I hope I am. Any suggestions?
I can not deal with Yoshi. Granted my only experience with good ones has been over Wifi (Jesus I wish I lived in a better area) but they seem to have an answer for everything. I can't out-camp them, obviously. Their grab is absolutely ridiculous, so most of my good approaches get squelched. The only option seems to be a really well-spaced surprise bair chain (until they drop their shield) but even that is very risky. Also, the traditional uair business I like to pull (as do most ZSS players) is hard because of Yoshi's down special that is not punishable on the ground because of the stars that knock you backward. So, you can't punish it with a grab or side-b. You can punish it with an aerial, but if Yoshi's doing his job, you won't be in a good position for that.
The saving graces are that the roll attack can be stopped with an uncharged paralyzer and Yoshi is easily edge-guarded. Incidentally, gimps are how I get most of my kills vs Yoshi (stage spiking and down-b spikes, or edge-guarding a bad recovery) because I absolutely cannot land a kill. Between that ludicrous grab range (which is only barely shorter than side-b and as long or longer than dsmash) and the eggs, a Yoshi that camps is a Yoshi I can't even get close to unless he wants me to. I have a harder time fighting Yoshi than Falco, MK, or Snake. I have to be doing something wrong, or at least I hope I am. Any suggestions?
fZk
Smash Lord
During a match against a Falco player, I found myself in the spot to stage spike my opponent with a bair as they recovered from below. I got the spike but when trying to get back to the satge with up-b I did the boosted up-b second jump, and the tether went right through the ledge and ended up SD'ing twice. I went from a possible 2-stock victory to losing the match, so that sucked.
The question is can the boosted up-b grab the ledge? I don't have my wii with me this week so I can't check myself this week.
The question is can the boosted up-b grab the ledge? I don't have my wii with me this week so I can't check myself this week.
Paradigm
Smash Ace
SFP - I moved to ZSS from Samus after giving up on Samus' potential in certain matchups. Yoshi is one of the few situations that I'll go back to my Varia suit. Yoshi can't chaingrab Samus, and Yoshi is tall enough that he has a hard time getting past the Zair/Hmissiles. I know "use a different character" isn't the advice you were looking for, but I've found this is one area where the unusual character selection for Sammy can be useful. If someone counterpicks you with Yoshi you can just let go of L/R. Hopefully someone else can give you a more ZSS-centric answer.
Often, when you're far enough under the stage that you can't normally reach with up-b, your opponent assumes you'd have already used your second jump if you had it and gets off the edge. Boost your up-b and you're back. This only works once, obviously.
Yes, the boosted up-b can grab the ledge. I use this at tournies.
Often, when you're far enough under the stage that you can't normally reach with up-b, your opponent assumes you'd have already used your second jump if you had it and gets off the edge. Boost your up-b and you're back. This only works once, obviously.
JayBee
Smash Champion
Supermodel From Paris
Smash Hero
JayBee
Smash Champion
awww.....i figured that but i thought there would be another...
i also want to confirm that when in close range, its better not to do the third part of the jab combo much, right? jab, jab2, then tilt, or something?
i also want to confirm that when in close range, its better not to do the third part of the jab combo much, right? jab, jab2, then tilt, or something?
Paradigm
Smash Ace
The jab is often - but not always - punishable. Some characters, like G&W, it works on. I think it works on everyone if they're in the air. The majority of the time, though, dtilt.
Snakeee
Smash Master
...Ironically the Yoshi you're playing is not very good if you're able to gimp him so easily. Yoshi is actually very hard to gimp unless you manage to footstool him.
Anyway, what you should be doing is keeping most of the battle to close-quarters while on the ground. Keep out of the distance of his eggs, and what I usually do is approach with caution, almost never rush in. You have to learn when his attacks will end, and when you can punish. If he approaches with b-air or d-air, he's usually going to follow up with another attack so wait it all out, and try to powershield the initial hit. after it's over you should usually go for a single jab or an f-tilt/d-tilt. Yoshi can't really grab out of shield, but his jabs can counter your own if you try to keep jabbing after your first one.
The main strategy is to find an opportunity to punish his approach, and get him in the air where you want him. Then he's almost completely vulnerable.
Also, watch out for his grabs, it's actually pretty good, and a solid approach. But, if he tries to CG you, you can just down B out of it if you mash it or time it almost perfectly.
lil cj
Smash Lord
Is ZSS good at pressuring the opponent
or is she better off camping?
or is she better off camping?
jibbyjaont
Smash Journeyman
I say it depends on playstyle and who the opponent is.
I'd go for uair, myself. Easier to escape from, and just as fast.Jab.
Snakeee
Smash Master
Don't even do the second jab. Against certain characters it seems that linking to a tilt will work out, but against a lot of them it doesn't. The thing that almost always works though is just do a single jab, and then Down-B away (dash away might work too,but I'm not positive).
ZSS' best 3 OOS options are Single Jab, F-tilt, and Up air
JayBee
Smash Champion
got it. hopefully I'll have some matches to show you guys and you can offer pointers soon.
one more thing: FSmash is useless, right? by that i mean i should never use it...
I also wanted to know if you could tech chase with UpB on the ground. like if you anticipate thier roll, then running Up B to catch them and reset the situation. I'm at school so i havent had time to practice this, but someone here might know already.
one more thing: FSmash is useless, right? by that i mean i should never use it...
I also wanted to know if you could tech chase with UpB on the ground. like if you anticipate thier roll, then running Up B to catch them and reset the situation. I'm at school so i havent had time to practice this, but someone here might know already.
Hey, I came here looking for ZSS frame data however, the thread that has the list of useful links for ZSS doesn't seem to have one. Well...It mentions it, but when I click on it, the link takes me somewhere else which I found to be quite odd. Does someone have the link to the frame data thread? Thanks.