Zelda, Shiek, or both?

[Champio30]

which do you prefer
Well.. I prefer both, really.
I raise % of people with Sheik, transform to Zelda, KO.

 

[powuh_of_PIE]

More Sheik mains prefer this than Zelda mains, simply because in this setup Zelda doesn't get much play time.

I prefer Zelda, but I'll switch if I need to.

 

[GKInfinity]

I typically play just Zelda, but it depends on the matchup. I'll occasionally use both, but pretty much never sheik by herself.

 

[Kataefi]

Both serve different purposes. One is versatile, very adaptable and incredibly quick and agile whilst the other is the terminator disguised as a sweet innocent little girl with sparkly powerzzzz!

There's ALWAYS a situation for them both at the player's discretion. So learn both!

 

[SinkingHigher]

I have found that one ALWAYS has an easier time with characters that are difficult for the other.

Learn both. Hands down best thing you can do.

This subject has been discussed many many times on both characters' boards, so use the search to get some detailed info.

 

[MRTW113]

To Sheik or not to Sheik
I use mostly Zelda, at least 80% of the time, because I can only do basic combos (Or attack chains) with Sheik. Sheik is just reserved for G&W and people like that.

 

[Scott!]

I only use Zelda, at least seriously, anyway. I just could never do anything with Sheik. I should change that. She's clearly useful.

 

[Oh Snap]

i use shiek from time to time but i feel more comfortable with zelda

 

[Shadia]

I use zelda 90% of the time, but sometimes sheik. I mained sheik in ssbm, but she's been nerfed so much in brawl I kinda get depressed when I use her. lol I'm gonna start training her soon though. ^^

 

[SSJ5Goku8932]

Using both can help,Shiek racks damge,Zelda for kill.

 

[Super Angry Luigi]

I only use Zelda between the two. I hate Sheik, and the only time I ever transform into Sheik is if I do it on accident.

 

[Ochobobo]

I need to practice a lot more with Sheik.

Just for the sake of it, I mean, not because I plan on switching to her very often. I still like Zelda way more, lol.

 

[GKInfinity]

Sheik's definitely worth learning and is actually more fun to play as IMO. Zelda is a little better though and I've mained her since the melee days so I'm definitely keeping her as my main.

 

[Dev2000]

i prefer sheik imo
shes better but thats just me...

 

[rathy Aro]

I use both pretty consistently though I've been use sheik a bit longer so she's better for me.

I switch if I'm having trouble killing, but also counter picking mid match when you realize you suck at the matchup is SO helpful.

On that note is there anyway to switch at the stage selection screen like in melee? I hate seeing my opponent pick Falco/mk/ICs and I can't do anything about it. =(

 

[Kataefi]

You can only select them from the character selection screen. I know what you mean though, it's annoying when they select someone and you feel you want to counterpick.

Zelda/Sheik as standalone characters do fine against Falco if you simply watch out for lasers (I prefer Zelda in this one because she kills him ridiculously early), Sheik does bad against ICs though Zelda destroys them, and.. good luck with MK lol he's a total ***** for everyone - but I'd start off with sheik and make the switch if possible against him personally.

My sheik is quite bad though, I need to really get down with the character and learn her tricks, which are plenty so I've heard ^^

 

[rathy Aro]

I prefer to start as Zelda against falco to avoid the cg. If I do that the matchup feels like its in my favor since I can switch and ftilt lock once I get enough damage.

Don't feel comfortable fighting MK with sheik. I like the range Zelda provides a lot more in that matchup. I'll probably go all sheik once I can get GR to DACUS down perfectly.

Maybe I'll randomly pick Zelda for double blind pick just to mess with my opponents head.

 

[bribri123123]

I like Zelda more because of her chain attacks, like U-Aaaaaaaa, it does alot of damage...

 

[Mr.T 07]

i use zelda absolutely 100% of the time. i mean, im good with sheik, but i like zelda better. so i just play as her. and i dont like switching in the match cause it leaves you open for attack.

 

[Scott!]

i use zelda absolutely 100% of the time. i mean, im good with sheik, but i like zelda better. so i just play as her. and i dont like switching in the match cause it leaves you open for attack.

Well, you can create openings for switching by hitting them offstage or something. It's just tough, since the transform doesn't take constant time. Good job not preloading the second character, game.

 

[RyokoYaksa]

Play me and see if you can, with a straight face, say that solo Sheik doesn't have an easier time than solo Zelda.

Zelda is still too slow to be truly dominant or otherwise a smart choice except in some niche matchups.

 

[mikekleman]

i use zelda absolutely 100% of the time. i mean, im good with sheik, but i like zelda better. so i just play as her. and i dont like switching in the match cause it leaves you open for attack.

another thing you can do is right after you die, transform right after you arrive on the platform. it will give you invincibility for a bit after you hit the ground. they will try to attack and it will leave them open for an attack. it lets you keep your invincability frames and is quite useful. lol works every time

 

[1UPChris]

I think using both is the best strategy, Sheik for the damage and Zelda for the KO.

 

[GodAtHand]

Play me and see if you can, with a straight face, say that solo Sheik doesn't have an easier time than solo Zelda.

Zelda is still too slow to be truly dominant or otherwise a smart choice except in some niche matchups.

I think you are in the wrong bored if you want people to agree with you. Unless you are talking about a specific matchup that I was not paying attention to.

I go Sheik VS Olimar, Mr.Gaw, Ike (perhaps), Wolf, and I think that is it. But even then I sometimes switch for the kill. DACUS does not help kill with Sheik as much as I hoped it would...

 

[goodkid]

I think they could potentially be high tier together, but I've been using Zelda solo for a while unless I accidentally press down-B, which is the only time I've changed to Shiek, I may have to learn Sheik if I want to win a tourney w/ Zelda >_<

 

[Kataefi]

Zelda's jab is slow. She doesn't have a quick frame 2 move or something to aid in closeup battles. But jabs tend to be short ranged... so fight at a range outside your opponent's jab game and you'll realise she's a lot faster from this distance ^^

Dtilt/FSmash range is good unless they're Marth/Bowser etc...! I've become really pokey with my Zelda now.

 

[-Mars-]

Sheik is better than Zelda against most of the cast. Imo there is no way that she should be higher than her on the tier list.

That aside, if you play Sheik and Zelda both at a high level there are only about five matchups where you will be at a sizable disadvantage which are Snake, MK, G&W, Lucario, and Marth. EVen then, you wil most likely have enough matchup experience against these foes to have developed your own tricks and things you can exploit against them to make your character able to fight against them.

Zelda's also fun as hell to play and if your really good with her she's going to cause a lot of people trouble. A really good Zelda is a very scary thing.

 

[Kataefi]

I'd contest that marsulas... I'm not doubting Sheik's abilties; she handles spam really well and that ftilt lock (especially to tipper usmash) saves her as a character, but I find Zelda to be more efficient in getting the job done quickly and efficiently IMO, especially if you learn not to stale her smashes and abuse dtilt outside grab range.

But I'm a player who prefers range and strength over speed hence my choice to main Zelda over Sheik (though I now play both). They both have matchups where they shine. But against matchups where they both do similar, I believe not one is better than the other. Obviously... if I'm going against GnW as Zelda, I WILL transform, likewise if I'm going against ICs as Sheik, I'd transform also... but against someone like Falco... I'd be comfortable playing whichever.

 

[-Mars-]

I'd contest that marsulas... I'm not doubting Sheik's abilties; she handles spam really well and that ftilt lock (especially to tipper usmash) saves her as a character, but I find Zelda to be more efficient in getting the job done quickly and efficiently IMO, especially if you learn not to stale her smashes and abuse dtilt outside grab range.

Honestly if you face an opponent who has a complete understanding of Zelda and her capabilities, it is far easier to space against her than it is against Sheik.

She has a mediocre projectile and possesses slow air and ground speed. In some matchups this becomes a huge problem and can sometimes make it hard to even land hits against players.........this is why you see very few Zelda players in the tournement scene.

Her recovery is also not as great as Sheiks. I don't think Zelda is a bad character, I just think Sheik is better.

 

[Volts]

With all the power Zelda has I find that I really don't need to pull out Sheik. Unless my opponent is really bugging with my recovery.

 

[Kataefi]

I'm going to use this reply to marsulas as a time of general reflection as to where I believe Zelda stands in the game. I'd encourage everyone to do this... I think we can realise her strengths and weaknesses this way and boost morale amongst her players (sounds soooo cheesy).

Honestly if you face an opponent who has a complete understanding of Zelda and her capabilities, it is far easier to space against her than it is against Sheik.

Fair point. Only very few matchups though. Her moveset is generally lingering and high priority for a reason. It's almost like she was built to make faster, agile opponents fall into her attacks when not whiffed, like a fly to a web almost. It's just most of her players tend to over-rely on these smashes and forget about everything else, me totally included, which is why she's misrepresented. People place too much faith in her smashes and are disappointed when they are predicted and *****, thus ditching her.

Put simply, she's definitely an easy character to pick up and play, but a really hard one to fully master. And when I say master, I mean play consistent to a point where you can very easily sweetspot and spot opportunities to sweetspot her entire aerial game. I believe this is a really difficult skill to learn in the game, certainly not the hardest, but one that takes so much experience to get going on a good level. I believe this is what puts her on par with Sheik, if not then slightly better.

The whole issue of predictability isn't that bad for Zelda either IMO, I find it opens up more doors to play around with opponents' minds. I find her moveset to be very safe in general and conditioning is her best asset. She's simply efficient whilst being notoriously difficult to punish. The only thing that ruins Zelda is baiting and punishment.... because of her committment to her moves in general.

I've changed my mind because I'm underestimating Sheik...I now think both characters run on the same line in comparison, almost exactly... I think the designers really took time to balance both of them out when you look at things really closely. If Sheik is played right she can rack insane amounts of damage fast and set up to tipper and edgeguard well, but if things go wrong or the opponent figures her out she'll become desperate for the kill and her setups won't work quite so well... if Zelda's played right she can moderately rack up damage well and spot good opportunities to kill her opponent unbelievably early, but when played wrong she'll be predictable and in turn demolished.

The reason I mained Zelda actually was because I was 2 stocks down against some player, and then did this dramatic comeback with LKs and a sudden (and totally random) urge of godly spacing and unpredictability and pulled it back fast... despite losing overall. It seriously opened my eyes and I thought to myself... ****!

Brawl's solely just a game of matchup knowledge. Someone who has perfect knowledge of Sheik will have an easy time against her, likewise with Zelda. Players just need to find ways of finding holes in their opponents' knowledge of the matchup by not fulfilling to stereotypes and doing brave and risky things ^^

So yeah! That's my overall opinion ^^

EDIT:: I swear no one ever uses her because she's a 'princess' archetype... alot of gamers actually factor this when making their decision to main a character =O (I hope this was somewhat of a good read because it goes on for aaages >.>)

 

[Ochobobo]

Good read, Kataefi. I love comebacks like the one you described, and Zelda's definitely the kind of character that could pull it off.

Whenever I have the option in an RPG or whatever, I'll always play as the wizard. I just liked that persona of being vastly underestimated at first glance. (and Gandalf was also my favorite character in LotR lol)

Zelda seems to be the closest one to a wizard in Brawl, and that ridiculous perspective of mine is why I usually play as her instead of Sheik, despite how awesome ninjas can be.

But wow, I just realized... Zelda's a Ninja Wizard!

http://www.danamongden.net/archives/images/mordor-vi_large.gif (lol, old gif)

Can't believe I never noticed that before. Too bad she can't be both at the same time, lolol

 

[Villi]

Zelda's a Ninja Wizard!

She's also a princess and former fatty. But she got Tae Bo tapes.

 

[Kataefi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUyZOBIOmwc

if only ^^

 

[Villi]

Shelda is cool! And ew Zeik is gross. >.>

 

[Ochobobo]

That's the strangest thing I've seen all day...

 

[Bandit]

It was kinda strange how their B recoveries kept their same animations while the rest of them were switched.

 

[Kataefi]

Shelda!

 

[-Mars-]

Kata I agree with your post. I still feel as if Sheik is a better character overall in terms of being a solo character and having better matchups.

But yes, I think Sheik and Zelda are both great characters that have a ton of......dare I say it?.............untapped potential. I think they complement each other well and now that we've established a thriving Zelda community....both of their metagames are quickly evolving.

Zelda has a lot of room to grow with this new stuff with her dtilt as we continue to explore the hitstun on several of her moves........this will keep me busy for a while.

Sheik has a dangerous secret in her chain and I hope to one day master it and all of it's wonders. I have a hope that Sheik will one day make certain prominent characters completely unviable because of her chain.

In about a year I want to get to a point where my Zelda game centers around mostly her dtilt and kill setups, while my Sheik game centers around abusing the hell out of ftilt and getting insanely early kills as well.

I'm certainly not discouraged with Zelda or down on her.........i'm actually enjoying her even more as of late.

 

[M@v]

Honestly I've been taking a much stronger liking to going all zelda rather than Zelda/sheik recently. I just a lot better with Zelda than I do with sheik. I guess its because Zelda was one of my melee mains, and I can still play her somewhat similar, meanwhile sheik got completely changed.