Sigrid Fiinikkusu
Smash Apprentice
Hahaha, Roy was an okay character. Technically he was the first Fire Emblem character you unlocked in melee, so Marth would be considered the clone in this case.
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Why do people NOW care about Roy and Mewtwo?
- Thread starter GreenKirby
- Start date
blayde_axel
Smash Master
lol. There you go. Sakurai's biggest flaw with the roster pick for Brawl.
cjrocker
Smash Ace
Uh, what?
You sir, are wrong.
•Col•
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,450
woopyfrood
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2008
- Messages
- 1,062
MOAR important links...
http://www.pokemon151.jp/cgi-bin/WebObjects/19960227.woa/2/wo/tvCke2UtbDtBmIF6nXQ0Tw/5.0.7.13
http://www.destructoid.com/five-day...ive-unfulfilled-brawl-pipe-dreams-71895.phtml
Also, since I got my copy of Melee (and a memory card to go with it) with all of the characters already unlocked, I always saw Marth as a clone of Roy...
http://www.pokemon151.jp/cgi-bin/WebObjects/19960227.woa/2/wo/tvCke2UtbDtBmIF6nXQ0Tw/5.0.7.13
http://www.destructoid.com/five-day...ive-unfulfilled-brawl-pipe-dreams-71895.phtml
Also, since I got my copy of Melee (and a memory card to go with it) with all of the characters already unlocked, I always saw Marth as a clone of Roy...
Dark Ryu
Smash Ace
Haha roy before marth? whaaa?
I remember I got marth before roy.
I remember I got marth before roy.
Quite honestly, I knew EXACTLY what I would be missing if ANYONE got cut. The moment I heard the word "cut" I prepared for the worst. Deep down, I feared even Mewtwo himself had a shot at being replaced... Just goes to show, prepare yourself for anything. I always knew I'd miss him if he weren't in the Smash series; I didn't need him to be cut to know that. The same goes for our other missing fighters. Doc, Roy, Pichu, Young Link... It was quite apparent that they were getting the boot (though I STILL felt Roy had one of the better chances of returning with a declonified moveset).
What I don't understand is that Sakurai said he'd bring back no clones... yet he STILL HAS THEM. And Mewtwo? That would've been one less clone in his book.
I just don't understand Sakurai.
It's for reasons like this that I seriously pray for a new Smash director... I don't know, Miyamoto would work nicely, or something.
Sukai
Smash Champion
I was hyper pissed when Roy didn't make it to Brawl, even to the extent that I considered not getting the game. He would have kicked *** in Brawl. Like the other returning clones, his moveset would have been tweaked, still using fire like he's famous for. His counter would have still been ****, and his Final Smash more than likely been a fire version of Marth's with some sort of over head super slash.
Roy would have been God tier and the only Meta Knight counter to exist.
A guy can dream...
Roy would have been God tier and the only Meta Knight counter to exist.
A guy can dream...
flyinfilipino
Smash Master
Except, you know, he didn't.
The Milk Monster
Smash Champion
If you want to get technical, he brought back Falco, Young Link basically, and Ganondorf as characters, but made them all completely different.
The Milk Monster
Smash Champion
Yeah I was pretty sure the only thing that they said was there were to be 2 to 3 3rd parties, which they did fulfill, another 3rd party would've been nice though.
flyinfilipino
Smash Master
REGARDLESS, SAKURAI SHOULDN'T HAVE CUT MEWTWO! HE WASN'T A CLONE.
/thread repeat
The Milk Monster
Smash Champion
Mewtwo needed to be in, Lucario Texture hack isn't good enough.
MasterWarlord
Smash Champion
Mewtwo should've been in over Ice Climbers, Rob, Toon Link, Falco, and Shiek. I lol if you object, and will explain if necessary.
blayde_axel
Smash Master
lol. I could understand Toon Link and Falco, but the others?
Sure! Explain away!
Showing some Roy love.
Roy would have been a hybrid of Marth and Ike.
Marth speed with Ike power. Not completely of course.
Such a shame. I'm not even going to talk about Mewtwo cause that's an even greater loss.
This has probably been said, but I'm pretty sure this was all due to meeting the deadline.
Which explains why is was pushed back like 4 times........
Roy would have been a hybrid of Marth and Ike.
Marth speed with Ike power. Not completely of course.
Such a shame. I'm not even going to talk about Mewtwo cause that's an even greater loss.
This has probably been said, but I'm pretty sure this was all due to meeting the deadline.
Which explains why is was pushed back like 4 times........
§leepy God
Smash Master
I blame the third parties. XD
Zylar
Smash Ace
I think people still would have bought Brawl, if they delayed it a couple times more to bring back Mewtwo and Roy.
(I didn't even know it was delayed back then...0_o)
(I didn't even know it was delayed back then...0_o)
Well let's just say, it was originally to be released: June 2007.
And really the only people waiting for it were people who loved melee.
Ironically enough, half of those people went back to melee a month after it came out due
to slow and seemingly noncompetitive game mechanics. I'd have to agree. Melee was way tougher
to master than Brawl, but then it did have 7 years to grow. Brawl is only 8 months old and already it's metagame has grown tenfold.
And really the only people waiting for it were people who loved melee.
Ironically enough, half of those people went back to melee a month after it came out due
to slow and seemingly noncompetitive game mechanics. I'd have to agree. Melee was way tougher
to master than Brawl, but then it did have 7 years to grow. Brawl is only 8 months old and already it's metagame has grown tenfold.
flyinfilipino
Smash Master
MasterWarlord
Smash Champion
Toon Link/Falco: Returning Original Moveset > Returning Clone
5 Pokemon > 4 Zelda/3 Starfox
Mewtwo has FAR more non geek popularity
Rob: Rob's sole purpose to exist is being a shock character, but the thing is we were expecting a shock character for Brawl, so it wasn't a shock. Rob isn't even the final unlockable like G&W was in Melee. He fails at being a shock character.
Shiek: Original Returning Character > Original returning Transformation
Shiek has no importance whatsoever to the Zelda series
Ice Climbers: No popularity whatsoever outside of Smash. At least Pit had a few people requesting him to be in and G&W was a shock character.
5 Pokemon > 4 Zelda/3 Starfox
Mewtwo has FAR more non geek popularity
Rob: Rob's sole purpose to exist is being a shock character, but the thing is we were expecting a shock character for Brawl, so it wasn't a shock. Rob isn't even the final unlockable like G&W was in Melee. He fails at being a shock character.
Shiek: Original Returning Character > Original returning Transformation
Shiek has no importance whatsoever to the Zelda series
Ice Climbers: No popularity whatsoever outside of Smash. At least Pit had a few people requesting him to be in and G&W was a shock character.
Zylar
Smash Ace
Mewtwo's Absence
This post was meant for the "How did you react when Mewtwo wasn't in SSBB?" thread.
There are rumors about as to why Mewtwo never showed up in Brawl. Even now, the secrets once hidden behind the curtain, whispers in the wind, and echos from the caves grow stronger. They twist and unwind their way out of the web of lies used to dismiss their existance.
But they exist. They tell of the most powerful pokemon in the universe's defeat. Yet the lie hidden beneath the lies have yet to be spread, the deeper secrets yet to be shown.
Let the light be made known.
Here is the truth suppressed by the darkness.
It was decided that the most legendary and powerful of pokemon, besides Mew, who is uncatchable, and only given, should be buffed up. They prepared to put the best care into his Brawl reincarnation: graphics, moveset, voice, and storyline-wise.
As a repayment to Mewtwo, Sakurai sought to rise him to demi-god tier, as close to broken as allowed. It was long awaited, and needed.
Yet, as Mewtwo's development went underway, he became overexcited about the prospect of the immensly popular pokemon bouting with his own creation. His bias favoring his own characters he created impelled him to create an equal to Mewtwo, and to buff him likewise.
He foresaw endless battles between Mewtwo and Metaknight.
That's correct, Mewtwo's destiny was to be equal with MK. Both restricting the other from the elusive god tier.
Thus the productions for MK began, while Mewtwo continued to be incredibly perfected. All testers, programmers, and staff alike eagerly performed their tasks. The first fight to the enternal rivalary was soon at hand.
However...
As they say, this town isn't big enough for the both of us.
Two overpowered characters overshadowing every other cast member was not the best for the game; it was deemed unstable. Even Sakurai himself could envision the metagame of "friendly games" possibly being reduced to M2 verses MK. He was in quite the predicament. Mewtwo long awaited his well deserved ascention, but Metaknight was new to smash was his own child.
The decsion as to which character was to be nerfed was heatly debated. Sakurai and supporters aruged that with the current M2 plans, nerfing MK would cause M2 alone to damage the game far more that if neither were nerfed.
Mewtwo supporters fought hard against the nerfing of Mewtwo with amazing passion. They ploclaimed the obvious truth that denying Mewtwo's right to ascension would cause terrible repercussions. Fans appalled by the Meele Mewtwo's representation demanded it, and Mewtwo is more well known regardless.
Neither side budged. But as the stalemate continued, a bridge was sought, desperately needed to continue production of the game. By then both sides were sick of debating. Thus they came together looking for compromise and came to this conclusion :
A game with one character in god tier is favorable as opposed to a game with two characters in demi-god tier, or one demi-god and a lesser-god.
So now the decision was to cut a character. With more influence, and with one final push, Sakurai insited that MK would be more benifical in all ways for the game. And he won.
Thus MK benefitted from the favor from his creator. And so M2 was cut down from the development, to lie as a ghost of his former self and a dark shadow of his future potential. Mewtwo gained the ultamite ban. Bannishment!!!
Soon after, this scenario repeated six more times, each time a potential character who's development begun, halted. Winning the debate the first time made Sakurai unstoppable in his control of the game development. Now currently known as the forbidden seven, their cries of injustice are not heard over the clanging of MK's sword. Each plagued with undeserved bannishment, least of all Mewtwo.
To this day Mewtwo lurcks behind the shadows of Brawl, beneath the layers of codes. He patiently lies in wait for that fateful day, for his glorious, golden opportunity to show Metaknight, Sakurai, the remaining characters, and all meele and brawlers alike his true power. The power that can only be titled to the best pokemon.
Mewtwo...
Will Strike Back!
This post was meant for the "How did you react when Mewtwo wasn't in SSBB?" thread.
There are rumors about as to why Mewtwo never showed up in Brawl. Even now, the secrets once hidden behind the curtain, whispers in the wind, and echos from the caves grow stronger. They twist and unwind their way out of the web of lies used to dismiss their existance.
But they exist. They tell of the most powerful pokemon in the universe's defeat. Yet the lie hidden beneath the lies have yet to be spread, the deeper secrets yet to be shown.
Let the light be made known.
Here is the truth suppressed by the darkness.
It was decided that the most legendary and powerful of pokemon, besides Mew, who is uncatchable, and only given, should be buffed up. They prepared to put the best care into his Brawl reincarnation: graphics, moveset, voice, and storyline-wise.
As a repayment to Mewtwo, Sakurai sought to rise him to demi-god tier, as close to broken as allowed. It was long awaited, and needed.
Yet, as Mewtwo's development went underway, he became overexcited about the prospect of the immensly popular pokemon bouting with his own creation. His bias favoring his own characters he created impelled him to create an equal to Mewtwo, and to buff him likewise.
He foresaw endless battles between Mewtwo and Metaknight.
That's correct, Mewtwo's destiny was to be equal with MK. Both restricting the other from the elusive god tier.
Thus the productions for MK began, while Mewtwo continued to be incredibly perfected. All testers, programmers, and staff alike eagerly performed their tasks. The first fight to the enternal rivalary was soon at hand.
However...
As they say, this town isn't big enough for the both of us.
Two overpowered characters overshadowing every other cast member was not the best for the game; it was deemed unstable. Even Sakurai himself could envision the metagame of "friendly games" possibly being reduced to M2 verses MK. He was in quite the predicament. Mewtwo long awaited his well deserved ascention, but Metaknight was new to smash was his own child.
The decsion as to which character was to be nerfed was heatly debated. Sakurai and supporters aruged that with the current M2 plans, nerfing MK would cause M2 alone to damage the game far more that if neither were nerfed.
Mewtwo supporters fought hard against the nerfing of Mewtwo with amazing passion. They ploclaimed the obvious truth that denying Mewtwo's right to ascension would cause terrible repercussions. Fans appalled by the Meele Mewtwo's representation demanded it, and Mewtwo is more well known regardless.
Neither side budged. But as the stalemate continued, a bridge was sought, desperately needed to continue production of the game. By then both sides were sick of debating. Thus they came together looking for compromise and came to this conclusion :
A game with one character in god tier is favorable as opposed to a game with two characters in demi-god tier, or one demi-god and a lesser-god.
So now the decision was to cut a character. With more influence, and with one final push, Sakurai insited that MK would be more benifical in all ways for the game. And he won.
Thus MK benefitted from the favor from his creator. And so M2 was cut down from the development, to lie as a ghost of his former self and a dark shadow of his future potential. Mewtwo gained the ultamite ban. Bannishment!!!
Soon after, this scenario repeated six more times, each time a potential character who's development begun, halted. Winning the debate the first time made Sakurai unstoppable in his control of the game development. Now currently known as the forbidden seven, their cries of injustice are not heard over the clanging of MK's sword. Each plagued with undeserved bannishment, least of all Mewtwo.
To this day Mewtwo lurcks behind the shadows of Brawl, beneath the layers of codes. He patiently lies in wait for that fateful day, for his glorious, golden opportunity to show Metaknight, Sakurai, the remaining characters, and all meele and brawlers alike his true power. The power that can only be titled to the best pokemon.
Mewtwo...
Will Strike Back!
flyinfilipino
Smash Master
Non-geek popularity? Lol
"Shock character" is just some term that people here made up. It's not his "sole purpose". R.O.B. did shock people when he was revealed.
Sheik is Zelda. Is Zelda important to the Zelda series? I would think so. Think of Sheik as an extension of Zelda. Is Ivysaur important to the Pokemon series?
Before people started b*tching profusely about every franchise being "represented" perfecty, people didn't mind what new characters made it into Smash as long as they were fun. And so came the Ice Climbers; people liked them, thus they returned.
MasterWarlord
Smash Champion
I still think the Ice Climbers should've returned, I just think that Mewtwo should've returned over them, and I also believe the Ice Climbers should've never been added in the first place.
By non geek popularity, I mean he's far more iconic.
Shiek is a far less iconic form of Zelda. . .Do you think she could get in as her own character? Hell no. Same goes for ZSS.
By non geek popularity, I mean he's far more iconic.
Shiek is a far less iconic form of Zelda. . .Do you think she could get in as her own character? Hell no. Same goes for ZSS.
flyinfilipino
Smash Master
Who knows; it was Melee back then. The point is, she's not separate from Zelda, so hurry up and forgive her already.
And people have been wanting to see Samus suit-less since the beginning of time.
pic by Akuago220
Hyper_Ridley
Smash Champion
Shiek hasn't appeared since Orcarina of Time. If anything she would be LESS important to the franchise now. There's no way she'll ever be her own character.
cjrocker
Smash Ace
Sheik was going to be in Twilight Princess; that's where her SSBB model came from. She isn't obsolete, yet I don't doubt she will be soon if she doesn't appear in another game. And she never will be her own character, is that even worth bringing up? They already have two Links, two Zeldas is overkill.
Geno was only in one game but people want him to return. Zelda and shiek are the same plus Shiek added something new to the game.
woopyfrood
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2008
- Messages
- 1,062
Wikipedia... Sources sound reliable enough, given they're... well, sourced.
Oddly enough, I never took into account how the older/more mature Pokemon fans had the tendancy to lean towards Mewtwo due to his dark nature. Awesome.
Also noteworthy:
http://supersmashbros.ign.com/poll/27/Do-You-Miss-Mewtwo
...I think I may love IGN now.
I hope the Mewtwo haters read that last bit slowwwwly and carefully.
cjrocker
Smash Ace
You do realize that the only people who care enough to vote are the ones that miss Mewtwo in the first place, right?
Exactly. The ones that voted either loved him or hated him. Neutrals obviously wouldn't bother.
Think about it.
* * *
I'm still holding out some hope for Mewtwo, Roy and Doctor Mario. As much as I want to say for the likes of Pichu (and possibly even Young Link)... I don't know. I haven't seen enough outcry for either, unfortunately.
Hmm. Perhaps we should be ranting for downloadable content at the same time for Mewtwo, Roy, etc.
Which reminds me, I REALLY hope that "HD Wii" thing surfaces again. More hope for us Smash Bros. fans for a possible Smash Bros. sequel... and, of course, for the return of some worthy faces (and hopefuls).
Shadow Huan
Smash Champion
BUMP 
Alter Roy's moveset, and I'll consider his return... He must've been planned because the FE stage's third area could very well be devoted to him... But Mewtwo shall return. Powerful, and ready to CRUSH the opposition... as he should have the first time around...
Alter Roy's moveset, and I'll consider his return... He must've been planned because the FE stage's third area could very well be devoted to him... But Mewtwo shall return. Powerful, and ready to CRUSH the opposition... as he should have the first time around...Indeed. If Mewtwo doesn't make it the next go round, there'll be hell to pay.BUMP
...Unless they cut Lucario to join the ranks of Mewtwo and Pichu, then I won't feel as bad. Not that I have anything against Lucario, it's just that if he IS cut, then we'll have the Lucario fanboys yelling at Sakurai alongside us Mewtwo people. Joining forces, 'twould be epic.
And yes, giving Roy an altered moveset is a MUST. I mean, if they can have three Fox's... why not two Marth's? Falco still has a LOT of Fox qualities to him; Wolf is nearly on a league of his own if it weren't for his Final Smash and B-moves being remotely similar. At least Marth and Ike are competely different.
Pelikinesis
Smash Journeyman
Mewtwo was a unique character with a completely original moveset? That's my guess for him.
Roy? If you had two kids, one who was brilliant and the other who was inferior in practically every way, you'd still feel bad if the inferior one didn't make it into college, right?
Well I'm biased. I mained both of them in Melee precisely because Mewtwo was bottom tier for awhile and because Roy was like Marth's ugly, disabled brother. I like me some underdogs.
Roy? If you had two kids, one who was brilliant and the other who was inferior in practically every way, you'd still feel bad if the inferior one didn't make it into college, right?
Well I'm biased. I mained both of them in Melee precisely because Mewtwo was bottom tier for awhile and because Roy was like Marth's ugly, disabled brother. I like me some underdogs.
woopyfrood
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 23, 2008
- Messages
- 1,062
Lucario fanboys seem to not notice that that would do that...they also seem to forget the giant uproar at even the slightest possibility at Ness be removed. Seriously, that happened at the possibility of Ness being removed, and when Mewtwo fanboys complain they act like it's something unheard of?
Of course, there are but a few LucyFans who act like that...
karthik_king
Smash Ace
Fanboy used riot
Genoisdabest
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- May 16, 2008
- Messages
- 62
Marth fans too intimidated by Marth's manliness shyed away and picked Roy as an alternative.
Seriously, people played Roy. While Marth was better, Roy was still favored by many.
Mewtwo sucking in Melee should not merit it not being in Brawl. Kirby was one of the worst in Melee. What they did to Kirby in Brawl (making him whupass) they could have done to Mewtwo. Mewtwo filled a niché for Brawl (the Pokémon antagonist). No one saw Mewtwo being dropped. Even with Lucario's inclusion, no one though Mewtwo would get booted.
Seriously, people played Roy. While Marth was better, Roy was still favored by many.
Mewtwo sucking in Melee should not merit it not being in Brawl. Kirby was one of the worst in Melee. What they did to Kirby in Brawl (making him whupass) they could have done to Mewtwo. Mewtwo filled a niché for Brawl (the Pokémon antagonist). No one saw Mewtwo being dropped. Even with Lucario's inclusion, no one though Mewtwo would get booted.