VaNz Stuff.. about Peach (Tactical Discussion)

[john!]

me and cpu lvl. 9 daisy say hello

 

[ShroudedOne]

Yeah...there are huge shoes to fill here, Get Low. I didn't want to post anything, but let's not get super ahead of ourselves.

 

[MacD]

funny enough, it seems westonballz might not be going to the tourney sunday anymore, so me and connor are gonna team now.

just like the good ol days, but i think connor sucks now so i'm scared

 

[Get Low]

Yeah...there are huge shoes to fill here, Get Low. I didn't want to post anything, but let's not get super ahead of ourselves.

I know, buddy. I was just being silly.

 

[DoH]

Mike G & Ryoko are the original team Peach Vision

Then Me & Xelic

Then VaNz and tec0

then Macd & alan/connor

 

[Get Low]

MacD and Vanz was my personal fave.

 

[MacD]

we are discussing doing that again at apex, only this time we'll be in shape so we won't suck

aka win it this time

 

[Get Low]

we are discussing doing that again at apex, only this time we'll be in shape so we won't suck

aka win it this time

I honestly think you guys could win next year. You two did great despite not being "in shape".

 

[ConnorTheKid]

funny enough, it seems westonballz might not be going to the tourney sunday anymore, so me and connor are gonna team now.

just like the good ol days, but i think connor sucks now so i'm scared

wow screw you dude

I got that boom boom pow gonna get top 3 this weekend ez

 

[Get Low]

I somehow remember when you two did the "Lady" and "Gaga" tags while teaming.

 

[MacD]

because it was amazing, DUH!!!

we in there connor. top 3 though????? you in there though

 

[ConnorTheKid]

lololol Lady Gaga tags almost as good as our (Sailor) Moon and (Tuxedo) Mask tags

 

[MacD]

lolololol moon and mask. man, picking tags is too good

like when me and vanz were mumu and sej

might have to think some up for this weekend

 

[ShroudedOne]

Mumu/Sej was my personal favorite.

 

[Ryobeat]

I need to start talking about Sheik here, I keep losing 2-1 to really good sheiks but I'm not closing it out. I went 2-1 vs Reno, Spawn, and Swedish Delight

 

[MacD]

i hope you guys enjoyed our tags this weekend. we certainly had fun with it

 

[Get Low]

I would like to take a moment and clarify that ShroudedOne and I are certainly not the most famous team on the Peach boards.

 

[AozoraX]

I need to start talking about Sheik here, I keep losing 2-1 to really good sheiks but I'm not closing it out. I went 2-1 vs Reno, Spawn, and Swedish Delight

http://www.twitch.tv/crouchingfiercetv/b/443236691

Starts at 4:36:00
I basically go on a 3-in-a-row Sheik gongshow.
I think it's worth bringing up the Sheik and Fox matchup; seems to be the rage among people who win vs. Peach. But I ain't no Armada.

 

[OliClutch117]

I wouldn't say that sheik is all the rage in beating peach, but then again there aren't any good sheiks in my area.

 

[Xyzz]

I wouldn't say that sheik is all the rage in beating peach, but then again there aren't any good sheiks in my area. I play PAL :D

Sheik is probably the second or third best character at beating Peach in NTSC. Puff is pretty much a given for our hardest matchup, and imho Sheik kinda competes with Falcon for second... CF is actually even better, but far harder to execute successfully, because while he has great combos and superior movement options, he pretty much melts upon touch as well.

 

[DoH]

i feel like falcon is harder to combo than sheik

 

[Xyzz]

Falcon is heavy, fast falling, and lacks fast aerials to counter attack at all. What's there not to like? :D

On a slightly more serious note: I suppose who we feel is easier to combo is mostly related to what we get to play more often (:

 

[ShroudedOne]

I would like to be able to touch either character so I can combo them.

 

[Xyzz]

Play Falco then :D

 

[Babatunde]

Sup Peaches! I have a question on FC fair. We know DA and turnip throw to aerial are pretty up there when it comes to our approaches, And when im not using these, i space with WD, Grounded bair, and Fair alot. Although it seems that FC Fair is too slow to be used as a consistent approach option in comparison to bair and nair, And dair just does not have enough priority to even be considered imo. Is our fair only to be used to punish lag and defend us greatly? Or should i be creative with it when i have the momentum?

 

[Whatislove]

Hey guys, when you're floating and want to do an aerial, whats the best way to hold the controller so you can maintain the float and use the c stick at the same time.

 

[Xyzz]

Sup Peaches! I have a question on FC fair. We know DA and turnip throw to aerial are pretty up there when it comes to our approaches, And when im not using these, i space with WD, Grounded bair, and Fair alot. Although it seems that FC Fair is too slow to be used as a consistent approach option in comparison to bair and nair, And dair just does not have enough priority to even be considered imo. Is our fair only to be used to punish lag and defend us greatly? Or should i be creative with it when i have the momentum?

You can use it for edge guards, combo finishers, offstage gimps or whatever you please to. Limiting the usage of a move to very specific situations for no apparent reason is usually not the best idea. Keep in mind what fair offers over other options and its drawbacks and you should find quite a few things other than punishing lag / defending yourself (e.g. yeah it probably is too slow to efficiently challenge fast moves of your opponent. But that doesn't prevent you from moving forward while doing it and claiming space that way, if you think that will work out)

Hey guys, when you're floating and want to do an aerial, whats the best way to hold the controller so you can maintain the float and use the c stick at the same time.

Unless you want to claw, you're probably stuck holding up on the control stick if you want to use the c stick for an aerial. I (and I think most other people as well) tend to use "A" for most of our float business. Also: There isn't a single "most efficient way" to hold the controller; just use what you're most comfortable with

 

[kalamazhu]

Sup Peaches! I have a question on FC fair. We know DA and turnip throw to aerial are pretty up there when it comes to our approaches, And when im not using these, i space with WD, Grounded bair, and Fair alot. Although it seems that FC Fair is too slow to be used as a consistent approach option in comparison to bair and nair, And dair just does not have enough priority to even be considered imo. Is our fair only to be used to punish lag and defend us greatly? Or should i be creative with it when i have the momentum?

keep in mind that fair has a lot more range than any of peaches other aerials.

 

[Babatunde]

And that would accomidate for the slow speed of float/the startup frames of fair?

 

[Eccupence]

Question: What's the best way to float when already in the air w/o wasting second jump?

 

[DoH]

Toad to float if you're in tumble or hold down then float

 

[KirbyKaze]

I wouldn't say that sheik is all the rage in beating peach, but then again there aren't any good sheiks in my area.

Whenever I played it from Sheik's side, Sheik vs Peach felt really lopsided except vs Armada. I think his float game and stupidly amazing speed on every action he does from shield really makes a difference.

I'm not sure what I mean by "really lopsided" though. I guess I was just comfortable? Then again my main training partner for a while was a Peach player (James <3) so maybe that's all it was. I dunno.

 

[knightpraetor]

I find peach's matchup vs sheik to be decent, but maybe i'm just not playing enough good sheiks.

I think sheik may have a very slight advantage, but I find sheik to be slightly easier than fox and I don't think fox is worse than 45:55. I also have yet to play these godlike falcons that can supposedly combo peach for massive damage. I think people's matchup conceptions are still living in the past. I feel she deserved to move up the tier list, but the vast majority of people seem to feel that she has 5 losing matchups.

Balance in a matchup can shift so much by just one small thing in your strategy changing, so it makes it very unlikely that people's personal matchup conceptions have any weight relative to the actual performance of top players. But then when the top player's performance doesn't match up to their own belief on what they think the matchup is like, then people just say that one pro is putting in more work and is at a different level than the others. Because of all this, it's pretty meaningless to talk about matchup advantages outside of explaining your thoughts to someone or asking the opinion of someone higher level whose opinion you respect.

1.5 years ago, I honestly never would have believed that marth could keep up with sheik at all, but the better i get, the more my opinion on the matchup keeps changing
...from my original 35:65 sheik to 40:60 to 45:55 with a 60:40 for marth on fd.

 

[ShroudedOne]

Her matchups aren't nearly as bad as they used to be (or as some people seem to think). I think Sheik is by far her hardest, though. At the very least on paper.

Everyone seems shocked when I say I think Falcon is even. Maybe I should rethink it.

Also, I don't think 6th relative to the other 5 means much. They're all extremely amazing characters.

 

[Xyzz]

I think CF is pretty good against peach... Dunno, his legs are just as bad as Marth's Sword in terms of stupid reach, he's even faster, and can actually kill Peach (of a grab no less) :D

But yeah, top 6 to maybe 10 are all amazing, and their matchups against everything are fairly manageable (ICs - Peach and Peach - Puff are pretty stupid though) (:

 

[Ryobeat]

I think matchups go like this from hardest to easiest

Puff
Fox
Falcon
Sheik
Marth
Falco

 

[Babatunde]

Started practicing FCed approaches! Cant wait to inplement them to my game!
But is the goal with FCed approaches ALWAYS Sourspot Bair/Nair -> Dsmash?

 

[The Irish Mafia]

Nope!
In using FC alone, you're going to create habits which lead to you having linear approaches. You should look into as many different FC applications as possible. I'm a big fan of turnip->fair.
Also, you want to use the advantage you get from your FC in a variety of ways, and generally as a response to what your opponent does about it. While FC-> Dsmash is generally a good place to start, some characters like sheik or falcon will rarely get shieldstabbed by the dsmash if you don't space it right. So you should FC into a grab instead! That's simply one alternative. You'll do best if you keep an open mind.

 

[Xyzz]

fc > dash away is also pretty fun: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AZvUo2dMEqQ

 

[Babatunde]

^That was nice! (And a bit trollish too XD)
And yea, Turnip to fair too good!
Also when dealing with projectiles we wanna get in close or retreat with fair right? With each option depending on whether or not the opponent is approaching.