Unpopular Smash Opinions (BE CIVIL)

[Wario Wario Wario]

While I don't agree with Kev's takes here (except maybe the one on Palutena), I will say that Lucas over Kumatora is probably one of the biggest moments where Smash's former "protagonists first" rule was a detriment. She's a way more fun character in a fighting context than Lucas, would provide a unique personality none of the other female Smash fighters have, and could probably house a very similar moveset. She also fits like a charm with Brawl's Hot Topic aesthetic.

 

[Perkilator]

Not sure where this falls on the "unpopular" scale, but sometimes Melee just looks ugly to me. Included are some shining examples of things I found... bleaugh.

Okay, I can agree. While it’s not completely ugly, it definitely didn’t age as well compared to other Smash games.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I feel like Melee's aesthetic is almost like the opposite of Brawl's - in Brawl, everyone has the proportions of their toyetic and plasticy canon counterparts, but photorealistic texturing; while in Melee everyone is given more realistic proportions and facial features but looks like an action figure.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

While I don't agree with Kev's takes here (except maybe the one on Palutena), I will say that Lucas over Kumatora is probably one of the biggest moments where Smash's "protagonists first" rule was a detriment. She's a way more fun character in a fighting context than Lucas, would provide a unique personality none of the other female Smash fighters have, and could probably house a very similar moveset. She also fits like a charm with Brawl's Hot Topic aesthetic.

Definitely.

I get why. Lucas was easy to retool from Ness as a character, and was intended as a replacement(even during Melee, the Mother 64 protagonist was going to replace Ness). So the choice was kind of set in stone for "easy creation" reasons. That said, yeah, there's lots of interesting characters who taken a backseat to a protagonist or otherwise(or sometimes we have cases like Spring Man where he was treated as close to a main character in some way but ultimately didn't get in, and apparently wasn't really a likely contender either. Though to be fair, any of those 15 listed were treated as "possible" for our purposes. Which isn't a bad thing~). So it can go many ways, due to various circumstances.

If you want a more funny point, Ness' main reason he was easy to get in is due to sharing a model design close enough to Mario to be retooled for Smash 64. So both Ness and Lucas were kind of lucky additions. XD

 

[Venus of the Desert Bloom]

Just get rid of Luigi. Bring in Spike instead.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

As fair as tone/aesthetics, I do find myself really missing the subtly... uncanny aspects of SSB64. Its hard to describe, but there's just a hint of ominous elements to it that never really quite came back to the series after that. Part of it is that the final game is so minimalist that one can effectively apply any unnerving view, but parts of really do feel oddly off in a way that few fighting games have tried, especially Smash. Even the character profile music just has this sense that there's something portentous potentially beneath the surface:

No future Smash title will likely go back to this kind of mood, especially given the grand nature of how the series is presented now, but man I'd love to see them do so.

 

[Champion of Hyrule]

While I don't agree with Kev's takes here (except maybe the one on Palutena), I will say that Lucas over Kumatora is probably one of the biggest moments where Smash's former "protagonists first" rule was a detriment. She's a way more fun character in a fighting context than Lucas, would provide a unique personality none of the other female Smash fighters have, and could probably house a very similar moveset. She also fits like a charm with Brawl's Hot Topic aesthetic.

I get why people want the “protagonists first” rule but I don’t get why people apply it so thoroughly to series with multiple protagonists and main casts. Like Ness is added to smash, okay good you got a protagonist, but then why can’t you add a side character from Mother 1 or 3 without their protagonists first? It seems like a very arbitrary rule that people want and it hinders the amount of creativity Smash’s roster could have.

 

[UserKev]

As fair as tone/aesthetics, I do find myself really missing the subtly... uncanny aspects of SSB64. Its hard to describe, but there's just a hint of ominous elements to it that never really quite came back to the series after that. Part of it is that the final game is so minimalist that one can effectively apply any unnerving view, but parts of really do feel oddly off in a way that few fighting games have tried, especially Smash. Even the character profile music just has this sense that there's something portentous potentially beneath the surface:

No future Smash title will likely go back to this kind of mood, especially given the grand nature of how the series is presented now, but man I'd love to see them do so.

To me, Smash 64 is more laid back and calmer. Old Smash had a "Mystery" undertone to it that you'd never be able to put your finger on that made its overall tone more immersive. I to would love for it to make a comeback.

 

[Champion of Hyrule]

To me, Smash 64 is more laid back and calmer. Old Smash had a "Mystery" undertone to it that you'd never be able to put your finger on that made its overall tone more immersive. I to would love for it to make a comeback.

I feel like it sort of had a dream-like quality to it and, looking back, it makes sense that the game was supposed to be a kid playing with toys. If a kid’s imagination is anything resembling Brawl or Ultimate I think I’d have some concerns about the kid.

 

[UserKev]

I feel like it sort of had a dream-like quality to it and, looking back, it makes sense that the game was supposed to be a kid playing with toys. If a kid’s imagination is anything resembling Brawl or Ultimate I think I’d have some concerns about the kid.

The subtle tone LiveStudio mentioned was also fairly present in Melee. Melee was the last Smash to follow the "kids toy" formula that Sakurai just forgot about.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I get why people want the “protagonists first” rule but I don’t get why people apply it so thoroughly to series with multiple protagonists and main casts. Like Ness is added to smash, okay good you got a protagonist, but then why can’t you add a side character from Mother 1 or 3 without their protagonists first? It seems like a very arbitrary rule that people want and it hinders the amount of creativity Smash’s roster could have.

Probably due playerbases most likely having connection to the main protagonist due taking control of them in the source games? Otherwise it'd be really hard to go represent a franchise in a way that appeals to everyone universally, including non-fans/newcomers that haven't experienced these series before.

Brawl seemed to try remedy on this with more addition to the existing series, such as Kirby and DK - however so far it seems side characters just don't interest Sakurai enough moveset-wise to expand on IPs (just look at Zelda especially) - or feature them first over a protagonist whenever introducing a new IP.
More often than not the protagonists end up taking parts of the side characters to include in their moveset, such as Ness and Lucas.

 

[Soy_Man]

Palutena is fan service-y and needs to go.

Bruh. God forbid a female character show 2cm of skin.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Palutena is fan service-y and needs to go.

Okay. I take a lot of issues with this.

This isn't okay dude.

 

[Baysha]

Brawl in the Family is the only good Smash Bros webcomic.

I feel like it sort of had a dream-like quality to it and, looking back, it makes sense that the game was supposed to be a kid playing with toys. If a kid’s imagination is anything resembling Brawl or Ultimate I think I’d have some concerns about the kid.

Brawl is the Smash 64 kid's imagination when they're a wannabe edgy teenager but they're still holding onto the things they liked as a kid and desperately trying to make King Dedede look badass and cool. Ultimate is when that kid is a young adult that gets into a lot of fights on Twitter.

 

[fogbadge]

I feel like it sort of had a dream-like quality to it and, looking back, it makes sense that the game was supposed to be a kid playing with toys. If a kid’s imagination is anything resembling Brawl or Ultimate I think I’d have some concerns about the kid.

it's been 20+ years, that kids an adult with anxiety now

 

[Diddy Kong]

it's been 20+ years, that kids an adult with anxiety now

At least 35 years old if he / she had a Ness and Samus toy at that age. Earthbound and Super Metroid weren't easy games.

 

[Brindor]

I honestly wouldn't mind if more of the third party characters are gutted for the next Smash Bros.
I like Sonic and Snake, but other then them I would not care if PacMan/MegaMan/Joker/Bayo/Cloud/Sora/Hero/Tekken Guy were marked for death from the roster.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

I honestly wouldn't mind if more of the third party characters are gutted for the next Smash Bros.
I like Sonic and Snake, but other then them I would not care if PacMan/MegaMan/Joker/Bayo/Cloud/Sora/Hero/Tekken Guy were marked for death from the roster.

I almost forgot how unpopular this opinion is, especially here. It's a shame, because it's hard to talk about Smash without the third-party discussion coming up in expansive formatting. To quote something I wrote a while back:

I mean, it was an interesting novelty in Brawl's heyday. I think they could've left it at a certain amount of third parties with various connections to the identity of Smash's publishers and it would've stayed tolerable.

And to be fair, that was basically what Smash 4 did in its base game, which few people had a problem with. But the moment they said third-parties were viable DLC candidates in the ballot was probably the point of no return, which led to the out-of-control spiral that Cloud introduced.

I even think depending on the third-party, the inclusion can be justified on other scales beyond Nintendo relations, but like I probably said before, the DLC we got just bloated it to unnecessary degrees. This made any really good third-party inclusion buried under a sea of excess, and it really hurts.
I think going forward, Smash really needs to double down on clarifying the criteria for who gets in. Ultimate bringing everyone back was a nice novelty, but also highlighted the major shifts and cut corners the franchise has made over time. Some of those decisions just don't match anymore.

 

[UserKev]

I find it bandwagon-y how the community goes haywire over the idea of a smaller roster. Hot take, Smash 64 is still a very fun game.

 

[Aligo]

I find it bandwagon-y how the community goes haywire over the idea of a smaller roster. Hot take, Smash 64 is still a very fun game.

It is fun until you play as link, I suppose. The main worry people have with roster stuff is that a lot of series will go poof, and representation in smash can go a long way towards promoting a series, which obviously benefits the fans of said series. Would anyone care about star fox if it had no characters in smash?

 

[UserKev]

It is fun until you play as link, I suppose. The main worry people have with roster stuff is that a lot of series will go poof, and representation in smash can go a long way towards promoting a series, which obviously benefits the fans of said series. Would anyone care about star fox if it had no characters in smash?

The overall point, Smash 64 is just genuinely fun. Star Fox is literally a Nintendo I.P, so it doesn't need to go anywhere. Series promotion has taken a turn for the worst, which is ultimately giving Smash a sense of deterioration.

 

[jamesster445]

My least favorite people in the Smash community has recently become people who love to complain about the Smash fans. These are people who love to lecture about how Smash fans only value 3rd parties over Nintendo characters simply because of hype (which to be fair does happen) while purposely choosing to ignore why it would be hype for some people. The kind of guy that would say the only reason people disliked Byleth was because they weren't a big hype 3rd party (hilarious when you remember that Persona only hit mainstream success a year before Joker was announced, DQ didn't have worldwide appeal despite being a monolith in Japan, Banjo hasn't had a game since the 360, and of course most smashers didn't even know what an SNK was). I call them Nintendo Knights, for how much they like to white knight the company. I won't name names, but I think we've all come across someone like this before.

What I dislike about them so much is that they prop themselves as these champions of "underdog" Nintendo characters. But if you actually asked them what 1st parties they would want to see, they will never mention actually wanting characters from new Nintendo IP. For example, they'll say they want a 9th FE character or PKMN over say an Advance Wars character (a series I'd like to remind everyone lost its Assist trophy, it's one real piece of representation, doesn't even have a song, and just got a remake making it relevant again) or newer Switch IPs like Astral Chain and Ring Fit.

At the end of the day they're just doing the exact same thing as the 3rd party fans, They just want characters from games they like. Which would be fine, but I can't stand the self righteousness of acting like you're championing underdogs while ignoring actual underdogs. While also still complaining about characters that they don't personally care for. I will never forget how so many people who unironically told you to let FE fans be happy for Byleth were among the first people to not let ARMS fans be happy over the announcement of an ARMS character coming to Smash.

TL:DR: They're just being this guy.

 

[fogbadge]

My least favorite people in the Smash community has recently become people who love to complain about the Smash fans. These are people who love to lecture about how Smash fans only value 3rd parties over Nintendo characters simply because of hype (which to be fair does happen) while purposely choosing to ignore why it would be hype for some people. The kind of guy that would say the only reason people disliked Byleth was because they weren't a big hype 3rd party (hilarious when you remember that Persona only hit mainstream success a year before Joker was announced, DQ didn't have worldwide appeal despite being a monolith in Japan, Banjo hasn't had a game since the 360, and of course most smashers didn't even know what an SNK was). I call them Nintendo Knights, for how much they like to white knight the company. I won't name names, but I think we've all come across someone like this before.

What I dislike about them so much is that they prop themselves as these champions of "underdog" Nintendo characters. But if you actually asked them what 1st parties they would want to see, they will never mention actually wanting characters from new Nintendo IP. For example, they'll say they want a 9th FE character or PKMN over say an Advance Wars character (a series I'd like to remind everyone lost its Assist trophy, it's one real piece of representation, doesn't even have a song, and just got a remake making it relevant again) or newer Switch IPs like Astral Chain and Ring Fit.

At the end of the day they're just doing the exact same thing as the 3rd party fans, They just want characters from games they like. Which would be fine, but I can't stand the self righteousness of acting like you're championing underdogs while ignoring actual underdogs. While also still complaining about characters that they don't personally care for. I will never forget how so many people who unironically told you to let FE fans be happy for Byleth were among the first people to not let ARMS fans be happy over the announcement of an ARMS character coming to Smash.

TL:DR: They're just being this guy.

that is one of those statements that everyone reading will think: they can't mean me

 

[jamesster445]

that is one of those statements that everyone reading will think: they can't mean me

"Wow these people are so wierd. Thank God I'm the only normal person here."

 

[Aligo]

I mean people should not hate on Byleth for being an FE protagonist, they should hate for the fact that they and the slithers are the bricks tied to the ankles of the game, dragging it kicking and screaming into the watery depths of cruddy plots.

As far as ARMS goes, ehh it exists. Min min is one of the characters of all time.

 

[fogbadge]

I mean people should not hate on Byleth for being an FE protagonist, they should hate for the fact that they and the slithers are the bricks tied to the ankles of the game, dragging it kicking and screaming into the watery depths of cruddy plots.

As far as ARMS goes, ehh it exists. Min min is one of the characters of all time.

Maybe jrpgs aren’t for you. I mean if you think that’s bad then I would suggest avoiding the rest of the series


P.s. just to be clear that’s a a dig at FE not you

 

[jamesster445]

I mean people should not hate on Byleth for being an FE protagonist, they should hate for the fact that they and the slithers are the bricks tied to the ankles of the game, dragging it kicking and screaming into the watery depths of cruddy plots.

As far as ARMS goes, ehh it exists. Min min is one of the characters of all time.

I know I threw shade at it, but I actually wouldnt hate Pepsiman and Colgate chan. From what I've seen, unlike Byleth they actually have something that resembles a personality. Does help that I've just accepted that they're probably going to be a lock.

 

[fogbadge]

I know I threw shade at it, but I actually wouldnt hate Pepsiman and Colgate chan. From what I've seen, unlike Byleth they actually have something that resembles a personality. Does help that I've just accepted that they're probably going to be a lock.

They don’t

 

[UserKev]

Birdo is such an underrated character. I feel like she's the most logical next echo and would be so perfect. I find it bizarre that Brido has been in countless Mario games, but is the least rallied character. Not to mention Mushroom Kingdom 2 being a literal home stage.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

My least favorite people in the Smash community has recently become people who love to complain about the Smash fans. These are people who love to lecture about how Smash fans only value 3rd parties over Nintendo characters simply because of hype (which to be fair does happen) while purposely choosing to ignore why it would be hype for some people. The kind of guy that would say the only reason people disliked Byleth was because they weren't a big hype 3rd party (hilarious when you remember that Persona only hit mainstream success a year before Joker was announced, DQ didn't have worldwide appeal despite being a monolith in Japan, Banjo hasn't had a game since the 360, and of course most smashers didn't even know what an SNK was). I call them Nintendo Knights, for how much they like to white knight the company. I won't name names, but I think we've all come across someone like this before.

What I dislike about them so much is that they prop themselves as these champions of "underdog" Nintendo characters. But if you actually asked them what 1st parties they would want to see, they will never mention actually wanting characters from new Nintendo IP. For example, they'll say they want a 9th FE character or PKMN over say an Advance Wars character (a series I'd like to remind everyone lost its Assist trophy, it's one real piece of representation, doesn't even have a song, and just got a remake making it relevant again) or newer Switch IPs like Astral Chain and Ring Fit.

At the end of the day they're just doing the exact same thing as the 3rd party fans, They just want characters from games they like. Which would be fine, but I can't stand the self righteousness of acting like you're championing underdogs while ignoring actual underdogs. While also still complaining about characters that they don't personally care for. I will never forget how so many people who unironically told you to let FE fans be happy for Byleth were among the first people to not let ARMS fans be happy over the announcement of an ARMS character coming to Smash.

TL:DR: They're just being this guy.

This post seems rather dismissive of what happened to Ultimate's cycle. But Imma need more evidence to back my theory up. What are you referring to in particular?

 

[jamesster445]

This post seems rather dismissive of what happened to Ultimate's cycle. But Imma need more evidence to back my theory up. What are you referring to in particular?

I'm not sure exactly what you're asking for or how it's dismissive.

I've just had the displeasure of having to listen to a number of people these past couple of years who love to whine about how the Smash community only favors 3rd parties (ignoring how even 3rd parties got their share of backlash) while acting as champions of "underdog Nintendo IPs" like FE or PKMN or other franchises that already had plenty of representation. Meanwhile there are actual underdog Nintendo IPs that could've used that support, again Advance Wars is the perfect example. The reason they don't is because ultimately they like everyone else is just asking for characters they like because they liked the games/series those characters came from. Which isn't a bad thing. But I'm not a fan of that kind of self righteousness. It's ignorant at best, and hypocritical at worst.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Trailers need to go in the next Smash - don't get me wrong, they won't, they're too major a part of the series' modern identity and give Nintendo too much extra press, capitalism gotta capitalism and all that - but at the same time they're a very major reason why Smash discourse is so toxic: days in advance of speculation, full animation to make the reveal something you need to make time for, that horrible sound effect - it all serves to make a character's inclusion a "validating experience", which then results in a character you like not getting in or a character you dislike/don't know getting in invalidating, as well as making any content that isn't a fighter (particularly mechanics) seem insignificant. Don't get me wrong, reverting to the Dojo or even revealing everyone at once would still cause some nasty discourse (I've read Brawl speculation threads), but it'd be way better than trailers.

 

[Opossum]

I mean I think the bigger issue there is people tying their own validation to video game trailers, being emblematic of deeper personal issues the person really needs to sort out, and not the basic marketing function of a trailer itself.

If you see a character you don't know get into a video game and your initial response is one of invalidation, there are some serious issues there.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

I'm not sure exactly what you're asking for or how it's dismissive.

I've just had the displeasure of having to listen to a number of people these past couple of years who love to whine about how the Smash community only favors 3rd parties (ignoring how even 3rd parties got their share of backlash) while acting as champions of "underdog Nintendo IPs" like FE or PKMN or other franchises that already had plenty of representation. Meanwhile there are actual underdog Nintendo IPs that could've used that support, again Advance Wars is the perfect example. The reason they don't is because ultimately they like everyone else is just asking for characters they like because they liked the games/series those characters came from. Which isn't a bad thing. But I'm not a fan of that kind of self righteousness. It's ignorant at best, and hypocritical at worst.

I just wasn't entirely sure what you were referring to. But I think I get it now. You're talking about people making broad strokes on the Smash community's preferences, correct? Because, yes, that's a problem.

The entire reason I came here was because I learned that standards aren't actually met in black and white strokes. Doesn't always mean it's fully justified, but there's an argument for every potential candidate, and that's perfectly understandable. Preference is subjective; but the way people disagree on preference often goes overboard.

 

[KingofFools]

I'm more or less fine with third party characters.
What I'm not fine with, however, is adding a DLC character to promote a Nintendo game that just came out.
In-game event? Absolutely, go nuts!
But an entire character? No.

 

[LoZ00]

A couple of maybe unpopular Ultimate takes:

• Ultimate has too many characters. It has become very overwhelming, to the point that characters hardly feel special now. In my opinion, Brawl had the right amount of characters, while Smash 4 had the right amount of “too many” characters, if you understand me.
• Ultimate added too many characters that radically change the way you play Smash. DLC is especially guilty of this. Back in Smash 4, Ryu and Bayonetta were the only ones and they felt special, while also being somewhat accessible (especially Bayonetta). Nowadays, we have Ken (who’s Ryu but more complex), Terry, Hero (admittedly a cool idea, but I would have foregone the critical hits), MinMin, Steve, and Kazuya. Kazuya and Steve in particular are just too outside the window for me to enjoy.
• As a whole, Ultimate was geared too much towards hype. From Everyone is Here to Sora, everything in that game’s lifespan was made for that purpose alone. It made everything feel a bit too… short-lived, in a way? I don’t know how to properly express this. But as long as you got a newcomer revealed, your mind would go towards the next one.
• Isabelle was the best addition to Ultimate. She has become something of a modern classic for Nintendo and Animal Crossing definitely deserved another character. If anything, Tom Nook could have stolen a spot and I would have enjoyed it. (I don’t like AC btw)
• In Ultimate, Link is a dumb character. You either go full BotW or you keep a more standardized version of Link (my preferred option).

And a couple of non-Ultimate takes:

• Melee was the best game when it came to handling clones. They really give the game a unique identity and a sort of charm. I don’t like Ganondorf as a Falcon clone, though.
• Smash 4 really had a good approach with stages. If anything, they should have brought back more from the past. I don’t get why people were upset in the first place: you wouldn’t be upset if the roster had, like, 75% veterans and 25% newcomers in a game as large as Smash 4.
• Finally, my definitive unpopular opinion: Smash 4 > Ultimate. When you take Smash 4 as the sum of 3DS + Wii U, there is nothing that Ultimate does better than Smash 4. The only things that Smash 4 could do better are mostly related to its roster: I would have replaced Robin with a few clones and I wouldn’t have added Roy and Cloud as DLCs, but anything else in Smash 4 is perfect. This is perhaps a hugely biased opinion because I remember playing extensively Smash for Wii U with my pals with literally any controller available (yup, even the 3DS), but I had to take this out of my chest.

 

[KingofFools]

A couple of maybe unpopular Ultimate takes:

• Ultimate has too many characters. It has become very overwhelming, to the point that characters hardly feel special now. In my opinion, Brawl had the right amount of characters, while Smash 4 had the right amount of “too many” characters, if you understand me.
• Ultimate added too many characters that radically change the way you play Smash. DLC is especially guilty of this. Back in Smash 4, Ryu and Bayonetta were the only ones and they felt special, while also being somewhat accessible (especially Bayonetta). Nowadays, we have Ken (who’s Ryu but more complex), Terry, Hero (admittedly a cool idea, but I would have foregone the critical hits), MinMin, Steve, and Kazuya. Kazuya and Steve in particular are just too outside the window for me to enjoy.
• As a whole, Ultimate was geared too much towards hype. From Everyone is Here to Sora, everything in that game’s lifespan was made for that purpose alone. It made everything feel a bit too… short-lived, in a way? I don’t know how to properly express this. But as long as you got a newcomer revealed, your mind would go towards the next one.
• Isabelle was the best addition to Ultimate. She has become something of a modern classic for Nintendo and Animal Crossing definitely deserved another character. If anything, Tom Nook could have stolen a spot and I would have enjoyed it. (I don’t like AC btw)
• In Ultimate, Link is a dumb character. You either go full BotW or you keep a more standardized version of Link (my preferred option).

And a couple of non-Ultimate takes:

• Melee was the best game when it came to handling clones. They really give the game a unique identity and a sort of charm. I don’t like Ganondorf as a Falcon clone, though.
• Smash 4 really had a good approach with stages. If anything, they should have brought back more from the past. I don’t get why people were upset in the first place: you wouldn’t be upset if the roster had, like, 75% veterans and 25% newcomers in a game as large as Smash 4.
• Finally, my definitive unpopular opinion: Smash 4 > Ultimate. When you take Smash 4 as the sum of 3DS + Wii U, there is nothing that Ultimate does better than Smash 4. The only things that Smash 4 could do better are mostly related to its roster: I would have replaced Robin with a few clones and I wouldn’t have added Roy and Cloud as DLCs, but anything else in Smash 4 is perfect. This is perhaps a hugely biased opinion because I remember playing extensively Smash for Wii U with my pals with literally any controller available (yup, even the 3DS), but I had to take this out of my chest.

Smash 4 controls like butt, though. I don't miss Mario throw combos, either.

 

[FazDude]

I'm more or less fine with third party characters.
What I'm not fine with, however, is adding a DLC character to promote a Nintendo game that just came out.
In-game event? Absolutely, go nuts!
But an entire character? No.

Not that I disagree, but I think this has only happened twice - Once with Corrin in Smash 4 (which was a whole deal), and the second time with Byleth (which was just a bad time to add a first party, let alone a FE rep, from a purely "hype" standpoint). I respect Corrin's inclusion a lot less, though.

 

[KingofFools]

Not that I disagree, but I think this has only happened twice - Once with Corrin in Smash 4 (which was a whole deal), and the second time with Byleth (which was just a bad time to add a first party, let alone a FE rep, from a purely "hype" standpoint). I respect Corrin's inclusion a lot less, though.

Pythra.
Pythra.
You forgot Pythra.

 

[FazDude]

Pythra.
Pythra.
You forgot Pythra.

I mean, 2017 is a long time away from 2021 (2017 being XC2’s release). Hell, even Min Min had less time between her debut and Smash reveal.

Granted, I do dislike Pythra’s inclusion, but for different reasons…