Unpopular Smash Opinions (BE CIVIL)

[LiveStudioAudience]

You know as much as it would defeat the purpose of Smash being a global crossover, a series of hypothetical SSB games that were regionally specific in terms of roster and focus really fascinates me as a concept. Just seeing how North American, European, and Japanese specific variants of Smash would all shake out in their final form just just be really cool to witness, even if its a practical impossibility.

Especially after learning about the British microcomputer scene of the 80s and early 90s, how that whole era would be paid tribute to in Smash would make the entire experiment worth it.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Smash 4 was also designed to be far more competitive. Ultimate just hit the nail on the head better thanks to more practice with the game's engine and less limitations system-wise too(3DS really hurt the technical side of development).

But yeah, the first three games weren't meant to be that way. Smash 64 was a fun idea, Melee was an accident, Brawl was meant to be as non-competitive as possible. Being purely competitive creates a far bigger barrier since we already have enough fracture between competitive and casual. The current design encompasses both, making it far easier for the fanbases to get along. Which is a much better situation, imo. Why would want stuff like elitism anyway? What purpose does it serve other than causing trouble? That's the only thing dividing it more would ultimately do. It's doing a great job overall of pandering to both, allowing them to get along better. That's a good thing~

 

[Oracle Link]

BOTW (shiekah slate ABilitys) and TOTK (Replaced Arm Abilitys) Links are by definition One Shots as the Shiekah slate Abilitys didnt stick arround for even one game! also they are incredibly unfit for a fighting game (Other than the remote bombs) so having a Champion Link and a Classic Adult Link is a waste of Zelda Roster Space!

There is no Good Reason to add Urbosa as one of the first 10 unique zelda characters in smash!

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I like the weird, experimental music tracks - 25M BGM, Environmental Noises, Swan Lesson, the 8-bit medleys, e.t.c.

 

[Oracle Link]

I like the weird, experimental music tracks - 25M BGM, Environmental Noises, Swan Lesson, the 8-bit medleys, e.t.c.

And i like sad music! I mean people seriously think that zero twos theme wouldnt work beacuse it sounds too sad? Bro its a boss theme!

 

[UserKev]

I find the competition scene the biggest curse on Smash and cringe. I know the gameplay can potentially add to in depth or whatever, but the competition scene makes Smash matches feel AI generated.

 

[Oracle Link]

I find the competition scene the biggest curse on Smash and cringe. I know the gameplay can potentially add to in depth or whatever, but the competition scene makes Smash matches feel AI generated.

Especially the stage selection in ultimate sucked because of the competitive scene every stage was flat but even those were banned Competivly!

 

[PeridotGX]

Especially the stage selection in ultimate sucked because of the competitive scene every stage was flat but even those were banned Competivly!

???

I don't know what the problem is with Ultimate's stages.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

???

I don't know what the problem is with Ultimate's stages.

Ultimate's new stages - especially in base game and FP1 - are rather minimalist in shape with very minor or no hazards, visually resembling competitive stages, but often have some kind of gimmick; attribute; or visual effect that makes it inappropriate for competitive play even with hazards off (Spring Stadium's ceilings; Mementos' size; and potential Northern Cave motion sickness respectively as examples). A lot of people have speculated that Ultimate's stages were designed for competitive play but without doing proper research on what competitive players like in stages.

 

[Opossum]

Ultimate's new stages - especially in base game and FP1 - are rather minimalist in shape with very minor or no hazards, visually resembling competitive stages, but often have some kind of gimmick; attribute; or visual effect that makes it inappropriate for competitive play even with hazards off (Spring Stadium's ceilings; Mementos' size; and potential Northern Cave motion sickness respectively as examples). A lot of people have speculated that Ultimate's stages were designed for competitive play but without doing proper research on what competitive players like in stages.

From what I've read, motion sickness isn't really a big issue for Northern Cave, especially compared to other stages with potential accessibility issues (Unova Pokémon League's darkness or Smash 4 FD's blinding light, for example). The issue is more so a copyright one, since it's borderline impossible to stream that stage due to Square-Enix's music copyright.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Honestly, I've heard more people complain about Spiral Mountain in regards to motion sickness.

Northern Cave is mostly fine I thought.

Regardless, Spiral Mountain is the only DLC stage stinker in my eyes. It's not competitive but it doesn't have to be. It just has to avoid making people sick.

The rest are really fun in their own ways.

 

[fogbadge]

Honestly, I've heard more people complain about Spiral Mountain in regards to motion sickness.

really? people get motion sickness from it?

 

[Opossum]

really? people get motion sickness from it?

As someone who almost never gets motion sickness from video games...

...Spiral Mountain (hazard form, at least) showed me there was a first time for everything.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Motion sickness is new to me, but am always uncomfortable falling great heights in games, especially from a bird eye's point of view which is always. In BotW and TotK for example I open my paraglider way earlier than optimal but I don't care.

Also unpopular opinon that's hated by everyone: Sheik is one of the most logical cuts in any case of a non Ultimate DX situation, same with Ice Climbers.

 

[LoZ00]

Also unpopular opinon that's hated by everyone: Sheik is one of the most logical cuts in any case of a non Ultimate DX situation, same with Ice Climbers.

I don't necessarily agree with you. I feel that ZSS is the most logical cut, but if we were ever to get a reboot or some sort of shenanigan, I feel that at this point I'd rather cut Zelda than Sheik. At least, Sheik's ninja prowess give us some sort of moveset capability. Zelda on the other hand? Nothing at all. All the abilities she exhibits in Smash are made up.

 

[fogbadge]

I don't necessarily agree with you. I feel that ZSS is the most logical cut, but if we were ever to get a reboot or some sort of shenanigan, I feel that at this point I'd rather cut Zelda than Sheik. At least, Sheik's ninja prowess give us some sort of moveset capability. Zelda on the other hand? Nothing at all. All the abilities she exhibits in Smash are made up.

not 100%, they're at least derived from the source material

 

[LoZ00]

not 100%, they're at least derived from the source material

I mean, that's true, but they are not moves Zelda does, with the exception of Phantom. It's as if Bowser's whole moveset revolved around Mario's power-ups. The issue here is that Zelda always played such a marginal role in her games. Sheik does too, but with her harp and the sheikah techniques and weapons they could use from BotW and Totk (don't know if they're still here, since I'm still playing it) they could at least build a functional and unique moveset.

 

[fogbadge]

I mean, that's true, but they are not moves Zelda does, with the exception of Phantom. It's as if Bowser's whole moveset revolved around Mario's power-ups. The issue here is that Zelda always played such a marginal role in her games. Sheik does too, but with her harp and the sheikah techniques and weapons they could use from BotW and Totk (don't know if they're still here, since I'm still playing it) they could at least build a functional and unique moveset.

hang on, you’re saying shiek can have moves from the games but Zelda can’t?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I mean, that's true, but they are not moves Zelda does, with the exception of Phantom. It's as if Bowser's whole moveset revolved around Mario's power-ups. The issue here is that Zelda always played such a marginal role in her games. Sheik does too, but with her harp and the sheikah techniques and weapons they could use from BotW and Totk (don't know if they're still here, since I'm still playing it) they could at least build a functional and unique moveset.

Not exactly like you mentioned. Three of her special moves is not from her, but her general magical ability has been showcased more than once. Her throw is derived from her telepathic abilities, but we have seen her be able to move stuff using magic(mainly open doors), so it's barely a stretch that she can magically throw someone. She's supposed to be a fairly strong magic user to begin with, and her Final Smash(originally) is the Light Arrows, who she is the keeper of.

Sheik isn't actually any better in this regard, as her only canon move was the Deku Nuts(and by proxy, the Light Arrows). Thus, it's not really a fair comparison here. They both are full of made-up moves overall(though Zelda has slightly more named ones). Moves do not work the same way as their source materials in a lot of cases, as transferring them over to a proper fighting game design requires clear tweaks. The way they are is actually quite fitting for a fighting game(Zelda's moveset being fairly bad is a different issue, though). To wit, Din's Fire being a giant explosion would give a huge amount of free damage and range. Farore's Wind would always send you to a safe spot if it worked more accurately. Nayru's Love would temporarily make you invincible. For the most part, only Din's Fire is super changed up from the concept, but it's also a more versatile ranged attack(though underpowered and too slow, yeah).

Also, to be fair, she's the reincarnation of the Goddess Hylia, and those are, from a different set of Goddesses, Deity-empowered spells. It's actually quite fitting for her to use those over Link, as she uses them in a different manner(which makes sense as she's a far more capable magical user than him). So it actually works out in a good manner(despite not being intended to coincidence with the whole Goddess factor). If anything, Sakurai gave the character a more unique factor that happens to make a lot more sense than her using them the classic way.

 

[fogbadge]

Not exactly like you mentioned. Three of her special moves is not from her, but her general magical ability has been showcased more than once. Her throw is derived from her telepathic abilities, but we have seen her be able to move stuff using magic(mainly open doors), so it's barely a stretch that she can magically throw someone. She's supposed to be a fairly strong magic user to begin with, and her Final Smash(originally) is the Light Arrows, who she is the keeper of.

Sheik isn't actually any better in this regard, as her only canon move was the Deku Nuts(and by proxy, the Light Arrows). Thus, it's not really a fair comparison here. They both are full of made-up moves overall(though Zelda has slightly more named ones). Moves do not work the same way as their source materials in a lot of cases, as transferring them over to a proper fighting game design requires clear tweaks. The way they are is actually quite fitting for a fighting game(Zelda's moveset being fairly bad is a different issue, though). To wit, Din's Fire being a giant explosion would give a huge amount of free damage and range. Farore's Wind would always send you to a safe spot if it worked more accurately. Nayru's Love would temporarily make you invincible. For the most part, only Din's Fire is super changed up from the concept, but it's also a more versatile ranged attack(though underpowered and too slow, yeah).

Also, to be fair, she's the reincarnation of the Goddess Hylia, and those are, from a different set of Goddesses, Deity-empowered spells. It's actually quite fitting for her to use those over Link, as she uses them in a different manner(which makes sense as she's a far more capable magical user than him). So it actually works out in a good manner(despite not being intended to coincidence with the whole Goddess factor). If anything, Sakurai gave the character a more unique factor that happens to make a lot more sense than her using them the classic way.

i feel the same is also true of her down special. Sure there’s a connection with the phantoms but not in the way smash does it

 

[LoZ00]

hang on, you’re saying shiek can have moves from the games but Zelda can’t?

Not exactly. Look, in order to better explain my issues with Zelda, picture this as an example:
What if, in Ultimate, we got Champion Zelda as a character? Champion Zelda's moves would have been Link's unique Sheikah Slate abilities in BotW, the powers of the Champions, and a couple of spells/abilities of the Guardians. She has shown both a close relationship with the Champions (she was their leader), and she used the Sheikah Slate. However you might agree with me that a Champion Zelda moveset feels out of place and that, in this case, they should have made a Champion version of Link instead, removing all the spells and Guardians stuff.
Everything that Zelda has in Smash are either vague references and a couple of spells that Link of all characters used.

With Sheik, this applies too, but at least I feel that what Sheik brings to the table (and it's not a lot at all) is unique to her, at least thematically. It would still be vague references, but I feel a bit better about Sheik.

With that being said, I would not be bothered at all if both Zelda and Sheik were removed in a hypothetical Ultimate sequel or, even better, a reboot.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

i feel the same is also true of her down special. Sure there’s a connection with the phantoms but not in the way smash does it

It's only slightly better in that it's fairly accurate to the attack a Phantom can use, but it's only akin to Farore's Wind(in that they both work near identically to the original, but clearly aren't the same).

That, Vanish, Transform, and Light Arrow were the most faithful respectively.

But yeah, good point~

 

[fogbadge]

Not exactly. Look, in order to better explain my issues with Zelda, picture this as an example:
What if, in Ultimate, we got Champion Zelda as a character? Champion Zelda's moves would have been Link's unique Sheikah Slate abilities in BotW, the powers of the Champions, and a couple of spells/abilities of the Guardians. She has shown both a close relationship with the Champions (she was their leader), and she used the Sheikah Slate. However you might agree with me that a Champion Zelda moveset feels out of place and that, in this case, they should have made a Champion version of Link instead, removing all the spells and Guardians stuff.
Everything that Zelda has in Smash are either vague references and a couple of spells that Link of all characters used.

With Sheik, this applies too, but at least I feel that what Sheik brings to the table (and it's not a lot at all) is unique to her, at least thematically. It would still be vague references, but I feel a bit better about Sheik.

With that being said, I would not be bothered at all if both Zelda and Sheik were removed in a hypothetical Ultimate sequel or, even better, a reboot.

zelda wasn’t a champion. also she has been shown using the runes in age of calamity so it’s less out there

 

[LoZ00]

zelda wasn’t a champion. also she has been shown using the runes in age of calamity so it’s less out there

Zelda was the leader of the Champions, even if she wasn't formally a part of them (perhaps?), so the connection between her and the group is still there.
She uses the runes in Age of Calamity, but I suppose they're abilities you still associate more with Link. Like, would you feel that a fireball would be a good reference for Peach?

 

[fogbadge]

Zelda was the leader of the Champions, even if she wasn't formally a part of them (perhaps?), so the connection between her and the group is still there.
She uses the runes in Age of Calamity, but I suppose they're abilities you still associate more with Link. Like, would you feel that a fireball would be a good reference for Peach?

but peach has used fireballs. and in a main series game rather than a spin off, so it wouldn’t exactly be a problem. Her side special is completely made up so it’d be better than that.

also I think you could probably get away with changing Zeldas specials in to light based moves that function the same if you wanted her to be more accurate to source material

 

[LoZ00]

but peach has used fireballs. and in a main series game rather than a spin off, so it wouldn’t exactly be a problem. Her side special is completely made up so it’d be better than that.

I think we disagree on what makes a good Smash reference then. My example with Peach wanted to show that I personally don't believe that something the character has done in their game is enough to warrant a moveset slot, as I think that a move should be an integral part of the character's identity, especially when it comes to special moves. Early Smash titles are especially guilty of this. That is not to say that I am right and you are wrong, it's just that we have different ideas and that's cool.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Sometimes, having an original move instead of a reference to something works better for a character's design.

Creative liberties aren't just a lazy way to fill movesets with "generic stuff" but rather a way to extend what is already established.

It's why Mario's non-special moves are mostly punches and kicks to make him a jack-of-all-trades rather than having every power-up under the sun.

 

[fogbadge]

I think we disagree on what makes a good Smash reference then. My example with Peach wanted to show that I personally don't believe that something the character has done in their game is enough to warrant a moveset slot, as I think that a move should be an integral part of the character's identity, especially when it comes to special moves. Early Smash titles are especially guilty of this. That is not to say that I am right and you are wrong, it's just that we have different ideas and that's cool.

I can see what you mean I suppose and while the vast majority of her moveset could be traced back to the games I wouldn’t call any of them as integral to her identity. Even the parasol has stopped being her signature move.

but I would also argue that nearly the entire roster has moves that aren’t integral to their identity

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Sometimes, having an original move instead of a reference to something works better for a character's design.

Creative liberties aren't just a lazy way to fill movesets with "generic stuff" but rather a way to extend what is already established.

It's why Mario's non-special moves are mostly punches and kicks to make him a jack-of-all-trades rather than having every power-up under the sun.

Though at least a few were taken from Super Mario 64, which just means he's lucky to have a decent set of moves to make a coherent moveset out of. Not something everyone has access to. Which is fine.

A good moveset isn't about references, it's about functioning properly while being fun. This extends as well to Echoes and various Clones. Tweaks will be needed down the line for future games either way(especially as the roster gets way bigger, it means that older movesets no longer function well enough due to a larger cast and need updates. Ganondorf, for instance, is not really much different from his Melee design nowadays, but the opponents include way more projectile and range users, meaning he cannot keep up in tournaments, but also that many others got far better updates than he did overall. Though ironically he's doing worse than his 4 self. Brawl at least was noticeably badly balanced too, so him being at the bottom after having a severe speed nerf doesn't feel as horrific. Ultimate having him bottom again after all these updates? Ow).

 

[LoZ00]

I can see what you mean I suppose and while the vast majority of her moveset could be traced back to the games I wouldn’t call any of them as integral to her identity. Even the parasol has stopped being her signature move.

but I would also argue that nearly the entire roster has moves that aren’t integral to their identity

Yup, that's true in a way. But Zelda feels like she ONLY has moves that aren't integral to her identity. Or rather, moves that honestly feel like... chosen just because she needed to be in Smash. I mean, sure, she's a mage. Cool. At least we don't have that many.
Generally, when characters have many moves that aren't integral to their identity, I put the blame on the philosophy Sakurai had while developing older titles. I can clearly see a shift in this sense from Brawl onwards. However with Zelda, the blame is all on Zelda herself and her role in the series. There is no way you could make Zelda work in Smash without picking generic references and bland spells just to make her work. Arguably, the only move you could use for her is the Light Arrow as a neutral special. But that's it.
For characters like DK, Samus, Ganondorf, or even Ridley in a way you could definitely add change some stuff to make them feel faithful to their source material.

But please, do note that faithful to their source materia =\= having their moveset filled with references. For example, a character that feels very close to their source material is, in my opinion, Joker. In Persona 5, Joker and the game as a whole are all about style, cockiness in a way. And Joker (while he could use his main attacking animation as a forward Smash) embodies so in Smash too. His moves are stylish, flashy, flow along very well. Even Arsène as a gimmick makes sense, despite not being faithful to his home series.
Going back, Marth uses a few clever references (Shield Breaker may reference the Rapier's effectiveness against armored foes, Counter wants to replicate the hit-counterattack flowchart of FE, though with debatable results) that make him somewhat feel like Marth in his source games. However, Marth feels right. He is a vanilla swordsman because his role in the first and third game of the series is just that: the righteous leader of the army that happens to be a swordsman. Even his stats are balanced!
But Zelda? What is Zelda supposed to feel like?

My issue with Zelda in Smash isn't all that related to Smash. It's related to Zelda's role in her home series as a whole. I probably will never be able to properly express my thought on Zelda, but it's a mixture of reasons, which can be boiled down to:
1. Zelda has a marginal role in her home series (she's mostly the namesake of the series, but in the games she does very few things before the endgame)
2. Her special moves (with the exception of the phantom, which is a good adaption of the move) are taken straight from Link because she lacks solid references.
3. Her standard moves are bland and uninspired magic attacks because Zelda is a spellcaster, though this is a rather minor part of her appearances. This is especially true considering that when Melee released, we only had gotten the first Zelda game, Zelda II, A Link to the Past, Link's Awakening (in which Zelda's absent), Ocarina of Time, and Majora's Mask (in which Zelda only makes a cameo), not exactly games where Zelda's spell casting abilities are shown in a significant way. I bring up this point because Zelda's moveset is mostly unchanged from Melee.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I guess my unpopular opinion is that the far majority of characters don't need reworks.

Tweaks? Sure, there's lots.

Full reworks? I can count that on one hand.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Now I'm curious who those five or less are.

 

[Oracle Link]

I don't necessarily agree with you. I feel that ZSS is the most logical cut, but if we were ever to get a reboot or some sort of shenanigan, I feel that at this point I'd rather cut Zelda than Sheik. At least, Sheik's ninja prowess give us some sort of moveset capability. Zelda on the other hand? Nothing at all. All the abilities she exhibits in Smash are made up.

Ive seen tons of disscusion surrounding this!
And while this is unpopular opinions cutting zelkda and leaving sheik is like if you cut adult and young Link and add Ravio (not a perfect analogy i guess) I mean Zelda is Pretty Important storywise and a beloved Character also like sheiks "moveset Capabilty" Can be filled out just as easily by Impa
Also yeah ZZS Is A Logical Cut and i much rather have a Metoird in the game instead!

 

[fogbadge]

Yup, that's true in a way. But Zelda feels like she ONLY has moves that aren't integral to her identity. Or rather, moves that honestly feel like... chosen just a character that feels very close to their source material is, in my opinion, Joker. In Persona 5, Joker and the game as a whole are all about style, cockiness in a way. And Joker (while he could use his main attacking animation as a forward Smash) embodies so in Smash too. His moves are stylish, flashy, flow along very well. Even Arsène as a gimmick makes sense, despite not being faithful to his home series.

i disagree greatly. joker's moveset feels quite understated in comparison to persona 5

My issue with Zelda in Smash isn't all that related to Smash. It's related to Zelda's role in her home series as a whole. I probably will never be able to properly express my thought on Zelda, but it's a mixture of reasons, which can be boiled down to:
1. Zelda has a marginal role in her home series (she's mostly the namesake of the series, but in the games she does very few things before the endgame)
2. Her special moves (with the exception of the phantom, which is a good adaption of the move) are taken straight from Link because she lacks solid references.
3. Her standard moves are bland and uninspired magic attacks because Zelda is a spellcaster, though this is a rather minor part of her appearances. This is especially true considering that when Melee released, we only had gotten the first Zelda game, Zelda II, A Link to the Past, Link's Awakening (in which Zelda's absent), Ocarina of Time, and Majora's Mask (in which Zelda only makes a cameo), not exactly games where Zelda's spell casting abilities are shown in a significant way. I bring up this point because Zelda's moveset is mostly unchanged from Melee.

i take it you haven't played many games. see zelda is the character out of all the recurring cast who does through the most personality tweaks across the series. the feisty pirate captain, the stoic one in twilight princess, the scientifically inclined one in botw. another thing worth noting is that when zelda was added into smash there had been only 6 zelda games and she was absent from two of them. there have now been 20 main series games and she has been shown to do many things. her main thing is of course her sacred power which banishes evil,. she used it to finish creating the master sword even imprison ganon for 100 years. zelda may not have done much at the time of her inclusion but she done loads now

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Though at least a few were taken from Super Mario 64, which just means he's lucky to have a decent set of moves to make a coherent moveset out of. Not something everyone has access to. Which is fine.

That is true. But even so, having simple punches and kicks would've felt very Mario anyway because he's never meant to be complicated.

Even if you remove the distinct SM64 references in the moves he has, the rest of his non-specials still feel very Mario.

Ganondorf, for instance, is not really much different from his Melee design nowadays, but the opponents include way more projectile and range users, meaning he cannot keep up in tournaments, but also that many others got far better updates than he did overall. Though ironically he's doing worse than his 4 self. Brawl at least was noticeably badly balanced too, so him being at the bottom after having a severe speed nerf doesn't feel as horrific. Ultimate having him bottom again after all these updates? Ow).

The problem is that while Ganondorf did get buffed, a lot of his worst matchups also did. Some through universal changes like the jumpsquat or reduced landing lag on aerials while others have even more sauce than in previous games. As a result, his buffs did nothing to help.

I do agree the relative lack of zoners and swordies is what made Melee his most viable incarnation though.

 

[Oracle Link]

i disagree greatly. joker's moveset feels quite understated in comparison to persona 5



i take it you haven't played many games. see zelda is the character out of all the recurring cast who does through the most personality tweaks across the series. the feisty pirate captain, the stoic one in twilight princess, the scientifically inclined one in botw. another thing worth noting is that when zelda was added into smash there had been only 6 zelda games and she was absent from two of them. there have now been 20 main series games and she has been shown to do many things. her main thing is of course her sacred power which banishes evil,. she used it to finish creating the master sword even imprison ganon for 100 years. zelda may not have done much at the time of her inclusion but she done loads now

True i guess i mean you could definitly give her some more intersting moves some ideas i came up with (Also no TOTK Spoilers please i have only finnished one dugeon)
Her non magic Normal could utilize the Rapier she has for a short while in TP
I do think she should keep her special because otherwise all of these attacks arent used anymore!
But her Smash Attacks could involve the Light Bow/ Arrows
And Her Final Smash should be sealing directly pulled from whatever game this zeldas from (or just use the calamity ganon seal as its pretty cinematic)
On a somewhat unrelated note:

Spoiler: Zelda TOTK Very Minor Spoilers

Also Pants Zelda Is Somewhat overated as she has a dress on in BOTW and TOTK for a majority of the important scenes

 

[fogbadge]

True i guess i mean you could definitly give her some more intersting moves some ideas i came up with (Also no TOTK Spoilers please i have only finnished one dugeon)
Her non magic Normal could utilize the Rapier she has for a short while in TP
I do think she should keep her special because otherwise all of these attacks arent used anymore!
But her Smash Attacks could involve the Light Bow/ Arrows
And Her Final Smash should be sealing directly pulled from whatever game this zeldas from (or just use the calamity ganon seal as its pretty cinematic)
On a somewhat unrelated note:

Spoiler: Zelda TOTK Very Minor Spoilers

Also Pants Zelda Is Somewhat overated as she has a dress on in BOTW and TOTK for a majority of the important scenes

well arguably the way her current final smash works is quite similar to that sealing of ganon

 

[Oracle Link]

well arguably the way her current final smash works is quite similar to that sealing of ganon

Yeah i know but it still somewhat made up so having the same basic concept with a more direct Reffrence would be cool!

Also we sorta got of topic right?

Here is a Unpopular Smash Opinion I would much prefer a regular non ghost Small Zelda over Tetra or Sheik
Why?
Easy if i ever play make a zelda pretend story in smash i dont want to have to use adult zelda together with Toon/ Young Link weird pet peeve i know But for my reason honestly having a Toon Zelda mii Costume would be enough!

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Now I'm curious who those five or less are.

Well....

Ganondorf
Sonic
Dark Samus
Daisy
Richter


Ganondorf maybe doesn't need a full rework at this point, but he does need major tweaking and has several moves that don't have much of a purpose other than being funny. Ganondorf "feels" as he should, but he's been awful for three consecutive games. He doesn't work in a balancing standpoint. If you're touching him up for balance reasons, might as well address his cloning issues and make him more original.

Sonic was rushed in Brawl, we all know that, but so was Wolf and I think he's largely fine as is. Sonic's issue is really one of conveyance. Spin Dash and Spin Charge are moves that serve different functions, but so many people mix them up because they're so similar in design. A lot of casual players don't even know there is a difference and I find that kind of issue unacceptable. If you're going to rework a special move, you might as well tweak Sonic to make him less "boring."

Dark Samus, Daisy and Richter are here for the same reasons. There is not a significant enough gameplay reason to pick one over the other. Lucina, Dark Pit, Ken and Chrom all have notable differences to gameplay. There are real substantial gameplay reasons to pick them up over their originals (and vice versa). Dark Samus, Daisy and Richter don't have that. The differences they do have are so small that accusations of being glorified skins are unfortunately accurate. And yes, having original movesets would be rad, but I'm not taking that into account. These characters are intended to be echoes, and they need to be redesigned as echoes.

 

[fogbadge]

Sonic was rushed in Brawl, we all know that

Guess it was appropriate he came with Sonic Rush music then



I’ll see myself out