Transcript of the SBR "MK Podcast" (Sonic section)//Steak Break Room:Sonic Discussion

[ROOOOY!]

He mains MK now.

I guess he knows him somewhat though.

 

[MarKO X]

Well, if anther, or any Sonic main for that matter, gets into the SBR, what will that do for Sonic? People will still probably be ignorant of what Sonic can do.

Of course, this is an ignorant mind speaking. Seriously, what would a Sonic main in the SBR accomplish?

 

[Kinzer]

Nothing, because having Sonic anywhere on you will destroy your chances of even getting an application considered.

Not unless you happen to be Tenki, though.

 

[memphischains]

having a sonic main in the sbr doesn't even mean anything.
it will make him/her the joke of the group if anything.

or... something like that

 

[clowsui]

you do realize that kel doesn't main anybody right?

he's switched characters ~6 times now

from like sonic to marth to mk to peach to pika and back to peach for this tournament, he may switch again :/

 

[aeghrur]

So Kel mains Azen.

 

[Sosuke]

So I been checkin out the Sonic boards a lil.. and.....

Is your whole board your general discussion thread?

Thats freaking awesome.

 

[darkNES386]

So I been checkin out the Sonic boards a lil.. and.....

Is your whole board your general discussion thread?

Thats freaking awesome.

Ouch

10FrozenSteaks

 

[Kinzer]

So I been checkin out the Sonic boards a lil.. and.....

Is your whole board your general discussion thread?

Thats freaking awesome.

The only problem is Mods hate us.

 

[Anther]

Just beat people with sonic, he's not as bad as the SBR thinks, and if people want to have ignorant discussions, so be it? Some people are gonna be *****, and if they beat you they'll give you a wide eyed expression and be like "Well, you are playing sonic." But **** them XD. He's fun and good enough to compete- doesn't matter if he's unjustly placed on the tier list, or if people declare dtilting limits all of his options. It happens ;p.

Kel was never really a Sonic main in my eyes, and it was too early in the game for him to be a true sonic IMO, plus he mained meta then anyway ;p... and typically mains meta..

Thanks for the tipsies and suches. Yall have thrown some pretty good steak at me and it's been showing lately. <3. Starting to perform really well with sonic is kinda fricken cool =].

Edit: oh, and btw, rest assured.. those bad recoveries aren't typical of me XD. Those vids aren't entirely representative of smart play... but they aren't horid anyways. tehe.. >=/.

Infzy totally called the surprise thing correctly. I still forget to watch for my second jump after starting the spins, and forget the properties when shenanigans like that happen. XD.

 

[Espy Rose]

Just beat people with sonic, he's not as bad as the SBR thinks, and if people want to have ignorant discussions, so be it? Some people are gonna be *****, and if they beat you they'll give you a wide eyed expression and be like "Well, you are playing sonic." But **** them XD. He's fun and good enough to compete- doesn't matter if he's unjustly placed on the tier list, or if people declare dtilting limits all of his options. It happens ;p.

This is the mentality I have. However, I like to break it here and there for good justice.
But yeah, the best reply to the SBR discussion, so what?

As I've said several times, the less people know about Sonic, the better. Makes it easier to **** 'em.

 

[aeghrur]

So I been checkin out the Sonic boards a lil.. and.....

Is your whole board your general discussion thread?

Thats freaking awesome.

So you should like, hang out at the sonic boards more.
Leave the Tink boards and your sanity, come with us. =)

 

[The Halloween Captain]

So you should like, hang out at the sonic boards more.
Leave the Tink boards and your sanity, come with us. =)

One of us....
One of us....
One of us....

 

[Camalange]

Steaksteaksteak.

 

[Renufus]

Sonic has a crapton of options available to him (although many of them can be beaten by only one or two strategies), and his saving grace for not only his approach but his entire game, are his grabs. His ability to punish even the slightest lag with a running grab is awesome, and he has some interesting options out of his throws, too. However, he is mostly limited by the player who uses him. Sonic has options for "mindgames," but if your opponent plays smarter than you, then you'll lose. Sonic's reliance on reading/tricking his opponent are both the strongest and the weakest part of his game.

What confuses me about this bold bit is that it is, by definition, what a middle-tier character is supposed to be, isn't it? I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't being high tier imply that you're at an advantage and being low tier imply you're at a disadvantage if skill is not a factor? If Sonic's ability to win or lose is determined only by the skill of the person playing him, shouldn't that put him smack dab in the middle of the tier list?

I wish this quote could've been our WCD. Overswarm's bias just oozed out of the real one (no offense to the guy or anything - but he even pretty much said himself that he's got a hate-on for Sonic... why would he not then get someone else to do our writeup?).

 

[Boxob]

What confuses me about this bold bit is that it is, by definition, what a middle-tier character is supposed to be, isn't it? I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't being high tier imply that you're at an advantage and being low tier imply you're at a disadvantage if skill is not a factor? If Sonic's ability to win or lose is determined only by the skill of the person playing him, shouldn't that put him smack dab in the middle of the tier list?

I wish this quote could've been our WCD. Overswarm's bias just oozed out of the real one (no offense to the guy or anything - but he even pretty much said himself that he's got a hate-on for Sonic... why would he not then get someone else to do our writeup?).

Why is it that a new poster from Canada who mains Link said perhaps what is the smartest thing in this thread?

 

[Jim Morrison]

Why is it that a new poster from Canada who mains Link said perhaps what is the smartest thing in this thread?

because you, me and everyone else here SUCK. It is the never-ending circle between the transitions of good and evil, how life will affect the tier list to all known exsistence. The hole consumes the energy you put in this, which will never be seen again.

 

[infomon]

No, it's just because Canadians have a natural affinity for awesome.

10icecapzones

 

[Jim Morrison]

No, it's just because Canadians have a natural affinity for awesome.

10icecapzones

10coldcountrieswherepeople****theirfamilies

 

[Boxob]

because you, me and everyone else here SUCK.

No, just you.

And Tenki.

 

[Jim Morrison]

No, just you.

And Tenki.

No, you, Haunter and everyone else suck. Counterproof statement, anyone countering will be deemed failure4life

 

[infomon]

...? Incest's illegal in my country, pal. Apparently it's perfectly fine in the netherlands tho?? lolol

 

[Jim Morrison]

...? Incest's illegal in my country, pal. Apparently it's perfectly fine in the netherlands tho?? lolol

I dunno, I just watched that South Park episode where they go to Canada when Saddam is ruling there

 

[The Halloween Captain]

It can't be all bad.

Total Drama Island is from Canada.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

It can't be all bad.

Total Drama Island is from Canada.

It is? When do we attack those maple syrup drinking hockey nuts?

 

[Napilopez]

Mr Canadian link gains +10 national points.

And yay new sig! =P

I'm always so lazy with my sigs, I just take the wallpapers I make, crop/resize them, and write my name and something Sonic related on them =P

 

[Boxob]

Mr Canadian link gains +10 national points.

And yay new sig! =P

I'm always so lazy with my sigs, I just take the wallpapers I make, crop/resize them, and write my name and something Sonic related on them =P

Still cool though :D

Now get a TV tuner and upload my **** you french fry.

 

[ROOOOY!]

I want some matches recorded and uploaded.
Ones where I don't suck, preferably.

 

[Sliq]

wut?

10 wuts

 

[memphischains]

oh hai sliq

 

[da K.I.D.]

sliq, im not sure if my TO is having any more tourneys but if he does have another one it will either be in 2 or 3 saturdays

 

[da K.I.D.]

another reason why MCs hate for you is transfering to me

Sonic has a crapton of options available to him (although many of them can be beaten by only one or two strategies), and his saving grace for not only his approach but his entire game, are his grabs. His ability to punish even the slightest lag with a running grab is awesome, and he has some interesting options out of his throws, too. However, he is mostly limited by the player who uses him. Sonic has options for "mindgames," but if your opponent plays smarter than you, then you'll lose. Sonic's reliance on reading/tricking his opponent are both the strongest and the weakest part of his game.

posted on page 7

personally i would be soooooooooooo incredibly happy and i would never say anything bad about mods again if you (SP) took that first paragraph of the post that you made explaining sonic, and put that where the weekly discussion synopsis of sonic is, because its much much more accurate and indicative of the character.

posted on page 17

What confuses me about this bold bit is that it is, by definition, what a middle-tier character is supposed to be, isn't it? I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't being high tier imply that you're at an advantage and being low tier imply you're at a disadvantage if skill is not a factor? If Sonic's ability to win or lose is determined only by the skill of the person playing him, shouldn't that put him smack dab in the middle of the tier list?

I wish this quote could've been our WCD. Overswarm's bias just oozed out of the real one (no offense to the guy or anything - but he even pretty much said himself that he's got a hate-on for Sonic... why would he not then get someone else to do our writeup?).

Why is it that a new poster from Canada who mains Link said perhaps what is the smartest thing in this thread?

the real answer is because you suck balls. and because you believe that some guy who comes in and says that same thing (albeit more eloquently) than i say half a week ago is smarter because you didnt look.

because you, me and everyone else here SUCK except for KID and tenki. It is the never-ending circle between the transitions of good and evil, how life will affect the tier list to all known exsistence. The hole consumes the energy you put in this, which will never be seen again.

i completely agree.

It can't be all bad.

Total Drama Island is from Canada.

is it now?
i just started watching that show and im actually enjoying MUCH more than i thought i would...

+10 to canada than

 

[Renufus]

the real answer is because you suck balls. and because you believe that some guy who comes in and says that same thing (albeit more eloquently) than i say half a week ago is smarter because you didnt look.

I think he might've been referring to my thoughts on Sonic's tier placement, which as far as I can tell are unique in this thread, rather than my thoughts on the WCD, which I can only assume are more or less universal.

 

[Jim Morrison]

i completely agree.

**** quote editor.

 

[BlueTerrorist]

edit:
Originally titled: Transcript of the SBR "MK Podcast" (Sonic section). Also known as WCD: Sonic! [beta]

So I finally got around to listening to this.
2:15:11

Alright guys! I'll write the transcript! I don't exactly know who the voices are right away, but I can separate them.

=================
"Tell the Sonic people out why he's so low on the tier list."


OS: "No disjointed hitboxes of any kind, spam works. And there's nothing that Sonic can do, because the only things that go around it are so telegraphed that the other person can just move out of the way. Like, I literally walked up to DastrnMarco and said
'hey, you're playing Anther's Sonic and you're down a couple stocks; Hold down and just hit A alot. He's gonna jump and do a neutral B. Shield and roll. Then down-tilt again. He then beat Anther's Sonic.'"

Umbreon: "But yeah uhm... I have a strategy to fight Sonic where I just ignore his hitboxes and it seems to work pretty well. I act like he's a moving target that doesn't attack and his moves always lose."

OS: "Yeah it's just like, all of his approaching aerials are, if they're any good, like... up-air, forward-air - You have to be in a very specific area(?). So if you just push yourself into a position where he has to forward-air, he's gonna do like 2 damage in the first hit of his move, and you just hit him with whatever-"

[1]: "Yeah, and the reason why I think he's so bad is because I don't think he has any options? I see Brawl as a game of options, and when you put him in a bad spot, he just doesn't have any options."

-silence-

[?]: "His up-B?"

[random voices: "hm? ye- uh. oh-- euh -??! &&&&"]

OS: "Well, his offensive options are another. He can up-B all he wants. I can just walk to the other side of the stage and" [laughs] "Smash really is a game of options, moreso in Brawl than it was in Melee. In Melee, a character was good if he had an offensive option. Period. If you could start it, then you could do it. In Brawl it's not really the case: You have to have an option for every scenario. That's why characters like Metaknight do really well and Snake- even though he's really strong and he has like, the perfect KO move with is up-tilt, has a great defensive game with grenades, his [?? breakdance step??] - he still doesn't dominate because he's so slow and... bulky in the air-"

[2]: "Yeah, in the air, he has absolutely no options for defending against people who can just juggle him."

OS: "It's really difficult for him to hold his ground because he really doesn't have the options that other people have."

[1]: "Yeah, he can't adapt as well"

OS: "That's a big thing too in Brawl. People will learn this as time goes on, but, when your character doesn't have an option in a certain scenario, the key to beating them is putting them in that scenario. Like once people realized that ROB had a blind spot the size of the sun behind him and below him, they would just knock him up with a 3% up-tilt or ... whatever and would end up doing 40% because what's ROB gonna do? D-air in the same place?"


==============

2:29: lmao stupid ad or something, I just started hearing a crappy low-qual version of "it doesn't matter" and I thought it was part of the podcast. I thought someone randomly started playing that in the background.

edit: oh, it was in Youko's playlist cause I opened SBR's podcast page to see if they did it before or after the Sonic discussion. lol.

You're Doing It Wrong!!! (Not directed to Tenki) Can't believe I missed this. Oh well, guess I'll continue to make fun of characters that are above Sonic when people complain about my Sonic .

"I'm too cheap!!"

 

[Daisy-Fan]

Many players change now. am happy for this ^^
Otherwise i will have i cpu soon.
i will play whit you! <3

 

[R4ZE]

I have said it before, and i will say it again. 90% of sonic mains dont understand sonic. If SBR doesent have a solid sonic main in their little group, then I don't think it is fair to expect them to understand sonic.

The tierlist is perfect if all the players are brainless. but if you have mindgames and skill incorperated, more can be done with sonic than most characters in that area. His speed and advanced techs make sonic more versitile in mindgaming. That is what i think not only SBR, but the smash community as a whole fails to recognize.

 

[infomon]

The tierlist is perfect if all the players are brainless. but if you have mindgames and skill incorperated, more can be done with sonic than most characters in that area.

No way. Link and Yoshi are very disappointed in your statement.

 

[Tenki]

I have said it before, and i will say it again. 90% of sonic mains dont understand sonic. If SBR doesent have a solid sonic main in their little group, then I don't think it is fair to expect them to understand sonic.

The tierlist is perfect if all the players are brainless. but if you have mindgames and skill incorperated, more can be done with sonic than most characters in that area. His speed and advanced techs make sonic more versitile in mindgaming. That is what i think not only SBR, but the smash community as a whole fails to recognize.

Unless by 90% of Sonic mains, you mean the ones that don't visit our boards and don't go to tournaments or make attempts to play at a competitive level...

every one just kinda... knows what they want to do with sonic all the time.. like:
-run straight, do some kind of attack


but i think sonic works better if you just mess around. there are so many alterations that sonic can quickly make on his own momentum. this can be an insane mindgame.



EXAMPLE: i am running at my opponent, he expects the attack at the same timing that i normally do, so i try to execute a skid-stop smash to alter the timing, i **** up the skid stop, but i still alter my speed, he executes his attack, and i wait while still moving toward him slightly slower to execute my dash attack. the timing is thrown, so i still win.


my point is, the usefullness of these techs doesent jsut come form being able to execute attacks quickly, or execute POWERFUL attacks quickly, it seems to be that main advantage of these techs are jsut throwing ur opponents timing off, mindgaming.. but the powerful attacks would be helfup for kills.

...you're way behind.

That stuff is common sense to like, almost everyone here lol.

edit:
Also, F-smash still doesn't work when MK spaces glide attack to drop over you :[

 

[Camalange]

lol I guess that's what happens when R4ZE doesn't pay a visit to the boards in a long time?