Tournament Mode [1.1.0] Community Patch Notes

[Eureka]

But it doesn't.

Do the following: Downtilt -> Dash -> Grounded Upspecial, It's hard to explain, but it like simply ignores the input. As someone mentioned you can indeed jump cancel it, but it's no where near as effective as catching opponents in the hitboxes and getting the kill.

Note: I just tested this on my 3ds, which has version 1.08 and you can flawlessly Downtilt -> Dash -> Grouded Upspecial and it will register the input the moment you enter it after dashing. This is not the case in 1.1.0 and is therefore a nerf, even if it's not listed in the mined data, it is still occurring.

This might be an unintentional bug, and if that's the case I hope it gets fixed next patch. I would really appreciate if someone could make a video on this and raise awareness.

You can not input anything in a characters opening dash animation except for a few things, dash attack or jump for example. Little Mac having a very long opening dash animation means he needs to jump cancel his raising uppercut if he wants to use it immediately out of a dash. To my knowledge, this is how it has always worked with Mac when using up b during the initial dash. Also, when you jump cancel you are still using the uppercut on the ground. You simply input up-b immediately after jumping. Hence why it's called jump canceling, you cancel by inputting a jump and then canceling that jump into whatever you're doing.

 

[Methacrylate]

I have a 3ds with 1.0.9 and a wii u with 1.1.0 so I can confirm that Bowser Jr.'s Clown cannon (neutral B) does more damage: Uncharged sweetspot increased from 7% to 8.5%; Uncharged sourspot increased from 4.4% to 5.9%; Fully charged Sweetspot increased from 18% to 20%; Fully charged sourspot increased from 12.6% to 14%.

This change is confirmed in the dantarion data as well:

Changed fighter_param_vl_koopajr.bin[17][2] from 7.0 to 8.5 <-- uncharged sweetspot
Changed fighter_param_vl_koopajr.bin[17][3] from 18.0 to 20.0 <-- fully charged sweetspot

These are the only changes to Bowser Jr. You can put a star by that change, Shaya.

 

[LancerStaff]

Need some help from somebody who can understand code... Pit's rapid jab finisher is supposed to be bigger but I can't find a difference horizontally. Could it be bigger in a different direction?

And Dark Pit has a different move with a bigger hitbox, but I can't identify it. Here's it's code:
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][1] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][4] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][7] from 3.75 to 4.19999980927

Unless it's actually knockback, since his arrows did get buffed.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Mii Brawler upair 9% -> 8%, first hit fair 3% -> 4% and other changes to Special moves are missing in the op

@ Shaya Can confirm these two and more changes to mii fighters:

: Feint Jump Kick (Down B 2) damage increased 8% > 10%

Foot Flurry (Down B 3) significant reduction of endlag when performed form the air. Data dump suggests a reduction of 10 frames.

: Shuriken of Light (Neutral B 2) damage increased at all ranges. I'm confident that only one of the new values has a decimal point.
1.2% > 2%
3.2% > 4%
4.8 > 6.5%
8.8% > 10%

Blurring Blade (Neutral B 3) - something has changed for this move to register all hits as a combo between the multihits and final hit, but I don't know what. Damage, duration, rehit rate, startup, and endlag are all unchanged.

Reversal Slash (Down B 2) endlag reduced. 40 -> 38

: Uair final hit damage increase 3% > 4% .

Edit: Lunar Launch (Up B 1) projectile knockback angle lowered.

Lazer Blaze (Neutral B 2) Damage increased at short and long range. New values have no decimals.
Short range - 3.6 > 4%
Long range - 2.6% > 3%

Grenade Launch (Neutral B 3) grenades now disappear upon making contact with a hitbox, similar to other projectiles. They used to explode on contact when attacked.

 

[OathToAwesome]

Nair, Fair, Uair, Bair, and Dair
Melee: 15, 15, 15, 24 iirc, 32. Dolphin Slash 34
Brawl: 8, 8, 8, 22 iirc, and 32. Dolphin Slash 34
Smash 4 1.0.0: 15, 18, 16, 19, 28. Dolphin Slash 23
Smash 4 1.1.0: 12, 16, 14, 17, 24. Dolphin Slash 20

Just to be sure, are those Melee landing lag figures including L-cancelling?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

The aerials are most certainly not including L-Canceling.

 

[TheWozny]

No, there were no such changes to Roy

That's a shame.... I feel like Roy's hitboxes on his ftilt and fsmash extend beyond the base of the sword.. KO-ing VERY early..

 

[TheWozny]

Edit:Double post

 

[Unowninator]

Okay, I'm pretty sure Mewtwo's back throw has been changed, I'm noticing that the angle is slightly lower & I'm finding that it kills much sooner at the edge.

 

[Linkshot]

@ Shaya Reversal Slash (Down B 2) endlag reduced (somebody frame counted this earlier in the thread. Can't find it.

Found Reversal Slash when labelling SubAction parameters, thanks for confirming there weren't any Frame Speed Mods interjecting.

Could you check Mii Brawler's Aerial Foot Flurry? I noticed some IASA changes in the dump.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Could you check Mii Brawler's Aerial Foot Flurry? I noticed some IASA changes in the dump.

Definitely faster to act out of the aerial version. No change to the grounded version. Good find. Adding to my list for the miis.

 

[Linkshot]

Definitely faster to act out of the aerial version. No change to the grounded version. Good find. Adding to my list for the miis.

Cool, the actual value for that, again assuming there are no Frame Speed Mods, should be changing from FAF 32 to FAF 22.

Reversal Slash (grounded and aerial) is 40 -> 38

 

[Deidara]

So I heard that G&W has changes, but no one wants to look into them. if this is true, you all suck.
I feel like this update kinda broke the game. no one was really buffed or nerfed to make a difference, but the changes were so weird. I can't believe Rosalina, Ness, Luigi, or Pikachu weren't nerfed. what the hell is Sakurai even doing? I feel like he loves Mario so much that he wants all Mario characters to be high tier. it's annoying.

 

[Linkshot]

So I heard that G&W has changes, but no one wants to look into them. if this is true, you all suck.
I feel like this update kinda broke the game. no one was really buffed or nerfed to make a difference, but the changes were so weird. I can't believe Rosalina, Ness, Luigi, or Pikachu weren't nerfed. what the hell is Sakurai even doing? I feel like he loves Mario so much that he wants all Mario characters to be high tier. it's annoying.

If you know what unk-F38E805D is, we'll know what G&W's changes were.

EDIT: The command seems to be on every character's ItemGrassPull script, so I'm not sure why it's on G&W's aerials.

 

[JamietheAuraUser]

http://smashboards.com/threads/new-update-has-altered-engine-and-reduced-input-lag.412566/

Could this be true?

If that were the case, I'd think that getting max hits off of MK's Mach Tornado would have become noticeably easier this patch, and it hasn't. Speaking of that, that's a buff that Meta Knight could really use: less mashing required for full Mach Tornado. (Also, semi-off topic but does Mach Tornado do more/higher damage hits if you're moving than if you're doing it in place?)

@ Shaya Can confirm these two and more changes to mii fighters:

: Feint Jump Kick (Down B 2) damage increased 8% > 10%

Foot Flurry (Down B 3) significant reduction of endlag when performed form the air. Frame count is unknown.

: Shuriken of Light (Neutral B 2) damage increased at all ranges. I'm confident that only one of the new values has a decimal point.
1.2% > 2%
3.2% > 4%
4.8 > 6.5%
8.8% > 10%

Blurring Blade (Neutral B 3) - something has changed for this move to register all hits as a combo between the multihits and final hit, but I don't know what.

Reversal Slash (Down B 2) endlag reduced (somebody frame counted this earlier in the thread. Can't find it.

: Uair final hit damage increase 3% > 4% .

Edit: Lunar Launch (Up B 1) projectile knockback angle lowered.

Lazer Blaze (Neutral B 2) Damage increased at short and long range. New values have no decimals.
Short range - 3.6 > 4%
Long range - 2.6% > 3%

Grenade Launch (Neutral B 3) grenades now disappear upon making contact with a hitbox, similar to other projectiles. They used to explode on contact when attacked.

Earlier in this thread someone mentioned a knockback change on Blurring Blade's multi-hits, which could account for the difference. I think the change specifically had something to do with an increase in Weight Knockback.

(It also feels like the last hit comes out sooner compared to the multi-hit. Also, is it just me or is there an increase in startup/minimum charge time on Blurring Blade? If they used Frame Speed Modifiers or an animation change to make the multi-hits slightly later while not changing the overall move duration, that would also do it. Again, I haven't heard anything about this in the data dump so it's probably all placebo, but that's what it feels like.)

 

[Linkshot]

(It also feels like the last hit comes out sooner compared to the multi-hit. Also, is it just me or is there an increase in startup/minimum charge time on Blurring Blade? If they used Frame Speed Modifiers or an animation change to make the multi-hits slightly later while not changing the overall move duration, that would also do it. Again, I haven't heard anything about this in the data dump so it's probably all placebo, but that's what it feels like.)

The data dump for Mii Swordfighter is largely unlabelled because I don't know what any of the parameters control. However, I can tell you that Mii Swordfighter does have the most parameters changed this build.

 

[Monadoboys]

Shulk's backslash has slower movement in the air.

 

[Kofu]

If you know what unk-F38E805D is, we'll know what G&W's changes were.

EDIT: The command seems to be on every character's ItemGrassPull script, so I'm not sure why it's on G&W's aerials.

This is the first I've heard of the "ItemGrassPull" script but it sounds like what's triggered when you grab the Grass item from the ground.

Several of Game & Watch's attacks pull articles for their animation, I've already guessed that the changes to his attacks simply have changed where in the code it pulls them from. But I'm not sure.

 

[Linkshot]

This is the first I've heard of the "ItemGrassPull" script but it sounds like what's triggered when you grab the Grass item from the ground.

Several of Game & Watch's attacks pull articles for their animation, I've already guessed that the changes to his attacks simply have changed where in the code it pulls them from. But I'm not sure.

I'm looking at other characters that pull out articles and they still only have it on ItemGrassPull. So far it's looking like G&W is the only one that has it elsewhere.

Shulk's backslash has slower movement in the air.

This corresponds to some values I posted a page earlier. Are Back Slash and Back Slash Leap's fallspeeds the same? And is Back Slash Charge about 20% faster than the other two?

 

[Kofu]

I'm looking at other characters that pull out articles and they still only have it on ItemGrassPull. So far it's looking like G&W is the only one that has it elsewhere.

What's the... following data for the ItemGrassPull script? Comparing it would be helpful. It's worth noting that it's already changed for Game & Watch between 1.0.4 and 1.0.8.

 

[Linkshot]

What's the... following data for the ItemGrassPull script? Comparing it would be helpful. It's worth noting that it's already changed for Game & Watch between 1.0.4 and 1.0.8.

ItemGrassPull

1 AsynchronousTimer(5.000000)
2 unk_F38E805D(0x2, 0x11000003)
3 AsynchronousTimer(12.000000)
4 unk_F38E805D(0x3, 0x11000003)
5 AsynchronousTimer(15.000000)
6 ?SetBit(0x2100000e)
7 unk_F38E805D(0x4, 0x11000007)
8 AsynchronousTimer(18.000000)
9 unk_F38E805D(0x4, 0x11000003)
10 AsynchronousTimer(30.000000)
11 unk_F38E805D(0x5, 0x11000003)
12 End()

G&W changes use unk_F38E805D(0x1, 0x10000086), was unk_...85) before.

 

[Kofu]

ItemGrassPull

1 AsynchronousTimer(5.000000)
2 unk_F38E805D(0x2, 0x11000003)
3 AsynchronousTimer(12.000000)
4 unk_F38E805D(0x3, 0x11000003)
5 AsynchronousTimer(15.000000)
6 ?SetBit(0x2100000e)
7 unk_F38E805D(0x4, 0x11000007)
8 AsynchronousTimer(18.000000)
9 unk_F38E805D(0x4, 0x11000003)
10 AsynchronousTimer(30.000000)
11 unk_F38E805D(0x5, 0x11000003)
12 End()

G&W changes use unk_F38E805D(0x1, 0x10000086), was unk_...85) before.

Huh. I have no idea. Or why his only has one and the ItemGrassPull has multiple.

But I think it's safe to say that whatever the change was it doesn't impact his game at all.

 

[Linkshot]

Need some help from somebody who can understand code... Pit's rapid jab finisher is supposed to be bigger but I can't find a difference horizontally. Could it be bigger in a different direction?

And Dark Pit has a different move with a bigger hitbox, but I can't identify it. Here's it's code:
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][1] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][4] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][7] from 3.75 to 4.19999980927

Unless it's actually knockback, since his arrows did get buffed.

If those are arrow sizes (Silver Bow, Guiding Bow, Piercing Bow), that's interesting. Can anybody confirm?

 

[GroundZero996]

That's a shame.... I feel like Roy's hitboxes on his ftilt and fsmash extend beyond the base of the sword.. KO-ing VERY early..

It would be very strange to change Roy already. He's less than two months old and he's already very powerful.

 

[Unowninator]

So, anything about my Mewtwo thing? Also, what do the stars mean in the chart?

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Was playing with link's customs to try and figure out something from the dump, and for some reason, the fully charged power bow is doing one less damage. I have no idea why it's doing 19% instead of 20%. There's no equipment, I'm playing in training mode, nothing to explain this change. And if this is a nerf to the move, I have to ask why just 1%? I'd like it if somebody could investigate the data dump for changes to Link's arrows.

Cool, the actual value for that, again assuming there are no Frame Speed Mods, should be changing from FAF 32 to FAF 22.

Hold on, there's more. The move naturally cuts Brawler's vertical momentum when in the air and stalls him for the move's duration. But if you were to land before the move's IASA frame, you'd suffer landing lag unique to the move. 39 frames according to this source. You don't suffer that lag anymore. In post-patch, Brawler's landing animation for the move still plays, but he can act as fast as if he was only suffering basic landing lag (2, 3 frames, however much it is for this character). The move is effectively lagless from the air. I did manage to get that landing lag under just one condition, using the move just under a platform will push brawler on top of it. Other than that, this seems like an attack with pretty good reward from the air, even if you hit their shield, you can double jump away before landing, or land for your own shield. What a wild update.

Earlier in this thread someone mentioned a knockback change on Blurring Blade's multi-hits, which could account for the difference. I think the change specifically had something to do with an increase in Weight Knockback.

(It also feels like the last hit comes out sooner compared to the multi-hit. Also, is it just me or is there an increase in startup/minimum charge time on Blurring Blade? If they used Frame Speed Modifiers or an animation change to make the multi-hits slightly later while not changing the overall move duration, that would also do it. Again, I haven't heard anything about this in the data dump so it's probably all placebo, but that's what it feels like.)

There's definitely no change to the move's damage, duration, startup, or endlag. I've compared the move post and pre-patch multiple times and have no idea what would make the combo counter so consistently different. If there were such a thing as hitstun multipliers, that's all I could think of, since the combo counter should be accurate at communicating hitstun. Regardless, there appears to be no change to the move's function.

 

[Masonomace]

This corresponds to some values I posted a page earlier. Are Back Slash and Back Slash Leap's fallspeeds the same? And is Back Slash Charge about 20% faster than the other two?

Back Slash Leap by far has the fastest fall speed. Even though Shulk leaps in the air he falls down so quick that he lands before BS or BSC. Back Slash & Back Slash Charge have a very similar fall speed (pre-patch BS & BSC had the exact same startup which meant they had the exact same fall speeds landing at the same time), but when I tested the speed comparison in Training Mode (Hold L) 1/4 speed, I used 3 scenarios:

1. Starting from the floor --- Both simultaneously inputted land at the same time
2. Starting from the lower level platform --- Both simultaneously inputted land at the same time
3. From a large custom stage I created that goes from the green outline's floor up 56 grid units. So both Shulks start from 56 units high, & BS vs BSC shows that BSC lands just before BS does

56 units high for a test sounds extreme but it's the maximum height you can create in a large custom stage so I thought I'd try it.

 

[Schiffe]

If those are arrow sizes (Silver Bow, Guiding Bow, Piercing Bow), that's interesting. Can anybody confirm?

@ LancerStaff

Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][1] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768
Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][4] from 3.5 to 3.70000004768

Size? I believe this is more likely to be the damage. I can only find one value corresponding to that odd number. Unsure which attack this hitbox may represent as I don't play Dark Pit, but it has to be a non-charged arrow as it was located in his "bowarrows" bin file.

As for "007", or this..

Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][7] from 3.75 to 4.19999980927

Couldn't find it anywhere. So I have no clue what this change might be

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

@ LancerStaff

Changed fighter_param_vl_pitb.bin[19][7] from 3.75 to 4.19999980927

Couldn't find it anywhere. So I have no clue what this change might be

I believe this change is the standard silver bow, because in post patch, the damage is higher than 4. In pre-patch, it was a high 3 (that is, it was 3 with a decimal that almost reaches 4%)

Dark Pit's guiding bow custom was increased in damage in this patch, but it's only changed from about a 2.5 to a somewhat higher 2 when uncharged. And I don't think Piercing Bow has changed in terms of damage. I'm getting the same numbers on both patches with charged and uncharged hits.

 

[Ffamran]

Er... With decimals, can't you just hit someone 10 times to see it? You don't have to say a "higher 2" or whatever.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

Er... With decimals, can't you just hit someone 10 times to see it? You don't have to say a "higher 2" or whatever.

100 times. It was 3.75 before, and you would need 100 shots to get that accurate of a number. Even after your 100th shot, it's not like the game will tell you, "yep! You've narrowed down the precise damage by this point!". Now with a damage value of
4.19999980927, guess how many shots we'd need to confirm that using just the game.

Much more reasonable to have game files tell you the value.

 

[Ffamran]

Oh, well, yeah, but really? 4.19999980927%? Come on, developers, just make it 4.2%. I swear that one day some character's attack is going to do a 12.000000009% and that ends up breaking their kills since they would be 0.000000001% off... Well, whatever. Carry on, everyone.

 

[hiramsthoughts]

Haven't been able to glide toss, can anyone confirm if it's still in the game? (Glide toss with z toss and c-stick, not jump cancelled toss)

 

[Thinkaman]

Hey @ Shaya , amateur hour is over, let's pound this out:

Note: I prefer quoting endframes in terms of the data numbers, which are 1 higher than how many people have been stating them based on video. The changes in the op use a mix of both.

complete
d-throw endframe changed from 74 to 71
air dodge invincibility ends 1 frame sooner (27 -> 26), but spotdodge, rolls, and air dodge each end one frame sooner
includes changes to Luigi Fireballs, Fox Laser, Marth/Lucina Shield Breaker,
2 mystery param changes
3 mystery param changes (up-b fall speed?)
grab end 56 -> 51, dash grab end 66 -> 61, pivot grab 66 -> 61, mystery param 17 -> 19
3 mystery param changes
subaction 251 allows movement on frame 32 -> 22; this is probably represented in the listed change, but it's a different number
uair endframe 66 -> 62
a billion mystery param changes
dtilt endframe 42 -> 40, I'm seeing her grab endframes length increased (34 -> 35, 42 -> 44, 40 -> 49) but it seems to animate faster and feel faster in-game. I don't see a frame speed mult? no clue what is going on here, needs more investigation.
the three mystery param changes are obviously arrow damage, which is already listed
5 mystery param changes (up-b movement?)
3 mystery param changes (back slash movement?)
a billion mystery param changes -- the first 2 are neutral b healing, including Sweeping

Oh, well, yeah, but really? 4.19999980927%? Come on, developers, just make it 4.2%. I swear that one day some character's attack is going to do a 12.000000009% and that ends up breaking their kills since they would be 0.000000001% off... Well, whatever. Carry on, everyone.

I don't think you understand how math/floats work. It is literally impossible to express 4.2 as a binary set of powers of 2.

 

[LancerStaff]

If those are arrow sizes (Silver Bow, Guiding Bow, Piercing Bow), that's interesting. Can anybody confirm?

Sorry for taking so long...

Doesn't appear to be.

What I am sure about is Pit's rapid jab is bigger at the base. Opponents can get stuck between Dark Pit and the finisher while with Pit they can't.

I believe this change is the standard silver bow, because in post patch, the damage is higher than 4. In pre-patch, it was a high 3 (that is, it was 3 with a decimal that almost reaches 4%)

Dark Pit's guiding bow custom was increased in damage in this patch, but it's only changed from about a 2.5 to a somewhat higher 2 when uncharged. And I don't think Piercing Bow has changed in terms of damage. I'm getting the same numbers on both patches with charged and uncharged hits.

Yaknow, that's actually it. Just tested it on my two 3DS systems. That's gotta be the most insignificant damage buff ever... Even fully charged there's barely a difference.

 

[OptimistNic]

Ryu's down smash seems like it causes a lower angle of knockback.

 

[Thinkaman]

BTW, does anyone know if we have a source for landing lag data yet? AFAIK that's the only numbers we don't have. I fully expected it to just be the FAF param for aerial landing animations, but this does not seem to be the case.

Ryu's down smash seems like it causes a lower angle of knockback.

Nope!

FYI, we basically have all the changes figured out now, except for a few mystery params and perhaps landing lag.

 

[Linkshot]

BTW, does anyone know if we have a source for landing lag data yet? AFAIK that's the only numbers we don't have. I fully expected it to just be the FAF param for aerial landing animations, but this does not seem to be the case.



Nope!

FYI, we basically have all the changes figured out now, except for a few mystery params and perhaps landing lag.

Landing Lag is essentially "mystery param" as it's tucked into the Attributes table. The params we can grab and compare easily are generally just floating points on specials.

 

[Vipermoon]

@ Thinkaman I believe we found all params for Marth.

1 frame inv. reduction on spot dodge and the rolls.
Utilt, all forms of neutral B, dancing blade 1, and landing lag on all up B's reduced frames
dancing blade increased input window for all hits

And then the other stuff like landing lag on every aerial except Nair reduced. And the Nair damage increase.

 

[LancerStaff]

Can somebody look at the KB of Pit and Dark Pit's rapid jab? Between my two 3DSs it looks like it sucks the opponent in now, but that might just be the CPU.