Divinokage
Smash Legend
Maybe for you but otherwise...
It's not that bad!!
-
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Top ten at Apex 2013 predictions.
- Thread starter hungrybox
- Start date
It's not that bad!!
Stevo
Smash Champion
have we as a community even decided on what exactly the ratios mean?
someone's "80:20" could be the same as someone else's "65:35" or whatever.
I think the point is that Sheik vs Ganon is about as one sided as matchups get in melee lol. (maybe not as bad as DK vs Falco)
someone's "80:20" could be the same as someone else's "65:35" or whatever.
I think the point is that Sheik vs Ganon is about as one sided as matchups get in melee lol. (maybe not as bad as DK vs Falco)
Divinokage
Smash Legend
I guess since it's a relevant matchup for me.. But it's not super terrible still.. depends who I fight. With Ganon, all you need is a couple of reads and the dude is dead regardless of character lol.
Stevo
Smash Champion
no, it's clearly 110 / -10
It's true that Ganon can punish really well once he get's something, so any character has to be careful.
It's true that Ganon can punish really well once he get's something, so any character has to be careful.
JPOBS
Smash Hero
When did this community start to call counterpicking chars as "copping out"
bunch of scrub mentalities up in here. no wonder FGC hates us
bunch of scrub mentalities up in here. no wonder FGC hates us
Juushichi
sugoi ~ sugoi ~
FGC hates us because we murdered items.
Biglard
Smash Journeyman
I guess the theoretical limit between a cop-out and a counter-pick lies in the unfairness of picking a certain character against another, regarding the match-up.
Taking Falco against Fox (50:50*) in the middle of a set is obviously a counter pick.
Taking Sheik against Ganon (110:-10*) in the middle of a set is a cop out.
Taking Falcon against Peach (60:40*) in the middle of a set... Could be considered both ways according to people.
* I don't remember the actual values of the matchups, the numbers are here to illustrate my point.
Taking Falco against Fox (50:50*) in the middle of a set is obviously a counter pick.
Taking Sheik against Ganon (110:-10*) in the middle of a set is a cop out.
Taking Falcon against Peach (60:40*) in the middle of a set... Could be considered both ways according to people.
* I don't remember the actual values of the matchups, the numbers are here to illustrate my point.
Beat!
Smash Master
I know, right?
Lovage
Smash Hero
Im actually not capable of losing if i play my best
and i 100 percent feel that way
1. I only went fox against taj because i had played fox against hbox and wanted to warm it up for armada
2. And im not saying everything is a cop out .. i never said that or i might have but now that im thinking about it more in depth this is what i feel .. I feel that ive put in enough work with all my characters to just play them whenever i want. I feel that armada using young link is a cop out because he wont use that against like anyone else and STRICTLY learned him to play against hbox and maybe my puff ( not sure ) . SO thats a STRAIGHT Cop out .. Where as if i use falcon id use falcon against everyoen else and same with my falco and fox and i feel that i can because i played falcon for years and same with my spacies. I didnt learn any of my characters for a specific match up or a person. Just for falco back in like 08 ( thats the reason i started playing falco ) At that point its just a counter pick and not a cop out imo
3. In my head i wanna play fox vs armada but i dont pick my character until i sit down.. and i play whoever feels right.. So i could actually play falcon vs armada last second.. I wouldnt see it as a cop out.. Its just what feels right and has nothing to do with match up **** or anything. Example: At impulse i went fox against m2k game one when i ALWAYS go falco against him just because it felt right and i got JUNKED and same thing against hbox that tourney. I went falco game one and got junked. I just play whatever feels right and sometimes its not but it never has nothing to do with matchup ****..
I only actually see falcon as a cop out against armada because everyone knows he legit not that great at the matchup
So its more of a mango thing.. I dont wanna walk away with my win and say well i beat him at his worst matchup
I wanna tell my grandkids i took this ****** down at his best matchup
-anonymous
#mangonation
and i 100 percent feel that way
1. I only went fox against taj because i had played fox against hbox and wanted to warm it up for armada
2. And im not saying everything is a cop out .. i never said that or i might have but now that im thinking about it more in depth this is what i feel .. I feel that ive put in enough work with all my characters to just play them whenever i want. I feel that armada using young link is a cop out because he wont use that against like anyone else and STRICTLY learned him to play against hbox and maybe my puff ( not sure ) . SO thats a STRAIGHT Cop out .. Where as if i use falcon id use falcon against everyoen else and same with my falco and fox and i feel that i can because i played falcon for years and same with my spacies. I didnt learn any of my characters for a specific match up or a person. Just for falco back in like 08 ( thats the reason i started playing falco ) At that point its just a counter pick and not a cop out imo
3. In my head i wanna play fox vs armada but i dont pick my character until i sit down.. and i play whoever feels right.. So i could actually play falcon vs armada last second.. I wouldnt see it as a cop out.. Its just what feels right and has nothing to do with match up **** or anything. Example: At impulse i went fox against m2k game one when i ALWAYS go falco against him just because it felt right and i got JUNKED and same thing against hbox that tourney. I went falco game one and got junked. I just play whatever feels right and sometimes its not but it never has nothing to do with matchup ****..
I only actually see falcon as a cop out against armada because everyone knows he legit not that great at the matchup
So its more of a mango thing.. I dont wanna walk away with my win and say well i beat him at his worst matchup
I wanna tell my grandkids i took this ****** down at his best matchup
-anonymous
#mangonation
TaFoKiNtS
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2005
- Messages
- 1,027
Does anyone think that Armada will have a hard time against Hbox if they met in bracket?
It's clear that Armada has very little confidence in his Peach vs. Hbox
Although, Armada beat Hbox solidly at P5. The Apex 2012 set shows that Hbox can beat Armada's YL with jigglypuff.
It's not going to be an easy matchup for Armada and could send Armada to Loser's as early as Winner's semis.
It's clear that Armada has very little confidence in his Peach vs. Hbox
Although, Armada beat Hbox solidly at P5. The Apex 2012 set shows that Hbox can beat Armada's YL with jigglypuff.
It's not going to be an easy matchup for Armada and could send Armada to Loser's as early as Winner's semis.
Beat!
Smash Master
Prove it, then. I'll gladly (okay, "gladly" is the wrong word since I want Armada to win, but you get the point) be the first to admit I was wrong.Mango said:
Stevo
Smash Champion
lol
we need mango back on the boards!
enCouRaging Bear
Smash Journeyman
what is armada's supposed best matchup?
TheCrimsonBlur
Smash Master
Probably Marth I'd guess
(but then again thats everyone's favorite/best matchup )
(but then again thats everyone's favorite/best matchup
)
enCouRaging Bear
Smash Journeyman
lol mango goin marth for his grandkids
Lovage
Smash Hero
i just said best matchup to hype my fox up __________ and to hype the nation
and i cant call u a bad word cause i dont wanna get oscar banned
LMAOAOAO
- anonymous
and i cant call u a bad word cause i dont wanna get oscar banned
LMAOAOAO
- anonymous
Bones0
Smash Legend
I'd want Armada to play because I think he does better vs. space animals.
1) Why don't u just use your password and **** that Novi(whoever it was that said youcould post with your own account again) SWF is boring as **** with no mango.
2) I kinda understand now why I can't find any vids of your jiggz vs a falco online(whether it be pp/zhu...etc.) makes sense though.
KanyeRest
bair-condtioned nightmare
i'm not gonna like it, but something tells me mango is gonna go in on armada
and then i'll read this post after apex 2013 and think "oh armada, why would a ***** doubt you?"
and then i'll read this post after apex 2013 and think "oh armada, why would a ***** doubt you?"
outofphase
Smash Apprentice
a battle for earth lol.
KirbyKaze
Smash Legend
I'm exaggerating with 110 / -10 but Sheik beats Ganon to such a degree it's comical IMO. I might be wildly biased and it might not be that bad - I might just be better than the Ganons. But I don't care and I think it's horrible either way.no, it's clearly 110 / -10
It's true that Ganon can punish really well once he get's something, so any character has to be careful.
His complete lack of a macro game sucks because Sheik usually has problems vs certain kinds of macro more than anything else (in regards to combat). His only usable traits vs her for making wins is a good edgeguard (that almost everyone has), a death CG (but he's too slow to straight grab and he lacks a good combo move to lead into grab aside from dair at like 0 so it's not really a big deal tbh), and more range. But then his lag, low ground speed, dependency on WL for speed, and severely limited fast attack suite cripples him so much it's lol. This mix makes him reliant on prediction & preemptive planning to be effective (you can't fair reactively to beat Sheik's things because it's too slow and he doesn't have Peach's cheats to work around this problem [float]) and Sheik punishes him too hard for errors that he struggles not to make because the aforementioned dependency on prediction to win attack vs. attack clashes (since that's his main way of winning exchanges aside from evade-punishing).
FWIW I think his bair is really good vs her. And so is his uair if she's above him (can often lead to a KO if you have finesse or the Sheik has bad DI). But it's not enough.
Stevo
Smash Champion
I would tend to agree with you, actually.
I think when Ganon is able to do stuff in that matchup it is because he is outplaying the Sheik player or tricking them somehow.
These sorts of things start to dissapear the more experience someone has in the matchup, which in your case, it seems you have plenty.
PB&J
Smash Hero
Why isnt mango back on the boards. Cant wait til after rom 5 for all the reall apex hype
JPOBS
Smash Hero
MANGO NATION BABY!!!!!
fuq da haters
Divinokage
Smash Legend
I'm definitely going to cheer for my man! (Let's have more drinks at Apex, )
)
Charlesz
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2007
- Messages
- 2,043
your ****ing ********. Even if he makes it into bracket he's going to go 2 and out.
PB&J
Smash Hero
cant wait to quote you after apex. Sorry hes been winning like 98 percent of the ny tournies but i guess we will see.
ThePrime
Smash Lord
mango nation fo real 
but real talk
ka-master is back and hes HUNGRY. Fanboys unite.
but real talk
ka-master is back and hes HUNGRY. Fanboys unite.
Max?
Smash Champion
Wrong. He wins the ones where he is the only good player there. He loses whenever Hax or Jman or anyone notably good goes.
Bones0
Smash Legend
Have you played him?
It's gonna be a close one at the top. Mango's good enough now to beat Apex 2012 Armada, but everyone knows that Apex 2013 Armada is going to have some new tricks up his sleeve. Mango's fox tech skill is better than it was last year, but if Mango doesn't adapt well, he's going to get wrecked.
On the other hand, I'm still of the belief that PP's last performances against Mango and Armada are enough to show that he still has a chance to win. Hbox has a chance too. Puff v. Ylink will be close like always, but Hbox might clutch it out this time. He's really just gotta focus on beating Mango.
On the other hand, I'm still of the belief that PP's last performances against Mango and Armada are enough to show that he still has a chance to win. Hbox has a chance too. Puff v. Ylink will be close like always, but Hbox might clutch it out this time. He's really just gotta focus on beating Mango.
Divinokage
Smash Legend
Nonsense, they were all already good enough to beat Armada since the beginning, it's just a matter of.. can they do it when it's time to do it at the tournament.
rjgbadger
Banned via Warnings
ThePrime
Smash Lord
oh the plumber is back, dont worryis he playing weegee? and how seriously will he take it
Ka showed up at our latest monthly couple days ago and took 3rd behind bladewise and silentwolf, and took both of them to game 5
... mind you Ka has been in nicaragua for the last two years which is why he fell off the scene. But he's back.
Westcooassst.
JOS.fm
Smash Journeyman
Ka-MASTER???????
