The Winning Steak Cinemas: Video Archive & Criticism Thread Updated

[Tenki]

I thought so too, but apparently it doesnt...

I think it was because you were higher than the Thunder or started too late. I forgot when it happened and don't feel like sifting through it right now.

 

[da K.I.D.]

I watched it like 15 times, I was below the cloud and started falling before the attack did, and still got "Rise of the Machines'd"

 

[WedginatorX]

I was kinda looking for some feedback.. I know KID's vid vs. ESAM was off the chain and all, but I wanted some critique =X

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7BqcYjK9ts
Rip me apart lol. This was offline so no lag johns for any mistakes I made. >_>

Note: I was going for a bit of a style change. Trying to use more spindash cuz according to a few people I could use some more of it. Did I use too much?

 

[NH Cody]

You seem pretty solid, Wedge.

You didn't really make any mistakes or SD, so that's a plus.

I recommend trying out different approaches, like hyphen, spinshot > ASCSC > shieldgrab, ASC > SDR > SDJ > DJ > ASCSC > shieldgrab, etc. Using nair while landing can be used to get your opponent off you and refresh your other moves so that's something else to try. I play Sonic differently, so if your style works, that's fine. I would just add in a few other moves.

Grabbing out of spindash is often unpredictable so that could work.

That's pretty much all I can suggest, you did a good job

 

[Kinzer]

:X

I would like to help, but Falco has to be my worst MU to this day so that immediately tosses out any chance of my advice helping you. XD

 

[Kinzer]

Double post, ignore this.

 

[Arikie]

I'm posting mainly for Critiques but I also want to contribute to the ccv so If you think a video is good I'll upload the .AVI



PEACH

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDoe0tEsYys mage(peach) vs arikie(sonic) 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-wMRwEcDfk mage(peach) vs arikie(sonic) 1


Ice Climbers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i6xrCwnq9ww 00-zero(ics) vs arikie(sonic) 4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4kfHpdz9ls 00-zero(ics) vs arikie(sonic) 5


Diddy Kong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGDI1mad0Gg 00-zero(diddy) vs arikie(sonic)


Snake

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dd_r4u5P-_U mello(snake) vs arikie(sonic)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Rw5XJvQHpw mello(snake) vs arikie(sonic)


Pikachu
FZ didn't know the matchup when we played these matches.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0epx_bGlg6E Forever_Zero(Pikachu) vs Arikie(Sonic)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0ZX-WeqYVU Forever_Zero(Pikachu) vs Arikie(Sonic)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=an3DUe32BOA Forever_Zero(Pikachu) vs Arikie(Sonic)


I have more but I didn't want to list all of them cause I doubt anyone wants to watch that much.
Here is the rest


Wolf
this is 2 rounds
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeYamCcs8pw 1 and 2 pulse(wolf) vs arikie(sonic)

Ics
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoBlrNrPD7o 00-zero(ics) s arikie(sonic)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcztDQC39R8 00-zero(ics) s arikie(sonic)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OB_Jp0zMnM 00-zero(ics) s arikie(sonic)

pikachu

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gGeGrr4QVA FZ(pikachu) vs ARikie(sonic)


Alright thats all, for some reason I havn't played any MKs lately.... wierd.

 

[da K.I.D.]

I do.

not gonna lie. youre getting really good man

 

[ShadoFiend]

Elohl. Scrub Sawnik vidz frm me.

Doubles.nou.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWtGTP_B8yk - Sonic (Shado aka ***** in this vid) and MK (seagull) vs Wario (slikvik) and Luigi (Boss)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=60mf4S47rbo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vAKLBFQFZE&feature=channel

Still kinda rusty. After this i went on to play boss in singles elohl. I did alright. Vids will be up soon. vs hi luigi and some marth

 

[Kinzer]

You may as well post all the videos you uploaded for the sake of adding more to the archive Arikie. If you want, separate the ones you want critiqued and the ones you either don't want to be critiqued on or the ones that don't concern you as much.

As for actual critique, I was watching you play Peach, and at times you tried to Spring/Dair gimp her like she was Ike. Just edgehog her; Spring/Dair gimps won't work because of the way she recovers. This way, even if she she does get back onstage, you'll have enough time to Fair/Uair/Nair/(maybe) Bair her.

Don't let Peach dance on top of your shield. Try to use an Aerials OoS if their spacing is bad. If. it's spot on like it should be with a Peach who knows what they're doing, use DA OoS if their float is low, if not then I'm out of ideas there. I don't play any Peaches that actually put any effort into good floats. I would imagine you could run and Fair or run to their landing and go from there, but I encourage you to experiment.

If all else fails, just back off and wait until you get your shield back, Peach can't really do much to you from mid range. Pulling a turnip that close is dangerous for her. Far away is not as dangerous but I won't say safe for her either since Sonic can run very fast, very far, in a little amount of time. You may already know this but why not reiterate?

Get her high in the air. She can't really do much aside from throwing out an attack and hoping it hits you because her airdodge is the worst and she is floaty. Again you may have already known this but it doesn't hurt.

Also you put the Peach videos backwards.

Oh, I noticed you killed yourself walljumping off of Battlefield when you were in your Spring Jump animation. I'm not sure if that was a mistake or you weren't thinking/didn't know about it, but always be sure to hold towards the ledge. That will guarantee you snap to the ledge assuming nobody else is hanging on it.

No more Slidding USmash and whatever variation of it there is out there please. Almost, if not everytime I saw you use it, it wasn't worth the tradeoff.

No more Forward Smashing either. At the very least, not at low percentages. Peach isn't going to die until she's like at least 85% from a fully charged one (and that's a stretch), but if somebody gets hit by something like that I'm afraid you need to find somebody else to play with if you're trying to get better at the matchup.

Next!

Argh, it's so hard to analyze a match with ICs. If we're assuming perfect play here, this match, along with 99.9% of them out there; even the ones that don't include Sonic, are a lie. This is more player vs. player based. In either case I think I'll ignore this. I don't play against that character at all. All I can say is you have to play smart and space your attacks properly. Bair should be best for approaching (from a Spinshot, any other way will get you grabbed) and defending. **** Nana when/if you separate the climbers... already a given but whatever.

Next!

You know you can Z-Catch Bananas right? This way of grabbing them from the air is much faster and less committed than having to use an aerial to grab 'em.

How coem I noly see you glide-tossing forwards all the time? You are aware that flicking the C-Stock in any of the 4 non-diagonal directions will throw the banana any way Sonic (or any character for that matter) is capable of, right? Sometiems flicking it down will set-up into a Glide-Toss combo better, Up throw Glide-Toss will give Diddy two things to dodge, the banana or you. If he catches the banana, he will have you to worry about after. If he doesn't he gets hit by that. Glide-tossing backwards really doesn't have that much practical use (in Singles) except for maybe retreating, but in doubles for example you can throw it at one opponent and slide at another that isn't expecting you or isn't going to react fast enough. These are some examples, I'd like for you to use some more.

Next!

Don't edgeguard Snake with Forward Air, use Bair air. This should at least clank with his Nair assuming he's facing forward like in most normal recovery circumstances. Nothing else he has is practical if you two are relatively at the same level for anti-edgeguarding except for Bair if he's facing away from the stage, but regardless a properly spaced Back air should at least trade with that too. If he's Fairing then LOL.

Don't challenge Snake with direct ball approaches. He can just throw hitboxes out there and clank with you or he can time a pivot grab. I will say this though, in the case that you want to challenge Snake in a game of Boxing after a successful clank, go right ahead. Both characters have a couple of ways to attack the other. Just understand that Snakes are far more damaging and much more threatening than yours but your are not at an auto-loss if you find yourself boxing with him. It's all about choosing your defense, offense, counter, and counter-counter options wisely. I can tell you some of Sonic's stuff. Depending on how far away you are from him, Jab is frame 3, shield is one frame, forward and down tilt, as well as grab, are 6, and Sonic should start being invincible from spotdodge at around 2-5 frames. I don't remember the lattermost by heart but that's a nice way to avoid Snake assuming he grabs you immediately from a clank and counterattack. Again those are just a couple of examples, you may come up with more. I would also suggest knowing Snake's boxing attacks and their frame-data. I would do it myself but I don't know Snake's frame-data.

Next!

The ledge is the worst place to be when playing against Pikachu. Don't go there after he gets off the recovery platform.

Don't try to punish Pikachu's FSmash with anything on block except for Dash Attack. It has far too much shield pushback to allow for much else.

Next!

Please don't ever HA or USmash against Wolf. If either whiff you're going to take serious damage best case scenario.

I don't think you'll be able to shieldgrab Wolf's Bair if it's properly spaced. Having said that, approaching him with his back facing you should have you take caution. At the same time though find out his pattern, I mean you can't just sit there and take Blaster Shots and Bairs forever, right...? Regardless do be careful too with approaching with ASC. Wolf has a lot of hitboxes that can take care of that stuff easy.

You may also want to find other ways of edgeguarding him besides Spring. Part of what makes this Matchup is how bad his recovery is. If you can get him low enough where he has to use Fire Wolf, just edguard him. If he somehow makes it back onstage with that just use an ledgedrop/hop aerial.

I think that's it. It's been a while since I've actually sat down and dissected your videos, let alone anybody's. It's so good to be on vacation.

Edit: Shado, are you looking for your videos to be critiqued?

 

[Arikie]

I do.

not gonna lie. youre getting really good man

Thanks =D

You may as well post all the videos you uploaded for the sake of adding more to the archive Arikie. If you want, separate the ones you want critiqued and the ones you either don't want to be critiqued on or the ones that don't concern you as much.

As for actual critique, I was watching you play Peach, and at times you tried to Spring/Dair gimp her like she was Ike. Just edgehog her; Spring/Dair gimps won't work because of the way she recovers. This way, even if she she does get back onstage, you'll have enough time to Fair/Uair/Nair/(maybe) Bair her.

Don't let Peach dance on top of your shield. Try to use an Aerials OoS if their spacing is bad. If. it's spot on like it should be with a Peach who knows what they're doing, use DA OoS if their float is low, if not then I'm out of ideas there. I don't play any Peaches that actually put any effort into good floats. I would imagine you could run and Fair or run to their landing and go from there, but I encourage you to experiment.

If all else fails, just back off and wait until you get your shield back, Peach can't really do much to you from mid range. Pulling a turnip that close is dangerous for her. Far away is not as dangerous but I won't say safe for her either since Sonic can run very fast, very far, in a little amount of time. You may already know this but why not reiterate?

Get her high in the air. She can't really do much aside from throwing out an attack and hoping it hits you because her airdodge is the worst and she is floaty. Again you may have already known this but it doesn't hurt.

Also you put the Peach videos backwards.

Oh, I noticed you killed yourself walljumping off of Battlefield when you were in your Spring Jump animation. I'm not sure if that was a mistake or you weren't thinking/didn't know about it, but always be sure to hold towards the ledge. That will guarantee you snap to the ledge assuming nobody else is hanging on it.

No more Slidding USmash and whatever variation of it there is out there please. Almost, if not everytime I saw you use it, it wasn't worth the tradeoff.

No more Forward Smashing either. At the very least, not at low percentages. Peach isn't going to die until she's like at least 85% from a fully charged one (and that's a stretch), but if somebody gets hit by something like that I'm afraid you need to find somebody else to play with if you're trying to get better at the matchup.

Next!

Argh, it's so hard to analyze a match with ICs. If we're assuming perfect play here, this match, along with 99.9% of them out there; even the ones that don't include Sonic, are a lie. This is more player vs. player based. In either case I think I'll ignore this. I don't play against that character at all. All I can say is you have to play smart and space your attacks properly. Bair should be best for approaching (from a Spinshot, any other way will get you grabbed) and defending. **** Nana when/if you separate the climbers... already a given but whatever.

Next!

You know you can Z-Catch Bananas right? This way of grabbing them from the air is much faster and less committed than having to use an aerial to grab 'em.

How coem I noly see you glide-tossing forwards all the time? You are aware that flicking the C-Stock in any of the 4 non-diagonal directions will throw the banana any way Sonic (or any character for that matter) is capable of, right? Sometiems flicking it down will set-up into a Glide-Toss combo better, Up throw Glide-Toss will give Diddy two things to dodge, the banana or you. If he catches the banana, he will have you to worry about after. If he doesn't he gets hit by that. Glide-tossing backwards really doesn't have that much practical use (in Singles) except for maybe retreating, but in doubles for example you can throw it at one opponent and slide at another that isn't expecting you or isn't going to react fast enough. These are some examples, I'd like for you to use some more.

Next!

Don't edgeguard Snake with Forward Air, use Bair air. This should at least clank with his Nair assuming he's facing forward like in most normal recovery circumstances. Nothing else he has is practical if you two are relatively at the same level for anti-edgeguarding except for Bair if he's facing away from the stage, but regardless a properly spaced Back air should at least trade with that too. If he's Fairing then LOL.

Don't challenge Snake with direct ball approaches. He can just throw hitboxes out there and clank with you or he can time a pivot grab. I will say this though, in the case that you want to challenge Snake in a game of Boxing after a successful clank, go right ahead. Both characters have a couple of ways to attack the other. Just understand that Snakes are far more damaging and much more threatening than yours but your are not at an auto-loss if you find yourself boxing with him. It's all about choosing your defense, offense, counter, and counter-counter options wisely. I can tell you some of Sonic's stuff. Depending on how far away you are from him, Jab is frame 3, shield is one frame, forward and down tilt, as well as grab, are 6, and Sonic should start being invincible from spotdodge at around 2-5 frames. I don't remember the lattermost by heart but that's a nice way to avoid Snake assuming he grabs you immediately from a clank and counterattack. Again those are just a couple of examples, you may come up with more. I would also suggest knowing Snake's boxing attacks and their frame-data. I would do it myself but I don't know Snake's frame-data.

Next!

The ledge is the worst place to be when playing against Pikachu. Don't go there after he gets off the recovery platform.

Don't try to punish Pikachu's FSmash with anything on block except for Dash Attack. It has far too much shield pushback to allow for much else.

Next!

Please don't ever HA or USmash against Wolf. If either whiff you're going to take serious damage best case scenario.

I don't think you'll be able to shieldgrab Wolf's Bair if it's properly spaced. Having said that, approaching him with his back facing you should have you take caution. At the same time though find out his pattern, I mean you can't just sit there and take Blaster Shots and Bairs forever, right...? Regardless do be careful too with approaching with ASC. Wolf has a lot of hitboxes that can take care of that stuff easy.

You may also want to find other ways of edgeguarding him besides Spring. Part of what makes this Matchup is how bad his recovery is. If you can get him low enough where he has to use Fire Wolf, just edguard him. If he somehow makes it back onstage with that just use an ledgedrop/hop aerial.

I think that's it. It's been a while since I've actually sat down and dissected your videos, let alone anybody's. It's so good to be on vacation.

0_0 Wow thats alot! thank you very much! and Next time I'll post my vids in order.

the ledgejump thing on BF was just a mess up btw, I know it lol I just messed.

 

[ShadoFiend]

**** no sir. I just felt like getting my post count up and feeling like im apart of these boards elohl. VIVA LA SAKURA!

 

[Kinzer]

**** no sir. I just felt like getting my post count up and feeling like im apart of these boards elohl. VIVA LA SAKURA!

...You have been gone for too long. Welcome back troll. <3

 

[Paix]

OMG i found some speed vs ksizzle vids

these are from Pound 4

match 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J77STczeddE
match 2:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GDZl8illr_U&feature=related

 

[~TBS~]

oh god, im soooo bad. >_<
I need MK tips...

 

[da K.I.D.]

Id say about half of the tornadoes that hit you, you could have avoided, and punished

the other half you couldnt really do anything about.

and 70% of the tornadoes that you DID punish, you didnt punish hard enough.

Id like a shot at Ksizzle, with the amount of nado he uses, I think I MIGHT be able to take him.

 

[BluePeachy100]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7wg0ogOmK0&playnext_from=TL&videos=vDgsbMdFP8I&feature=sub

Basically should be archived, instantly.

 

[ksizl4life]

Id say about half of the tornadoes that hit you, you could have avoided, and punished

the other half you couldnt really do anything about.

and 70% of the tornadoes that you DID punish, you didnt punish hard enough.

Id like a shot at Ksizzle, with the amount of nado he uses, I think I MIGHT be able to take him.

lol i played badly due to being up around 30-35 hours by the time me and speed played, which is why i overused and overelied on tornado. for some reason, it worked.

that isnt the real me.

 

[Espy Rose]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7wg0ogOmK0&playnext_from=TL&videos=vDgsbMdFP8I&feature=sub

Basically should be archived, instantly.

What a scrub.
That's some old mess right there.

 

[JayBee]

lol i played badly due to being up around 30-35 hours by the time me and speed played, which is why i overused and overelied on tornado. for some reason, it worked.

that isnt the real me.

lol i liked how he said he used nado so much successfully and doesn't know why. I know why. He knows why.
move is freaking gay.

 

[BluePeachy100]

What a scrub.
That's some old mess right there.

**** happens.

 

[ksizl4life]

lol i liked how he said he used nado so much successfully and doesn't know why. I know why. He knows why.
move is freaking gay.

You don't understand dude. I tried tornado'ing alot vs Shugo a while back and got demolished. 2 stocked easily and forced me to win with Lucario. It really doesnt work vs a good sonic. I think Speed was off maybe.

 

[WedginatorX]

Cuz shugo ***** the **** out of nado and mk in general. Didn't he have an "imma angle up an fsmash and kill you while you're in nado" mindset going when he played against MKs?

Also, got a new vid up. Offline. Wifi is ***. I cut down on the spindash a bit and this is the result. Still against the same falco >_>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFTi4s4F1Jg
I need more people in south jersey to brawl me. Ksizzle know anyone down here? I have trouble finding people. D:

 

[ksizl4life]

lol i thought no one lived in south jersey. that sucks. move to north jersey yo. smash scene here is da bess

 

[WedginatorX]

I came up to ktar 2 a few months ago after taking forever to find a ride. Just to get bracket ***** having to play NL first round and i forget who i had in losers. lol. Then school got busy but now im lookin to get to some tourneys again.

 

[da K.I.D.]

I have two friends that went up here for college, that both live in jersey over the summer. But one lives in S. Jersey, and one lives in N. Jersey, and one plays brawl and one plays melee, and I forgot which is which.

You don't understand dude. I tried tornado'ing alot vs Shugo a while back and got demolished. 2 stocked easily and forced me to win with Lucario. It really doesnt work vs a good sonic. I think Speed was off maybe.

either that or speed isnt good.

im going with the later...


...

OH SNAP

but seriously speed i think is just really bad vs nado.

 

[Joe1337nou.]

Ah yes.......

 

[~TBS~]

i'd wish people stop beating around the bush and would just say im bad already. =/

I dont know if i was off, i'll just do something different next time. probably wont help though.

 

[Kinzer]

Umad ubadgood? It rhymes, sorry.

If you're bad, then that must mean I don't exits exist.

Spoiler

Well I don't believe I do but that's another thing.

Anyway, you were either off or you didn't know at the time. Don't you know that Sonic's Fair tears right through MK's glide? I know you got hit by SL more often than not, but I saw you trying off some run behind to FSmash shizz and that wasn't working and I'm going "Why?!" And that last stock the 2nd match just made me sadface. Speed I know you're better than this (if only because Pound was in January but, just don't lose faith.

I know we talked a lot yesterday... even though I just basically told you a lot about myself and went off-topic; I did not really talk about how to specifically deal with your problems. At least other people believe in you.

 

[da K.I.D.]

i dont.

especially after how you tried to look big and touch in front of your region acting like your better than me

 

[~TBS~]

i dont.

especially after how you tried to look big and touch in front of your region acting like your better than me

I didnt though. Why would i try to act "big" when thats the same thing as cockiness, which i hate with a passion? I was trying to say that you were better than me. But you misread it, and i had edit what was said...i hate cockiness dude. Why would i even do that to you KID? I have no reason to dude. =/

Maybe this isnt the place, but i dont want to lose anymore friends over misunderstandings man. KID, you mad chill.

 

[da K.I.D.]

LOL at losing friends.

Im not gonna get mad at somebody saying their better than me. or that im bad, it happens to me constantly...

its not a big deal son.


also, Im officially 21 today

 

[infomon]

happy K.I.D. day!

 

[~TBS~]

Cuz shugo ***** the **** out of nado and mk in general. Didn't he have an "imma angle up an fsmash and kill you while you're in nado" mindset going when he played against MKs?

Also, got a new vid up. Offline. Wifi is ***. I cut down on the spindash a bit and this is the result. Still against the same falco >_>
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dFTi4s4F1Jg
I need more people in south jersey to brawl me. Ksizzle know anyone down here? I have trouble finding people. D:

i see you over there doin work Wedge. Just keep at it. And the whole spindashing thing? iono, people just get hit by it. o. o

Ksizzle too good for me.

LOL at losing friends.

Im not gonna get mad at somebody saying their better than me. or that im bad, it happens to me constantly...

its not a big deal son.

also, Im officially 21 today

Just to clear it up, i dont say im better than ANYONE. Not a single living person. And you've proven yourself KID. (I think we all have, minus one) If anyone says you suck, they dont know what they're talkin about. happy b-day though. o=

I've been working on my "aggro" sonic. i dont know whats developing, but people that i've fought said that im more annoying or something...i'll mess around with with this aggro stuff for a while longer, and get some vids up soon hopefully.

 

[Trent]

Happy BDay KID. I got 2 more months for 21..

Speed you're not bad, change your frickin' Avatar.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHbhFfP8de0



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSswKPOtMDE



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwhZaKWvRzg

 

[JayBee]

i see you over there doin work Wedge. Just keep at it. And the whole spindashing thing? iono, people just get hit by it. o. o

Ksizzle too good for me.



Just to clear it up, i dont say im better than ANYONE. Not a single living person. And you've proven yourself KID. (I think we all have, minus one) If anyone says you suck, they dont know what they're talkin about. happy b-day though. o=

I've been working on my "aggro" sonic. i dont know whats developing, but people that i've fought said that im more annoying or something...i'll mess around with with this aggro stuff for a while longer, and get some vids up soon hopefully.

annoying is good. very good. keep it up. im happy that you got to use that "patient style" for a while, but now that you are working on the aggro more, when you get that the way you want it then you can use the first match of sets simply to watch patterns, then let loose with one style or the other the next round. you got this.

Sonic and Mario vs Dedede and Kirby

A friendly match i had up, and i didn't post it here, i think. so here ya go. I'll try to get more matches up for critique later. The little time i do have to train I've added a few minor things. see if you can find them. I'm gonna have more time for brawl training after this hectic semester at college.

Speed, trying really hard to have that campy style, i'm just too impatent it seems. but then i play meta and im as patient as I'll ever get... sigh im too wierd...

 

[da K.I.D.]

@ trent

only watched the first match.

Stop rolling so much.

 

[Exceladon City]

I need to work on my MK match-up. I used to be good at it and now I just ****ing suck at fighting him.

 

[da K.I.D.]

you know youre bad when you lose to iska-scrub-ble.

 

[B.A.M.]

so ima hate on Mew2King becuz he wouldnt play me when tyrant, haze and i were chillin at tyrants. Terrible person that guy is. Real talk KID you're getting better; ur sonic is actually makin some sense now lol. Speed u are solid when ur on it man, but i think u go autopilot sometimes and get wrecked hard. I do the same, one minute im going toe to toe with the best on my coast, next minute im getting 3 stocked for no reason other than my own. I think i want some follow ups 2 bad. I havent been playing in a while now, but im gonna get back into it and do some training with Mr. Tyrant. So stay tuned for those videos.

Quick question peeps; you guys have any good solid advice on lucario? We hads stauffy and some other lucario there and i was having tons of trouble. never had the chance to play sick *** lucarios until now. what would be ur suggestions? whats some of the best vids we have on the matchup?