The Unity Ruleset: Discussion

[Tin Man]

Looks like its time to read up, but I wonder if i'll catch up...

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 35 (31 members and 4 guests)

Tin Man, ProdigyA.K.A MVD, AlexoftheAura, SaveMeJebus, Twinkie, -Ran, Metakill, DJ Jack, ElNoNombreHombre, Gnes, Calvo819, Limit129, Sky`, King~, dabuz, DMG, deathbysuarez, Xnpio, 2link121, GunmasterLombardi, Ussi, Technical_Chase, Omega Tyrant, cHp

 

[Bizkit047]

Not getting what I'm trying to say. Me going peach vs. anti was close-game 5.


If I go Ivysaur, there's no hope of the set going past game 3, so that could technically be a form of forfeiting. But the argument was brought up before that if you try, then that is not considered bracket manipulation/intentional forfeiting. M2k is being criticized for going ganondorf, but what if he tried to win?

If you come forth and tell the TO or someone that you did it to forfeit (like Sade/M2K), then yes, you would get Carded. If nothing was said, then no. Have fun going Ivy then?

 

[Sky`]

That's why you have ten or so individuals in there that are capable of filling in the holes of knowledge and insight that they lack. To ban a player is a simple affair, if you have set forth rules, and they fail to follow them after warnings, you ban them. Rules enforcement is a important part of any community.

But how can you lay out rules that can't be proven?

Can you really prove that M2K's intention was Bracket Manipulation?

 

[MVD]

Subscribe!!!

 

[-Ran]

When someone admits it to the TO? Yea, you can. When they go Ganon to intentionally lose to someone in Pools, yea you can certainly look at the intent there. You can look at the character choice and remember that this is M2k, a player that goes Meta Knight almost universally every tournament match. Smash players have a horrible [grade school level] lack of the ability to keep their intentions and actions on the down-low. The moment they do something, they are prone to bragging [splitting, etc.]

Ask yourself this, how fair is it to the other individuals that fly to a huge tournament, that are on the cusp of getting into bracket to get denied entry because of the favoritism of the top seeds?

 

[ADHD]

Ask yourself this, how fair is it to the other individuals that fly to a huge tournament, that are on the cusp of getting into bracket to get denied entry because of the favoritism of the top seeds?

Your argument was sound until this because no one was ****ed over.. she forfeited out of pools didn't she?

 

[SaveMeJebus]

When someone admits it to the TO? Yea, you can. When they go Ganon to intentionally lose to someone in Pools, yea you can certainly look at the intent there. You can look at the character choice and remember that this is M2k, a player that goes Meta Knight almost universally every tournament match. Smash players have a horrible [grade school level] lack of the ability to keep their intentions and actions on the down-low. The moment they do something, they are prone to bragging [splitting, etc.]

Ask yourself this, how fair is it to the other individuals that fly to a huge tournament, that are on the cusp of getting into bracket to get denied entry because of the favoritism of the top seeds?

That's their fault for not being better. You would never see that happening to to players like M2K or ALLY

 

[Sky`]

ADHD Beat me to it.

 

[Player-1]

simple solution is simple just ban ganondorf.

 

[-Ran]

Your argument was sound until this because no one was ****ed over.. she forfeited out of pools didn't she?

I don't know if she forfeited out of pools, or if that became an issue -after- it was admitted that he was attempting to manipulate the brackets. I'm not an RC member, so I don't have that information, I'm just looking at the facts that we are aware of.

However, the intent and actions that were against the rules still exist. Furthermore, by M2k intentionally performing poorly, he alters the entire purpose of pools. The goal is to place the best players away from each other in the pools [and then bracket], and so by him going in with a lower seed, it upsets the entire balance of the tournament structure/theory.

 

[WindMajor]

I don't know if she forfeited out of pools, or if that became an issue -after- it was admitted that he was attempting to manipulate the brackets.

I always thought this was the case.

 

[Yung Mei]

That's their fault for not being better. You would never see that happening to to players like M2K or ALLY

You guys know this is part of the reason why attendance can be affected at ANY event?

talk like this scares away newer players, ive known people trying to get better but just give up and quit as soon as they try and ask for help and end up reading **** like this.

Hell this makes me not want to go to Apex, but **** that im going to hang out with my buttbuddies

 

[Ripple]

just because you pay money to do something, that does NOT give them the right to do whatever the **** they want.

 

[ADHD]

just because you pay money to do something, that does NOT give them the right to do whatever the **** they want.

K, so Ally shouldn't go wolf in pools and get 2nd seed? That manipulated the bracket.

 

[Yung Mei]

hella off topic

@ADHD, i just read your sig and i cant stop laughing

 

[SaveMeJebus]

You guys know this is part of the reason why attendance can be affected at ANY event?

talk like this scares away newer players, ive known people trying to get better but just give up and quit as soon as they try and ask for help and end up reading **** like this.

Hell this makes me not want to go to Apex, but **** that im going to hang out with my buttbuddies

It is true though. The problem is that you guys don't give top players any reason not to sandbag they get treated like everybody else and yet they can't go random or sandbag like everybody else because they might get a red card. also, should 9b get a red card for ****ing up consistency in japan by maining Lucario (assuming that they used the unity rule set)?

 

[Ripple]

K, so Ally shouldn't go wolf in pools and get 2nd seed? That manipulated the bracket.

Ally actually puts time and effort into his wolf and plays him at a top level and wins against other top players' mains.

M2K doesn't put anytime or effort into learning another character. he lost on purpose not going MK

 

[ADHD]

Ally actually puts time and effort into his wolf and plays him at a top level and wins against other top players' mains.

M2K doesn't put anytime or effort into learning another character. he lost on purpose not going MK

Okay.

Lol.

 

[Ripple]

Okay.

Lol.

I give up, you have beaten my argument in 1 word

oh wait >_>... you didn't

 

[[FBC] ESAM]

*yawn* gonna go PT my next tournament and get a red card for myself :D

 

[Life]

How can M2K put in enough practice to get good at another character without using that character in serious matches?

 

[Yung Mei]

It is true though. The problem is that you guys don't give top players any reason not to sandbag they get treated like everybody else and yet they can't go random or sandbag like everybody else because they might get a red card. Should 9b get a red card for ****ing up consistency in japan by maining Lucario?

yeah agreed, i know its true, but wording is a little weird.

One thing i can say for myself as a "random" is that sandbagging from a pro is ****ed up to a certain degree. Hell, if i were playing M2k, i would want him to play his hardest, and if he sandbags, that just makes me feel bad because im trying, and he isnt :V

Its like, could you guys at least PRETEND to be interested. so we dont feel so bad?

 

[ADHD]

Oh wellz. I tried.

When you guys are overthrown maybe we can recreate this committee that legitimately cares.

 

[Bizkit047]

yeah agreed, i know its true, but wording is a little weird.

One thing i can say for myself as a "random" is that sandbagging from a pro is ****ed up to a certain degree. Hell, if i were playing M2k, i would want him to play his hardest, and if he sandbags, that just makes me feel bad because im trying, and he isnt :V

Its like, could you guys at least PRETEND to be interested. so we dont feel so bad?

Yea, more top players need to help the lesser players. I find giving advice after a set would help best.

 

[Crow!]

As many will no doubt recall, I am a solid detractor to the basic concept of the "unity" ruleset, which is the primary function of the BBR-RC. I'm no friend of theirs.

However, the Smash community has in the past generally turned a blind eye toward unacceptable behavior in tournaments, both in terms of game related activities and in terms of conduct at the venue and in housing. As a community that depends on a fairly large percentage of younger players, and as a community which depends on players enjoying their tournament experiences, these events are very bad for us.

I don't pretend to know the exact details of the event being debated at present, but I would like to suggest that we should be supporting the basic idea of having tournament organizers band together to stamp out such embarassments to our otherwise enjoyable competitive experience. This is exactly the sort of task an organization of TOs is best suited to accomplish, and we would be foolish to discourage them from continuing to serve us in this way in the future.

 

[xDD-Master]

I ASK AGAIN.

Wouldve M2K get redcarded if he won?

 

[Flayl]

Was M2K trying to pick up Sade by intentionally losing to her? lmao

 

[SaveMeJebus]

I too ask again. Would 9B be given a red card for going Lucario when ICs are clearly his best character?

 

[Ripple]

I ASK AGAIN.

Wouldve M2K get redcarded if he won?

still intentional under performance. he won to a lesser degree than what he should have

 

[DMG]

YO real talk


My name is M2KAY
*****es KNOW I play gay
Ally da bess, MacChicken N da ress
Rich Brown got planked, his mini fro stanked
Anti and his momma doin Errands at the bank
Gnes goin hard, whippen out his Pnes
Blackanese told me to skeet, but for real ***** I'd beat
ADHD now got Polio. His legs all whiplashed after I styled on him
That part don't rhyme, too busy takin that ***** to time


Now you know we be doin it real
This smasher swag askin you to pay for mah meal
You go an house me, see that face beamin, don't check the covers cause I probably left my semen



This red card bull**** ain't nothin but magic tricks
I caused a problem, I hear yall shout
****in LOL you *****s is dumb no doubt
Cause look at me, you still payed out

 

[Bizkit047]

I ASK AGAIN.

Wouldve M2K get redcarded if he won?

If neither said anything about it and didn't involve the TO, then probably wouldn't have gotten carded.

 

[-DR3W-]

Was M2K trying to pick up Sade by intentionally losing to her? lmao

Isn't he taken? lol
WHAT A BEAST

 

[Bees!]

It's only a big deal because it manipulated the bracket in a way that's quite obvious that shouldn't have happened (technically it affected pools, but w/e).

Ever think about the other guy in pools who's admittance into R2 Pools depended on whether Sade beat M2K or not?

When someone admits it to the TO? Yea, you can. When they go Ganon to intentionally lose to someone in Pools, yea you can certainly look at the intent there. You can look at the character choice and remember that this is M2k, a player that goes Meta Knight almost universally every tournament match. Smash players have a horrible [grade school level] lack of the ability to keep their intentions and actions on the down-low. The moment they do something, they are prone to bragging [splitting, etc.]

Ask yourself this, how fair is it to the other individuals that fly to a huge tournament, that are on the cusp of getting into bracket to get denied entry because of the favoritism of the top seeds?

yeah agreed, i know its true, but wording is a little weird.

One thing i can say for myself as a "random" is that sandbagging from a pro is ****ed up to a certain degree. Hell, if i were playing M2k, i would want him to play his hardest, and if he sandbags, that just makes me feel bad because im trying, and he isnt :V

Its like, could you guys at least PRETEND to be interested. so we dont feel so bad?

all that pretty much sums up how I feel.

It sounds like the RC are actually trying to care. Compared to some of the tourneys I have seen. They are actually trying to consider people other than Ally and M2k. that sort of behavior does affect other people besides top players(which don't matter apparently) also to say well the person forfeit so its worked out this time is like russian roulette. Just because it worked out this time was a only because the person forfeit(if that were the case) but usually its not. Top Level players are usually like a clique. At Supercon 2010. I saw Tearbear go bowser and 0-200% with pummel releases to some new player who was playing ness. Now this guy was VERY new to competitive play. What Tearbear did was totally unnecessary, made high level players look like douche-bags.(also that player revealed to me that he would not play competitively at all after that happened in pools.) Many other instances like this occured. After seeing his behavior at a high level like that and how none of the other high level players took issue with it. If I ever become regarded as a high level player I will never put myself in the same camp as others who treat it as an elite country club. Or act so cruel to other people as if its a way of being an ******* in a video game. Its meant to be enjoyed. I don't think others enjoy it when results are tampered because someone didn't care enough to try at all and throw matches. However I will say banning m2k does seem a bit excessive.

 

[Marc]

It's iffy to punish people for playing other characters, but I think it's much simpler than that: there is a rule against intentional underperformance and M2K admitted to doing exactly that. All the hypotheticals in the world don't change this configuration of facts. =/

 

[-DR3W-]

You could just say that other characters are for friendlies and money matches...it isn't much to ask at all to try your hardest and use your main to keep a tournament non-manipulated...

 

[WindMajor]

I ASK AGAIN.

Wouldve M2K get redcarded if he won?

Probably not because it's 99% probable that he would have won anyways.

 

[Marc]

If he had won it most likely wouldn't meet the criterium of underperformance anymore.

 

[Bees!]

^^thatthat^^

 

[Maharba the Mystic]

so uh.....................................................................

 

[GunmasterLombardi]

If neither said anything about it and didn't involve the TO, then probably wouldn't have gotten carded.

Well damn.

What they don't know won't hurt them right?