WhatIsRaizen?
Smash Ace
A smasher you know creator that tier list? 0_o that doesn't sound very good..
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The State of Brawl in Japan: 3rd Update 14/02/10
- Thread starter Attila_
- Start date
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
Smash Legend
You could pretty much say that about every American player, because they play differently there.
Watch this:
http://allisbrawl.com/video/video.aspx?id=8374
It's an old video, but look at how they play as opposed to NEO or MikeHAZE. See the difference?
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
If you look carefully enough, you'll see a trend in this tier list. It's ranked from the characters who have an easy time killing to the characters who have a hard time killing, but they've also added a couple of other factors in between.
Metaknight is obvious. No trouble killing whatsoever (killing includes gimping). Snake is another obvious one. Falco and Pit don't surprise me either, both these characters have the tools to play as defensive as possible, and their kill power is nothing to write home about. Marth, Fox, Wario, Diddy, all have good killing potential, and they all have their very own advanced 'tactic' which makes up for their not-so good killing potential (Marth with his great spacing, Fox with his intensive ability to rack up damage, Diddy with his Banana metagame, and Wario's great defensive play). King Dedede, Olimar, Game & Watch, Zelda/Shiek, Wolf and Zero Suit Samus can all kill quite easily.
Now, Ice Climbers, while they may have chain grabs, have a low killing potential, and their defensive play isn't that good either. Toon Link shares the same problem; his kill moves are quite obvious. Everyone in C Tier seems to share something in common, which is, having just one major attribute that doesn't make up for their other problems.
I gotta admit, I don't quite understand why Donkey Kong's down there, though everyone else in D Tier seem to be following where I'm going.
E tier, same thing. You could tell that these characters have some major issues in certain parts of their game play, and their killing potential isn't that good.
F tier has the characters who have an insane amount of trouble killing. Ganondorf seems to be in the lead just cause of the power each of his moves pack. Samus, Falcon & Sonic all have trouble killing. Jigglypuff seems to be the character who suffers the most because of her very weak killing power, along with it being very easy to kill her herself.
Palpi
Smash Hero
Is the difference worse?
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
Smash Legend
No, I'm just saying that it's difficult to compare players from here and Japan because of this difference in overall playstyle.
D
Deleted member
Guest
Thats a year old....
How can u compare that to our players lol
Because they have an incredible amount of control over their characters for it being a year old O_O.
Red Arremer
Smash Legend
Only America is good in games, accept that!
There's no chance in hell that any other region could even come CLOSE to America's metagame, yet alone being better than America! That's impossible. Only America counts, and everyone who says that America could not be the best is a ******. Seriously!
There's no chance in hell that any other region could even come CLOSE to America's metagame, yet alone being better than America! That's impossible. Only America counts, and everyone who says that America could not be the best is a ******. Seriously!
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
Smash Legend
"I'm just saying that it's difficult to compare players from here and Japan because of this difference in overall playstyle."
It helps to read, you know.
Besides, that's just an example I'm not saying that they haven't progressed since then.
I'd rather be that guy than have a name like Onishiba.Only America is good in games, accept that!
There's no chance in hell that any other region could even come CLOSE to America's metagame, yet alone being better than America! That's impossible. Only America counts, and everyone who says that America could not be the best is a ******. Seriously!
Clai
Smash Lord
I just instantly fell in love with Japan.
Palpi
Smash Hero
Sonic being 2nd to last is funny, though he is low tier...being worse than ganon is =/
solecalibur
Smash Master
They ban inf in japan so some other characters can sore higher in the tier list but fox and pit arent as good as there tier list is and they are highly over rated and in America they are some what under rated with there undeveloped meta game (my opinion not basing off of facts since its difficult to prove that)
You guys should also should remember Sonic's metagame took a leap before he became higher on the tier list japan must have not done this looking at the tier list
You guys should also should remember Sonic's metagame took a leap before he became higher on the tier list japan must have not done this looking at the tier list
First of all, fix your "there," "their," and "they're." Unlike many other things, there actually is a big difference so your post was annoying to make sense out of.
Second of all, where did you hear that Japan banned infinites?
adumbrodeus
Smash Legend
True, it's quite possible that the japanese are scoffing at our tier list for having sonic so high with the occassional person saying, "those americans have a sonic metagame like you wouldn't believe!"
I think it's more likely that we have things to learn from each other.
Falcon88
Smash Ace
I agree... It's **** annoying when people can't spell around here.
I read in the first post of this thread that some tourneys in Japan don't allow CG's. I don't know about infinites, though.
Bloodcross
Smash Champion
Only video of Masashi I saw was of him camping Michael Hey.
But cmon, IT'S IC'S. Who WOULDN'T camp? (better question is who has the balls to camp)
More vids are pretty much required for these biased Americans. Japan is different, doesn't mean they suck. Most of us know little about Japan, but there could be a player at Ally/M2K caliber lurking around in Japan. You never know.
But cmon, IT'S IC'S. Who WOULDN'T camp? (better question is who has the balls to camp)
More vids are pretty much required for these biased Americans. Japan is different, doesn't mean they suck. Most of us know little about Japan, but there could be a player at Ally/M2K caliber lurking around in Japan. You never know.
Palpi
Smash Hero
I remember Kel said a while ago that Japan is more afraid of D3 than MK.
Red Arremer
Smash Legend
So that means any region that doesn't "fear" Meta Knight sucks?
Actually they don't. What I saw was a lot of mispacing which seemed like "aggressive play" but was very inherently flawed. Looking at Europe in itself is not that different from america in term of game play, but when I look at japan, I see a lot of players trying to play overaggressive which is fairly easy to punish through the use of OOS options.
EDIT: Turns out this video you got of these players really does not represent anything near the current metagame.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrCxs4lKOHE
This is much better, and actually is comparable to America's gameplay. Still, ics are most probably simply not abused at all over there.
CRASHiC
Smash Hero
That's not true at all. D3 still gets to chain grab. I've seen the D3 Japanese matches.
QFT.
Their tier list probably has as many flaws as ours...just in different areas. Many of our character's metagames are underdeveloped due to being underplayed (Pit, Zelda, Sheik, Wolf) or are simply not properly represented in the tourney scene despite their potential being showcased in some areas of the nation.
Who's to say they actually have a Boss (Luigi) or a high level Sonic player (too many to name) over in Japan that can actually show what those lower rated characters are actually capable of?
Or...they could just be THAT much better than we are. I mean...look at Starcraft's metagame...from my understanding, there's only a handful of regions good enough to compete with the best.
Conviction
Human Nature
Aiyyo both Oni and V chill no need to act stupid. Ray Kalm has a point and seems to make perfect sense but there seems to be this one thing that I think that seperates us is that word POTENTIAL. I think we call it potential and never make it ability. What I'm saying is maybe Japan has made all these potentials into abilities. I agree with Matador what if they ARE THAT BETTER THAN US? Because our communities are sooooo spread apart how would any of us know there top people? For all we know we might just be watching the average people. Most people on vids are former melee players.
My agruement: Japan makes potential into ability and we just call it potential.
In US Fox has killing potential. In Japan Fox has killing ABILITY.
P.S. We need a place where Japan and US can meet in harmony and help each other.
My agruement: Japan makes potential into ability and we just call it potential.
In US Fox has killing potential. In Japan Fox has killing ABILITY.
P.S. We need a place where Japan and US can meet in harmony and help each other.
Red Arremer
Smash Legend
People should stop assuming I'm angry when I'm obviously being sarcastic.
Ray_Kalm
Smash Master
Then stop making everyone of your posts sarcastic.
Don't compare apples to oranges and then proceed to talk down to me...
The video I commented on was a year old wifi marth ditto friendly. Enough said... don't take my comment out of context.
And you are partially right... the teal Marth lacked some basic control over his character. I didn't agree with his use of fox trotting, fairing into shield so often... etc.
The black Marth, on the other hand, utilized some interesting techniques (retreating pivot grab for one) and applied higher level cognitive play to the match up (good use of rhythm with db... spontaneous to punish potential reads) and had an overall nice flow in general. He handled his joy stick well. You can't take that away from him.
That's all I was saying.
Because sarcasm obviously doesn't fail on the internet.
Red Arremer
Smash Legend
Come on. That one was so obvious from the picture I posted and the way I worded that post. Also, I'm from Europe, that adds to that. I can't understand how someone wouldn't get that one.
Speaking just between the diff in American vs Ausi: at Genesis Ausi got totaled in crew battles. I watched Vyse's Diddy a lot and he was roughly 6 months behind where the US top Diddy's were at.
He went out of his way to show he was kidding. Get off his case.
n88
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2008
- Messages
- 1,536
The picture and the fact that I knew Oni was from Europe gave it away. Plus, I swear nobody is that patriotic here.
Oh, right... there's an actual topic here. I agree with the general consensus that their metagame has probably developed more in some areas and less in others. I'd love to see some off their Zeldas play if they've got her at B.
Oh, right... there's an actual topic here. I agree with the general consensus that their metagame has probably developed more in some areas and less in others. I'd love to see some off their Zeldas play if they've got her at B.
zeldspazz
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2008
- Messages
- 3,432
Well they have it as Zelda/Sheik. So even if the Zeldas are trash and the Sheiks are great it still shows Zelda as being B tier. So idk what thats about. Although I too would like to see her in action in Japan as well.
Melomaniacal
Smash Champion
Wow, it's really a shame that we equate patriotism to stupidity.
But ignore this and go back on topic.
Man of Popsicle
Smash Lord
Is it just me or do they roll a lot?
¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯
Smash Legend
I doubt it, because the Japanese don't seem to really have any techniques that we don't. Also, the Australian community is on SWF so they know pretty much every technique that the American community does.
Palpi
Smash Hero
No, I was merely stating something that someone said, baring little significance, but Kel's named was mentioned so I said what I had remembered. In no way did I imply that not fearing Metaknight means your bad, as a person or a region. You are just really salty.