The Official SBR-B Brawl Tier List v3.0

[Napoleon]

There is no "right" person to play with unless you're playing to win. If you're playing to win, I would pick up sommeone in the S tier. The list shouldn't influence who u play though. and brinboys right. Don't think a roll would do much.

Lol I know have better English than what I used in my first post!

What I meant by "not playing the right people" was I must not be playing frends who play Wario well.

As in I pull off that retreating roll thing and they run right into me. Sweetspots F-Smash.

 

[:mad:]

Let me say that I don't want to get sucked into the argument. As I've pointed out before, debates simply don't matter to me. Just commenting on the current topic. Though not on the KO Power: Mario Vs Yoshi issue.

In the future I can see Yoshi rising, but Mario falling. Many of Mario's best tricks work mainly on lower tier characters (people with mediocre recoveries), as opposed to Yoshi who"s Grab-Release game (as well as other techniques) works on a fair number of characters on the upper half. Though I doubt that'll take Yoshi 'too far'. A sad reality considering how much I like the two.

Actually, I think Mario will stay where he is- not fall.

I didn't know bad recoveries were only limited to low tier. As a matter of fact, most of Mario's cute little tricks work on top tiers more so than lowers.

Yoshi's Grab releases aren't that deadly. Pummel damage isn't worth it, you're better off Usmasing.

 

[aeghrur]

I didn't know lower tier necessarily had worse recoveries considering, last I checked, Jiggs had a "semi-decent recovery."

 

[adumbrodeus]

Trolling? I'm not allowed my opinion? I think Mario kills better than Yoshi. I'm unable to prove it, you're unable to prove otherwise..

Actually, the operating assumption is that all characters kill just as well until proven otherwise. Obviously, this isn't true, but there's plenty to prove it wrong in the cases where it is wrong, so the assumption's basic purpose is to establish the burden of proof which would otherwise result in stalemates, like this one.

Sorry Matador, the burden of proof is yours.


That said, I'd say you're right, Mario does kill better then Yoshi due to his amazing (relatively of course, and the comparison is Yoshi) gimp game (not to be confused with "has better killing power"). How do I know this? Two words, "CAPE TELEPORT.


Yes, I love cape teleport in concept, it's so ridiculously cool. I'm never seconding Mario, I'm seconding Cape Teleport.

 

[Matador]

You're right, you win. They're even. What an eye-opener.

But they're even.

 

[mountain_tiger]

P.S. - Can we talk about Yoshi v. some character that matters or Mario v. some character that matters?

Does Peach count? Because I could write a novella about that.

 

[deepseadiva]

Can we talk about Yoshi v. some character that matters or Mario v. some character that matters?

How about Yoshi v. Mario?

Oh wait.

 

[The Cunning Weasel]

Lol I know have better English than what I used in my first post!

What I meant by "not playing the right people" was I must not be playing frends who play Wario well.

As in I pull off that retreating roll thing and they run right into me. Sweetspots F-Smash.

Hey what is Darkrai holding in your avatar?

 

[infomon]

How about Yoshi v. Mario?

Oh wait.

BAHAHAHA

10amazingmeno's

 

[Frown]

Let's discuss Samus.

I think she is utter crap. She has that zair, but I think those predictable projectiles and that awful range is enough to make her worse than Link.

 

[mountain_tiger]

Let's discuss Samus.

I think she is utter crap. She has that zair, but I think those predictable projectiles and that awful range is enough to make her worse than Link.

I love how you say Samus is crap, yet fail to mention the fact that she sucks at killing, which is easily one of her biggest flaws. And her projectiles aren't predictable if you use them right.

 

[Esca]

It's already understood that she can't kill. Tard.

Her projectiles are predictable. Too predictable.

Unless Xyro is doing it wrong?

 

[.Marik]

It's already understood that she can't kill. Tard.

Her projectiles are predictable. Too predictable.

Unless Xyro is doing it wrong?

For such a mediocre character, Xyro is actually doing pretty well.

He's like the only one, though. They're somewhat predictable, but not all the time.

You just gotta mix it up.

 

[mountain_tiger]

It's already understood that she can't kill. Tard.

Hey, no need for tasteless insults. Since he's saying that Samus is terrible, I would have thought that he would have mentioned it, even if it is obvious to most people, since it is one of her biggest flaws.

 

[Blatt Blvd]

every bad character in brawl has trouble killing.

 

[mountain_tiger]

every bad character in brawl has trouble killing.

Zelda would like a word with you....

And Samus is especially bad at killing. Her best kill moves often require extremely good set-ups, and kill at 130% WITHOUT DI.

 

[:mad:]

every bad character in brawl has trouble killing.

Diddy Kong has trouble killing.

IS HE BAD?!11

 

[Tenki]

In his defense, he didn't say that every character in Brawl who has trouble killing is bad.

 

[da K.I.D.]

many characters kill very easily, snake, DK, fox just to name a few.

 

[Esca]

Samus' only kill moves are usually used for damage. Her best kill moves usually require the player to be extremely dumb off-stage. She has to rely on spiking you to have any hope at winning the matchup. It's a sad thing, I know. Another funny thing, is that her zair doesn't even refresh moves. WTF.

 

[Nestec]

I seriously hate Samus. It could just be that I don't know enough about her, but I'd almost say that she's worse than Link.

Isn't recovery her only plus on him? And maybe the fact that Link is more susceptible to combos. But Samus is a larger target, so that can't be made as a good point.

---
@ Blatt:

Ness is considered bad, but I wouldn't say he has trouble killing.

 

[kingcobra9]

Hey what is Darkrai holding in your avatar?

a ball of enegry nothing in particular just artistic

 

[Deathcarter]

Admittedly, I think Samus is worse than Falcon. She gets obliterated when any opponent is right next to her which is sad because she cannot really do much to keep opponents out. At least Falcon has his good jab for close combat and mobility to maneuver around opponents without very large hitboxes.

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

A looong time ago when we were talking about DAL in this thread I said we'd have a video soon.

Well, we didn't get it for a while, but here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pItF4Sa5NHY&fmt=18

To preempt one question: Yes, SDI does effect the lock, but that doesn't mean it's necessarily easily escapable using SDI. The Dash Attack has multiple hitboxes, so each time the opponent SDIs toward you, they have to go through the next one to escape. Plus you can buffer a reverse DA and continue the lock.

So yes, you could conceivably escape this through SDI, just like everything else that isn't a grab, but that doesn't mean it is easy to do it or that it's a guaranteed escape. ZSS will still get 3-4 guaranteed Dash Attacks before SDI puts you behind her, which is plenty and will put you over the edge in most cases.

Also, it was touched on in the video, but you cannot Nade Pull/Dolphin Slash/Flip Jump/Shuttle Loop etc. to escape.

 

[BSP]

Admittedly, I think Samus is worse than Falcon. She gets obliterated when any opponent is right next to her which is sad because she cannot really do much to keep opponents out. At least Falcon has his good jab for close combat and mobility to maneuver around opponents without very large hitboxes.

Wait. Doesn't samus have missles, charge shot, longest z-air, and bombs to keep people away?

 

[Napoleon]

Hey what is Darkrai holding in your avatar?

Might want to keep this to PMs but...

It's a Life Orb, but the Pink Stuff is a Dark Void. The yellow thingo is a crescent moon.

On topic, Samus gets tossed if you can rush her. No keepaway moves, and pretty much reliant on projectiles. And no moves with good priority to speak of, which come out quickly.

 

[Yonder]

Admittedly, I think Samus is worse than Falcon. She gets obliterated when any opponent is right next to her which is sad because she cannot really do much to keep opponents out. At least Falcon has his good jab for close combat and mobility to maneuver around opponents without very large hitboxes.

In a way, I sorta agree, I find Samus to be a terrible character who should definatly drop below Jigglypuff in the next tier list, MAYBE become 3rd worst, but probably 4th worst is best.

 

[Chuee]

The reason Samus is higher than Falcon is because she has a **** good camping game. She has missles, charge shot, and Zair. Shes so low on the list because she almost has nothing in close combat. She doesn't have any moves that can get the opponent away from her so that she can camp. She also doesn't have many reliable kill moves. Dsmash and maybe dtilt and Charge Shot.

 

[Browny]

So I havent posted here in a while...

Imo Wario, Diddy and DDD are just too close to each other to separate properly. The best of each character mains sometimes does awesome, sometimes they dont. theres just not enough consistancy with them to be able to definitively rank them. IC's are still proving they should be there with them.

S Tier
MK
Snake

A Tier
(Wario Diddy DDD IC)
Falco

the rest

/flame away

 

[Conspiricy]

I fail to see why Manondorf is so low.

...well apart from his little problem with projectiles...

 

[Supermodel From Paris]

I fail to see why Manondorf is so low.

...well apart from his little problem with projectiles...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te6WkqQfSmc&feature=channel_page

 

[Red Arremer]

I fail to see why Manondorf is so low.

...well apart from his little problem with projectiles...

His problem with projectiles isn't little, and neither is his problem with pretty much every other move in the game. <_<

 

[MysticKenji]

I fail to see why Manondorf is so low.

...well apart from his little problem with projectiles...

In order for him to go up, someone must be worse than him.
And only Falcon could arguably be considered worse than Ganon. >_>

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te6WkqQfSmc&feature=channel_page

This is classic XD

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Wow... At first I thought it was gonna be about Brawl and he mentioned wavedashing and getting your second jump back. That was awesome.

Also for the Ganon argument I'd like to post this.


Inb4 people snap about how one vid doesn't prove jack. It's funny. Take it at face value.

 

[Lore]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Te6WkqQfSmc&feature=channel_page

Classic.

Ganon just simply has major problems. Nothing you can really do about it other than unplug the wii.

I'm pretty happy with this list. Sheik could be a bit higher, but that's really about it.

edit: if anyone wants to post some good ganon videos, I'd be happy, since I've never seen a good ganon. XD

 

[Dark 3nergy]

Classic.

Ganon just simply has major problems. Nothing you can really do about it other than unplug the wii.

I'm pretty happy with this list. Sheik could be a bit higher, but that's really about it.

edit: if anyone wants to post some good ganon videos, I'd be happy, since I've never seen a good ganon. XD

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=FBDFB6789DFFD7D4&search_query=Kosk

Scroll down to the Kosk(Ganon) vs SuperBoom (Snake) grand final videos

the match at Norfair kicked ***

 

[PK-ow!]

Wow... At first I thought it was gonna be about Brawl and he mentioned wavedashing and getting your second jump back. That was awesome.

Also for the Ganon argument I'd like to post this.


Inb4 people snap about how one vid doesn't prove jack. It's funny. Take it at face value.

Obviously that Ganon is **** garbage. So yes, it's good for lulz. But it does nothing for the argument.
And since you said "For the Ganon argument I'd like to post" it, this rebuttal is mandatory.

Ganon does have major problems. But I think it will work out that Link, Falcon, and Ness are worse than him. Maybe Jiggs.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

It was supposed to be like that. So if people quoted it they'd be like AWW trolled. T_T

 

[tocador]

Obviously that Ganon is **** garbage. So yes, it's good for lulz. But it does nothing for the argument.
And since you said "For the Ganon argument I'd like to post" it, this rebuttal is mandatory.

Ganon does have major problems. But I think it will work out that Link, Falcon, and Ness are worse than him. Maybe Jiggs.

Now sir, sorry to say, but falcon is just too manly to be under oldmandorf :D!

 

[Zenthewanderer]

I'd have to disagree with Jiggly and Link being below Ganondorf. I'd defend Ness as well but I don't know enough about him to do so. I personally wouldn't put him below Ganon considering Ness -like Jig & Link-has some redeeming qualities.

It all comes down to options. Link and Jiggly simply have many more than Ganon. Link's projectiles and Zair give him the range and spacing tools that Ganon so sorely lacks. Jiggly, to my understanding, counters at a couple of the upper tiers, in her defense. I think Ganon is right where he belongs...

Feel free to disagree, it doesn't matter to me. Also, I agree with the posts above on Samus. I'd place her somewhere among the four bottom characters.