The Lucas General Discussion

[BlueberrySyrup]

I need to learn that nana lock, diddy is a horrible MU for me xD

 

[Jamwa]

I need to learn that nana lock, diddy is a horrible MU for me xD

And then learn to tire lock vs Wario, or footstall > DJC Zair > DTILT LOCK.

Dam these techs are hard

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

Someone should make a video on it, I don't even know a Lucas in the US that can do that.

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcpuVJhNtL8&feature=plcp

I can do it. The only one I've ever done in an actual match was vs Peach with her turnip though. I almost did it to a ROB in tourney but I DJC'ed the Zair and I went in front of him instead of behind so I missed the lock.

EDIT: Oh, and I use a DVC 100

EDITEDIT: Just saw your post Jamwa. Zair Jump and Zap Jump have the same height, and you can't wavebounce the Zair Jump. For all practical uses, Zap Jump is just a much better option than Zair Jump. For offense, Zap Jump shoots out a PK Fire. Zair Jump holds you in a bit of Zair lag until just after you've reached the apex of the Jump (just like Zap Jump does, except you shoot out a hitbox while you're waiting to be able to do stuff). For recovery Zap Jump's better. With the Zair Jump you have to input an aerial and then use the Zair Jump. For the Zap Jump, you can do it whenever, and you an wavebounce it and get a Magnet Pull after. The only practical use that the Zair Jump has is that you can use it right after a ledgedrop and it cancels into a Dusterslide. Btw, Dusterslide's like five times easier to learn than the Zair Jump so I'd just learn dustersliding instead.

So yeah, there's no real point in learning how to Zair Jump if you don't know how to already. I mean, unless you want the reaction of:
"WOW! Lucas can Zap Jump with Zair?!"
"Yeah dude, it's pretty kewl."
"Can you cancel it into an attack?"
"Nope."
"Can you Magnet Pull with it?"
"Nope."
"... Then what's the point?"
"There's no point at all. "
"..."
"..."

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

"It's just meant to confuse you, it's really easy you should try it!"
"Okay, how do I do it?"
"You just do this, then this and hold a roll and make sure you zair right after it and buffer everything"
"...Okay."


I wanna learn dustersliding soon, I can do it sometime but I don't have good timing for it.

Like Idk how far I should drop down and when I should jump to do it efficiently.

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

Press back on the control stick so you let go, quickly let the Control Stick reset to the neutral position, then quickly press towards the stage on the control stick and then Y anld Z quickly after, or whatever your Jump and Zair/Grab buttons are

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

Thanks, and what programs do you use to record? I might download em tonight.

We can rate threads lol? Didn't even know.

 

[Jamwa]

FAE, can you explain the difference between platform cancelling and that thing where people seem to platform cancel but platform drop straight away? i think it has something to do with shield + down...

hargh so many techniques to learn. DJC, Dusterslide, Wavebounced zap jump, nana/tire lock.

when Smash 4 comes out im going to make sure to be up to date with all this stuff rather than discovering all of this 4 years after the game comes out.
lawl

or i could just use ness and learn PK jump, and ill know every AT for him

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

You could just use Ganondorf, I heard he's really good now.

 

[FightAdamantEevee]

Thanks, and what programs do you use to record? I might download em tonight.

I use Pinnacle Studio

FAE, can you explain the difference between platform cancelling and that thing where people seem to platform cancel but platform drop straight away? i think it has something to do with shield + down...

Platform Cancelling is cancelling your jump by holding down on the control stick until you just pass through a moving platform. This will make you immediately and laglessly on the platform, meaning you can do anything right out of it (run off, ftilt, grab, anything).

The platform drop is when you press Shield + Down on the control stick at the time you would hold down to platform cancel. Instead of it cancelling your jump on the platform, you imediately drop back through.

Platform Cancel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_K-RBt7qI#t=5m49s

Platform Drop
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_K-RBt7qI#t=6m1s

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

There's a lot of Pinaccle studios, it makes like files 8 gb when I use it though, makes it really annoying.

Does it do that to you?

And what version do you have, the most recent is 15 I think.

Lucas in next smash should get crits because, uh. SMAAAASSHH!!!

Yeah.

 

[Alberto1866]

I use Pinnacle Studio



Platform Cancelling is cancelling your jump by holding down on the control stick until you just pass through a moving platform. This will make you immediately and laglessly on the platform, meaning you can do anything right out of it (run off, ftilt, grab, anything).

The platform drop is when you press Shield + Down on the control stick at the time you would hold down to platform cancel. Instead of it cancelling your jump on the platform, you imediately drop back through.

Platform Cancel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_K-RBt7qI#t=5m49s

Platform Drop
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2_K-RBt7qI#t=6m1s

How do you immediately do PK Fire from the ledge? And how do you cancel the rope snake when you grab the ledge?

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0kw6V0p3E0

How to improve? I adapted pretty fast after first game. :o

I missed alot of powershields trying to powershield fair on approach to punish, so that's smthg i need to work on.

 

[#HBC | J]

Man that was some sexy stuff there Pink Fresh. Really good job and nice reads. You really outplayed the guy.

How'd you do overall at that tourney?

Lol, the commentators did not really know too much about Lucas. "It works on Ness, so it should work on Lucas right?"

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

I got 9th. lost to salem and nakat. I seem to play better in losers. I took Salem to game 3 but he just outplayed me.

 

[#HBC | J]

Salem probably has one of the coolest ZSS' to watch. He is getting pretty insanely good over the last few tourneys it seems. Sucks about Nakat though.

Really well done getting 9th. You keep on seeming to get really close to making a few bucks but hopefully next tourny you will do really well.

So now I see why you don't think Marth isn't that bad.

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0kw6V0p3E0

How to improve? I adapted pretty fast after first game. :o

I missed alot of powershields trying to powershield fair on approach to punish, so that's smthg i need to work on.

I think you just got pressured in the first game and started letting him get to you, I think you did everything pretty much right. I think your playstyle would've had to change if he grabbed though.

Just my opinion on it.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

Correct!

I jumped out of shield alot first game and got punished for it :[

I THOUGHT HE PLAYED FOX STILL LOL. it shocked me to see mk. and to be that patient ._. I'll get em next time.

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

Lucas mains will achieve ultimate satisfaction.

And yeah lol I saw. You still did really good.

 

[#HBC | J]

Pink Fresh's style for Lucas I have to say is aggressive, he makes sure he knows his openings while baiting reads that allow him to get in. He never lets up the pressure of his game. He knows what he has to do and has probably the easiest time killing his opponents than the other two. However, because he is more aggro, he is more susceptible to being read in terms of his attack and also if he gets knocked off his balance of aggro, he can get messed around with a bit. What I've noticed is that if he is fighting someone equally aggressive/more aggressive than himself, he runs into trouble.

Mekos on the other hands is a style of passive aggressive where he is much more patient then Pink Fresh. He has a more campy style than Pink and makes sure he has his opponent down pact before rushing in to be aggressive with Lucas, but even then he is methodological with his approach moreso than Pink's in your face game-play. He seems to try and play a balance of camping/aggressiveness and spacing to get things down. The thing about Mekos' style is that he plays every stock like it is his last most of the time. Whenever he isn't playing this way, he is feeling out his opponent to see which playstyle will be the best to take them out.

Followed by FAE who is more...gimmicky I guess would be the word. He knows how to abuse pretty much every AT by Lucas and uses them to his advantage. He is a mix-up Lucas where he can use his arsenal of moves with expertise in knowing them to wreck havoc on other people. He does really really good when they do not know his tricks whatsoever. The flashiest Lucas out of the Top 3 definitely. Don't know whether he is more campy or aggro though because it is really reliant on who he is facing it seems. Needs to stop doubting himself though because whenever he begins to doubt himself, he does worse. (then again, that could also be said for Pink)

That's what I've noticed from our top three's plays and my opinion on them. The rambling started from Blue's thought on Pink's play.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

i still suck tho. need improvement.

 

[#HBC | J]

Dude, you don't suck. You doubt yourself which is your biggest problem. Optimism. Everyone can say they need improvement, but still you are doing great lately and there is no need to knock that. Regardless, Lucas' gonna hype each other at Apex and make it awesome.

Also Pink, I want to Lucas ditto you even though those are terrible haha. I've gotten soooo much better than in the past man.

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

I just need to remind myself of what to do. I know what to do, I just get frustrated sometimes.

also apex gonna be hype. glad you gonna make it out this time. (don't recall you at the last one?)

 

[Jamwa]

does anyone know how to do that thing where you run across the stage while spinning in circles? would be a cool taunt

dang it i should upload vids, but me filming them with my phone would seem lame, and i might embarrass myself. i really need help refining my playstyle, because i know what i gotta do but i just get super aggro ingame, more aggro than PF, and dair/nair everything.

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

I downloaded my recording software again, I wanna play you too Pink xD

 

[#HBC | J]

Nah, I wasnt able to go to Apex last year due to directing a show. This Apex should be fun though.

 

[Alberto1866]

Are Mekos and Fow going to team again? :3

 

[Dark 3nergy]

So apparently there's a Mother 4 game being made, did anyone here know about this? If so, any information out there?

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

FAE which version of Pinnacle studios do you use?
Pinnacle 15 is horrible for me, makes the screen flash black -.-

And yeah, I know about it.

It's coming out soon I think, it's been under dev. for 4 years or so, they recoded everything to C++ too, and I've heard some of the music, it sounds great, just like a Mother game.

It's honestly going to feel like a Mother 4 imo.

 

[Alberto1866]

I want a Mother 4 do you think they'll make a US version?

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

The Mother 4 fangame is English made, so it won't even be made for Japan unless it's translated lol.

 

[Mekos]

Probably not -____-

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

Probably not -____-

The fanmade on is English. :D

Mother 4 (If there's ever a real one) probably won't be made by Itoi, the only thing I see us getting would be remakes of Mother 1-3

 

[Luco]

Jeez Luco, blowing up the Lucas boards last night eh?

When you're in the desert with absolutely no internet connection and you finally get on when everybody else is asleep (because, you know, I live in Australia)... You begin to answer in every thread you can find, if nothing else to say hi. :3

As to J's post a page back, what i'd like to achieve with my playstyle is a mix of Mekos' playstyle and PF's probably, where I go aggro and camp randomly so it becomes that much harder for my opponent to read me. This is why I absolutely love to bait with PK freeze. If it doesn't hit i'll go for a punish from the airdodge, otherwise they get hit. Sometimes though, I just leave it alone. Do nothing after the PK freeze or SHPKF or something of the sort.

Also, blueberry, the ness t-shirt is rather well known and good for cosplay but... If you want a shirt you can wear in the public without getting weird stares and a few [very cool] people getting the reference, i'd go for the runaway five t-shirt. Or you could get both. The ness shirt is still awesome and really great to use for practical purposes (e.g. making a ness or earthbound - related video in which you wear the shirt in).

I don't cosplay (i'm nerdy enough and don't have the courage to go to cosplay hehe) but I support those that do. It's great fun once in a while. :-D

Ah, Jamwa: What you're talking about is known usually as pivot walking. My brother does it quite a bit as a taunt and yes, it does annoy the opponent, I can definitely attest to that. Although then again, it also makes me laugh just as much as it bugs me, so I actually probably approve of it. Anyway, I digress. I can't exactly remember how to do it and my brother is asleep but I remember a few things about it. It does actually have a use with a couple of characters (marth is a good example of one) where they can go straight to a smash attack while going at near running speeds. that's right, for some characters, pivot walking can take them across a stage in like a second or two. it's nuts. Marths can usually do it in something like 4-6 pivots. there are some other characters that go just as fast. Unfortunately for us, Lucas doesn't get this benefit. His pivot walking is rather slow but on the bright side, it means you get to watch him do it for that much longer before turning around! Still, the main fun of it with lucas is just watching him turn. And turn. And keep turning. It's soooooo hilarious. I wish you could watchmy brother do it sometime, he's quite good.

The one thing I DO remember about doing it is that if you do it wrong if often results in you doing a side or down smash rather than going anywhere. No biggie, but it can be annoying when you Dsmash 5 or 6 times in a row needlessly.

Anyway, someone will probably give you a better explanation than I have, there's a list of who can do it well somewhere on the boards... Dunno where, though.

 

[Jamwa]

Thanks Luco lol, seems the desert has drained you

I'm going to MM Atilla (#1 plaer who is a snake main in aus, but also plays falco, ics and lucas) in a Lucas v Lucas. Hopefully it will get uploaded and ill post it somewhere here

 

[Luco]

Oh you're going to BAM aren't you? Dang i wish i could go.... I love the desert but it does kill me sometimes. >.>

 

[Mekos]

I think J has a good analysis of my playstyle. I'm not a campy player. I just make every action count and play to my opponent. Lucas can't afford to go all aggro if the opponent is familiar with him.

If I am playing someone with low power level I can just go in and be real aggro. But if it is an opponent who is at least Super Saiyan 3 then "bait and punish" is needed. Lucas has very little priority with his attacks and struggles to approach someone who knows how to bait him.

So it is not camping. It's just at high level play each action is thought out and the two players are figuring each other out and learning from each action. Each situation should be played out differently.

If your opponent is rushing you then go aggro. If your opponent is camping you then stay calm and "bait and punish" them. Most players realize once I'm inside I will read them heavily, outsmart them, and destroy them. One of my best assests in smash. With that said alot of players choose to camp me and try to only pick their safe options. So in most of my matches you will see me "bait and punishing" them for the majority of the game.

 

[Alberto1866]

The Mother 4 fangame is English made, so it won't even be made for Japan unless it's translated lol.

Awesome do you know where I can find more info?

 

[BlueberrySyrup]

Awesome do you know where I can find more info?

This is the site.
http://mother4.andonuts.net/

 

[~Pink Fresh~]

So it is not camping. It's just at high level play each action is thought out and the two players are figuring each other out and learning from each action. Each situation should be played out differently.

If your opponent is rushing you then go aggro. If your opponent is camping you then stay calm and "bait and punish" them. Most players realize once I'm inside I will read them heavily, outsmart them, and destroy them. One of my best assests in smash. With that said alot of players choose to camp me and try to only pick their safe options. So in most of my matches you will see me "bait and punishing" them for the majority of the game.

Lucas in a nutshell. My only problem is how frustrated i get sometimes and it causes me to go aggro against really campy opponents.